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Frugal Friday’s Workwear Report: Floral Clip Puff-Sleeve Top

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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

Has anyone else been googling “How to Look Good on Zoom Calls”? This has been a bit of trial and error for me, but I think what’s been working is a solid-colored top in a flattering color. Bonus points if it has a fun neckline, sleeve, or some other piece of visual interest. This rosy pink top with a slightly puffed sleeve seems like it would fit the bill perfectly. You can wear this with whatever bottoms work for you while you’re working from home. Once we’re out and about, I would love to see it with white jeans and sandals for the weekend or a navy suit at work.

The top is $39.50 at Loft, but right now you can get 70% off (!) one full-price item, which brings it down to only $11.85. It's available in straight sizes XS–XXL and plus sizes 14–26 and also comes in white and seafoam. Floral Clip Puff-Sleeve Top

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Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com.

Sales of note for 3/15/25:

  • Nordstrom – Spring sale, up to 50% off
  • Ann Taylor – 40% off everything + free shipping
  • Banana Republic Factory – 40% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Eloquii – 50% off select styles + extra 50% off sale
  • J.Crew – Extra 30% off women's styles + spring break styles on sale
  • J.Crew Factory – 40% off everything + extra 20% off 3 styles + 50% off clearance
  • M.M.LaFleur – Friends and family sale, 20% off with code; use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – 40% off 1 item + 30% off everything else (includes markdowns, already 25% off)

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

523 Comments

  1. Something Silly

    For something silly this morning, what words did you hear/say wrong (either as a child or an adult)?

    I’ll go first:
    -the “specific” ocean. For a long time I thought people were talking about a specific ocean not realizing that the Pacific Ocean is the actual name of an ocean
    -only when reading but for years by brain would read “uniformed” as “uninformed” when reading, which led me to unintentionally assume most police officers in novels were completely hopeless when they arrived on scene

    1. I was a precocious reader and definitely said words incorrectly because I only read them. Cupboard and cubbard were two distinct things in my brain.

      1. Same! Grotesque (spoken) and graw-tess-cue (how I read it) were two different words in my mind until… maybe adulthood? Amazing.

      2. Same, and add to that the fact that my mom’s first language isn’t English — I mispronounced words like ‘jewellery’ and ‘Thailand’ for years.

      3. Misled. I maintain that there should be a word pronounced mizzled (like drizzle) to mean disappointed/ miffed.

        1. Same, but MY-zled meaning tricked by a dastardly person. Also think it should be a word.

          1. I also said (and sometimes still say) – MYzled and I think it should totally be a word!

      4. I thought I was the only one who thought cubbard and cupboard were two different words! I didn’t know until last year when my husband told me…

        1. Yep, I think it was made worse by my reading of the Indian in the Cupboard, the cover photo didn’t look like my cupboard. I think I imagined it as some sort of pegboard for cups.

    2. I thought that classic John Denver song was “Crunchy Roaaaads, take me home”.
      Which still makes sense, because roads can TOTALLY be crunchy.

    4. I thought “parking lots” were “parking nots” for a long time. I asked my mom why they were called parking nots when you could park there, and it definitely made her reevaluate my intelligence…

      I also still have a hard time saying “album” instead of “alblum” for some reason.

    5. somehow I misheard “A&W Root Beer” as “Indian W Root Beer”. Even today I have no explanation….

    6. I thought the letter in the Elvis song was being returned to a person named Cinda.

    7. This is kind of related, but until I was about 25 I thought the song “I Saw Mommy Kissing Santa Claus” was about Mommy cheating on Daddy with Santa.

    8. debauchery, I would say (until embarrassingly recent years) de-bawk-ery (hard K)

      1. I don’t believe I have ever had a conversation in which “debauchery” would have come up. I am so intrigued by what you’ve been talking about!

        I, of course, instantly go to Stephen saying to Jack, ‘You debauched my sloth!” (HUGE points for anyone who knows about Jack, Stephen, and the sloth. I need to reread those books.)

        1. I don’t even know. I think I read it once and then would use it in college as a funny “let’s get this party started” saying… like “Let’s go engage in some debauchery!” or something funnier and alcohol induced… And one time I said it in front of my now-husband and he called me out about how I was saying it wrong. Face palm.

      3. When I was younger, I used to read the name Sean as Seeean, not Shawn haha! I thought they were two different names in my head until I was a teenager.

    9. When I was really little, I had this sudden realization that what I thought was ellemeno in the alphabet song was LMNO because I was always singing “ellemeno P!”
      I was a big reader so there were lots of words that I heard incorrectly in my head before I put it together with the pronunciation.

      1. Ditto! I wondered what “aeiou” spelled. The word must be important, if it was so necessary that we learn how to spell it.

        1. I thought “OBGYN” was a bad word because my parents always spelled it when there were kids in the room.

    10. For many, many years, I thought there were two distinct words that meant stylish -“chic” (pronounced “chick”), and “sheek,” which I just never saw in writing.

      1. Me too! I only learned they were the same word when I read out a letter in front of my entire sorority where the mom was calling her daughter “chick.” I was flabbergasted that that was the same word as “shiek.”

    11. I didn’t realize for the longest time ever that I say “cow-webs” instead of “cobwebs” until an intern pointed out to me a couple years ago .

    12. This is a fun thread. Does anyone else fall back into these mispronunciations or malapropisms after a few drinks? I feel embarrassed about this, because while other people may revert to their home dialect or accent, I just revert to my “native language” of what I thought words were when I was four years old.

        2. Hahaha, yes, when someone asks me where in the south I am from, I know it’s time to stop! (5 years in South Carolina had an impact, apaprently!)

      2. I grew up in the DC burbs, now live in Philly. Try as I might, I will always say “Worschington”. For the past 20 years, I have made a concerted effort to say DC instead…. Doing laundry is doing laundry; I avoid saying “warscher”.

      3. I absolutely cannot say “usually.” It’s you-ser-all-y apparently, which is why I always use “typically” instead! It’s not a regional thing, just my brain…

        Gah-zee-boh or gah-zay-boh?

        1. gah-zee-bow! ;)
          There’s a list circulating online of ‘places you’ll mispronounce unless you grew up rich’ or something like that – which is how I learned how places like ‘Antibes’, ‘Nice” “Lucerne” “Chamonix” etc. were actually pronounced. Had NO idea that “Sha-mon-ee” was actually “Chamonix”. It also took me YEARS to be able to correctly say “Siobhan” and “Thierry” when reading them aloud (ie – answering phones where the speakers name pops up).

    13. No joke, I only learned about a year ago (at age 37) that the word ‘biopic’ is bio-pic, like biographical picture, rather than bi-opic. I had seen it written down a million times and never spoken.

      Similar experience in my early 30s with ‘chasm’.

      1. Welp, I only learned that it is bio-pic and not bi-opic today…thanks for sharing!

      2. I thought it was bi-OPP-ick (like myopic). Never heard it said as “bio-pic.” Learn something new everyday, I suppose.

    14. I struggle so hard with saying investigatory – I flip the “sti” with the “ga,” which is super awesome since I do a training for our sites globally which includes the word! I poke fun at myself for it the first time I say it because I know I will not be able to get it right unless I saw it VERY slowly in a hooked on phonics kind of way!

      1. I can ONLY say it properly in the British way “In-VEST-uh-ga-tory” and quickly. Otherwise I stumble over it…

        1. Yes! That’s how I have been making it work too. I will claim my 50% British side for this :)

      2. I can’t say “conscientious” on the first try. It always ends up with like two extra syllables. Conscientioutious.

    15. I adored the Joan Jett song “I love Rocky Road”. I was well into my 30s until someone clued me in. (It seems completely reasonable to me that there should be a rock anthem to a minor flavor of icecream.)

      2. I understood “rock and roll,” but I thought the next line was “Zips in time and a new bop, baby.”

        1. Reminds me of the time my then-preschooler told me that she knew what to do in the event of a fire: “Stop, rock and roll!” complete with her hips twitching to the imaginary beat. I need to remind her of this.

          2. My child said “lasterday” instead of “yesterday” for the longest time, which I loved!

    16. I grew up in Atlanta and went to a lot of baseball games as a child. I thought for years that the last line of the national anthem was ‘land of the free and home of the Braves.’ I was so confused and thought about it a LOT whenever I heard the national anthem in any context. How could the USA be the land of the Braves when the Braves were only in Atlanta? Why would people be singing that line in non-baseball contexts?! It was, um, many years later that I figured it out.

      2. As a Canadian, as a kid you’re taught the national anthem in English and French. I definitely fumbled my way through the French version and to this day do not really know the real French words, just how to vaguely make the right sounds.

      3. And on that note, the mascot of the Braves team was Chief Nokahoma. I still remember the moment it dawned on me while I was sitting in the stadium that it was Chief Knock-a-Homer. And of course cringeworthy now, that you could go visit the Chief in his teepee during the games…

    17. The first meal of the day, to young Pompom, was “brefticks.”

      When I was little, I would pack for vacations in my “soupcase.”

      2. For some reason as a child, I thought the song dirty deeds was about a thunder chief.. not done dirt cheap.

        1. I had “Dunder Chief” and was like – man, Australians have some weird authority figures.

    19. I thought ear lobes were ear loafs, and my mom didn’t correct me for a ridiculously long time.

    20. Another precocious reader – my worst was probably “leen-gear-ree” for lingerie. To this day, I always know the meaning of words and can use them in writing well before I say them out loud. Risky game :)

      1. Same! My dad heard me say “lin gur rie”, laughed and told my mother, who also laughed (and laughed…) and my embarrassment was complete. They both tried to comfort me with words they didn’t know, but it was too late. Totally embarrassed, and about 13 years old, which only made it worse.

      2. I remember as a little girl saying “lingerie” as lin-gurr-ree, and “negligee” as in neg-giggly. Those were the days where you went to a department store and they had a lingerie and negligee section.

    21. Every time I see the word “indictment,” I read it as “in-dickt-ment.” I read a lot of John Grisham novels when I was younger and pronounced it that way in my head for years. Not ideal as I’m now a lawyer, and have to pause when I see it to make sure I don’t mispronounce it out loud. :)

    22. The one my parents still tease me about is how I pronounced biscuits (UK cookies, not the kind you have with gravy): big-sh its. “I want a bigsh it!”

      Also ‘turturing’ for watering plants.

      There were more when I became a reader but those are the big two before then.

      1. Toddlerisms are adorable! My 1.5yo says ‘sleep down’ for ‘lie down’, and ‘atta birdie’ for ‘happy birthday’.

        1. I love these. My son has a speech delay and we try to correct his pronunciation constantly, but he says “cukamama” instead of cucumber and I let him because it is the cutest thing ever.

          1. According to my mom, when I was a toddler I couldn’t pronounce the hard “g” or “k” sounds. My first language is Chinese, and turtle is correctly pronounced “wūguī” in Chinese but I would end up saying “wūduī” instead. I eventually grew out of it but my relatives still make fun of me for it! (And my cousins and I are all in our 30s now!)

    23. Another precocious reader, so many, many words fall into the category (much to my embarrassment). But one that really stands out is “cerulean” – I had the big box of crayons with that color and pronounced it sell-your-een. I guess because the color reminded me of a bright blue pool and chlorine and I wanted it to sound like chlorine? I have no idea. I think this one sticks with me because I STILL pronounce it like this in my head (and happen to be reading a book at the moment where the word comes up a lot.)

    24. I thought the lyrics in “it’s my party, and I’ll cry if I want to” were “it’s my potty, and I’ll cry if I want to”

      I legit asked my mom was she was crying about her potty.

    25. Apparently, I called the hospital a “hotipal” when I was little.
      More amusingly, as a kid who read everything regardless of appropriateness, I read a lot of my mother’s romance novels (or what my father referred to as “dirty books”). I also came from a family that did not ever use proper names for body parts. For years, I thought the word was pronounced pen-iss.

    26. Decorative. It’s deck-o-rate and deck-o-rater, so I thought it was deck-or-a-tive. Nope. It’s deck-rah-tive.

      English. Who can explain it?

    27. Oh, I thought of another good one – my husband’s native language isn’t English (although he’s fluent now) and he sometimes has the best malapropisms. My favorite is a toss-up between when he said something was “spreading like wildflowers” (instead of wildfire) and when he said he would “try his thumb” at a new task. Some of them are the cutest and they show his personality so well.

    28. Fun thread! World War I and World War II were “War War I” and “War War 2.”

    30. I thought Portuguese (I had only ever heard it spoken, not read the word) was the same as “pork-and-cheese”

      1. Also, my parents love telling the story of the time I told my mom that my dad got us a “cond0m” for a vacation (rather than condo).

    31. One of my favorite books as a kid was Absolutely Normal Chaos. Took it out of the library so many times, mispronouncing chaos as “chay-o’s.” I only ever read the word and didn’t hear it spoken aloud for years. Why did no one correct me?

    32. In Korean, “eve” is similar in pronunciation to a Korean word that means “part two”. Whenever my parents talked about plans for “Christmas eve” I thought it was “Christmas, part two” (and kept asking them when is “Christmas, part one.” And whether I will get presents.

      This continued until I was 9 when I started learning English and figured out that “Christmas eve” is actually not a Korean word (although we use the same pronunciation in Korean).

    33. Awry was the one for me. I was sure that the word I was reading was aw-ree. Things went a-rye when I said it out loud.

      2. Yep- said it exactly like you did, in public, as a college student. And no one understood me, so I had to keep repeating it until someone guessed.

    34. I thought dog dirt and dog poop were two different things. I thought dog dirt (which was used as a euphemism for poop in my childhood) was some kind of special dirt dogs created, but not poop.

    35. I grew up on the west coast with a southern dad and a midwestern mom, so we had all kinds of pronunciations going on.

      One of my biggest embarrassments once I was grown up was talking about jewelry and one of my coworkers overheard and confronted me. He felt that I, a gentile, should not be talking about Jewry as if I were an expert on the subject. He was quite angry!

    36. Prague was “Pra-goo” from reading it.

      Malevolent was “Mail-voe-lint” in my head for a number of years.

    37. I still say “Lib” in my head for “Lb” (as in abbreviation for pound).
      And I did think the expression was “for all intensive purposes” as opposed to “for all intents and purposes” for many years.

    39. It took me an embarrassing time to put together rhetoric with the ‘redderick’ they always discuss in the news.

    40. Ped Xing or Animal Xing as “sing” and not “crossing”. Also, I thought genre was pronounced “jehn-ray” instead of “jehn-rah”

    41. I had a bit of a lisp and the sounds S and L were a challenge. I sang “Let It Snow” as “Yet It No” and to this day it’s “yet it no” in our family.

    42. I learned English as a second language and for the longest time I thought “suttle” and “subtle” were two different words!

    44. I pronounced “citrus” as “sir-tick-us”. I have no idea how my brain even got there

    45. Pneumonia, because I was sure I needed to pronounce the p. I knew how what it was and why it was bad. It took me reading a book out loud in the car to my mom for her to realize that I hadn’t connected the word on the page to the spoken word.

    47. This is a fun thread! I have come across many words that I mispronounce (including, apparently, “biopic”) because I have only read them, and never heard them out loud. I also learned, in a zoom meetup with my family, that I have been pronouncing “cabinet” wrong (I apparently say “cabinent” and never realized it). When describing historical sculptures, I also have to pause when I’m speaking to make sure I say “statue” and not “statute” (the latter being way more common in my day to day vocabulary)

    48. I thought the lyrics to the song “Old Town Road” were “gonna take my horse to the hotel room…” Took me about 6 months to realize and still makes me laugh.

  2. I’m lucky and grateful to have had great health in life so far, with honestly my worst illness in memory being a 3-day bad cold/maybe it was a mild flu. The flip side is that I don’t have much experience being sick and get very scared when I think I might be. A lot of things that seem normal for this illness (or even for less serious ones) sound terrifying to me: feeling out of breath or like you can’t get enough air, fever that lasts for days, fatigue so bad you can’t get out of bed, bad coughing fits, not immediately getting better in a linear way.

    I’ve never had any of those symptoms before, and if I do, I know I will immediately start worrying that I’m going to die. Also I am single now so don’t have someone to gut check whether my situation is okay or whether it’s bad enough to need medical attention (which previous partners have done and calmed me down).

    I have started seeing a therapist recently for this anxiety but it’s early days and I’m wondering if anyone has any coping tips for being sick without losing your mind because you temporarily feel bad. I can say to myself “you just temporarily feel bad” but my mind is like “but what if you are actually dying right now? it’s not normal to feel this way!” And now there is real danger, too, not just my usual anxiety.

    1. It is okay to call your doctor for any of these symptoms. They will probably tell you to rest, take Tylenol, and get lots of fluids. But it is fine to call and check!

    2. If you are actually dying right now, you’d be coughing up blood and not breathing on your own. A lot of this can be reconciled with “in two hours I will be dead or bored; what would Vegas set the odds at?” Can you ask yourself: is it POSSIBLE? and then: it is LIKELY?

    3. First, you are not alone in feeling very anxious about this virus. It really does sound dreadful and horrible, and we all have fears of dying should we get this. On the other hand, I (for example) had a friend who had a mild version of this, and she was ok–low fever, cough, exhausted, and recovered at home, and life goes on.

      To help myself, I made a Covid Kit: tylenol, ibuprofen, thermometer, and pulse-oximeter (if your oxygen levels go below 95 or 94, call for help) to check oxygen levels. Cough drops, lots of pjs, cans of soup, etc. eased my mind.

      I suggest you check your town’s website: often there is a public health office, and they are checking on people who are recovering from home if needed. If you prepare perhaps it will ease your mind.

      Look for relaxation and anti anxiety apps to listen to.

      Hang in there, it will be ok.

      1. Thank you! I’m in NYC so I don’t think they have capacity to check on anyone individually, but I do have the stuff in the kit…I have tried to be physically prepared to shore up my mental lack of preparation.

      2. Heeeey, I built that same Covid kit! Mine also includes some tea, my doctor’s phone number, and my wallet with my insurance card sits next to it.

      3. Great kit! Just remember – no ibuprofen. Only tylenol is recommended for Covid symptoms, so may as well stick with that for all cold/flu/gastrointestinal issues for now.

          1. It has not been debunked as a myth. It was always a hypothesis. I often go without tylenol or ibuprofen when I have fevers (I have contraindications for both). I assume there’s some point at which medication is necessary, but in the ICU setting, I understand that the thing that definitely damages your liver over time (tylenol) is preferred over the thing that could immediately damages your kidneys (ibuprofen) anyway.

        2. Neither the CDC, nor the FDA or WHO advise against ibuprofen at this point. Unless you have other issues that are not compatible with ibuprofen, of course.

    4. My main coping tip is to learn breathing exercises. Because testing isn’t widely available and we’ve been advised to handle this alone as much as possible, and the scariest (to me) symptom is the shortness of breath, I found breathing exercises to be the best thing. They serve a triple purpose: they remind you that you ARE currently breathing; they lower anxiety; and they actually work to mitigate SoB symptoms and outcomes. There are tons of apps but one called Breath Ball is really nice.

    5. This is interesting for me to hear, as a person who hasn’t had super serious illnesses, but definitely gets sick often. The human body is actually very very resilient. The fact that you haven’t gotten sick means that your body has encountered a lot of germs over your lifetime that your immune system has beaten. All the different systems of your body have taken incoming at some time or the other, it’s normal. Even if you feel a bit bad, or even very bad, your body can deal with that.

      Last year I got a second degree burn. It healed completely, barely visible scar, with honestly minimal medical intervention other than keeping it clean and protected. How cool! My body was able to repair what was a gruesome looking injury itself. The human body developed and evolved in such a way that ensures its survival (some exceptions apply) and a little sickness is something you can deal with.

    6. I live alone so when sh!t started going down, I bought Tylenol, cough syrup, cough drops, Gatorade, soups, etc. It feels good to be prepared and know I can take care of myself if I do get sick. I also know the majority of people with this virus have mild symptoms that are no worse than a regular cold/flu. It will suck for a little bit, but you will get better. And it’s not like if you do get sick, you have to suffer and die! You ask for help, you call the doctor, you call 911. There are options.

      1. Same. I have this conversation with myself at least once every few days as someone who lives alone.

      2. Same. The last day before shelter-in-place, I stocked up on Nyquil, Chloraseptic, Afrin, and allergy meds. If this hits, I plan to take a giant shot of Nyquil and try to sleep through it.

    7. The following is from the Harvard Business Review’s Management tip of the day, but I think it is good, concrete advice for dealing with anxiety in the moment:

      “Stop Your Mind from Imagining the Worst-Case Scenario: When you feel anxious about losing things that are dear to you, your mind may imagine the worst. To calm yourself, return to the present. Start simple. Name five things in the room: There’s a computer, a chair, a picture of the dog, an old rug, and a coffee mug. Breathe. Realize that in the present moment, this room is your reality. In this moment, you’re OK. Use your senses, think about how these objects feel. The desk is hard. Feel the breath come into your nose. The goal is to find balance in your thoughts. If you feel a negative image taking shape, make yourself think of a positive one. Let go of what you can’t control. And be compassionate and patient with yourself and others. Being generous in your thinking can help brush aside some of your negative thoughts.”

      This is kind of Mindfulness Meditation lite – focusing on the present moment, not sugar-coating or minimizing it, but just accepting it.

      Also, for you I think having a plan might be helpful – like if I start feeling sick, I will call the doctor and they will help me decide what to do. Have the number ready, prepare an if-then chart. Your plan could also include, I will wait x hours to see if my symptoms change before I call, or doing things like taking your temperature–I do this when I start feeling cough-y and start worrying. Just make a written plan. Then when you start spiraling into anxiety you can remind your anxious brain that you have already thought this through and don’t need to rehash it, then try to distract yourself with something else–mindfulness or Kim Kardashian, whatever works.

      Headspace is also currently free for New Yorkers. sending hugs!

      1. Lol, a few nights ago I was lying awake and tried this other exercise people recommend to stop my thoughts from spiraling. Name one thing I can feel, name one thing I can smell, etc. Well, in a city on lockdown, in the middle of the night, there was not a thing that I could hear, hahaha!

    8. If there are still available, sudafed and mucinex are both suggested as good front-line OTC meds. We usually get at least one bad cold/flu a year (kid germs) and these help a TON in getting the gunk out of your chest more quickly. I’d also get a humidifier if you’re sure you can keep it clean, otherwise, a stool (even a folding one!) for your shower so you can sit in hot steamy air (or sit and shower if you’re very sick) are all great ideas.

    9. So I’ve also always been relatively lucky health wise (I’ve had very minor issues but nothing that ever required an ER visit or any other meaningful interventions, never broke or sprained anything, etc.), and it occurred to me recently that I’ve always taken a weird irrational pride in my health and I am really ill equipped to deal with being sick and getting older. I had this epiphany before this whole situation but this certainly hasn’t helped. Do you think it’s possible it’s also tied up with other issues for you? I haven’t quite figured myself out with this stuff but I definitely know there’s something there.

      Anyway, just a thought. And I agree that having a plan helps. Also, remind yourself that even if you get sick, and even if you feel like crap, you will most likely be fine.

      1. AIMS, yes, 100%! I have the same exact situation, weird irrational pride in my health and background knowledge I’m ill-equipped to deal with those things, and it’s not that this problem didn’t exist before this but it has SKYROCKETED during this situation. Just started seeing this therapist 2 weeks ago but she surfaced its connection to issues in my childhood already in a way that makes sense. But it certainly doesn’t mean the feeling has lessened or gone away yet!

        Intellectually I know I will probably be fine but emotionally I can’t make myself feel/believe it. Like the connection between my brain and my emotions has been completely severed.

        1. Honestly, if you take irrational pride in your good health, this is a good moment to check yourself and remind yourself that the vast majority of this is good luck. Even with eating healthy, working out, sleeping well, etc. I have some of the healthiest habits of people I know and am battling cancer. I used to take great pride in my health. It wasn’t a thing I did though. It was luck. Some genetics. Mostly luck. I think you can hurt your health with your habits, but you can’t eat or workout your way to living to 100 without issues.

          1. Totally agreed and maybe pride was the wrong word…I definitely do not think I caused my good health and while I do try to live healthily I’m by no means amazing at that.

          2. People are very blind to their own health. Every member of DHs family has had a lifestyle cancer except for DH. They all swear they’re super healthy yet guzzle milk with their meat nary a vegetable in sight. It’s not luck that DH is cancer free.

          3. “It’s not luck that DH is cancer free.”
            Yes, it absolutely is, you are just too young to realize it. If I sat here and listed the number of very healthy people, fit people who eat tons of vegetables, I have known who have died of cancer, it would take me an hour. Younger people tend to be very smug about how their lifestyle choices are the reason why they have not experienced misfortune, health-wise. I was like that. Then we turned 40 and all of a sudden we started seeing our vegan marathon runner friends get brain tumors, or non-smoker lung cancer, or ovarian cancer, and we realized – this is not as simple as we thought it was. As the body count piled up I learned to be less smug and more grateful. I am sorry you are one of the people on this board who believes that if you do everything “right” you are “safe” – genuinely, I am sorry. Because you will have that perception beaten out of you by life and its unpredictability as the years go on. If you’re lucky enough to live that long.

          4. Anon at 12:13, you are so spot on. All I will say is I lost a marathoner, a vegetarian and a hiking/skiing/outdoors person junkie in my life – three different people – to cancers and heart disease in their 40s. There is so much luck (and sometimes “luck” is actually gene pool) when it comes to baseline heath and people take it very, very for granted.

            My dad is obese who hasn’t cared for himself a day in his life. On the other hand my mom runs 3-6 miles per day 6x/week and does a ‘rest’ day at the gym lifting on day 7… and she’s the one of the pair that has had three absolutely distinct cancer battles,not recurrences (and won. go her).

            I could go on. I will not. Embrace your health, if you are lucky enough to have it.

          5. “It’s not luck that DH is cancer-free” is pretty offensive for the reasons Anon at 12:13 recounts.

        2. Sometimes just identifying the problem is helpful! Think of it as essential step 1.
          And then to deal with anxiety you have to break it down into a million other steps (if you get it, it may be mild; even if it’s not mid, it might not be severe; even if it’s severe, it may not mean hospitalization, and even if it does, it doesn’t mean you won’t survive to tell the tale!). And hey maybe remind yourself that there is no reason to think that your prior good health will not similarly help you in this situation.

        3. “It’s not luck that DH is cancer free.”

          Oh yes it is. I did everything right, very healthy diet, not a smoker, rarely drink, don’t do drugs, eat very little meat, I’m very fit (runner) and no breast cancer history in my family.

          Except I was diagnosed last April (so one year ago) with breast cancer. That IS luck, not the good kind, but luck nevertheless.

    10. I was sick basically from November 2016 to April 2017, either getting sick, being sick, or getting over being sick. Then I felt kind of short of breath and wheezy unto probably Fall of 2017 (walking through indoor garages or subways with lots of pollution was awful). But then one day I realized, Hey, I feel pretty much normal! And I’m oldish (52), so there’s that.

      I was quite sick with what was probably the flu in January. So much sweating – I’d wake up in the middle of the night and have to put on new pajamas and move to dry spot on the bed (it was so gross). And I was basically immobile for most of the day for nearly a week. Again, it took a few weeks to get over it and I felt like I would NEVER be well, but then I was.

      So, for most of us, I agree with the poster down thread – we’re resilient. I realize COVID is different, but so far there’s no reason not to believe that a significant majority of people who get sick will get through it okay.

    11. I have a chronic lung condition and have a LOT if experience with all of the symptoms of COVID, even the scary ones (coughing up blood, serious shortness of breath necessitating supplemental oxygen). The best thing I can say is that your body is resilient and it takes a lot for it to get completely beat. For about 3 years, my lung function was somewhere between 75 and 90% of normal. Even with that long period of subpar health and all of the misery that accompanied it, I was able to get back to almost 100% of lung function once I was on highly effective medication that addressed the underlying cause of the disease. If you are starting with even a not-ideal slate, your body has the tools to come back from illnesses and be as good or quite nearly as good as it was before. Obviously that isn’t always the case, especially here, but in most cases people are coming out of this after a few weeks of suck and can go back to normal life fairly quickly.

    12. I had serious pneumonia requiring hospitalization 6 times before the age of 15. What I can tell you about serious respiratory illness is that even as a kid (other than the time I was 2) you will know when you hit the “I need to go to the hospital” level of not being able to breathe. It is a very distinct feeling to be going through the mechanics of breathing and struggling to get air.

      If you have any concerns or are really feeling bad you should always call your doctor / a clinic. I’d add to this set yourself some rules like “I will call and seek a medical opinion with a fever higher than 102 that doesnt break for more than 24 hours / if I go more than 24 hours without being able to keep anything in my stomach / if I have shortness of breath. Don’t attempt to mental toughness your way through or think that not taking medication is some sort of sign of strength. My mother was like that, hence my repeated bouts with pneumonia.

      1. Thanks, that is actually helpful to know, as someone who is lucky enough not to have experienced this even a tiny bit.

  3. How’s everyone feeling? I am feeling good. I got to be alone last night for 40 glorious minutes. I let the silence relax my ears and it felt great. Also I have zero meetings today!

    If you need a pep talk, comment below and I will tell you how awesome you are!

    1. I surprisingly had a good week minus the gross weather in Michigan – SNOW in April!
      Enjoy the weekend, y’all – I am grateful to have this community, we can get through this!

      1. My great grand-boss said to us: “It’s not ‘we will get through this’–we already are getting through it. It’s happening now, and we are in the process of getting through it.” There was even a sign up that said this on the door to the staff break room on our inpatient unit. (I’m not sure if he himself put it up, or got the concept from whomever did.)

        1. There’s gonna be so much innovation to come out of this. I know there’s still a lot of suffering and madness but I feel a lot of hope for the future. What a nice sign!

      2. Yes Abby!!! I’m looking out my window in SE Michigan and it is full winter wonderland out there!!

    2. My husband and his siblings just agreed on the specifics of the DNR order for their 80-something-year-old mother, who is in assisted living and was just diagnosed with COVID-19. Now all we can do is wait.

      1. This is very hard. Sending you and your family positive energy for these difficult days.

      2. I think that is very merciful of them. Hopefully it won’t come to that but if it does I think their mother will be pleased by the DNR, which is a very gentle alternative to invasive interventions.

        1. Yes, in this case the interventions they have declined have basically no hope of success anyway. The survival rate for people like her with COVID-19 on a ventilator is basically zero. There is evidence that less invasive methods of supplying oxygen may work just as well as or even better.

      3. Hugs to you, your husband, and his siblings. We had to do this with my mom when she was very sick two years ago and it is the hardest decision in the world to make. It’s also one of the most merciful, I know now, but it was not an easy decision by any means.

        Hoping your MIL comes through this.

      4. I am so sorry your family is going through this, but what an amazing thing they are doing by talking about it now, rather than later. Having lived through the latter situation, this is the least terrible of the options. Sending warm thoughts from the internet in this difficult time.

      5. I don’t want to give false hope or anything, but where I work we’re actually finding a lot of asymptomatic Long-Term Care residents who are testing positive as testing expands. It’s scary to think about in one way, but in another I find it really comforting. If even those who are in the most vulnerable population can get it and be asymptomatic, maybe there’s hope for everyone else!

    3. I am okay. My husband’s grandfather passed away unexpectedly on Wednesday. He’s reeling and I’m struggling to support my normally no-emotions husband who is suddenly swimming in the biggest emotion for the first time in his life. I think I’m doing an okay job, but I’m hardly going to beg him to tell me how I’m doing right now, so I feel an awful lot like I’m flying blind.

      And further, although I’m getting to be involved in lots of new stuff at work that hopefully represents the long road to a promotion, it really feels like it’s exposing how much I don’t know. Like this morning I got an email from the guy who is training me on some of this stuff and said, “By the way, just in case, don’t do X. But I’m probably pointing out the obvious…” he was not, and I have already done X, a lot. AGH.

      1. You’re doing an okay job! He’s just gotta get through it, you can’t feel his feelings for him. As long as you’re not actively being an asshole you’re fine.

        As for how much you don’t know… my industry (pharma) is very comfortable with the idea that none of us knows everything so take heart. We all don’t know SO MUCH that’s why we need to work together.

        You’re awesome, Vicky Austin! (see that even almost rhymes, that’s how you know it’s true)

      2. Oh Vicky, big hugs. First your new work: If it was me, I would reply “Appreciate you looking out for me, feel free to continue to point out the obvious so I know I’m learning things correctly!” He doesn’t know how much you do or don’t know, and don’t worry about asking a lot of questions, you are being trained for a reason. My brother told me to ask extra questions now, because it’s a lot worse to ask them later in a new job.
        As for your husband, I’m so so sorry. I was a little surprised by my aunt’s passing a few weeks ago and also am not very emotional, and it helped when my husband just held me while I cried. He also asked me a few times how I was each day, and even though I always answered “ok”, it was nice to be acknowledged. You don’t need to say a lot, but being available for him to talk to is worth more than you’d expect.

      3. Sending you hugs, too, Vicky! I’m so sorry about your husband’s grandfather. I agree, too, that all you can do is be there for your husband. Everyone deals with grief in their own way and while you’re muddling through how to help your husband, he’s muddling through how to handle how he’s feeling. Just be there for him — you don’t have to say anything, just be there. That’s all you can do.

        As for work, nobody is expecting you to be perfect or know everything. I’m sure it’s a whole new ballgame in this situation, especially if you’re WFH. Maybe on the things you’ve done before, you could ask “With X, is it like ? Do you do it the same way?” Then the guy training you will know you already know that much and can train you on what you don’t know, all while maybe framing things in a way that ties what you’ve already done/know to what you’re learning. Maybe this isn’t even relevant to your situation. I’m just tossing out an idea that might help. I can’t imagine trying to learn a new job in the mess we’ve got going right now, so kudos to you for taking on a challenge. Good Morning! is right, you are awesome and you can do this!

      4. Thank you so much, all three! I appreciate the scripts, the hugs, the good cheer. Y’all rock!

    4. Thankful that the powers that be where I work decided on salary cuts rather than layoffs. The cuts are no picnic and fall less on lower-paid positions than higher-paid ones. But a 100% pay cut when there is a slim chance of getting hired again right now would be devastating.

    5. I’m taking a small victory in one of my houseplants. I’ve had this pothos for easily a year, and for a while it was just kind of alive, but not thriving. Long story short, I moved it to a new spot in the house and now it’s large enough that I can transplant a few shoots into a new pot.
      We have a birdhouse in our backyard that has its first residents this year. A few weeks ago they were mere eggs, now they’ve hatched into a bunch of healthy chicks. Based on the egg color, I’m quite certain they are robins.
      My baby boy keeps growing and kicking away. It seems like an eternity away right now, but he will be here before we know it at the end of July.
      Life keeps moving y’all and we can too!

      1. For your houseplants: I got a new app a few months ago, Planta, and it is amazing. You list which plants you have and in which room (to determine amount of sun) and it will notify you when to water them. I’ve been much more diligent about my plants since then and they are really growing!

        1. Thank you for the suggestion! I’m lazy and tend to water almost all my houseplants (except my succulents) on the same day every week. Probably not the optimal watering schedule, and this app sounds perfect.

          1. I have killed 5+ succulents and finally have one living its best life thanks to the app! I learned I’m really only supposed to water it like once a month…

      2. Once pothos get into the right spot, they grow like crazy. I have one near a window in my kitchen and I just repotted it and will have to repot it again soon, it is out of control!

        I have gotten really into houseplants recently and I’m finding that taking care of them is soothing and contemplative, just the right activity for a time like this.

    6. This week has triggered my worst migraines like, ever – the barometric pressure shifts (torential rains and winds! tornado watch! freezing temps! snow! sun and clear skies!), plus stress and that time of the month and I’ve been flattened. I am really just looking forward to a weekend of not having to look at screens and spend some time outside and exercising.

      1. I don’t get migraines but I have had a headache since Monday night. Weather is all over the place here too. I hope things even out and we can recover soon!

      2. I hear that, I’ve been sneezing all morning and Aunt Flo is peeking around the corner, ughhhh.

      3. Same here – had a bad migraine for two days now. Plus my jaw clenching is acting up at night which doesn’t help. Already have an appointment to get a mouth guard (I have TMJ so it has to be made specially). Hope you feel better!

      4. I was in bad shape Sun-Tues as the front moved through our area. I just kept taking my preventative migraine med and hoping for the best. I had to lay down for awhile on Tuesday afternoon but was grateful it didn’t get too bad.

      1. Ugh, ouch. I am waiting for this to happen even though I am also working at 95% (at home, with two kids).

      3. Same. It did not help I was talking to some UK friends who informed me that while some London firms were cutting pay, they were also correspondingly cutting hours requirements. It must be nice to have employment contracts and labor protections.

    8. I’m doing okay! We have had beautiful weather this week and my knee has been well enough to walk about 4.5 miles a day. Still waiting for my new bike to be ready and I need to figure out the helmet situation. My new glasses were supposedly (finally!) ready but they swapped the lens type in my glasses and sunglasses. I just had to laugh and get them to fix it. I will probably get them Monday. Nothing is normal!

      I am finally getting to work mostly from home. There is an article coming out in the school newspaper that may increase my work but I am trying to roll with it. Had a fun appointment with a grad student last night. Sadly, I had to make the decision yesterday not to teach in the fall, but I am surprisingly at peace with it. A former colleague called me the other day and did a tarot card reading for me. Lots to digest there! Busy day today then the weekend! Virtual hugs to all of you wonderful women.

      1. I lived in New Orleans for a short time a long time ago and I still miss it. I remember riding bikes was great because it was all very flat. Sounds like you have a lot of fun things going on and I’m glad your knee feels better!

        1. When I went to Bicycle World, the sales guy let me ride bikes up and down their alley to try them and I told him that I probably hadn’t ridden a bike in 40 years, at which point, he realized that I am older than I look (!). This city is a minefield for bicyclists in normal times, but I’m going to give it a shot.

          Yeah I have a lot going on. I just heard that La Boulangerie is open for takeout and it’s a perfect choice for a friend’s birthday that is tomorrow, so I’m trying to work that out. Luckily, so far, work has been quiet this morning. I just never know!

        1. You, too, cat socks! I think the knee pain and immobility was partly what was making me so depressed. What I discovered the other day was that it feels better if I am walking on it. So I’m wearing a brace and walking on dirt rather than pavement, but it’s something!

    9. I went to my actual office yesterday and finally felt like I could work at 100%. It was so eerie feeling alone in a big city though. My building takes up about half of a block and I saw 5 co-workers total (we are all essential but largely WFH) over about 10 hours.

    10. A bit tired today but I’ve been making some work progress and settling into a work from home routine. Just trying to tick a few projects off the list before the weekend. A bit stressed as my husband will need to go into the office every Tuesday from next week. We’ve been so diligent about social distancing – taking walks at quiet time, restricting our food shopping to a weekly visit tiny farm shop with incredible safety protocols once a week, and he’s going to be in a massive building with people travelling from all over the country.

      Submitted a job application this week and while it’s a total long-shot, I keep daydreaming/worrying about what it would mean for life. It’s a pretty significant commute, one which would likely require being away from home 2-3 nights a week, at least during term-time. But it’s academia, so beggars can’t be choosers.

        1. Ah, that’s super helpful! I’m sure they will all be very careful but makes me a bit anxious as an immuno-compromised person.

    11. I’m feeling good today. I had a zoom happy hour last night with my fellow associates at our sattelite biglaw office. We’re not one of the biglaw firms that has announced salary cuts, and no one’s work has completely stopped yet, but we’re all slower than usual (and we’re predicting that if things don’t pick up by early to mid May, we’ll be getting lay offs or furloughs or salary cuts or all of the above). I am thankful for the partners that I work for, who were associates at the firm during 2007-2009 understand the anxiety I am feeling and are having regular check in calls and are making sure that I am getting my hours in by passing more and more tasks to me. I am grateful for one of the big equity partners that I work for, (who is a male with a stay at home wife and no kids, so doesn’t live the reality of two WFH parents with an infant), who, after a client was annoyed when I relayed news that a closing date was being pushed out yet again, told the client that “people keep touting that everything is seamless in this ‘Work From Home Era’. It’s not and that’s a lie for anyone who says it. There will be delays beyond anyone’s control and resulting frustrations. I can assure that we are working as hard as possible to minimize delays and frustrations, but there will still be some.” The client backed down after this, but I am appreciative of the leadership in my practice group and firm – providing clear communication about the state of the firm; sticking up for associates and genuinely understanding that me working from home 100% of the time is not the same thing as me working from the office and not pretending to clients that everything is normal. Who knows… they might lay me off at any point, but I think that I work for genuinely goodhearted people.

        1. I think so! And this will reveal my firm and office for anyone else from my office who reads here, but the managing partner of our particular office has been sending out an email each day we’ve been working from home (even weekends) with his favorite comics and quotes/proverbs. He said he would be doing it every day while we work from home as a way of staying in touch and connecting with everyone in the office that is not an overt “how are you doing” email. I’ve come to enjoy it more than I thought I would.

          1. I wish our site director would do this. We’ve been WFH for a month now and I think he’s sent out 3 emails total. My direct supervisor only checks in with my team once a week on our 15 min conference call. It’s ridiculous and is killing everyone’s morale.

    12. I’m glad you were able to have some quiet time! And zero meetings on Friday sounds wonderful.

    13. Regular poster on the moms site going anon for this. I am feeling like this situation is exacerbating the difficulties that parents face in this country.

      I have two small kids (4 and 1.5), which is hard enough to deal with in regular times but is extremely challenging now without childcare and with trying to work from home. The shelter in place orders make parents do the impossible, which is just not sustainable beyond a few weeks at most and trying to continue this will lead to negative repercussions for the kids, not so much for their lack of educational learning but from negative effects on the parents who try to balance something that is not meant to be balanced this way.

      For those of you who may say we parents chose this “lifestyle” – well, first off all, I didn’t choose to have kids in a quarantine and try to take care of them without any help and without being able to go to playgrounds and whatnot, and second of all, I think we’re all trying to raise kids who will become productive members of society i.e. those of you who plan to be in nursing homes or have medical needs in the future will need these kids to take care of you. Or be your plumbers. Or your housecleaners. Or office workers that help drive company profits to help your retirement accounts. This interconnectedness often gets lost in the debate between parents and non parents.

      So what’s the point of this rant? I’m seeing a lot of posts where parents feel guilty for not working enough. Well that’s because caregiving is not seen as valuable work by those in charge as they (generally) have never had to balance caregiving with paid work. I’m working 6:30am-8:30pm everyday in between paid work and caregiving so I don’t feel guilty, I feel angry that some companies have expectations that people continue to remain “productive” when it’s literally impossible to try to do everything ourselves. I wish that all companies (even biglaw!) would recognize this now and not penalize those who don’t put in the same hours, but barring that, I wish there were some government recognition or acknowledgement of this. And maybe penalties for those companies that don’t provide accommodations. And for those of you who can afford outside help right now because your companies aren’t being accommodating, you shouldn’t feel guilty at all about having to balance the risks when the options are just not great. Do I want more people to get this virus and die? No. But the negative impact on my mental health, my employment and my kids needs to be considered too when I’m not getting a solution from governments or companies.

        1. Because she’s exhausted and at the end of her rope. I get it. It helps to vent. This is really, really hard on the parents. Especially of young kids who need constant supervision.

          1. Can’t you take some time off to handle your mom stuff? Sounds like you’re not contributing much at work anyway.

          2. Wait, what? That’s not a fair suggestion. Besides, yes, someone could take a day or even a week, but who knows how long this will last? It’s not going to be better by next Friday, so that’s not really workable.

          4. “Can’t you take some time off to handle your mom stuff? Sounds like you’re not contributing much at work anyway.”
            If I knew who you were in real life, and I sent this comment along with the OP’s post to your mother, your best friends and your spouse or children, would you feel proud of yourself for posting it? If the answer is “no,” maybe next time don’t do something like this.

          5. Not meant to be trolly. I know several women who have cut their hours or voluntarily furloughed themselves to prioritize family obligations and avoid underperforming at work.

        2. Right. Well when you start out with aggression/condescension like this, OP…

          -signed, a childless person who 100% agrees with you and empathizes, but really doesn’t appreciate being talked to like I’m your enemy. You are not having children for the purpose of gifting me future plumbers.

          1. I agree with OP’s point and want to give her recognition she deserves but I also think this was a weird way to put this. Like, doesn’t this mean that her kids should thank me for giving them their future jobs? Good thing I exist so her future kid has a nursing home job or plumbing job? So weird.

          2. I think OP is just fed up with the subset of childless people who are insufferably smug about how it is morally wrong for anyone to have children. I have one of these people on my staff. She is very young and has zero life experience, and it drives me up the wall whenever I hear her pontificating on how selfish it is for people to breed. She’s lucky her parents didn’t share her views.

          3. “I think OP is just fed up with the subset of childless people who are insufferably smug about how it is morally wrong for anyone to have children.”

            And no one here said anything like that, so it just seems necessarily pot-stirry to lead with a counter attack right of the gate.

      2. Just wanted to chime in and say I hear you. I do not have kids. But I am working hard to understand and see how I can be helpful to my friends and employees who do. Many like me are (and many are not). You did not choose this situation. Hell no. This is impossible to maintain. I literally have no idea how you parents out there are doing this.

        We see you! We support you! I know there are people and institutions who don’t see you, or are looking at you through their dirty lenses, but I am hopeful this situation will help them see more clearly just how hard this is. Being a parent in this country (world?) right now is damn near impossible.

        2. I hear you! I remember how stupidly hard it was to be a working mom back in the day, and I only had one child and I was not in a pandemic! I really hope we come out of this with a lot of structural changes, not least of which will be some rational child care policies.

        3. +1. I honestly think the problem is there just isn’t a lot I can do to help a parent right now. I can’t go to your house. I can pick up the slack at work, have some grace and am doing that but really what else is there?

        4. Also want to say I hear you. No kids, and it’s hard enough to keep the wheels on in my household. I have a lot of sympathy for my coworkers with kids. Their work might not be at the level it was before the crisis, but tbh neither is anyone’s. Everyone’s just trying to get through this.
          Hugs from an internet stranger. The current situation is an impossible ask of working parents with small kids.

      3. Are you a single parent? Is your husband still working outside the home, or is he not helping you when he is home? This seems like the exact thing that the FFCRA was intended to address with the additional paid leave provisions.

      4. I’m really sorry working parents in this country don’t have very good options. I can’t even imagine how hard it is. And biglaw…sigh.

        I hear you.

    14. My mood was lifted 1000% this morning when I found out it’s likely golf will be opened back up in my state, as early as tomorrow. Happy feelings leaked out of my eyes, and it’s possible I went and told my golf clubs. I also purchased a Veronica Beard jacket from their big sale, so I can have something I’m really excited to wear when this is all over. I was supposed to be on a trip this weekend, so the little bit of good news is softening the blow of seeing these dates pass on the calendar from home.

      Overall, I also got a big lift this week on our monthly company-wide meeting. My company is a great place to work in general, and they’re really showing with words and actions that leadership is putting their people first.

      1. How fun! I’m so happy for you and your golf clubs! I’ve never played but I can imagine how nice it would be to be outside walking around. Glad your company is being positive too.

          1. +1 golf isn’t my cup of tea but I’m not going to say that no one can have their hobbies back just because mine can’t be done while socially distancing.

        2. We feel really lucky because our outlet – cycling – has not been cut off from us during this time. Our other outlet, going to the gym and lifting weights, has been cut off from us, but at least we can still get out on our bikes. Had we lost that, we would have really struggled. I totally feel what Anon at 10:23 is saying and I’m really happy for her. Have posted this before, but my dad is a golfer and going golfing (while maintaining social distancing) has kept him sane during this time; the courses around him stayed open.

      3. My husband is dying to be able to play golf. I know it’s a sticky topic, but I think if people avoid the use of carts, pay online, it’s more distancing than walking around our neighborhood. Glad it lifted your spirits!

      4. Hobbies are SO important. I’m glad that golf will open for you! It seems like a sport where good social distancing can take place too.

    15. I’m not doing so well today – starting a few weeks ago, we took 50% pay cuts as a management team. I decided to apply for a job that I didn’t consider to be a long shot, and last night got the email saying there were lots of qualified candidates, so sorry not to move forward with me at this time, etc. They had a finalist in the pipeline already, from what I have heard, and it’s not like it’s really about me, anyway, but I’m feeling kind of rejected and trapped. I don’t actually want to leave my current job, but I’m scared that it’s going to go from this current massive pay cut to furloughs or layoffs soon, and I thought this other thing was a pretty safe option.

      1. They probably would have loved to have you if they didn’t already have a candidate in mind. Keep trying, there’s a place out there for you.

    16. Had a few sticky work calls today and my manager has stood up for me about it 100%. Which is nice and makes me realise how odd things were in my last role.

      3. My last manager was more likely to stab me in the back than she was to have my back and it’s taken 7+ months to feel like my new manager is someone I can trust.

    17. I had an acquaintance of mine that is tangentially related die tragically yesterday (not COVID19). In theory it shouldn’t affect me that much as we weren’t close. In reality, I’m a wreck and it’s hitting me incredibly hard. I’m just so angry and sad and it’s making me worthless today.

      2. It’s just one more brutal thing on top of everything else. I hope you have a better day tomorrow. You’re never worthless.

    18. I’ve been all over the place this week but today is a good day. I’m doing some different things at work due to consolidation of duties and sending some people home, and getting great feedback from above, so that’s been nice. And the tenants in my house came through with the rent after I gave them an extension to the 15th and that was a huge relief.

      Sending love and encouragement to all of you who are struggling!

      1. I mean I’m not sending people home. I mean I’m doing different things because some people have been sent home. Anyway. As you were.

    19. I’m doing okay! Felt pretty unproductive at work this week, but I am trying not to beat myself up. I’m completing projects, have had multiple calls, and have been doing team projects too so I’m trying to just appreciate what I have completed. Can’t wait for this weekend to spend time away from my laptop with my dogs and husband.

    20. Thank you for this post! I don’t need a pep talk nor to be told I’m awesome, but I do appreciate others who can appreciate the little things right now. I’ve had yet another horrible day of living through this pandemic stuff, and reading this cheery comment at the end of the day is already starting to brighten it.

  4. Just wanted to say thanks for the help re: 401k contributions and pay cuts yesterday! Really helpful and I’m going to wind up cutting my contributions in half until I have a full emergency fund then scaling back up.

    1. I like it but my sense of style is a bit flashy. Maybe go ahead and get it and return it if you don’t like it?

    2. It would be too “on the nose” for me. Meaning, too “pinstriped suit that I wear in a straight-up way to a corporate office.” If my style were more free, individual, or trendy (it’s not), I think it could be worn in a really great way and look fantastic. Instead, I’d just look like the caricature of a middle-aged corporate person.

      So I think it depends totally on how it’s going to look ON you, and how you want to look in your workplace. Totally worth ordering it and playing around with how to style it.

      1. Me too. I think it would look great with a hot pink, yellow or (my fave) chartreuse blouse. I guess I also trend toward flashy.

    5. Pinstripes are classic – I had a skirted pinstripe suit that I wore to bar mitzvahs and the like with a dressy blouse – but it was a subtler stripe, black with a sort of gray thin stripe. This is a pretty strong white stripe with a lot of contrast, so it might have to be a “see it in person” to fairly evaluate whether it looks classic or cheap.

    6. I love this – I work in a business casual office so would pair it with white jeans, nude block heels and call it a day, probably with a white blouse.

      1. +1 I have a black pinstripe blazer that I wear with jeans for work travel (not meetings, but the actual traveling part). Then, I wear the blazer with a solid jewel tone sheath dress for meetings.

    7. I’m not a particularly flashy dresser. I had a similar suit a few years ago, then lost some weight and gave it to a friend, who lovingly wears it now. Go for it! I think pinstripes are a classic.

    8. I’m coming to come right out and say no for the following reasons:
      1. I am not a woman who will ever get between another woman and her potential clothing purchase, but just looking at the picture on this one shows poorly made quality, possibly coupled with poor fabrication (impossible to tell online unfortunately, because even with a fabric like polyester, there can be a significant quality divide. Unfortunately, I’m also unfamiliar with the brand to be able to tell you whether their products are generally good.
      2. Pinstripes, however, are never a bad idea. I don’t ever work in a business attire environment anymore, but I always keep pinstripe suits on hand because the blazer, skirt/pants, or dress pieces always come in handy when I do need a suit or want to pair them with other non-matching items.
      3. Black and gray pinstripes tend to be more aesthetically sleek than navy, but that may be a personal preference. And to echo off of LaurenB’s comment, you never want bold white pinstripes, as this tends to look cheap. I’m a fan of cream or off-white stripes, or if white, very fine stripes.
      4. Overall, I think pinstripes are great, regardless of whether you’re minimalist or flashy. Since you’re the former, if you were to get a pinstripe suit with better stitching and fabrication than this particular one, stay away from a white button-up; you’ll cross the minimalist line into frumpy. Stick with a collarless blouse, and if you can convince yourself to go flashy, then perhaps a colorful tie-neck blouse would spruce up the look.

    9. I had a pin stripe like that and really liked it. I am not flashy so wore it with silk tops in light colors.

  6. All this staying home has me thinking about travel (not just vacation, but actually seeing/experiencing different places), and how I haven’t done enough of it. What are your thoughts on places a person really should see in a lifetime?

    For places I’ve actually been, the ones that come to mind: the Louvre, Norte Dame (sigh), Westminster Abby, the Washington DC monuments, the Smithsonian Museum of Natural History the Freedom Tower in NY, the Statue of Liberty and Ellis Island, and Disney World (I realize that’s a funny addition, but in terms of “wow, they really did something amazing here,” it’s sort of mind-blowing).

    What are yours?

    2. Its not easy to get to Dettifoss waterfall in Iceland, but it was amazing and so worth it. Unlike anything else I’ve seen.

      1. Iceland generally is just amazing. One of the coolest experiences I had when I was there this last summer was to stand on the edge of the North American plate and look across to the European plate. Also, now would be the time to go because the glaciers are disappearing.

    3. I would add national parks, particularly the humongous ones in the US or Canada like Grand Canyon, Yellowstone, or anything along the Rockies. It’s hard not to be awed by the sense of scale looking at these massive geologic formations. And breathtakingly beautiful too!

    4. Antarctica!
      Yes it’s expensive. Yes it’s a tough journey to get there. YES IT WAS WORTH IT!!! And I’m not even someone who likes being out in nature usually but I absolutely loved it. It was just a truly awe-inspiring place.

    5. The Grand Canyon via raft, Yosemite, the Swiss Alps, Paris, Rwanda, Hawaii, too many ski mountains to name…I’m more into the natural wonders and I feel like I’ve barely scratched the surface.

    6. London Bridge/Big Ben, Paris, NY city skyline, the Washington memorial/reflecting pool, Grand Canyon, at least one or two national parks in the US.
      I’d love to do more travel when possible! On my bucket list are a safari, trip to Hawaii, Alaska, and the Galapagos.
      Also – anyone else find it too emotionally difficult to visit certain places/go more than once? I’m glad I did the Vietnam memorial/holocaust museum/Anne frank house, but I just don’t think I can do them again. I also haven’t been able to make myself go to the Freedom Tower, too raw (still) as a NY’er.

    7. I have no opinion about what anybody else should see, but I finally made it to Venice last summer and it blew. my. mind. So amazing. I’ve been saying for years that I wanted to get there before it sank, and darned if I didn’t just make it by a matter of weeks.

    9. This is kind of depressing me (not that you should stop having the convo!) because H was planning on retiring at the end of this year, and our plan for 2021 and beyond was to travel, travel, travel all over the world and do all the travel we delayed while working and building up our next egg. We’re still young and active enough to do very active vacations – Machu Picchu, hike the Alps, etc. I would have been in the midst of planning all this travel, and now I just can’t even think about it because who knows when it will be safe /appropriate to do so. I realize this is a very first world problem to have.

      1. Yes, my husband and I were talking about this last night. Pretty much since we met, we have always been planning the next trip, and now… not. So strange.

        But… I have long thought that because of climate change, the era of willy-nilly air travel was going to have to come to an end at some point anyway. So maybe this is just the nudge we need to make that happen sooner rather than later, and maybe that’s not the worst thing.

      2. We had a trip to Peru for first week in June to hike to Machu Picchu and I’m telling myself it’s not cancelled just postponed to avoid being extra sad

    10. Safari – by far the best trip I’ve ever taken, and amazing to see animals in their natural habitat. We went to South Africa (but I’m sure safaris elsewhere are equally amazing).

    11. Love all the suggestions above, but instead of actual sites or natural wonders would add places so incredibly different from your regular life that give you a taste of other worlds. Some of my favorites have been the colorful chaos of cities in India (Delhi, Bangalore, Mysore, Calcutta), trekking through small villages in Laos, floating villages in Cambodia and Burma, Mexico City and the small towns of the Yucatan, Valparaiso in Chile, Tel Aviv, Beirut, the old city of Fez and the date palm oases in Morocco. When the world opens back up I would love to explore more of sub-Saharan Africa and east Asia, although I mainly chase airfare deals (and often travel on the cheap while on the ground) so who knows where I’ll end up.

    12. Iceland. It is beautiful and really makes global warming real when you go to a glacier and see the sign where it was 10 years ago and see how much it has shrunk, or when you see the huge number of geothermal plants. But also, Blue Lagoon is one of the only super tourist-y things I’ve ever done that I would (and have!) done again.

      Walking to the top of the Arc de Triomphe. I did it the same day I went to the top of the Eiffel Tower and the views from both- and of each other!- were incredible.

  7. What are you doing this weekend that you’re looking forward to? I enjoyed reading the responses last week so I’m asking again! I’m going to start a new craft project, run to a landmark in my city, try making a tofu-based dish, and I might give in and sign up for Disney Plus because Disney movies sound good right now.

  8. Non COVID post.

    If money were no object, what vacuum would you buy? 3 kids (tons of crumbs), no pets now but on the horizon. Too much clutter for a roomba. Mostly low pile area rugs over hardwood. 3500 Sq ft and 3 staircases. Lost of nooks and crannies that need the little tiny tools.

    FWIW we have biweekly cleaners that bring their own vacuum. Ours is old, cheap, and dying (esp under the new workout it gets!), and was bought in 2009 for my house apartment which was 1000sq ft and had no children or pets ;-).

    1. Pick up the clutter and get a roomba. You have too much going on to haul out a vacuum all the time.

      Second choice, Miele canister style.

      1. We have 2 kids and a Roomba. We used to use it more, but haven’t in awhile. Since it runs all around the task of making sure every piece of lego or whatever is cleaned up in the entire open area it can run around just seems daunting. Also, my 4 and 5 year olds are scared of it and run and scream from it (I suspect this is more to be dramatic at this point, but a couple of years ago they were legit scared of it). I know there is a lot of Roomba love and this won’t be everyone with kid’s experience, but just my 2 cents.

        We tend to use our Dyson cordless much more, b/c then we can just quickly spot clean under the table or just the main area rug without making it a whole production. Even my husband is into using it.

        2. My husband definitely uses our cordless Dyson more. I think it feels kind of like a leaf blower to him.

    3. I would buy three matching Shark/ G-tech cordless vacuums (or however many is the right amount to have one on each floor of the house) and the matching handheld vacuum accompaniments. I have the Gtech one and I love it.

    4. I think you might want 2 – a Miele canister and a cordless Dyson with all the brush heads, or at least both the hard-surface only one and the power brush one, as the latter will not pick up large debris like Cheerios, and the former is not good for rugs. But I would try the cordless Dyson first. You might want something more powerful for the carpets or if you run out of charge for the Dyson. (I’m in a 1,300 sq foot duplex apartment and our older Dyson V6 does about 60-75% of that on a charge when used in normal, not turbo, mode).

      1. The Miele isn’t good on rugs? Ugh.

        We have a cordless stick vac in the mudroom but I hardly consider that a vacuum. We would also downgrade our current vac to be on one floor and generally keep the new one on the main floor.

        We sweep the kitchen, not vacuum, but mainly bc the vacuum is a hassle.

        1. I’m not the person you’re replying to but I have a Miele with a separate powered head for rugs. We only have Area rugs (Persian type) but it works great on those. We just have to switch out the head.

        2. Very late response but no, I meant that the Dyson “fluffy head” — which is marketed only for hard floors — isn’t good on rugs, and like any cordless the Dyson in general is a little less powerful than a corded vacuum so may not be enough for keeping your rugs clean, depending on your rugs and preferences. I have no personal experience with Mieles but owning one was a fantasy until we got the Dyson. We actually have 3 vacuums, partially because 2 were free, but none are that fancy. The Dyson v6 is what gets used the most, but we also have a basic Eureka upright I use on our area rugs, especially the shag carpet. And we have an old panasonic canister that we use occasionally, sometimes as a shop vac. If I were to buy something new I would get a newer Dyson cordless. But I live in a much smaller space.

    5. That $800 pink dyson. love it/always have wanted it, would wedding register for it but i’m single and stuck in my house for the foreseeable future.

    6. I LOVE my Dyson stick vac that I bought at Costco last year. I have always hated vacuuming, but this one doesn’t have a cord, which makes the whole thing so much easier. It also doesn’t weigh very much and has easy to use attachment parts. And it’s quiet. I now vacuum public areas at least once a week because it’s no big deal.

      1. +1 – we just got the Dyson v10 stick and it is SO easy to use and so much quieter. I HATE vacuuming but even I will use this.

    7. We have a yellow ball Dyson that is still going strong 10 years later, even with 4 hairy humans and a shedding dog. We use a Roomba in our family room twice a week since that’s the area where dog and family hang out the most, to help supplement the Dyson. If I had a ton of money, I’d maybe try out a cordless pet hair version of the Dyson to see if it’s even better.

    8. I don’t know what you are planning with “pet”, but friends of ours had a Roomba and 2 large dogs and a Very Bad Thing happened with a dog accident and the Roomba. so. Think about that. I love my Dyson.

  9. Per Pew Research, 81% of Americans believe social distancing should continue as long as needed to curb the spread of the virus even if it means continued economic damage. 73% think the worst of the virus is yet to come. 66% percent are concerned that state governments will lift restrictions too quickly.

    Yet, the push to start reopening things is getting louder. A heck of a lot louder than any push to just give people more money and pause rent/mortgage payments. Under normal circumstances, I hate our excessive deficit spending but these aren’t normal circumstances! In my fantasy world, there would be a focus on a massive testing apparatus and robust financial help while we stay at home. In my real world, there is a 0% of that happening. My governor (Missouri) is already making noises about starting the reopening process next month and my firm will absolutely demand that we all go back to the office as soon as he does. My mom has so many friends who are sick and some who have died already. But they are older and Black so I guess a not insignificant part of the population is fine with more of their deaths so the economy ramps back up.

    I’m feeling down today.

    1. Pew didn’t call me.

      I’m a both-and person. I would continue to practice distancing personally, but think that some things should reopen, perhaps with the people-within-space limits that already-open stores are using. Some businesses will fail with those constraints, but more businesses are essential than are currently open (e.g., many elective medical procedures have been postponed and may become urgent; etc.). I think that people are afraid enough of headline risk and getting sued and will figure out how to open responsibly and we need to let that happen.

      I am willing to have school and camps cancelled until August, but I want to have libraries reopen (maybe a challenge where large #s of homeless camp in them during the daytime) or at least bookstores. I’d like for pools to be able to open, perhaps with time/space limits (like I could reserve time from 7-9 at my pool in the evening b/c my kids are older, younger kids tend to get taken to the pool before dinner; we don’t all need to go all day long). Museums should be able to open. Tennis courts and parks. Public boat ramps.

        1. I think that people (other than some old people and the homeless) aren’t in libraries for long and are fairly spread out. People stuck at home need to read. Kids not in school should be reading. It seems very low risk.

          Camps are more clumpy. I can see that their go-no-go timeline for hiring on people may be when schools and facilities are still closed, so we may miss the window on that seasonal hiring (not that people aren’t going to be still available, but camps may have no revenue stream if people are hesitant to send their kids). I’d send my kids if this were an option, as our camps are generally outdoor / in museums / spread out sports camps for tennis.

          1. For schools, we are closed until 5/15. If we reopen, it will be for 3 weeks. 2 weeks for state testing and 1 week for EOY parties. So not important to cancel as state testing is likely waived this year (if it hasn’t been; I don’t care as no one’s kid is repeating a grade over this). So I think they may just cancel as our leaders seem to be 100% risk adverse (and I think they truly do not know what to do with older / at risk workers — I WISH we would allow for those workers to opt-in to some sort of compassionate furlough (like: humanitarian leave with pay and benefits but you can’t come in to work so that you don’t get sick and run up bigger medical costs that your leave costs; the BAD thing is that population is still largely being used to prepare and distribute meals to needy kids formerly fed in school 2x/day)).

          2. Library worker in a large city here. Majority of patrons do stay for hours, and likely 50% of our patrons are experiencing homelessness, addiction or mental illness – very high risk group. Libraries do not sanitize computers after each use, and materials like books and DVDs are never sanitized or cleaned in any way. Toys in the children’s areas sometimes are sanitized depending if there are supplies available, but certainly not to the extent needed during something like this (or just regular cold and flu season!) Additionally, many libraries do not have general sanitation for tables, chairs, etc – in our library, maybe they get wiped down once a week, but again, not to the level needed for something like this. Some of this is a challenge due to these extraordinary circumstances, but largely the issue is that libraries have been historically underfunded for decades. I think a lot of things would need to be changed before we could safely open our buildings again. But in the meantime, do check in with your library’s website – almost all have extensive eBook and online learning resources for all ages available.

          3. Libraries cannot figure out how to adapt? Not be open for picking up and returning books? Not fulfilling some of their mission. If they can’t figure out how to reopen, I guess we should just shutter them and lay off the staffs (like all museums in my city have done and many small businesses) so taxpayers and broke governments aren’t paying nonworking people for years until we get a vaccine. Maybe small bookstores should reopen so that the end result of this is that we can only get books from publicly traded companies like Amazon and Target and Walmart. Because it looks like that is where we are headed. Bookstores in my city are closed. Big box stores are open.

          4. There’s a large middle ground between opening with no precautions or cleaning and closing down all libraries. Hundreds of library workers across the country have gotten COVID, several have been on ventilators and I know of at least a handful of people who have died.

            It seems like you just want to pick up and return books, which is a really antiquated view and small percentage of what modern libraries do for communities overall. If that’s all you need, then perhaps a bookstore is a better option for your particular situation.

          5. 11:56: patrons can not learn how to adapt? Libraries offer ebooks and streaming right now. You don’t need a dedicated ebook reader either, you can get them on your phone.

          6. “It seems like you just want to pick up and return books, which is a really antiquated view and small percentage of what modern libraries do for communities overall. If that’s all you need, then perhaps a bookstore is a better option for your particular situation.”

            Can you explain what you mean by what modern libraries are doing for communities overall? I see ill-attended programs that are geared towards older people (and by older, I don’t mean me at 55, I mean much older). The librarians seem to be un-busy, and don’t seem expert on anything I might need a library for, other than pointing me in the direction of a certain Dewey decimal range.

          7. If libraries are not interested in exploring low-contact re-openings they face withering on the vine. Do you want that? It sounds like that is where we are headed. Like you said, people can get books elsewhere.

          8. Yo, Lauren and all these anons thinking that libraries are creaky old dinosaurs: libraries provide essential services to many sectors of society. Sure, you might not see all of these things at every city/county branch, but the resources are there.

            1. It’s a place where the general public is allowed to just be, without the expectation of buying anything. These kinds of places are vanishingly rare.
            2. Children’s programs. I know quite a few librarians who have 100% shifted their children’s programming to online options. And these programs aren’t just storytime – some are aligned with local standards and are basically preschool/kindergarten classes. FOR FREE.
            3. Pre-teen/teen programming. You know how many kids spend hours at a library every day? LOTS. Libraries offer clubs, tutoring, summer programs for these kids who might otherwise be bored and getting into trouble.
            4. All kinds of civic forms you might need are available at a library. Need a tax form? Want to incorporate a business but not sure how? Talk to a librarian. They’ll print you a copy and help you fill it out.
            5. Internet access. Many libraries have expanded their WiFi ranges so that you can get onto their system from the parking lot.

            This is rambling and unorganized but man it burns my grits when people denigrate libraries. They are an essential public good.

          9. LaurenB and others wondering what libraries do for communities– A LOT. The library in my county provides bus passes and meals for low income children. They have a very nice children’s museum that provides a huge variety of enrichment programs for kids. They run summer programs for children in low income neighborhoods. They have a very popular program where you can check out all kinds of physical items from tools to fishing poles to telescopes. They provide resources and programming for people starting/running small business and people who are looking for jobs. They provide genealogy resources. They put on programs, including concerts, free/low cost movie nights, and all kinds of lectures that are very well attended by people in many demographic groups. They provide meeting space and technology to other nonprofits or small businesses. The arts center in my city is closed for 2-3 years for renovation, and the library is hosting parts of the collection so citizens can still view it.

            Lending books is a very small part of the mission of most modern libraries. I’m in the capital city of a rural southern state, so I’m sure that libraries in larger areas provide even more services.

            Apologies if this posts twice– I tried to submit a few minutes ago and got an error message.

          10. Our local library branch is phenomenal, as is the staff that works there. With young children, we’re there at least once a week in normal times. Kids should be reading a lot, we all grow out of or get tired of their books quickly, and being able to replenish the books they read often without having to buy them just to take up more space in our house has been invaluable in keeping them engaged in their reading. And I’m even privileged and could afford to buy more books if needed, but not everyone is that fortunate. Our librarians are great at letting us know what would engage them or is appropriate for them for the next level up that scouring amazon reviews just cannot replicate. I see a ton of tutoring going on every day there. It’s a free place moms with babies can go when they otherwise feel socially isolated, without feeling pressure to buy things and maybe even meet another mom on the way.
            And there is a whole other adult side to it that I don’t use but other people certainly do.

          11. LaurenB, I’m not sure where you are located, but it sounds like you are an outlier community, which is unfortunate. You may be able to get reciprocal borrowing at a neighboring community and check out what they do.

            In general, libraries in modern society are much more community centers and connectors than places where you just go pick up a book. Which is not to say that materials are not important – circulation is higher than ever, especially with the rise of eBooks, streaming movies, etc. But most of the work of the modern public library is in serving the community’s needs – for kids and parents, that means not only your traditional programs like storytime and summer reading, but also early childhood learning expert librarians who are developing programs based on the latest research on how to prevent learning loss over the summer, science librarians who are running STEM activities for kids, billingual services for new immigrants and English language learners, and social workers who help families experiencing crisis connect with housing and food. For tweens and teens, one of the most important roles of the library is being a safe place to hang out, which is worth its weight in gold to begin with, in my city. But tween and teen services include things like homework help, coding camp, Maker programs teaching you how to sew or cook or use 3D printers, music jam sessions, virtual reality gaming, and more – all of which yes are fun ways to hang out with friends, but also help tweens and teens develop career interests and college skills, and have been proven to keep kids in school and out of trouble. For adults, the number one service is job searching assistance, resume writing help, digital skills development for people who are unemployed or underemployed. In addition, citizenship classes and English language learning are very popular, as well as classes and workshops on better parenting, career advancement, healthy eating and cooking, writing groups, computer skills classes and more. And of course you have all the “fun” stuff like book signings and author appearances, concerts, movies, plays, etc.
            More people went to their library than went to see a movie last year and Millennials are the number one group who use their library. More from Pew – https://www.pewresearch.org/topics/libraries/

          12. This is helpful to see what all of the libraries are doing around the country. Thanks for answering.

        2. I see libraries as more high risk than schools, ESPECIALLY while schools are closed. They are a mixing place for children (likely to carry the virus without showing symptoms) and the retired (likely to have serious cases if they get sick). If libraries reopened a lot of parents would be likely to take their kids to the library as an outlet from being cooped up at home, and a lot of middle school children would be likely to return to hanging out there all day. At least in my area, kids during summer vacation whose families don’t have childcare and can’t afford camp are literally at the library all day once they are old enough to be there without a parent. Many of their patrons are not popping in quickly, they would have a lot of exposure. I can’t imagine libraries being able to open for anything except maybe curbside pickup anytime soon. Even curbside pickup puts the librarians at risk and I’m not sure I would feel comfortable supporting it.

          2. Schools are much closer quarters than libraries. Have you ever been in a cafeteria at lunch time? The classrooms aren’t much better and what about PE with shared equipment?!!

          3. But those are relatively easy to fix. Schools are much more controlled environments relative to libraries. you can eliminate the cafeteria entirely and have kids eat in their classrooms. You can modify PE to eliminate use of equipment. There are relatively easy tweaks that could be implemented to mitigate a lot of the risks of schools. You can’t really open a library and say “oh, only these 20 people are ever allowed in this particular reading room or use this computer” the way that would be relatively simple to do with a school.

    4. I’m not fine with it. I think the economy should serve the people not the other way round and we should prioritize protecting the vulnerable. Unfortunately the people with the most money are making the decisions, but I just want to let you know I agree with you.

      1. Dude, the people with the least money are the ones who want to go back to work. I want to reopen for their sakes, not mine. I am able to do my white collar job from home, so I think it’s rich for me to tell a hairdresser that she can’t go back to work when she can’t feed her family and would happily wear a mask and limit the waiting room, etc.

        1. Yeah, you’re right. Actually this is part of what pisses me off when people complain about welfare or whatever. MOST people like working or do want to work. The fact that they can’t afford an income interruption is cast as stupidity or laziness on their part when it’s actually a bug of unfettered exploitative capitalism. If we had a social safety net like UBI, and paid sick leave, people could work and find a fufilling place in society, without having to come in sick or being afraid all the time or whatever.

        2. Gently, the ones with the least amount of money are likely those with no income option or savings option so they -need- to get back to work. If we offered to our people what other nations do, if we fixed the unemployment registration problems, etc., I think we’d not find the lowest income level people wanting to risk their health. The need for those with lower wages (and thus less opportunity to save) to return to work isn’t proof we should, it’s proof of the privilege higher paid people have during these horrible times.

        3. But my point is that we should be giving that hairdresser more money now so her family can eat while
          ramping up testing so that she and her customers can interact again safely. My state’s approach is to let her starve and then demand she get back to work without sufficient testing.

          The idea that the only way to help low-income workers is to force them back to work soon is a fallacy. I mean, the Trump administration increased the deficit dramatically to give my family a tax cut that didn’t change our behavior because we already earn much more than we spend. But the low-income folks only get $1200 in the midst of an economic and public health crisis? And the Treasury Secretary thinks that $1200 will last them 10 weeks?

          1. +100. The safest way to open up the economy is to ramp up testing procedures/timelines/kits and to hire/train contact tracers.

          2. Queer socialist democrat here, and not loving how often I have to defend the current administration for misleading quotes that go viral these days, but the quote was not *just* about the $1200 checks (CARES also intended to get money to people through the SBA, through the $600/wk extra in unemployment, etc.):

            “I think the entire package provides economic relief overall for about 10 weeks. Hopefully we will kill this virus quicker and we won’t need it, but we have liquidity to put into the American economy to support American workers and American business.”

          3. Dude, I cannot pay people right now. I am saving $ to pay for stuff when I get the stuff, but I do not have $ to send in now b/c my pay just got cut and none of my bills did. IDK if my pay doesn’t further get cut to $0, so I am not pre-paying for any service from businesses that I expect will never reopen. I s*cks, but if I could GET a haircut today I would pay for it, but I will need an actual cut at some point and want to make sure I haven’t been generous to the point of stupid. If it were only one month, maybe. But it will be at least two seasons and I just can’t do that. We are all hurting here and no one is or feels like they won’t be the next economic victim here.

        4. I’ve seen a lot of posts from people still working essential low wage jobs (cleaners, grocery store, McDonald’s) who don’t feel safe working – they feel like they’re almost being martyred because they have to be. They’re doing it because they need the income, not because they want to work. If we had a strong social safety net, I don’t think they would want to work in this environment.

          1. the federal government just implemented paid leave. unemployment has been expanded so much that it will likely bankrupt governments, what else do you want? the money has to come from somewhere, and with the economy shut theres no money coming in.

            @every liberal arts major on this board, take a remedial econ class and google the law of unintended consequences.

          2. The Families First Act only mandated paid leave for employers with fewer than 500 employees. That means nearly all grocery stores and many fast food places are not affected.

          3. “@every liberal arts major on this board, take a remedial econ class and google the law of unintended consequences.”

            For real. There’s this incredibly powerful and prescient thing called “math” which helps us understand that if we spend X amount of money, without X amount of money coming in to cover the expense, we end up with a negative number. No economic activity generating tax dollars means money cannot be spent on benefits without incurring massive debt and/or having to cut funding elsewhere. Cities and states are already revising budgets sharply downward because of lost tax revenue. Now we want them to find a way to pay for months and months of enhanced unemployment benefits and food assistance? Do you like having emergency services and roads for them to drive on? Because something will have to give somewhere.

          4. What social safety net? We can only support so many people. Only 34% of Americans can do their jobs from home, and those 34% cannot earn enough to support the other 66% – even presuming that those 34% still have jobs when the economy is dying.

        5. There’s a lot of frustration that I can relate to on this thread, so as a liberal arts major who did study economics too (granted too many years ago), I can say that keeping the economy closed for too long is going to have severe consequences for everyone eventually. Obviously, the class divide shows up, and obviously, those in poverty are suffering more. As someone who used to have a cushy office job (don’t get me wrong, I used to work my *** off to get it and keep it) but is currently long-term unemployed with no income, I can understand the urgency for people to want to open up the economy again. I personally am very concerned about the virus spreading, but I am also the extremely cautious person that would always have a mask and gloves on anytime I step out the door. If the rate of contagion is slowing (and from the news articles, it seems to have even in majorly hit cities like NYC), I wholeheartedly support Governor Cuomo’s plans to reopen in stages. There’s no such thing as zero risk in anything, and with such a strain on global markets down to average people’s pockets, extended shutdowns from anything resembling paranoia just doesn’t seem to make sense to me.

    5. When was that survey taken? I’ve sensed a shift in society’s mood.

      I guess I feel bad admitting it, but I do think things should open back up to the level individuals are comfortable. Let rural areas open, let healthy people go about their lives. Urban areas where hospitals could still be overwhelmed? Sure, keep things closed/limited. But we’re destroying people’s lives with blanket directives.

      I’d really like to see governors treat their urban and rural areas differently when we start to reopen. Illinois is a great example of how stark that divide can be.

      1. I think Illinois is also a great example of what is needed before we can reopen. The gov has been saying over and over again we need widespread Covid testing + antibody testing, effective tracing, and a virus treatment. Urban or rural, he is right.

        2. wish i could get a haircut like mayor lightfoot has done. she needs one more than the rest of us i guess.

      2. So– completely agree with you that things should slowly reopen, but the rural/urban divide with this virus isn’t as clear as you would think. I am in Tennessee, and this is the approach the governor initially took. Nashville had pretty much all the cases and shut down first, then slowly other cities got more cases and shut down, then eventually we got a statewide stay at home order. Nashville has been shut down for a month and is currently the only part of the state where virus spread is contained, and the highest spread is in rural areas of the state. Rural areas of Tennessee often don’t have hospitals that are easily accessible, and the sickest patients in those hospitals will be transported to the cities. (The capacity issues we’ve had have been due to patients from rural areas needed to be accommodated in city hospitals.) Also, if you allow rural areas to operate as normal, then everyone from the cities just goes to those areas and camps, canoes, etc. or goes and stays with their family and spreads it there. Reopening is unfortunately going to need to be a coordinated effort across states and regions.

        1. Are you in West or Middle Tennessee? Because that’s not at all what I’m seeing in Knoxville and Chattanooga. Our numbers are low and hospitals are empty. I know things are a lot hotter in Memphis (and the rural is a lot more rural that way), but I don’t see any reason why the more rural areas in the East should stay at full lock down.

          1. Poster above. I’m in Nashville. The most recent VUMC study says that Nashville has effectively contained the virus. The same report said that in East TN (Knoxville and Chattanooga), results were essentially inconclusive– due to either lack of testing or the virus not really getting much of a foothold to begin with. (I think the latter.) Memphis is obviously pretty hot, but they are actually saying the hottest area (in terms of level of spread, not number of cases) is the rural area south of 840 around Nashville to the Alabama border (so Giles and Lewis County etc.).
            https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/health/2020/04/16/vanderbilt-nashville-starving-coronavirus-but-tennessee-not/5145025002/

          2. Concur. Look at rural Virginia vs. NoVA. Many of Virginia’s rural counties have single digits of cases. If you restrict travel (no moving between counties/groups of counties except for certain authorized reasons), you can reopen those areas. Rural hospitals are at risk of closing for good because they need elective procedures to survive financially. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/the-worst-is-yet-to-come-how-covid-19-could-wipe-out-many-rural-hospitals

          3. “The hospitals are empty” because the hospitals cancelled elective surgeries / procedures (like your routine colonoscopy) to have beds open for the surge. The fact that they are NOT filled to the gills means that the social distancing in your area worked.

        2. Rural Tennessee here. For our county, the ventilator count is four. That’s double what we started out with and will be woefully insufficient if this virus has unfettered access to the population. The rural hospital norm around here is to amend serious cases and even just broken bones to the big city hospitals. It’s not going to take much at all to overwhelm the local hospital.

      3. There is no inherent difference between parts of the country that have been hard hit already and parts that haven’t. Yes, density is a factor in why New York has it so bad, but the epidemic was seeded there early by many travelers. With community transmission so widespread at this point, rural areas are also at risk and cases there are also increasing. As others are noting here, the important missing piece is testing and capacity to contact trace and isolate. You don’t need to wait till cases are at zero to reopen, you need to wait until a) we actually know how many there are (our current testing is only telling us who is sick enough to be hospitalized!), b) we can test everyone immediately who may have been exposed c) we can trace all their contacts and d) we have a way to isolate them e) the resources (PPE, medications, ventilators) to treat the number of people likely to continue to get sick. This isn’t just some general idea that we can decide when to reopen based on areas we feel like should be okay, or things we think are lower risk, or amount of time, or when the economic pain is too much. We need the capacity to do the public health work that is required to keep this virus in check. The time we were shut down should have allowed us to build up to having a-e but we are still woefully behind. How do you think doctors and nurses who are still currently being asked to recycle masks feel about reopening before we have means to keep another wave out of hospitals? Why do people insist on acting like there is going to be some difference in how quickly exponential growth happens now vs. one month ago? I know this is hard, I know it is hurting people. But more people will be hurt by a new explosion than by staying the course now and doing the hard work of setting up the public health infrastructure and processes we need. 300,000 contact tracers is the estimate I’ve seen we need. Not the couple hundred the White House announced yesterday. We are so far from ready.

    6. “Stay inside until there’s a vaccine” is not a workable plan either and what Americans believe is often at odds with the best, evidence-based course of action. I am more worried about the general public’s response to COVID-19 than I am about the virus itself. It’s bringing out the worst in people in my area.
      I’m sorry for your and your mother’s losses.

    7. I’m sorry.

      I guess my counterpoint is something like this: you always have the option to stay home. It sounds really harsh to say that right? I know. But at some point, even if you’re lucky enough to still be paid right now, your choices are work (and risk it) or starve. I’m lucky that wfh is an option for now, but without childcare, soon, I’m going to lose my job. I can always decide it’s too risky to send my kid back to daycare and lose my job if daycare is open. But I’m not comfortable with the government making that call on behalf of everyone. And I’m lucky; many people have had no income for weeks. People need food at some point. The state government says they are broke. At what point do we starve?

      1. This is a huge concern of mine. Our state and local governments depend on revenues from tourism and oil. Unemployment funds are running low. The food banks are overwhelmed with thousands of cars per day. The social safety net is running out quickly. (Not to mention, with a lack of jobs, people are losing health insurance.)

        Right now, there are no eviction proceedings, and the banks are allowing people to suspend mortgages. I’m concerned that if small landlords can’t pay their mortgages at the end of the deferral period, there will be mass foreclosures and evictions as soon as the courts reopen.

        There are so many “secondary” public health crises that are a ripple effect–mental health, substance abuse, domestic abuse, food insecurity. Increased homelessness is almost certainly going to follow. There just isn’t a simple dichotomy between “saving lives” and “reopening the economy.” And, of course, poor people are going to bear the brunt of any decision.

      2. I agree that I can stay at home. Me and other fortunate people can stay at home and carefully consider the level of exposure we are personally comfortable with. Low-income people will go back to work and risk death to avoid starvation. I just don’t get why we have decided as a wealthy society that forcing people to interact with the public during a pandemic is an option but the federal government giving people more money for food is not.

        1. “I just don’t get why we have decided as a wealthy society that forcing people to interact with the public during a pandemic is an option but the federal government giving people more money for food is not.”

          Because money doesn’t grow on trees? How do you think we’re going to pay for people to be out of work and reliant on government assistance for months and months? Are you willing to eliminate Social Security and Medicare permanently so we can buy our way out of this temporary crisis?

          The U.S. government is really good at spending money we don’t have but eventually the bills do come due. In order to keep other functions of government operating – and to keep people employed – we cannot divert every cent of taxes to Covid relief. At some point it becomes an escalating downward spiral – we keep people out of work and spend tax dollars to keep them alive but the longer people are out of work and not paying taxes and not generating sales and other taxes, the less money the government has to support people, and on and on. It’s simple economics. And logic.

          1. +1 this money is going to come from somewhere, personally I’d be fine raiding social security to shore up the safety net for working families.

          2. While it’s true that money doesn’t grow on trees, it’s also true that we, as a country, have an enormous budget, most of which goes towards the military and tax cuts for big businesses. This isn’t a problem of “the money doesn’t exist, there’s no way we could pay for it!”, it’s “we’d rather pour massive amounts of money into other things instead of directly helping individuals.”

          3. Right, and they sure as hell aren’t going to cut any of that, so we might as well suck it up and get on with it and go back to work.
            I’ve long ago accepted the fact that nobody particularly gives a crap if I’m alive or not, so whatever. I’m ready to get on with my life.

      3. I’d agree with this IF there were protections for employees that decide the risk is too big. If that means their job is protected and they get some income from the government in the meantime, great. If the consequence is you don’t have the money to feed your family then what you are asking for is economic duress for the poor, not choice.

        1. Except you’re treating this like :
          1. Every employer can pay folks to not work indefinitely or
          2. The government can fund everyone not working indefinitely.

          Neither of those things are true. My mother laid off employees because her business was closed and their jobs don’t exist right now. No one is paying her to pay them for not working. It would be great if the government wrote her a magical check, maybe it should have, but it didn’t. If the government lets her open she can ask people if they want to work. She’s certainly not conscripting them into service, regardless of their economic motivations.

          Everyone gets to decide if the job they’re offered is worth the trade offs. That’s not new. Rich folks don’t tend to join the military or take jobs on oil rigs, but some people decide it’s a worthwhile trade off. I’m not totally sure how this is different.

          1. All of this. Even if the government was willing to fund this, they cannot do so indefinitely.

    8. My biggest problem is that leaders are letting the uneducated public have an influence on policy. It’s completely asine that people without basic understanding of biology are protesting. The American education system is just becoming a stuffy fulfilling prophecy at this point.

      1. Your last sentence is what scares me about the rumblings of keeping schools closed in the fall…there is ample evidence that the achievement gap could be significantly closed if we got rid of long summer breaks. My kids have access to books and educational apps and programming and all sorts of other at-home educational enrichment. I’m not worried for them but I worry about the bulk of kids in this country without that privilege.

        1. Yes. It is low-income and minority populations that will be significantly damaged by ongoing school closures. Many families do not have the resources to provide substantive out-of-school instruction and enrichment activities to their kids. Many children with special educational needs, who are on IEPs, are not getting the education they are entitled to by law while they are at home. My prediction is that there will be class-action lawsuits to force schools to reopen because of the hugely damaging disparate impact on disadvantaged populations.

      2. No, it’s not. They have the right to protest if they so choose. Your opinion of their knowledge or intelligence doesn’t supersede their rights.

    9. I saw something on social media that illustrated it well – opening up the economy now is like falling through the air while skydiving and saying “oh great, the parachute does work, I’ll close it now.”

      I think we all care about sick people and who will be most hurt by this and we are also cognizant of the economic impacts, which are real and severe. I just don’t understand the line of thinking that we should open everything now to “save the economy” when it means that we’ll likely get an even worse second wave, which will….destroy the economy.

      1. And I predict if we have a second wave with a second round of stay at home orders there will be far less compliance than there is currently

        1. Ding ding ding. Now that we all know what this is like, if they try this again many people will nope out of it. Then where will we be?

      2. I like the analogy that opening everything up now is like saying “oh, I feel better, I can stop taking my antibiotics halfway through a rx.”

        1. yea or “i don’t feel depressed, I’m going to stop taking my antidepressants”

    10. I think what’s lost in this is that even if things reopen, lots of individuals are going to make the personal decision that they don’t feel safe going to restaurants, or shopping at stores, or going to the movies, or whatever… so the economic effects of this are still going to be felt by those people who aren’t going to go out and spend money on these things. I also think we have millions of people who have lost their jobs in the last month – they are not going to resume prior spending levels either. And people like me who are, I think, secure financially are cutting back because we may need to help out unemployed family members. Reopening, whatever that means, isn’t the silver bullet everyone’s hoping for.

      1. Yes, I would both continue to stay home and also keep saving money so I can support family if I need to. Also I assume my insurance premiums are going to skyrocket soon. I think your assessment of what would happen economically if we did reopen is more realistic than any sort of “back to normal” dream.

        1. If I didn’t own an apartement, I would also have just gone home to stay with Mom and Dad, but b/c Grandma Trudy is living there, I think I would have asked her permission b/c I live in the city, and have been close to alot of people and for all I know, I could have been exposed to the virus just walking down the street. FOOEY!

      2. Perhaps not, but it’s a step in the right direction rather than having the government go through another round of stimulus they can’t afford. People may not be spending to previous levels, but that’s not what’s at issue. It’s the hemorrhaging of jobs as a result of stopping all non-essential activity that’s the problem. Businesses that can’t afford to keep people under these types of restrictions won’t, and for those that can, they won’t take any new ones on until they have a timeline of when the restrictions are lifted since they’re suffering losses too. If things reopen, at least businesses of all sizes can start recouping and start to think about hiring again. While there will still be a lot of contagion concerns, I certainly will be one of the first to return to NYC as soon as I’m able to when they’ve lifted restrictions. There is no normal so there’s no right answer, but it is irrational to sit at home and hide until the virus goes away. It’s starting to already be contained more each day, and sure, there are deaths, but the tests are available and as long as one has the ability to go get tested if they suspect having contracted it, why require an entire population to sit at home?

    12. “81% of Americans believe social distancing should continue as long as needed to curb the spread of the virus even if it means continued economic damage”

      I hate polls like this. “Social distancing” means staying six feet apart and please wear a mask if you can. It does not mean quarantines, although it could. “Continued economic damage” is a highly qualitative statement: would people be willing to have an extra 1% of Americans out of work or 65%?

  10. I see so many not-helpful stats (and I’m not sure if HIPAA flies out the window in a pandemic), but my county releases these stats daily:
    % new cases
    % total cases (broken out by age)
    % on ventilators

    What I’d like to see:
    # or % recovered (the cases # just gets larger, but after a month, if you subtract out the deaths, surely you can add recoveries in there? this # is not the # of people who are currently sick)
    % hospitalized, by age
    % that is nursing-home spread or originated (residents + workers) (which seems to be happening in clusters, not just in my city)
    % ventilator, by age
    % ventilator that recover, by age

    I’d like for someone to be monitoring hot-spot spread particularly (because I think it will be helpful in understanding why it is likely OK to open a lot of outdoor activities and how spread really works)

    I think it’s also interesting that until schools closed, we didn’t seem to have school-based spread but have had spread in areas with lots of older / sicker / older + sicker people, and how that affects the viral load that may be why it also spreads more to caregivers (who are younger than residents but could well have conditions that make them vulnerable).

    I saw an interesting article about a Boston homeless shelter where a large # of people were positive but didn’t have symptoms and weren’t in fact getting sick (even after having been separated into another location). My gut says that this is a mild disease that spreads easily except it can be randomly awful to either people exposed to huge viral loads or people with underlying factors (age, diabetes, etc.). So maybe efforts go more towards protecting the most vulnerable (like maybe we do not see elderly relatives at all until possibly after Christmas, but kids can go back to school at least in the fall) and figuring out that part of the puzzle first.

    1. My county has been giving daily stats on total positives, total recovered, total who have been hospitalized at any point, and deaths. It’s really interesting -in our 470k population, we’ve had just under 200 positives, but only 30-something are still active. We’ve had 21 hospitalizations at any point (not all at once) (the county has 4 large general hospitals, so that’s basically nil), and 4 deaths. The state has also put out charts with absolutely tons of data, broken down in all sorts of ways.

    2. Wow your uninformed gut has lots of opinions on this! Mine just wants more snacks.

      1. My uninformed gut has soooo many opinions, including about what kind of snacks are best and how often/when they should be available. Come to think of it, my uninformed gut sounds a lot like your typical house cat.

    3. Re: HIPAA, HHS has issued guidance that relaxes privacy rules for medical providers sharing data with government or research entities trying to track/cure the disease.

    5. I have no idea what is wrong with me, but my brain read the “title” (username) as “dats what I wanna see” and I laughed out loud. Anyways…I am doing just fine…hahah

    6. I agree – I really wish there was better information/data. I know two people who tested positive after initially testing negative only 1-2 days prior. One had it pretty bad (was hospitalized for a few days and on oxygen at home for about a week) and the other had what she describes as “the worst flu ever” for about a week. Both of them live with multiple other people who had no symptoms. I suppose it’s possible their family/roommates didn’t get it at all (but that seems unlikley given how contagious this is supposed to be) but it seems more likely that they all had it and the two people were hit hard and the others were asymptomatic. Totally anecdotal but I’ve heard similar anecdotal stories elsewhere, I’d really like to see a prioritization on getting accurate tests, including for asymptomatic people to understand this better.

    7. IDK but I would move home any family members I cared about who were in nursing homes. Everything else seems safe by comparison. And I would also be so nervous about working in one.

      1. Except that these folks are in a nursing home because they need skilled or other care that isn’t readily available in the home. Or requires people to come into the home to provide this type of skilled care. Yes, these are fragile populations to be sure, but they are also can be somewhat controlled environments that are highly regulated for infection prevention and other safety features. Even for folks that need lower levels of care, like assisted living, going to stay for the duration with family isn’t the best option. Does fall risk grandma need to be climbing stairs all the time? Do you have a safety plan for your great uncle with dementia while also caring for your young kids?

    8. “My gut says that this is a mild disease that spreads easily except it can be randomly awful to either people exposed to huge viral loads or people with underlying factors (age, diabetes, etc.). ”

      Your gut is wrong. There are young, fit, perfectly healthy people without underlying factors who are suffering and dying from this. Please stay away from the “well, I’m not old and not a healthcare worker so I’m fine” fallacy.

      1. Right. My 55-year-old ex-BIL – a massive assh*le to my sister but physically healthy and active – died of COVID-19 last weekend. He was not a health care worker or a first responder but ran a wine and gourmet shop.

  11. Unrelated to current events….has anyone had surgery to repair a herniated disc? I’ve had sciatica for almost 10 years, but I could keep it at bay with regular exercise. Once I had my kids (singleton and twins within 2 years) the pain became much worse and has only responded somewhat to a year (on and off) of physical therapy. I’ve also tried epidural injections, to no relief. The pain during the day is annoying, but my main issue is that it becomes almost unbearable at night and I can’t get much sleep. It seems like surgery might be my only answer but I worry about somehow making the situation worse.

    1. I haven’t but my husband has and a good girlfriend. For both of them, it brought relief. Anecdotally, I think there is a large percentage of lack of help in this type of surgery (more so than most surgeries), but the risk that you are worse off is really low.

    2. I haven’t, although I also have a herniated disc, but a close family member did and had questionable results and ended up with opioid use disorder (the classic case of getting addicted after taking medications as prescribed for real pain). Since he had it done, I believe there are significant questions that have been raised about efficacy. I’d urge you to really do your research on this one.

    3. I had a microdiscectomy for a herniated disc last summer and it was 100% worth it. I’ve had back pain off and on since high school (for about 25 years) and suddenly, was in so much pain I couldn’t walk or sit. Now, with the help of physical therapy during recovery, I am so much better. If it is really bad, I would suggest the surgery. I was out of work for 3 weeks after the surgery, but only had pain from the surgery for about a week. I was also up and walking right away.

    4. I had this surgery in July 2018 and it was nearly instant relief. I had previously had epidural injections as well with little sustained success (and was seeing a chiropractor). A few things that I was told – the post surgery PT is the most important thing – you need to be diligent about it and continue to do it. My doctor said that one of the issues he sees in patients is that they get the surgery, and then don’t do PT/some form of exercise (like walking) enough after the surgery so then scar tissue builds up at the surgery site, which causes pain/discomfort. You can’t really do anything about the scar tissue to relieve the pain. Well, you *can* but the “thing” is more surgery = more scar tissue. So that’s a thing to focus on – movement after surgery helps to prevent the build up of scar tissue. I became pregnant like 4 months after surgery and even during pregnancy I didn’t have any pain in my back.

    5. My husband had the surgery about 15 years ago and it was a 100% success. He suffered with the pain for years (bike vs. car in his teen years). And literally, he was able to stand up in the recovery room with no pain shortly after surgery. He has minor pain here and there when he goes too long without exercise but it is minor pain and stops after he starts being active again.

      His post-surgery recovery was harder on me than on him because he could not move in certain ways for a few weeks — so I had to do many unexpected tasks for him like put on his socks (I probably should have expected it bit was apparently clueless). As for PT after surgery, his was mostly walking outside every day.

    6. My boss did and while the surgery was mostly a success, he ended up with a massive infection. He was home-bound for almost 3 months, intravenous antibiotics, and had to have a nurse come daily. He was miserable.

  12. Just posted a link that may be in mod, but the cdc has just posted breakdowns of the national provisional counts for deaths involving COVID-19 in the United States by week, by age, by sex, by place of death and by jurisdiction of residence.

  13. Friends, how can I best support one of my team members who is melting down under extraordinarily difficult circumstances? We have always been remote, and she is a fantastic, hard-working, dedicated lawyer. She is now trying to do her job with her husband and small children around. She is starting to come apart at the seams for obvious and understandable reasons. She asked for a short time off, which I assured her is fine and told her to take more if needed. She isn’t working on anything truly time-sensitive, and I told her to offload anything to me she would like. The thing is, she is under serious consideration for a big promotion. I don’t want anyone above me to have any perception of her that would put her ability to do the new job in question, so I am reluctant to talk to anyone in the company about rearranging workload, etc. Some of you are in the same position as she is, I know. What could your boss do to help you right now?

    1. I don’t see this as different than taking a vacation. Unless you’d ordinarily kick up a big fuss with the hierarchy about one of your reports taking a few vacation days I think you say nothing for now.

    2. For me, hearing from my boss that they’re also finding all this tough, and hearing from them that they understand the whole ‘you’re not working from home, you’re sheltering at home from a pandemic and also trying to be productive’ thing has been really meaningful. If you can make that the tone of any communications, both to your team member and outwards within the organisation, that would help.

    3. Don’t bash her to leadership, of course. Why do they even need to know she’s on a short break? Is rearranging workload going to be something they need to know about at that level? “Yes, she’s a top performer and we couldn’t do it without her. She absolutely is the right person for this promotion.” Advocate for her!

      1. I absolutely have advocated for her. And I don’t have to tell anyone anything about how she is doing at the moment, but I wish there were a way I could tell people not to bug her unless absolutely necessary. My intent is to shield her as much as possible and will am trying to rearrange workload within our team. I will do this as long as I possibly can.

    4. Why can’t your frame this as medical leave or family medical leave? It sounds like that’s what it is. Would higher ups penalize her for that?

      1. Not OP, but family leave is unfortunately a bad look. I agree with anon at 10:43 and Pure Imagination that higher-ups don’t even need to know she’s out or having issues.

    5. Bless you for supporting her and paying attention to perceptions. In addition to what you are already doing, I’d cut back on meetings, and have the essential meetings voice-only instead of video. I’d also encourage her not to feel she has to be available 24/7. Encourage her to work out a child supervision schedule with her husband, then block off unavailable times on her calendar and make it clear that you expect her NOT to check her e-mail or carry her work phone during those periods. I have several mothers with young children on my team, and I’ve been telling them that I’d rather have them set reasonable schedules and go completely offline during non-working hours than burn themselves out trying to maintain the appearance of constant availability. Tell me when you can work, and that’s the only time I’ll expect you to work. If you have to change those hours at the last minute because something comes up, that’s fine. These principles should apply to all employees, not just parents of young children, and not just during a pandemic. When you’re not working, you’re not working.

      1. Thank you, Anon at 10:56. It had not occurred to me to tell her to go completely offline. I think that would bring her some relief. I don’t know why I didn’t think of this.

        1. I started back from maternity leave into this crisis, WFH full time, daycare shut down. My manager told me that the one thing they can really offer is flexibility with my schedule, and I appreciate that. I also appreciate that she does not mind that I do a “hard stop” in the evening and shut down my computer, and only monitor email via my work phone. By the time 6 pm rolls around, I either have a drink in my hand or my feet are hitting pavement outside.

    6. My boss could not hold this impossible situation against me when being considered for a promotion, and could advocate for me to people who might see it negatively. If she’s a top performer, give her the space she needs to work through this and the grace to understand that it was hard for her to make the request and she’s probably terrified of how it reflects on her. If she had covid or another health problem, would you ding her track record or give her time to recover and come back to full strength? Treat this similarly.

      Ask a manager dealt with a similar question recently: https://www.askamanager.org/2020/04/whats-reasonable-for-managers-to-expect-of-parents-working-from-home.html

    7. Being a working parent only works if you have childcare. The vast majority of us do not have childcare right now. Advocate for the parents on your team; the struggle is real and if some bonehead at the top won’t promote her because she couldn’t handle working with 2 small children, she needs to find another place to work.

    8. Ask her how many hours a week she plans to work and only give her as much work as can reasonably done in those hours. Presumably it would be something around 50% less then her normal hours. It’s easier to manage bigger projects on fewer different deals/cases, and if she is a litigator, it’s probably easier to write briefs then be in discovery. So think and talk to her about the types of projects that will let her be most successful and ensure she can say when it’s time for the promotion that she did XYZ concrete things this year – no one needs to know what she did NOT do. Also, ask her when it’s easiest to use meetings – for internal calls, maybe there is a a very early or late time that will work better. For external calls, maybe you can commit that you will do them but only on anon, Wed, and Fri so she has more flexibility on Tues or Thurs.
      What not to do – just cut her out of stuff without telling her. That feels really bad and makes people anxious they are being left behind. Also, don’t force her to share – lots of the current management advice is about getting people to tell you how they are doing and honestly, I don’t want to tell my boss that I’m drowning, my husband isn’t doing enough, I’m worried about my kids, etc. I just want to say what I can and can’t do and have that be respected.
      In summary: Come up with a clear plan, communicate it, and then let her be.

    9. if leadership is at all reasonable, when decision time comes I would remind them that they all saw the potential in her pre-covid, and advocate that her performance during normal circumstances should be the most important criterion. If you thought she was suited for a promotion and then instead of a global crisis, she had a personal crisis, that wouldn’t be held against her I hope?
      I have made the decision privately that DH and I get a free pass for bickering right now (within reason), because this situation is not normal, and once some of this stress is lifted, we will let it go. I think employers should do the same to what extent they can.

  14. I have ordered a bicycle and it’s currently being built for me. I may be able to pick it up this weekend. Because it’s been so many years since I rode a bike, I hadn’t even thought about a helmet, but obviously, I need to. I measured my head and it’s 21.5″ and that looks like it’s small for an adult (the adult helmets start at 22) and my hair is fine, so it’s not a factor. Any help with what kind of helmet to buy and how to pick one is appreciated! I’m not getting into hardcore cycling, just looking to stay active and fit and be outdoors right now. I want to protect my noggin (I’m really clumsy) and not look like a complete dork. Thanks!

      1. Yeah, I looked at their website and it looked fairly limited, but I will check with them when I pick up the bike.

      1. I’ll try that. They mainly cater to people who are pretty serious cyclists, but they may have something to suit me.

    3. I have the standard £20 cheap bike helmet from Decathlon. Most helmets these days will have adjustment wheels in the back so fit isn’t so difficult as it used to be. My consideration was colour – I bought the helmet in white for added visibility. It’s also meant that knocks and scratches are visible and as I frequently walk around with my helmet attached to my backpack I replaced it after two years, with the plan to keep the older helmet in my work locker for when I go somewhere by city-hire-bike on a whim after work. (Obviously I’m not doing that at the moment!)

    4. Order a helmet with MIPS protection, as it offers some rotational protection (not just impact). You would want to look at a youth/teenager’s helmet (eg Giro Tremor MIPS, Giro Hale MIPS, or Bell Nomad) which has up to 57 cm (22″) head circumference.

      2. Second the requirement for MIPS. Rotational impacts are going to be much more likely. I have two MIPS bike helmets (mountain and road) and MIPS horse riding helmet.

        I like Giro helmets, and they were really good with a crash replacement discount, so I’ll stay loyal to that brand.

    5. FWIW, I bought my kids helmets that are from Specialized. Purchased in a bike shop. We tend to have small heads in my family and the Specialized brand helmets have a little dial in the back to keep the helmet fit tight enough on the head. Might be a kid-only feature.

    6. Try them on in the bike store. Some brands are more round and others are more oval. For my head shape, I need an oval-shaped one.

    7. Cyclist here! Seconding the other responder – you want a MIPS helmet preferably. Probably horrifying to hear, but safety testing on helmets is VERY lax (basically, you have no assurance that real safety testing has been done). MIPS has been shown in independent testing to reduce head injuries in a crash. They cost more but aren’t all super expensive. Take a look at the listings here – there are some good low-cost options.

      https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicycle-helmet-ratings.html

      Also, a bike helmet is most like to protect you in a one-person crash (so you go down bc you lose your balance/hit broken pavement/slide on sand/etc.). It won’t do much if anything if you’re hit by a car. The best thing you can do to protect yourself from car crashes is to put front and rear FLASHING lights on your bike and use them even if it’s daytime. There are fancy ones you can get, but even a cheap one is better than nothing.

      1. Yes to all of this. You are incredibly vulnerable as a cyclist and you need to do everything you can to protect yourself.

      2. That’s great advice on helmets and blinkers.

        I know a half dozen people who were in serious cycling accidents: knocked unconscious and saved by firefighters who happened to be on-scene, concussions, brain damage ultimately leading to death, hit by a car and almost bled to death, someone who was hit and did bleed to death.

      3. Thanks! Our streets are a mess and I know a lot of people who have been hit by cars, etc. It scares me and I don’t intend on biking on busy streets. I am more likely to fall off and hurt myself. I need to see how this goes.

        1. So before I was pregnant I rode about 10 hours/week and (knock on wood), I’ve never had a serious accident on the road (I have racing on dirt but racing crashes are obviously different than what you’re talking about!). I have been hit by cars twice while running, though, and I used to work for a road safety nonprofit. So I’m pretty risk aware.

          The best thing you can do is stick to quiet streets until you feel confident and stable on the bike. But I’ll tell you that even as a very experienced rider, I stay on streets I know well because I know where the broken pavement is, what intersection drivers are likely to speed through, the places where it’s harder for a card to see me, etc. Getting to know your local roads as a cyclist is different than learning them as a driver, and it’s a process for sure. But honestly you can have a ton of fun and get some good exercise riding on quiet neighborhood streets – you don’t have to venture out into heavy or high-speed traffic ever if you don’t want to.

          Have fun!

    8. As someone living in a college town with a lot of cyclists seemingly unfamiliar with the basic rules:
      1. Assume you are the weakest element in the road.
      2. Wear a reflective vest, helmet, and flashing lights.
      3. Assume cars do not see you, and behave accordingly, even when crossing the street at a traffic light when you have the right of way. This is extra important at dusk/nighttime.
      4. Ride in the right side of the road, with a bit of distance to the curb, but not in the middle of the road and not on the opposite side either.
      5. Don’t hang things on your handle (shopping bags etc).
      6. Have the bike shop adjust your bike seat so that you can reach the floor with your feet. This will be your additional emergency stopping mechanism.

      1. 7. Learn how to signal which way you’re going. Left arm out – turning left. Right arm – right. Practice how to bike one-handed if you can’t do it currently.

  15. Can anyone recommend a vitamin c serum you’ve used and would recommend? I’ve tried 2 different brands and haven’t seen any difference. Also, when it oxidizes and turns yellow, does that mean it’s no longer good and I should toss it? Any thoughts on whether the more expensive ones work better? The ones over used are in the $20 range and I would pay a little more if it either lasted longer or seemed to work miracles. Thanks.

    2. I like the dr sebagh vitamin c powder. I don’t know how much it costs because I got in the liberty London advent calendar, but it is a powder that you can mix with a serum of your choice. I have seen the brightening effects of vitamin c that I didn’t see with that drunk elephant vitamin c that everyone loves. The drunk elephant stuff is sticky, smells weird to me, and makes my skin seem more sensitive.

      1. The Ordinary products changed my skin. I actually think I look better without any foundation or tinted moisturizer now. Highly recommend.

      2. They have a bunch of Vitamin C products — which do you recommend? I am always looking for brightening products that work.

    4. Yes, throw it out when it oxidizes. Have you been keeping it in the fridge? That will generally prolong its life. If you want to go big money, Skinceuticals is generally the gold standard. For me, Timeless is an excellent dupe although slightly more hot dog smelling. The Ordinary is also good, mix a few drops of the Ferulic acid with one of the Vitamin C suspensions.

    5. I have tried a bunch. My HG is Timeless, ordered through their website, not on Amazon. This formula is very close to the patented Skinceuticals one, for a fraction of the price, and they make each bottle to order so it is very fresh. I really liked the Drunk Elephant one too but not enough to justify the price difference between Timeless and DE. Paula’s Choice CE Feurulic would be my second choice after Timeless. I have heard great things about Mae Love’s The Glowmaker, and was really interested because it has Hyaluronic acid in the formula, but it broke me out which is really strange for me, so I can’t personally recommend that one.

    6. I am using a new one I LOVE from a target brand called cocokind. My other favorite has been the Mad Hippie one.

    7. I like the Neogen vitamin C powder that you mix into your moisturizer. It last a long time and you don’t have to keep it in the fridge. I bought mine on Soko Glam but Amazon might have it. I love all the Neogen Korean beauty products.

  16. The sciatica question above got me thinking. Does anyone get intense pain in their tailbone area when lying on a flat surface? For example, when laying on a yoga mat or trying to do sit ups. It seems no matter how thick my yoga mat is, I get a sharp intense pain in that area. It doesn’t happen when lying in bed or when sitting in a chair.
    I have tried go.ogling but am having a hard time finding relevant info, since everything seems to be related to lower back muscle pain… I’m not sure what to do about it, and it’s really getting in the way since I’ve been trying to work out more but find it’s hard to find standing-only exercises since most core exercises want you on the floor at some point.

    1. Mine is probably different than yours, but my tailbone is all jacked up from falling off horses when younger so a part of it hits the ground and puts pressure on the bone when I am laying flat on the ground. I have to have a crazy thick almost mattress like yoga mat for it not to hurt.

    2. Yes, I had to stop doing the Blogilates 30-day program because it absolutely ruined my tailbone. I asked my osteopath, who I see for treatment of hyper-mobility spectrum disorder, and she said there are a few reasons in my case – my tailbone is tilted, I am naturally very skinny and have little ‘padding’, and my body is just out of alignment all the time.

      My best recommendation would be to find an osteopath or chiro to see if your tailbone is actually out of alignment and just needs to be adjusted. Then based on their advice, see a PT for exercises that can help. In my case, I’ll probably go back to yoga that doesn’t require me to lay on my back.

    3. Yeah it’s not uncommon to have tailbone issues like this. An osteopath or chiropractor can help you out in a session or two and show you some stretches to do. My tailbone gets messed up when I sit hunched up on the sofa liking I’m doing right now. I can’t wait to see my osteopath after lockdown is over, for this and my usual back issues.

  17. I’m sure others can relate to this, my firm’s leadership has made it clear that they expect us to be billing at full capacity during this period, despite a drastic slow down in work. The vast majority of my billing comes from court appearances and depositions, preparing for those things, reporting on those thing, and traveling to and from those things, so I am really struggling. I find I have been kind of spreading out my work for fear I will completely run out, instead of billing a full day and burning through everything I’ve got. But maybe I should just trust that more work will come? Can anyone relate?

    1. Client managing litigation here. First of all, your firm needs to get a grip. Hours are going to go down before everyone is comfortable with Zoom depositions, etc. (we are leaving this up to our attorneys) and court is back up to speed. I am kind of expecting to see some poorly disguised file-churning on the next set of bills. Here is what I would like to see – catch up on your reporting. Go back into each of your files. Is a comprehensive report due under the client’s litigation guidelines? Draft it. Did you summarize every deposition? You might feel awkward sending me one that should have been completed months ago, but do it anyway. I am happy to receive it. Is there any discovery that needs to be supplemented? Are your experts up to speed or do you need to send them additional information to shore up their opinions? I hope this helps.

        1. +1! Housecounsel, if you feel inclined to post any further about your pet peeves and/or preferences as an in house counsel, please do! I find them so helpful as an associate at a firm! I’m a transactional attorney but still enjoy hearing your perspective!

      2. It helps me, as I’m in the same situation as the person you’re responding to. I’m curious what you mean by file churning– I think I know, but if you’re willing to elaborate, that would be awesome.

        1. File churning . . . hard to define, kind of a know it when I see it thing? My boss calls it “pool slapping,” where you’re splashing around but not getting anywhere. But let me try. I might take a hard look at tasks that don’t have any work product. Don’t bill me for hours of reviewing documents if I can’t look and see what you learned. This is easy to fix; just dictate or type a summary not just of what you reviewed but how it affects the case, changes your opinion, leads you to consider a different direction, etc. Don’t call it “analyzing” when I know it’s more like “glancing at and throwing in the file” or “developing strategy” when you haven’t told me what that strategy is. Churning can also take the form of going back over old territory. If you prepared for a deposition, and took the deposition, and prepared a summary, don’t bill me multiple times for reviewing the same deposition to prepare your quarterly report, to prepare for a different deposition, etc. Be wary of going down rabbit holes on legal research (this was one of my tendencies). With every entry on a bill, you should be able to tell me, if I ask, why it was necessary and helpful. That answer might be as simple as because my litigation guidelines or the court rules require it, or it might require some more explanation about why you thought it was worth your time and our money to research a potential dispositive motion or prepare a background memo on something or someone. I hope that helps. And know that you build trust with every bill.

          1. Thanks! This all makes sense and makes me feel better about what I’ve been working on and plan to keep working on during this time.

  18. I just read an article where an Australian professor who was involved in making the HPV vaccine says that he has concerns about whether they can make a COVID-19 vaccine. He said that the problem “with corona vaccines in the past has been that when the immune response does cross over to where the virus-infected cells are it actually increases the pathology rather than reducing it,” and that the SARS vaccines caused inflammation in the lungs of animals.

    I find this concerning, especially when antibodies may help only for a few months. If there won’t be a vaccine, I can’t even imagine what the next few years will be like.

    2. I’ve sorta assumed the vaccine is a pipe-dream and even if they have one it will be somewhat like the flu where there will be multiple strains each year in the future and some years the vaccine will be more effective than others. I think we need to start thinking about how to function as a society where this is the reality (i.e., think of ways we can “re-open” things in a way to help mitigate as much of the spread as possible but understand that we are unlikely to be in a place where the risk is even mostly elimintated)

    3. There’s been a canine corona virus vaccine for decades (it’s a common part of puppy shots), so developing a vaccine for that family of viruses is not new.

    4. I think we deal with it by just making sure that if you do get it (which it seems like we will), if you are very ill, there are non-overwhelmed hospitals with supplies to go to. Old/vulnerable people should absolutely distance voluntarily until then.

      I would be hesitant to let any older family move to a nursing home — I would find a flat in a town with a lot of services or hire one caregiver who will take appropriate precautions when providing services. That is the big change I see — fear of nursing homes.

    5. Stop reading what every random person says about it, it’s not going to be helpful to you unless you’re a virologist, in which case I assume you have a lot of other knowledge with which to place this in context.

      1. No, OP’s concern is valid. For people who haven’t had dengue before, the dengue vaccine actually worsens the disease instead of preventing it. The same thing happened with a SARS vaccine candidate. This is why we need proper testing before a vaccine is approved.

    6. Ex vaccine researcher here. Different vaccines can target different immune responses and mechanisms. We can learn from past issues to try another approach that may not have been the first choice based on, for example, the strength of antibody response, but instead provides a more tailored response, for example triggering T cell responses, that may turn out to be effective. Regulatory agencies tend to prefer standard antibody approaches because they are easy to measure, but given the past experiences, it should be easier to try a different approach.

  19. Hi! Now that we’re a little past the initial: “actually, please wear masks” does anyone have recommendations for masks they have purchased that they think are comfy, effective, and not too expensive? My diy solutions are fine in the short term, but are a little uncomfortable (and all fog my glasses). Thanks!

    1. I don’t think there is a solution to the glasses fogging which is really annoying as another glasses wearer (at least not with homemade masks). There was a Lifehacker article about this which basically said there’s no good solution. :(

        1. The struggle is real! On the other hand, it does make walking around feel like a “and it was all a dream” sequence.

    2. This mask by Los Angeles Apparel was recommended by someone on this board. While I haven’t tried them on yet, the set of 3 I received seem high quality and I know they are adjustable. The only thing they are missing is some type of filter. I’ve read that some masks have an A/C filter or other type of filter slot sewn in. But for now these seem like a good choice. https://losangelesapparel.net/products/3-pack-cotton-mask

      1. Just an FYI, Los Angeles Apparel is run by Dov Charney, the founder of American Apparel, who was run off after a slew of credible, serious sexual harassment issues. I’m not judging anyone who orders from them–we need masks–but wanted to throw that out there for those who care.

    3. I *like* the face guards; plexi over the entire face secured to the head with a Geordi type visor. Can see the face, be cleaned easily, seems to be more comfortable.

    4. we ordered ours from blaqpak – i have found my solution for glasses fogging is fold up a small piece of TP or kleenex and put it under mask over the bridge of my nose, i feel like it soaks up the moisture from my breath

    5. I haven’t tried it, but a few friends have suggested using shaving cream to clean glasses to keep them from fogging. Like I said — haven’t tried it, but just tossing it out there as a suggestion. I have the same problem and it is annoying AF. I hate walking around the grocery store blind and constantly bumping my glasses up to try to unfog them.

        1. Some other easy ways to fix this are to wash your glasses with baby shampoo or toothpaste (just a little and not the whitening kind). This is what scuba divers do for scuba masks for the same issue and it works very well!

    6. I think masks are going to be here to stay so I’ve been ordering “fashion” ones – Amy Kuschel (the wedding dress maker) is putting out some exceptionally cute ones

  20. It might be too late to get answers on this post, but…my husband, a lifelong athlete, now has a chronic neck injury that prevents him from running — which was his workout of choice for years. He even gets neck pain from walking, although it’s not as bad, so in the past two years he really took to swimming and was working out a ton until all the pools closed. Can you help me think of a low-impact cardio workout he can do that won’t strain his neck? He’s going stir-crazy in the house and long daily walks aren’t cutting it. We don’t have a ton of room for workout equipment but I’m willing to bite the bullet and figure it out b/c he really needs this for his mental and physical health.

    1. Is a stationary bike (whether that’s a Peloton or similar—a friend got the Nordic Track one and loves it!—or the old school kind that doesn’t include a screen) an option? I don’t have one, but I also don’t think they take up a lot of space.

      1. +1 this is always my go-to for a low-impact workout. Coaching on form can help him recruit the right muscles (more legs than back) and hopefully avoid aggravating his injury.

      2. +1 I love my rowing machine. I use it daily, and it stands up (taking up very little space) when not in use. It has wheels and is easy to move around.

    3. I think a bike, stationary or otherwise, is your option here. But also sounds like he should be going to PT for his neck.

  21. I am an excellent sewist and have a few extra meters of fabric and elastic kicking around. I was thinking of offering up masks to friends and family. I just need some language to indicate that this is a limited first come first serve offer, when my supplies are done I’m done. Any ideas how to do this without hurt feelings?

    1. “Due to limited supply, the masks are first-come, first-serve” is totally fine. They’ll see that you’re doing a nice thing and I doubt anyone will have hurt feelings. Thanks for doing something like this!

    2. One of my friends did this on Instagram. She said something like “I have some extra fabric, time and stamps. Let me know if you want a mask and I’ll make you one until they run out!” I thought it was so kind and so sweet.

    3. “This is a limited first-come first serve offer. When my supplies are done, I’m done!”

    4. Why not make the masks first, then offer them one by one to people in order of how much you care?

    5. I have been sewing masks on the weekends for a few weeks. I offered them as they were done first to my employees, then family, then close friends. After that, I have been taking done ones to the grocery store for the workers there and leaving them out for delivery people.

  22. Testing: is ten times what it was a month ago. We now have a couple of virus tests, and antibody tests (not all fully validated, some might have a higher false pos/neg rate that more established tests, still useful for screening population statistically). It would be better to ramp up faster, but progress is happening.

    Political leadership and coordination: Even though 45 likes to hot-tweet stream of consciousness and then backpaddle, he still has Fauci and Birx on his team, and most of the time listens to their advice. Even though federal assistance and coordination is a sh!tshow, governors are stepping in. On both coasts, states are working together to coordinate PPE procurement, common criteria and joint strategy for reopening. CA had a press conference this week on a stepwise plan to reopen. They haven’t set a date, but they are watching the case numbers and making plans. Georgia and SF are sending medical workers/ventilators to NYC. They could do that because flattening the curve is working. Our being stuck at home is for a reason and has the intended effect. Other countries that are ahead of us on bending their curve will probably do partial opening in the coming weeks, we can learn from them.

    Research: there are a huge number of ways in which academic and industrial research has pivoted within days and weeks to shift resources to accelerate covid-research and testing. UC Berkeley has pulled together machines and supplies from bio-research and nearby biotech firms, and deployed those plus scientists who are trained to run these machines, and helped to ramp up testing in the area. The NIH is doing a study to quantify undetected infections. On an all-staff-zoom meeting 3 weeks ago, they told us that our large, completely shut down research lab, will do a partial reopening to give instrument time to some covid projects. Yesterday, they gave us an update that they had resolved the crystal structure of a promising antibody that could be part of a preventative or treatment drug. There are a number of different candidates being studied for this purpose, so in the end, the successful drug may likely be not the one that was studied in our lab. But there are about 20 similar facilities in the world, where you normally have to do a lot of paperwork to be granted some time in a few months, and now pretty much all of them (including in hot spot Italy) are fast-tracking covid-projects. Also all the scientific supercomputers are running simulations of which molecule might effectively attack the virus, which then narrows down the list of things to try in actual experiment. Sorry, other computational research projects, you just have to wait in line, because all our compute cores are churning virus data!
    Because the runway for a vaccine is so long, the Bill Gates foundation is investing billions to build up production capabilities for 8 of the most promising vaccine candidates, not yet knowing which one will eventually be safe, successful, approved and deployed. They will end up wasting a few billion $ but they will be prepared to produce large scale quantities of whichever vaccine we need in the end.

    A lot of players are really stepping in to do what they can to help: Mutual aid networks have sprung up in a lot of cities and they have more volunteers that people asking for help. Google and Apple are collaborating on a contact tracing app, and volunteers from watchdog organizations are X-raying the app for privacy concerns. Tufts University opened their vacant dorms for essential workers that wanted to isolate, as well as potential quarantine rooms for people with mild symptoms. The large luxury multinational that makes Chanel and other perfumes is switching to make hand sanitizer, the Gap is producing masks and gowns. Not sure what’s going on with the ventilators that Elon promised us, but I think GM is building some. Those are just a few examples, there are so many more. All of those efforts boosting supplies are another building block in reopening, because your dentist or OB will probably have to completely sanitize the whole office after every patient for a while, so they need supplies.

    2. sorry, that is the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, to be exact.

    7. Can this OP know all of this herself? She is either a true expert, or, as more likely, she’s a great cut and paster, like me! The manageing partner knows I do NOT create from scratch, but from others, and my work is a “derivative work” he says. That is what Dad think is going on here, so more power to our soul sister! YAY!!

  23. Lawyers – What is your view of many states postponing the bar exam and the push from the graduating class of 2020 to adopt a diploma privilege? I have two c/o 2020 interns at our small firm that are clerking starting in August. The options for them seem limited. Either study all or part of the summer in hopes of a September bar exam, or work while studying for the February bar and take vacation time to study?

    1. I love diploma privilege generally, but I don’t quite see why the exam needs to be postponed? Social distancing seems pretty simple to achieve in a testing center. And heck knows there’s nothing else to do right now besides study…

      1. I don’t either but several states including NY and MA have already stated that they have decided to postpone

      2. New York lawyer here. That’s not really true. The testing centers aren’t big enough for proper social distancing and many have been converted to temporary hospitals. They are working with law schools to see if they can potentially use classrooms for testing

        1. Maybe the previous testing centers can’t social distance, but it’s easy to achieve. I’ve taken the bar in two states – one used a giant convention center and we were all several feet apart, the other used classrooms at a law school where we each sat so many seats apart. Heck, public schools aren’t being used right now – use them. Sure, last year’s testing center or whatever isn’t available, but that’s no reason to screw over the class of 2020.

          1. I’m not saying they shouldn’t try but that solution would also require using many many more proctors than have been traditionally used. I think people are working to figure out solutions but I’m just noting that even with a delay into September in New York, the bar examiners are still worried that they won’t allow everyone to sit that wants to.

      3. This varies widely from state to state. In my state, there are enough available rooms in the facility and a low number of examinees, so there is plenty of room. That wouldn’t be the case in other, more populated areas.

    2. With the caveat that my mind is open and I can be persuaded otherwise, I think bar exams should be postponed and diploma privileges generally denied, with exceptions. Grads should be able to practice with government entities and qualifying non-profit orgs under supervising attorneys, but not private for profit law firms and companies. The bar exam, in my experience, requires very uniform administration and to hold the exam with proper social distancing will require hundreds and hundreds of proctors, and they all need to be well trained so that each testing site is exactly the same. This just does not seem feasible to me. Also, students feeling sick will not stay home and miss the bar exam. I think postpone until September balances the interests best.

    3. The options are great. Start studying now; it’s not like they have much else going on. While they may still have classes, they are wrapping those up and at this point, their grades do not much matter. The more they learn the material now, which includes how the exam is structured, techniques for the MBE, etc., the less they will need to learn as the exam date approaches. If they choose to take the February exam, they will need much less time off than they otherwise would.

      1. I wonder if this will lead to NCBE to reevaluate if a bar exam is really necessary. In the current environment, I would say yes it is still necessary since the pass rate in states such as CA makes it clear that not everyone that goes to law school should be given the privilege to practice. However, if law schools were more stringent with who was accepted I could see the need for an exam to be phased out. I definitely don’t think that will be happening given law schools accept students they shouldn’t because they make more $$ and there are still unaccredited and for-profit schools out there.

  24. Administrative Professional’s Day is next Wednesday. Any idea for things to do for our admins who are working remotely, like the rest of the team?

    1. How about we take this opportunity to let this ridiculousness die once and for all?

    2. can admin professional’s day get corona? i’m socially distancing from it forever.

    3. Honestly, I’d half-forgotten I had an admin. I use mine mostly for answering my phone and helping manage physical files, both now very obviously NA. I do not think several months of forcing people to be mostly self-sufficient from the admin perspective is good news for the longevity of that career path.

    4. I am coordinating with my group to get our admin a gift card that I will drop off in her mailbox at a designated time. I am one who always recognizes holidays though!

    5. My firm gave all of our admins an extra day of PTO. My work group is getting our specific admin a gift card for a local restaurant that is still doing take-out and delivery.

  25. The Ordinary products changed my skin. I actually think I look better without any foundation or tinted moisturizer now. Highly recommend.

    1. +100 I love The Ordinary/Deciem products. My skin looks great as I am about to turn 40 (and yes I realize a lot of that is genetics and having used sunscreen, but the products have made a visible difference).

    2. Which products? Sephora Rouge sale starts today and I was going to order some cleansers, etc. during the sale, so maybe I could add this on as an extra little treat.

      1. Fave product is the 100% Organic Cold-Pressed Rose Hip Seed Oil.
        I also like:
        – AHA 30% + BHA 2% Peeling Solution
        – Glycolic Acid 7% Toning Solution
        – Niacinamide 10% + Zinc 1%
        – Hyaluronic Acid 2% + B5

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