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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
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This pattern is also available in a blouse, a skirt, and a dress.
The sweater is $89.50 and comes in sizes XXS–XXL.
Sales of note for 10.10.24
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- Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale (ends 10/12)
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- Neiman Marcus – Sale on sale, up to 85% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 50% off 2+ markdowns
- Target – Circle week, deals on 1000s of items
- White House Black Market – Buy one, get one – 50% off full price styles
Anonnnnn
Thanks to everyone who responded last night about helping a friend leave an abusive relationship. I feel like I at least have a direction now: lawyer, apartment, childcare.
anon
If you tell us what city she is near, we can recommend lawyers.
Anonnnnn
Thanks for offering — Dallas area
anon
Dallas people can probably tell you the org name, but check out the Houston Area Women’s Center – they can probably refer you to their Dallas equivalent.
Dallasite
Check out Genesis Women’s Shelter in Dallas.
Anonnnnn
Thank you both Dallasite and anon. Will pass this along to her.
Sunflower
Thank you both Dallasite and anon. Will pass this along to her.
Sunshine
Reagan Riddle at armstronglawtexas dot com. Recommend her as a divorce lawyer. I don’t know anything about the other lawyers in the practice.
Anonnnnn
Thank you!
Anonymous
Hi, I know you don’t want to hear this, but you should also develop a contingency plan if she goes back. On average, an abused spouse will attempt to leave seven times. The likelihood of her returning increases if there are children or pets involved and, unfortunately, violence increases each time as well. Make sure you have the name of emergency shelters that take in children, just in case she needs it down the road.
Hernia surgery
DH is scheduled for laparoscopic surgery on an inguinal hernia in two weeks. We haven’t heard much about what to expect or how to prepare; any words of wisdom? I’d love an idea of what we might buy to have on hand and what to expect in terms of recovery. Three kids three and under, so advice on what to expect in terms of timeline and how long he’ll be functionally out of the home game would be especially useful. TIA!
Anonymous
Aw hugs to you. DH had this surgery a year ago and we definitely felt like we were the only people in the world dealing with this and small kids. 1) it will be ok. 2) my husband is in decent shape and I was honestly surprised how long it took him to recover. For example, he also had a vasectomy and was back on his feet 2 days later. Hernia surgery was a much slower recovery and he had to take it easy, which was hard for him. That being said, he didn’t need much… other than nagging to actually take his pain meds and rest. He didn’t need/want special foods or anything. I don’t exactly remember but I think he could pick up the kids, just no weight lifting for 6 weeks. I didn’t need to call in my mom to help with day to day tasks or anything. I wish y’all a speedy recovery!
Anonymous
My husband had the open version of this surgery when our daughter was a baby. He was back on his feet within a couple of days, which was extremely aggressive (should have taken more like a week) and I would not have wanted toddlers slamming into him or demanding to be picked up for a couple of weeks. I did not have to do a lot of direct caregiving other than bringing him food. For pain control, if your DH can get one of those devices that delivers a local anaesthetic directly to the surgical site for a day or so after the surgery, he may be able to avoid taking any systemic narcotics, which makes recovery a LOT easier on both the patient and the caregiver. For me the most difficult part was waiting at the hospital with an infant during the outpatient surgery and getting him home afterwards while wrangling the baby.
My husband’s surgery required an early morning arrival, and I wasn’t able to take him home until late afternoon. If at all possible, I’d line up a family member, friend, or sitter to take the kids to day care, pick them up, and handle the evening routine the day of the surgery. For the next few days, I’d have DH hide out in the bedroom with the door closed and keep the kids away from him. Then handle this time the way you would ordinarily solo parent if he were on a trip–takeout dinners, outings to keep the kids from climbing the walls, a grandparent on the weekend, whatever usually works for you.
Anon
My dh had this at age 60 and recovery took way way longer than they told us — like closer to 3 months than 4 weeks. But then at one of his follow up visits, the doctor said they specifically told people a shorter time period than it normally takes. We didn’t have small children at the time so I can’t help with that. Dh also refused pain killers after the first 24 hours, which is on-brand for him. He couldn’t drive for some period of time, so that meant errands and transportation were on me. Someone mentioned it taking a long time, but I took him in at 5 am and we were home before lunch time. But if I had children, I definitely would have wanted a back up adult that day.
Anonymous
The timing is really variable. If there are delays in getting him into surgery or in the recovery room you could be there a long time. Knowing you have to pick kids up at day care makes the delays much more stressful.
Anonymous
Get a wedge pillow. I had laparoscopic abdominal surgery and it was the most important thing in getting me up and ambulatory again. Seriously was the most important thing. If you have any sort of a tray table that’s height for eating in bed, that also can be helpful. It made it a ton easier to keep all my stuff together. Also, have him download podcasts or something else sort of meaningless. When I was medicated, I’d get frustrated about losing my place in a movie or book when I slept. Something where that doesn’t matter as much is helpful.
anon
One of those soft cold packs that you can keep in the freezer can be useful. Sometimes this surgery can irritate/injure a nerve that can run down the leg. It will recover fine, but can be an additional unexpected pain that the doctors wont warn you about. Cold packs can be amazingly effective for pain.
Nesprin
My hubs had an open bilateral repair a couple years back in an outpatient setting. He was entirely out of commission for 2 weeks (i.e. almost bed bound) then needed another 2 weeks to get back up to mostly functional. He’s not going to be useful with the kids for at least a few days even with a laparoscopic procedure.
Make sure that you advocate for pain relief- it’s better to have the strong stuff and not need it than to try to get someone in a lot of pain to a pharmacy for pickup, and make sure that if he is provided opioids he takes stool softeners with it.
Stairs will be hard, getting up from lying down will be hard, and going to the bathroom could be rough for a day or two. Wedge pillow is a good idea. Putting him in a bedroom with the closest bathroom, minifridge and a TV and letting him sleep it off would be my rec. If you can get a useful friend/grandparent to come stay it’s prob worth it with 3 young kids.
Anon
My husband had this when our kids were little. There was definitely a man cold aspect of it but honestly he was fine in a week.
Anonymous
Oh I disagree. My husband had a vasectomy and I feel like that was man cold territory. When he had hernia repair surgery at 39 he was truly in pain and out of commission for a few weeks. It reminded me of the first week or so after delivering my first baby. Lots of very gentle movement and necessary round the clock pain meds.
Anon
It really depends on the hernia. There isn’t one answer here.
Anonymous
Ooh!! My husband just had one this year at age 39. Also 3 kids!
It was pretty textbook in terms of recovery. Expect him to be sore and mostly physically useless for a full week. Be pleasantly surprised if he heals faster. My husband is in really good shape and sort of pushed himself on recovery, which made him more sore. No heavy lifting and lots of ice.
He spend a good 2-3 weeks on meds. He didn’t take any Rx painkillers at all but I was honestly surprised he still needed round the clock ibuprofen/Tylenol for that long. He did wean off it and as a benchmark, his pain tolerance is very high and he declined narcotics for his wisdom teeth.
It took a few months for the swelling to subside. I just asked and he said the scarring is barely noticeable under the skin now but that it was 3+ months until that happened.
Hit me up if you have any specific questions! I didn’t find a lot about young healthy men with this surgery when I looked. If you are in the Boston area he highly recommends Boston Hernia. He was in and out of the hospital in 4 hours (dropped at 8am, got the call he was ready for pickup at noon), including full anesthesia.
AnonAnon
How long do you usually keep your car for and what are you currently driving? I’ve typically stuck with Toyota’s and kept them for 10+ years, but was recently in a friend’s new Volvo and woah was it a gorgeous ride. Any thoughts re: Lexus vs. Toyota? I know they are sister brands of the same company.
Vroom
I opt for luxury brands and usually 8 years or so has been the sweet spot for me before they are too expensive to maintain. I recently got a new car of the same luxury brand I typically buy (BMW) and wow technology has improved a lot in the last few years with all of the bells and whistles! Since I drive less now I expect to be able to keep it at least 10 years, maybe more. I assume at that point I’ll have to more
to electric.
Anon
I lease all my cars now so I always have a new car and no maintenance to worry about. I used to keep them until they basically died and realized that approach was just deferring paying roughly the same amount of money. With leasing, you’re paying a fixed cost every month and always have a reliable car. I far prefer that to surprise bills and random breakdowns at the end of life of a car. That all said, it doesn’t work well if you need to put significant miles on a car.
Anon
This is what my family has always done. It surprises me to see so many people here driving cars 20 years until they die.
Anon
Same here. Cars are a depreciating asset and I just don’t get the point of buying them. I had a terrible accident in a Toyota once too, so while they may be reliable, they’re also tin cans. I’m willing to spend perhaps a little more for reliability and safety.
Anon
Counterpoint: a lease doesn’t make sense to me at all when I can avoid having a car payment for a solid decade by buying the vehicle and then maintaining it as it ages. Maintenance costs are not nothing, but I find they are far less than a monthly lease payment would be over that same timeframe.
Anon
You’re just spreading the cost out equally over time. I lease for roughly $450/mo, in 6 years that’s about 32k. My down payment was originally 2k but since I’m loyal to the dealer it’s been waived ever since. So if you buy a new car every 6 years or so, you’re talking about roughly the same amount of money with no unpredictability. You can scale this up or down too based on what kind of car you choose to drive.
Anon
Also my “value” in a car is more than just the cost, reliability and safety plus driving something nice are intangibles I’m willing to pay extra for. Like my time, they’re worth something. Same reason I don’t take jobs with long commutes and outsource other things for convenience.
anon
Buying a new car every 6 years…… is pretty wasteful.
Anon
“Also my “value” in a car is more than just the cost, reliability and safety plus driving something nice are intangibles I’m willing to pay extra for.”
Same. Sorry if this offends some people, but I feel like I make too much money and spend too much time working to be driving around in a 20-year-old beater, holding it together with spit and duct tape, hoping it doesn’t break down on the freeway. At my job, no one cares if people are driving a luxury vehicle or whatever, but if I had an unreliable car that couldn’t get me to client or work meetings, that would be looked on askance – like, we’re paying you a nice amount of money; get a car that won’t break down on you. One of the questions in my interview was about “reliable transportation” because I do have to do site visits and onsite meetings, and my boss specifically said: because you’ll be having to drive in this job, you need a reliable vehicle; do you have one? And I said, yes, I do. Apparently it had been an issue with some people in the past, who were trying to save money on their cars and so shared cars or had cars that broke down repeatedly. I live in the West where there’s really no public transportation and having a reliable vehicle is a big deal.
I don’t believe people need to buy a Bentley to drive to work in but it is nice to have a nice car you can drive people to lunch or meetings in, if need be, and be proud of what you’re driving.
Anon
My 20 year old car is not held together by spit and duct tape. It has leather seats in like-new condition and very few scratches on the body. My car is extremely reliable, I take care of it and it’s never once broken down on me. I’ve only had it in the shop overnight once in the 5 years I’ve owned it. It’s very reliable and I’ve never been late to anything because of car issues. I also do have pride in my car, yes it’s old but it’s well maintained. The only thing that tips anyone off to its age is that there’s no backup camera or aux cord (let alone Bluetooth!). I actually get compliments on my car when I drive colleagues to offsite meetings and nobody can believe how old it is. If a colleague did comment on how old it is I’d mention that I can’t comfortably afford a car payment on my $75k salary and if the company wants me to have a nice car to show off they can pay me commensurately.
Just because a car is old doesn’t mean it’s a beater.
Anon
Counterpoint OP: I usually spend $10k on a solid used car, about 5-7 years old with 80k miles. Cash, no car payments. Then I proceed to drive it until about 300k miles. Usually I need to do a few major repairs during that time, maybe an engine or transmission, so all-in it’s perhaps another $10k over 12-15 years. That is not anything close to the same as leasing a car and paying $450 a month in perpetuity. I budget $100 per month for auto repairs and let it accumulate until I need it. That amount historically proves out for me.
Anon
Haha no @12:46 I am in no way spending the equivalent of $450 a month on my 8 year old car. That is nonsense.
Anonymous
Seriously. I haven’t had to spend that on my (finicky German luxury) 12 year old car. Buying for the win.
Anon
I barely spend $450 a year on my 25 year old car! (Assuming you exclude consumables like gas).
Anonymous
Right. My car is 13+. I stopped paying on it after 4 years. I have spent approximately $5000 on it in the nine years since, on maintenance, nice tires twice, and repairs. I may need to pay another $1500 soon. It drives great. I want a new car because I have treated this one badly cosmetically, but I in no way spent the equivalent of $450/mo on it ever.
Anon
Yeah what? We just rehomed a Hyundai after about fourteen years and a stratospheric number of miles; we didn’t spend any $70k on surprise bills or random breakdowns or anything else! We never had a breakdown; it just got to the point where we wouldn’t fault it for having trouble on a road trip.
Maybe cars are just better than they used to be?
Trish
Oh dear. You are allowed to spend a lot of money each month to drive a luxury, almost new car at all times if that’s what you want. But it is not a good investment at all. My 2013 paid-for Honda CRV had some dings on the outside but the engine is perfect. I spent a little on bodywork and will keep her another couple of years especialy since we both work from home. For the past 24 years, DH and I switch buying new or barely used cars so we usually have one car payment.
Anon
It’s totally fine to lease a car if you enjoy driving a relatively new car! But it’s just not true that it’s the same cost as getting a new car and driving it until it dies, nor is it the only way to drive a reliable/safe car.
Anon
I drive Toyotas and we typically keep them 20+ years. Currently I drive an ‘09 Camry and my husband drives a ‘99. Maintenance costs have been very minimal, we put about $2k into the ‘99 more than 10 years ago, but otherwise have not done anything beyond routine maintenance. We’re replacing the ‘99 with a 2015 Corolla later this year. I drive new cars on vacation regularly, and don’t enjoy them any more. I’m not a car person and as long as the car is comfortable and reliable it’s fine.
However our cars are relatively low mileage for their age, which I think may be a big factor. The ‘99 only has I think 170k miles.
anon
+1
Similar
Toyotas (now with a Prius) that are passed through the family. Parents got a Lexus RX350 when they were having mobility issues, as it was much easier to get in/out of. Lexus = Toyota, but was much more expensive for service with relatively poor gas mileage and needs the pricey gas. Nice though.
If you really want to splurge, think about electric or at least hybrid. Depending upon where you live, you might get some very nice tax credits, save a lot on gas, good for the world etc…
But I drive reliable good cars, until they die. Just not where I value investing my $$.
Eliza
100%. I have an Acura with 280,000 miles on it. Other than basic maintenance such as new tires and routine oil changes, it’s needed no other attention. I haven’t had a car payment in the last 12 years.
I love cars, but I love my money more. And at the end of the day, the car is continuing to do exactly what I bought it to do.
anon
We drive Hondas and keep them for a very long time. My first couple of cars where totaled in accidents that were not my fault. A couple of times, the repairs have not been worth it compared to the value of the car. My husband just replaced is 2007 truck last year. It had a bad transmission issue and it just wasn’t worth it to put money into fixing it. It had low mileage because we spent several years carpooling to work in my car.
I currently have a 2011 Accord. I WFH and don’t drive that much so I’ll probably keep that for a while. Unfortunately it’s in the body shop getting about $7K worth of repairs from a teenage driver who wasn’t paying attention and turned into the side. So far the shop is saying it can be fixed and not totaled. Fingers crossed that remains the case.
Anon
I somehow manage to put a decent amount of miles on cars, even now that I work from home!
First (used) car (I bought myself), Nissan Pathfinder: 237k miles and ~15 years
Second car, VW Jetta TDI: until VW bought it back after the scandal broke (1.5 years SAD)
Third car, another VW Jetta, hybrid: Three very painful years. Always in the shop.
Current car, 2011 Subaru Outback: 4 yrs, 70k miles (total 126k). I plan to keep this past 200k, but buy an EV within the next year or so.
ELS
I presently drive a 2018 Subaru Crosstrek that I plan to keep past 200K as well. I now have a commute that can be walkable, so outside of site visits/client meetings, I’m not driving a ton, as my partner has a larger car and drives when we take trips, on weekends, etc.
I’m set for a pretty large promotion at the start of the year that will come with a hefty pay raise, but I’m not really tempted by a luxury brand car until other financial goals are met.
In-House Anon
Another Toyota family here :) I drive a 2010 Prius and my husband just got a plug-in Rav4 replacing his 2010 Subaru. He bought the highest trim package, so the car was not inexpensive…but still much less than a Lexus.
I think people are just either “car people” or not. I can certainly appreciate a nice car, but at the end of the day it’s just not something I care enough about to spend lots of money on (granted, I do not drive much at all; I might feel differently if I had a long commute). It’s not a judgement — we’re not a particularly frugal family — we just historically haven’t spent a lot on cars. Good friends of mine are the oppos ite — each drive $100k Mercedes, which they can afford, and replacing them every few years. They love, love, love nice cars.
Anonymous
10+ years as well, and I absolutely loved my Lexus. And the Lexus dealer was really helpful.
anon
10 years / 150k is my absolute minimum goal with the new-new car I bought in Jan 2021 (2021 model). We paid cash and I thoroughly enjoy no payment so we’re going to make it the “family car” (as opposed to DH’s which is mostly a commuter car) and just drive the shit out of it as long as we can. It’s a Lexus SUV and I love it.
Anon101
We do Toyota for 10+ years. (Purchased new). Currently towards the end of that cycle with a 2013 RAV4 but plan to keep driving it until it dies or needs significant repair. I haven’t done the math, but someone once told me that if you keep your car for 10+ years its financially better to buy new rather than lease new. I am occasionally tempted by nicer vehicles, especially because I drive a lot for work, but ultimately its not a priority so its an area where we have avoided lifestyle creep.
Anonymous
I firmly believe that the most economical option is to buy new, in cash if possible, and drive the car until it wears out. Used cars are really not much cheaper than new ones and someone else has already extracted the benefit of driving it new when it has zero maintenance costs.
anon
Or even better, you buy a 1 or 2 year old pre-owned car from the dealer with a full warranty. “Certified” by the dealer.
Anon
I buy the used ones that come off leases!
Anonymous
This is what we do. used cars that are 1/2/3 years old, pay in full, keep them for about 5-6 years, sell when they still have value before they start to have major/expensive issues.
Anonymous
Those are like $1,000 less than a brand-new car, which makes zero sense.
Anon
11:32 is spot on, they’re barely cheaper and by the time I’m turning in my leased cars, the new ones are so much better. Certified pre-owned is the biggest rip off there is.
anon
Well, who’s retiring early….. :)
Anon
I bought mine with 5000 miles on it. It had been a dealer service vehicle for a few months. It’s a Volvo and that gave me about $12k off average retail price. Even my husband thought that was a good deal, and he doesn’t think anything is a good deal.
Anon
We buy our used cars from my parents, so we know they were cared for and maintained well. They are usually at least 5 years old so *much* cheaper for us than a new car, and we have not had to put much money into maintaining them. I have a 2009 car we bought from my parents in 2015 and we’ve put exactly $0 into it over the last eight years other than routine maintenance and one new set of tires. My parents like having newer cars for the recent safety features and we pay them more than they could get from re-selling to the dealer, so it works out well all around.
Anon
I drive Toyotas. Current Toyota is 19 years old! I drive cars into the ground.
Anonymous
I’ve had 2 cars in my life. My parents bought me a used 1997 4Runner when I turned 16. I proceeded to keep it until I was 35. I’ve had it’s replacement for 3 years. Clearly, I am very much a “drive it into the ground” person. 20 years is, I admit, a touch extreme, but assuming they last, i’ll keep them at least 10 years.
Anonymous
We drive Toyotas and Hondas and drive them forever.
Anonymous
We buy Toyotas and drive them until they start to require multiple major repairs, which for us generally seems to work out to about 12 years and 250K miles. We have had an Acura, a Nissan, and a Subaru, and none of them was nearly as reliable or stayed nice on the interior as long as our Toyotas. I have not been impressed with Lexus as a luxury brand. It’s just not that much fancier than Toyota, although it does have the advantage of the Toyota reliability. With something like a Volvo you are buying an experience more than a means of transportation, so the financial calculus is different.
Betsy
We buy new and usually the highest trim package and plan to drive to 200k miles. Going with the highest trim package helps with feeling like my car isn’t out of date even when it’s older. Also getting occasional detailing so it feels shiny and new again! We also drive a lot, so 200k miles only takes about 8-10 years. I have my first non-Toyota now, a Subaru, and I am looking forward to going back to a Toyota in a few years.
Anon
I keep my Volvos until they die, in the range of 300,000 to 350,000 miles. My benchmark for maintenance costs not being worth it: if the yearly cost of maintenance exceeds the cost of year’s worth of car payments. There is also a qualitative element of eyeballing the car and asking myself what kind of car I have at the end of the maintenance/repairs. If it will be a workhorse after, do the repairs. If it’s not a reliable car after, we are done.
Anonymous
This was my plan on an xc90 we purchased in 2017. After 4 years of and less than 50k miles it needed a new catalytic converter. This is after two or more brake pad replacements in addition to some other funky things.
We ended up cutting our losses, trading it for a good value, and getting a VW lease.
Granted, the Volvo was the first of the new XC90 redesign so maybe it was just bad luck but I feel like they don’t make cars like they used to.
Our VW leases are serviceable but still have a host of small issues in only 3 years we have them so I don’t know if we’ll ever purchase again. Especially when you have to sink so much cash into a down payment to purchase or deal with the sky high monthly.
Anon
My car (Toyota) is 21 years old and I’m beginning to think about replacing it. Dh’s car is 25 years old (VW), and he wants to get a new one but hasn’t found anything he wants to drive instead. Neither of our cars are costing us a lot of money at this point so there is no rush. We also drive a 63 year old sports car for fun on the weekends.
Anonnnnn
Something I wish I had known before I bought my first luxury car– it costs way more for maintenance and to get work done. I went from a Nissan to a used Volvo and was shocked how expensive an oil change was, and every time I needed something done it seemed to cost at least $1,000 (at my local, trusted mechanic).
Anon
Pro tip on Volvo oil changes: buy the oil at Costco (they sell them in six-quart boxes), or at Advance Auto Parts (don’t even bother with the little quarts; get 2 five-quart jugs), and have your local mechanic do the change with the oil you bring. Ask them if you also need to bring a filter; buy those at the auto store. They will charge you about $15 to do the change when you provide the supplies.
Volvos take between 6.5 and 7.5 quarts of full synthetic, depending on the model. Most places charge a flat rate for the first 5 quarts, and then a crazy amount (like $15 a quart) for each additional quart. Hence the crazy cost.
Also ignore them when they tell you to get the oil changed every 3,000 or 4,000 miles. It’s full synthetic! Six months or 6,000 miles, whichever comes first. (The filter breaks down after six months.)
Anon
According to the Volvo dealerships, some models only need an a oil change every 10,000 miles:
https://www.volvocarsofcary.com/volvo-oil-change.ht
Anonymous
Same with my 2018 Prius.
Anon
Same for my Volvo. And my husband does the oil changes. He had to buy the special Volvo wrench to get the filter off (he bought it for my last Volvo) but yeah, I know I’m lucky to be married to someone who can do this. I certainly couldn’t do it myself.
Anon
You can! Position container to catch oil, undo nut, undo oil filter, attach new oil filter, put nut back on, pour in oil. Hardest part is jacking up the car.
No Face
Lexus has all the reliability of a Toyota with a touch of luxury. I would happily buy one.
I have a minivan and it will be my daily driver until my kids outgrow their car seats.
Anonymous
Very timely question for me – I have just decided it is time to swap out my 2013 Acura MDX with 152K miles on it. I love that car, and it still looks great. My no. 1 priority for cars is reliability, and while the Acura has been literally perfect, I just don’t think I can count on that for the next 50 to 100K miles probably left in that car. I am on the list for new Lexus RX hybrid and expect to wait 3 to 6 months. Looked at the NX hybrid, which I can get in a plug in model, which I’d prefer, but my husband, son and nephew – all of whom would be in the car every so often – are all 6 foot + and the back seat is just a bit too small. I looked at all the luxury SUVs and Lexus came out on top for reliability in every rating I found, so going with that.
Anne-on
Hi, are you me? Exact same situation except our MDX is from 2011 with slightly less miles. We’ll drive the MDX into into the ground but we’re excited for the Lexus hybrid (expecting it in another few weeks) after being VERY impressed with the test drive (and using less gas is a huge plus!).
anon
I posted below, but I have the Lexus NX PHEV and am so in love with it. Drives smoothly, zero problems with it in the 8 months I’ve owned it and everyone who rides in it comments on how great it is. Since I WFH FT, I pretty much never even use the gas function other than for occasional trips to a large city nearby.
Sunshine
I had a Volvo sedan and got emotionally attached to being a Volvo Driver. However, I found repairs were expensive because Volvo uses a lot of unique parts. At 100,000 miles, the Volvo needed a very expensive repair and putting more money into it wasn’t worth it. I actually cried when I gave up my Volvo. I considered myself a Volvo Driver.
I replaced the Volvo with a Lexus sedan and could not be happier. I’ve only had it about 3 years so I cannot comment on repair costs etc. for now. But a big reason for me to buy the Lexus was to be able to use Toyota parts and repair persons, and hopefully keep it as long as I can without huge repair costs.
Anonnnnn
Are you me? I totally fell in love with my Volvo and also had to trade it in because maintenance was getting too expensive, but in my heart I’m still a Volvo driver.
Anon
Previously a Honda person and just bought a Lexus PHEV this year and LOVE it. Definitely appreciate the extra touches of luxury and convenience. Zero problems with it thus far and I plan to keep it for 10 years plus as I have with every car I’ve owned.
Anonymous
I drive Hondas (currently a 2012 odyssey) because they last forever and don’t cost much to maintain. We have always paid cash and always bought used, though post pandemic we will probably buy new as prices are comparable. On average, I drive my car 6 years. My husband drives an old Sequoia. Toyotas are also cheap to maintain. My mom drives a Lexus. She maintains it at the dealership and it is expensive. But mom is 68 and still working and takes care of my disabled dad, so for her I think a nice vehicle is a small luxury.
Anon
2015 Volvo XC70 wagon, 110,000 miles. I will be keeping it through the timing belt or chain replacement, so I hope for another 100k.
Anon
We lease. We just bought out the lease on a 3-year old Honda hybrid. We could turn around and sell for a profit, but are selling to a family member instead for the same amount we paid for it (way cheaper than current used car market) to help them out. And we just leased two new cars (going from a 1 car household to 2 cars). DH got a Toyota highlander hybrid, I got a VW ID.4 electric. Love both of them. We really like having new cars every 3 years and not having to worry about long-term maintenance. I recognize that in the end we probably end up paying more, but it’s worth it to us have the newest car technology and not worry about long-term maintenance. When our current leases are up, we’ll probably lease 2 fully electric vehicles.
ollie
I only had to buy a car for the first time 2 years ago, and got a new Camry hybrid paid in cash. I fully intend to keep it for 15+ years if I can – I only commute once a week and my husband doesn’t really drive so we don’t put a lot of miles on it. My parents are the same way, Toyotas and Hondas that they keep for as long as makes financial sense.
Anon
We aim to keep cars for at least 10 years and then will trade in and buy a used car to replace (we don’t buy new cars, ever). We’ve mostly been successful at that, with two exceptions that I talked about on yesterday’s thread, where we (in my opinion) overspent on repairs when we just should have replaced the vehicle.
This year, I replaced a 2011 Hyundai Sonata with 125k miles (so thoroughly out of warranty) with a Lexus NX300 and I really, really love my new car. I liked the Sonata, but it lacked a backup camera and sensor technology, as well as some of the other “creature comforts” the Lexus has. I WFH, but have to visit clients and attend meetings in a city about a 90 minutes away from my house two or three times a month. Having a really comfortable car is very nice when I have put in a 10-hour day at a client site and then have to drive a 90 minutes home (sometimes more, if traffic is bad). It’s a nice upgrade for me, that I feel very justified in paying for with my salary.
We have contemplated leasing in the past, and I have to say, some of the comments in this thread are persuading me it might be a good idea for our next vehicle. We’ve been mostly lucky with having reliable cars but the ones that weren’t reliable, or got less reliable over time – it was such a pain in the butt, and I don’t enjoy the unexpected shock of going out and trying to go somewhere and the car won’t start, or worse – it dies on the road. I am willing to not try to pour effort and money into a 15-year-old vehicle to avoid the inconvenience of unexpected repairs; I’d rather trade the car in before I’ve squeezed every mile out of the engine, and know that the car is going to work when I need it to. I also feel like maintenance is a consideration. I got new tires and brakes on my Sonata about 18 months before I traded it in, and it was $2000. My husband had advocated for me to just get a new car, but we were in the pandemic and I didn’t want to deal with car shopping. I don’t mind spending on maintenance to get a car to 10 years/100,000 miles but beyond that point – I do feel like sometimes it becomes a situation of diminishing returns.
Anonymous
I have a 2020 minivan we are planning to keep until we no longer need a minivan, and a 2010 Acura MDX. The Acura will probably be replaced with another one in the next few years but we both wFH and it doesn’t get much use so we aren’t replacing it.
Anonymous
I have 2017 bmw that I bought cash my husband also has one that I think is 2019 also bought cash. Car payments and lease payments feel really stressful for us financially, whereas paying cash means we’re good to keep them for as long as we still like them. Most years we look at our raises and bonuses and decide we’re not excited enough about the thought of a new car to buy one so we just bank the money or do a home improvement project. Leasing seems really stressful to me. My parents are always ending up with a slightly newer version of their car in a weird color because they needed a new car and that’s all they had and the rate is higher. I like the freedom of buying what I want when I want. I think part of the reason I’m not itching for a new car is that I got exactly the car I wanted because I owned the last one and had time to find a new one that had everything on my wishlist.
Kat G
#car
Anon
Anyone have any post-40 glow-up stories? I.e., financial, career, family, travel, overall happiness growth or changes that happened at or after turning forty?
Anonymous
My mom moved literally half way across the world shortly before turning 40, learned a whole new language, made new friends, got divorced around 40, and then post-40 got remarried, pursued a degree in a wholly new area for her, became a registered nurse, had some problems with her marriage but came through better and stronger on the other side of them, is in a happy marriage now and enjoying her life in just about all the categories you mention. It wasn’t easy and I gloss over a lot of drama in making it all happen but she’s such an inspiration to me because she just doesn’t stop trying no matter what.
Anonymous
While I’m not familliar with the term glow-up, I will say that I loved how comfortable in my own skin I became after 40. I stopped worrying about other’s opinions, embraced my persobal style and really just liked myself overall in a way I didn’t before…
Anon
Same!
Anon
I called it my f*** you forties.
Anonymous
Same.
Anonymous
It’s not mine but my mentor!
In her mid 40s, she lateraled as a partner to a much more higher paying firm with more interesting work where she was very successful.
Then in her late 40s she reconnected with a former colleague and they got married.
He was older and had adult children, and his kids had grandkids shortly after the marriage. His kids love her and she is an active and involved step grandmother to his grandkids. She is also super close with her sister and her children and her sister’s kids spend the summer with my mentor in our city now that they are old enough to fly on their own.
She also got back into triathlons after getting serious about addressing the injury that stopped her from doing them.
She’s awesome!
Anon
Yep, 40 on has been the best years for me. Met my husband at 40, got promoted into the c-suite, got a dog and a second home. I’m firmly of the view life just gets better as you get older.
Anon
I met my husband two weeks after I turned 40.
Anon
I’m hoping this happens for me!
Anon
Me too, two months later but close enough!
anonshmanon
My mom’s career made a big jump at that time, when all her kids became more or less independent.
Anne-on
+1 to this – saw it with my mom who went back to graduate school when we were in middle school and got a big promotion when we were in high school/college. I’ve seen many other women I work with do similar things – it’s amazing how much time opens up when your kids hit their teens.
Anonymous
This is so true. My kids are now 13 and 15 and the ability for them to catch the bus home from school and be home alone for a couple hours is amazing.
Anon
My son started driving last year, right about the time I got a new job. Not having to schedule my life around drop-off and pick-up and getting him to practice has made a huge difference in our lives, and I’ve already been promoted once and have another promotion on the horizon. It’s also just a thousand times less stress on the household in general, now that he can drive himself places and we don’t have to go into protracted logistical conversations about who can take him where at what time.
LawDawg
I started law school when I was 40. I was already working in a law-adjacent field and wanted to move ahead. So I left full-time work when my kids were 1 and 4 to go to school full-time (big shout out to the most supportive spouse ever). I have zero regrets about that decision and am now working in a job I love. This wasn’t a huge change since I am still in the same industry, but it was a big sacrifice and leap of faith at that age.
Anon
Sure!
I quit drinking after decades of problematic alcohol use, am in the best fitness shape of my life, feel great about myself (both inside and outside), have a robust and fulfilling life full of hobbies I picked up later in life, was recruited for a job last year that increased my salary by 30% and bonus target by 5% and got a retention bonus within 6 months of hire date, and while I am single, I really enjoy my life so much!
Anonymous
Go you! I dont know you but just reading this, I feel so impressed and so proud.
Hootster
Me too!
Anon
That’s so kind of you, thanks!!!
BeenThatGuy
Honestly, me. I was around 40 when I feel like my whole life came together. I’m about to turn 47 next week. I’ve just gotten (re)married after swearing off relationships after my divorce when I was 31. I was just offered a limited partnership at my Fortune 500 company. I’m healthier, meaning my diet and exercise routines are on point, than I’ve been in my life. My skincare routine makes me look 10 years younger. I have the financial freedom to travel internationally/domestic multiple times a year and I can help people in my family, when needed. My teenage son brings me more joy than I could ever express (mainly because he’d be annoyed – IYKYK). I’ve built a solid group of friends, that have become family, as a support system that I never got from my family. Honestly, that was super hard because I had to be really vulnerable by asking for help/support and opening myself up in ways that I wasn’t capable of when I was younger.
My life is not all butterflies and rainbows but I am grateful every morning when I feet hit the ground and I get a new day to live my best damn life!
Anon
i’m not 40 yet, but my parents made a big move in their 40s with two young kids to a state where my mom knew like one person and developed the most incredible community of friends. They both say that moving was the best decision they made.
Bette
My mom went to college in her early 40s. She graduated, became a teacher for 15 years, then in her early 60s she started an incredibly successful non-profit.
She just retired from the non-profit recently in her mid-70s.
For me, I went to grad school in my late 30s, did a career pivot and dramatically increased my earnings. I then had two kids in my early 40s.
Finally, I think of a woman who I interned with back when I was in college too. She was in her late 40s, had just recently gotten married. Her husband was in his mid-50s and had adult children. She was a really enthusiastic step-mom. I kept in touch and she went on to law school in her 50s and loved being a grandmother. I’m friends with her on LinkedIn and she’s still practicing in her early 70s!
Good luck! Life is long.
KS IT Chick
At 47, I made a job change that has led to a better team environment, a more fulfilling role and far more money. I’m still in the same industry, but I work for an organization that believes in doing the right thing every time.
The job changes also led us to moving within our state. We have a home that fits our needs, without requiring significant changes. We have a neighborhood where we met more people in 3 months in a global pandemic than we had met in more than a decade at our previous home.
Anonymous
In my 40s I was finally able to start living my life partly for myself and not just for my spouse and child. I picked back up with what had been a serious hobby during high school and college and took on a big volunteer position. I got a dog and we take a long walk to the lake every day, just the two of us.
Anne-on
It’s more ‘real self-care’ vs. bubble bath type self care but I’ve been spending the last few years of my 40’s systematically taking care of my health (physical and mental) and addressing issues that I’d ignored for a long time in favor of family/work stuff. It isn’t super fun to do invisalign/start therapy/do PT/see specialists but I feel like it’s a sold investment in myself as I age. The therapy has also given me more tools and insights to be a better mother/wife/friend as well.
I’ve also been spending a lot of time thinking critically about how to set myself up in this next phase of life – my child will be out of college in ~10yrs so what do I want my life to look like when it doesn’t revolve around child-rearing – how can I deepen connections in my family and community? It’s led me to reach out to old and new friends and to volunteer more. Financially – I’ve more than doubled my income from when I was 30 which I’m very proud of! Still working on some debt but it’s very manageable and frankly we’re not paying it off in one lump sum because the interest rates are lower than our investment returns.
DC Pandas
Check out the “never too late” series from the NYT! Full of stories of folks making big changes and finding success in unexpected ways: https://www.nytimes.com/series/its-never-too-late
anon
Well, I didn’t see a dermatologist until I turned 40.
My skin now looks better than it did in my 20s.
I glow!
And I don’t do botox/fillers etc. Just finally saw a doctor who knew something about skin!
Anon
I’m jealous! Dermatologists have been pretty useless for me, but I’ve been wondering if I should try an aesthetician now.
Anon2
Forbes just released their 50 over 50 list: https://www.forbes.com/50over50/
I know Forbes is not the publication it used to be but you may still find some inspiration.
Anonymous
my mom separated from my dad at 58, moved by herself to Dallas, got a new job, found incredible community through her gardening club, 5am gym classes, and neighbors and is living the fullest life she’s had in the last 40 years.
Monday
I’m 41, and life is only getting better. I met my partner when we were both in our late 30s, and he puts all my exes to shame. I quit my job to go solo just in time for my 41st birthday, and I am SO MUCH HAPPIER without an employer. I also make more money and have far more time to myself, as well as much better relationships with my patients and almost complete control over my work. I echo the person above talking about feeling more comfortable physically–I think I look fine, but more importantly I am not preoccupied with my appearance the way I was when I was younger. My friendships are awesome, and I knew when and how to eliminate the one friendship that had gone rotten. I’m managing my money better than ever, probably because I no longer need retail therapy. I get along with my family better than ever before, probably because I am less stressed and more free to be myself. I could go on. I’m expecting the rest of my 40s to be great, and I am not a natural optimist!
Anon
I had more money post 40 so that always helps. If I’m going by male attention, I was probably flower in my early 30s, but if I’m going by how I felt about myself, the 40s were where it was at!!
Anonymous
My mom divorced from my terrible father at 53, got her MA degree at 54 and changed her career. Now, at 63, she looks so happy, energized, she goes to the gym 4x/week. She is my idol.
Anon
I went to law school late (graduated at 37) and turned 40 when I was seconded to a tech company. I ended up staying as it was a great learning experience being a solo at a hypergrowth company. I ultimately left because I valued my law license (ahem!), but the company subsequently did a SPAC, and my options were worth over a million bucks. I then returned to biglaw, and so many people in biglaw looked down on my in-house experience without knowing that I both accelerated my career and cleaned-up comp-wise.
I’m also the same poster who was just despondent this spring when my best friend died in a car accident. There’s never enough time when something like that happens.
Money’s great, and it was nice to get back on track financially after taking an expensive time-out in grad school in my 30s, but I’d take my best friend back any day over the money. Any day.
I co-sign all of the comments that IDGAF about what other people think of me, in a way that is so incredibly freeing. I don’t think I had abnormal anxiety in my 20s–a normal amount of “what would people think?!?”, but now doing what I want to do feels great.
Eliza
Yes! I felt stagnant in my field and was looking for a challenge. I took up a new hobby that ended up becoming a passion. That hobby can be parlayed into a lucrative career, so I’m planning on a 180° course reversal over the next few years. I’ll slowly transition away from my current field as I gain the experience necessary for the new job. My family is very supportive and I couldn’t be more excited. Also, I’m well over 40!
Hootster
Just curious if you pop back in this thread – what hobby is this?
Eliza
Aviation! I started taking flying lessons for fun and I’m now a commercial pilot and certified flight instructor.
Anon
Bada$$! I love this!
Anon
I smoked from age 14 to 40. At 40, I was hacking up a lung, my legs and feet were purple, and my skin was dry dry. Now, at 57, I look and feel so much better. Chantix.
Kat G
#turning40
General
I’m an in-house generalist at a large company and I need to come up with some development items for next year. I don’t want to go to any conferences and have all of my CLEs covered, so I was trying to think outside the box a bit. Maybe something like a training course or a certification. Any ideas?
In-House Anon
You might consider trainings or certifications in data security/cybersecurity, data privacy and/or ethical enterprise AI.
OP
Any specific ones you recommend? I was thinking about this as it seems to be coming up a lot.
In-House Anon
Unfortunately, no…I was just thinking about the big topics in my large tech company, and areas I’d explore if I were in your shoes. For data privacy, there’s the CIPP/US certification, but for the other areas, I’m not sure.
FP
What about a course/certificate on AI/language learning models? This will impact so many industries, it would be great to understand the technology and limitations.
Anonie
If you’re open to travel, rather than a conference, could you do something like a writer’s retreat, at which you focus on a non-urgent but high-value piece of work product? Or, even more outside the box, would your employer be supportive of something like a meditation or wellness retreat, particularly if you brought back your learnings and presented on them to the team?
anon
Am in-house and similarly not interested in law conferences. My development goals are internal: meet so-and-so in a different division who is based in Europe, work on X kind of work that is outside my normal responsibilities, attend Y event in person to better understand our customer base. Basically, I make business goals that develop my internal client base. When I am older, these goals will morph into things that expose me to the C-suite and board of directors.
Sarah
Has anyone bought jewelry from Brilliant Earth or Aurate? How were your experiences?
I want to buy an 18k gold ring for myself and those seem like some of the places that have that. Mejuri etc have 14k.
Anon
They’re all the same thing. It’s kind of like asking “I’m looking at JCrew and usually shop at Banana and Ann Taylor.” The designs are similar, so is the quality. I’ve never been happy with an online jewelry purchase for a ring. I’d go to a jeweler and try things on.
Worried
For a milestone ten + years ago, my husband bought me an 18k gold ring. I had gone to a brilliant earth store with him while on a trip and tried lots of styles in person, but couldn’t really decide and sort of forgot about it. Several months later he bought what I picked out for me as a gift – he added a rounder, wider center stone. I love the ring though I have bashed up the band a bit as 18k gold is quite soft. The stones are going strong though!
Anne-on
I’ve heard amazing things about Roen NYC and it looks like they also do bespoke. Costco also has great deals on classic pieces.
Anon
I bought a ring from aurate. it was good quality. I will say it looked a lot meatier online that when I received it, and I was a bit disappointed. But it’s still a pretty ring, and I’m glad I bought it. Get on their mailing list–they’ve been doing 35% off coupons lately, and that’s not nothing.
Anonymous
The problem with Ann Taylor is A) Quality is poor B) Everyone else has it C) It’s going to be 30% off in a month so why buy it now.
Anon
And it is SO expensive for what it is! I actually like a lot of their options for basic work clothes but I can’t afford it (even on sale is pricey for me).
Anne-on
This – I refuse to buy things from Ann Taylor online anymore because it’s inevitably poor quality when it arrives and then I have to deal with the return. I’ll try stuff on if I happen to be in store but I have better success with Jcrew/Boden for roughly the same amount of $$ (comparing full price AT vs. Boden/JCrew on sale).
Anon
+1 to the quality issues
OOO
I agree on all points, but I bought this sweater this morning anyway (actually I used the posted link to buy this sweater in the blue/plum version). With shipping it was $93 for a polyester blend sweater, which is probably $30 more than it should have been, but I have been wearing a lot of sweater tees this summer and Ann Taylor has had some lovely color combos lately. Some of the Ann Taylor styles that are online exclusives aren’t as likely to be bought by other people in my office. The last time I waited for a sale on an Ann Taylor sweater tee it sold out in my size, so I snapped this one up quickly.
Anon
Where do you suggest shopping for 14P size suits?
Panda Bear
Check out Talbots, they have petites in almost all their sizes.
Anonymous
I’m the same size and it is very hard to find suits. It was impossible for me to find one in-person in my mid-size city that has all the major department stores. My favorite suit is like 10 years old from Talbots, but recently have also had luck ordering from Dillards and Macy’s. I have to get everything tailored.
Anon
All of this.
Almost all of my suits are from Talbots, or Laura (the Canadian equivalent). Louben Petite and Precis Petite were my favourite brands, but they don’t seem to exist anymore.
Anonymous
The blouse in this print is really pretty, but I am not paying $95 for a polyester, poor quality blouse.
Anonymous
Has anyone considered ADU vs shed to add a space for guests?
Anon
Yes, we built an ADU to have guest space. A shed was never a consideration for that though. We love it and have friends and family stay with us often.
anon
My relatives have them. They live in California, and ADUs have become incredibly popular in their area.
And my relatives are lucky to have very large yards.
I have stayed in them. They are …. amazing. A small guest house that is modern, well designed, private, lovely. I mean…. I would be happy to live there, as a single person. In fact, when I lived in that area years ago I tried to rent one as an alternative to apartment living, but they were highly desirable.
I was shocked at how relatively inexpensive they are to build – I mean, they aren’t cheap, but they increase property values a lot. My relatives now have their elderly parents move there, when they were no longer able/interested in living in the big family home alone anymore. Everyone has privacy. During COVID, the college kids came home and lived in them.
I mean, what guest wouldn’t love to have their own private guest house!
NW Islander
I think the costs have increased significantly. I own a property with an 800sf garage that I do not use. When I got bids to replace the garage with an ADU, the cheapest was $400k and the most expensive was $550k. That is using the existing concrete slab, utilities already in street. I told the builders that basic finishes were fine. Still almost half a mill. I’m in WA state, not California.
anon
That’s an order of magnitude more expensive than the ones I’ve seen. Maybe you didn’t have one of the very well established/efficient companies that install them all the time. They have it down to a science. On staff are all the architects, the models are all pre-designed and easy to modify/personalized. Sounds like you were hiring contractors that were starting from scratch. You definitely don’t want to go that route.
A company like this is the one you want. If you don’t live in the Bay Area, you could call them and ask them to recommend a local company.
https://inspiredadus.com/team
Anon
That is bigger than my whole apartment! I imagine most people in this thread are talking about smaller buildings.
Also don’t you live on an island? Not sure if there is a bridge to your island, but boating/barging materials and workers would increase the cost quite a bit.
Anon
We’re actually in the middle of building an ADU right now in the Bay Area. We went with a modular and what was originally quoted doubled over the life of the contract (materials and the installation labor were agreed at-cost and this is what pushed it waay over). At this point the 1000 sq ft modular will cost about $450K to build and then there is the foundation, permits, and all the utility connections. It will cost about 550K in total, so that’s $550 psf which is only a little cheaper psf than buying an actual house in the Bay Area. I’m sure we made mistakes but we are competent people who felt like we did our homework. At the time we went under contract InspireADUs did not offer a 1000 sq ft plan (everything mainstream modular in the Bay Area was under 750 sq ft, probably to avoid impact fees, and we needed bigger because it would become the primary residence).
Anonymous
You would have guests stay in a shed?!?
Anon
I’m going to assume she means an out building that’s basically a room rather than a mini home with a bathroom and kitchen. As a guest, I’d happily stay in an ADU but no thanks to the shed.
Anne-on
It depends on the type of unit – many in our area have electric/heat but no plumbing and they’re more work studio/office type set ups vs. full on guest homes. Our town has more restrictions on adding plumbing/water than electricity/gas as the water and plumbing lines are old, many people have septic tanks, etc.
Anne-on
We built a large shed to replace one that came down in a hurricane and intentionally sized it/built it with the ability to become an ADU in the future. A few things to keep in mind – cost to run utilities can be VERY expensive. We already gas and electric lines a few feet away that we can tap into but that’s because a previous project involved extending the gas and electric lines to behind our garage where the generator lives. That cost a ton – roughly ~20k over 10 years ago to manually dig the lines, run them, hook them up, and have them inspected by the town. We don’t intend to run water out as that’s a whole other (expensive) process. If you already have all of that OR don’t intend to run power/water to it then it becomes much easier.
Anon
I’m in the Bay Area. We have a fairly big old house for the area, so we can do some musical chairs and make room for guests but we don’t have a dedicated guest room, with 5 humans living here full time. I have been casually looking into an ADU, and apparently the local building regulations are more friendly towards them now, but I’m not 100% sure I want to give up that much of my outdoor space to it.
Anon
Be aware that many utilities will charge you a multi-unit rate when you add an ADU, regardless of whether it’s rented out or not.
Anon
The LA Times did a five part series on ADUs about two months ago–like everything you’d want to know, ever. They’re paywalled, but may be worth signing up for a free month and cancelling–it was incredibly comprehensive and interesting, from design to zoning to architecture.
Anon
We would love to do that, but we have a small, oddly-configured yard and we just can’t make it work with city building codes.
If you have the ability to do it and you have aging parents you will be caring for in the future, I highly recommend it. One of my friends built a new house and included an ADU, and just moved her mother into it. She and her husband both WFH and her mom doesn’t need a ton of care; basically just someone to check in on her twice a day or so to make sure she hasn’t fallen, and that she’s eaten and taken her meds, so they’re doing that themselves right now. At some point, they may have to get a daytime caregiver, but that’s still going to be cheaper than having her mom in assisted living at $7k per month. If push comes to shove, we may sell our house and move so we can have an ADU for one or both of my parents, vs. putting them in assisted living.
anon
Thanks for sharing this.
These are truly wonderful for multi-generational living like this. Universally, my family members who have done it are so happy with it. It works for everyone and is cost effective for the long run. The cost of assisted living and daily homecare workers is just staggering.
Anon
Good morning! I work in public education admin, and I’m in the middle of a year-long unpaid maternity leave with my third kid. Money is a little tight, so we had decided not to do professional family photos this year. Recently, a local mom posted on a mom’s Facebook page that her college-aged daughter was interested in photography and offering “free, tips appreciated” family photo sessions to build her portfolio. I actually indirectly worked with her daughter while she was a student at my school years ago, and I remember she was a very smart kid. So, we signed up!
Now I’m wondering, what should I tip the student photographer? When we did regular-priced professional photo sessions in the past, we would pay $400. We live in a HCOL area (but not VHCOL). I have a couple ideas of what I should tip, but I’d like to hear your input first! Thank you!
Anonie
Like $50
Anonymous
If the session is an hour, I’d give her $50 and another $50 if the pictures come back great/reasonably usable. I think around $100 is probably right, but if the pictures are blurry etc. I wouldn’t want to have paid $100 for something I can’t use.
Anon
I like this plan. $100 was the number that popped into my head, but agree I’d want to make sure they’re decent before doing the whole amount.
Anon
I think you would be fine at $50, but I’d give her a $100 bill.
Anon
I would too. This is influenced by the fact that you know her and she’s a college student.
Anon
I agree with $50-100 as far as cash, but marketing is so important for photographers that I think one of the best things you can give her is exposure, i.e., sharing the photos widely and giving her credit. My pro photographer also asked me to write a Google review for her (which I happily did). Apparently it’s the #1 source of new business for her. So I’d think about doing those things too if you’re happy with the results.
Anon
Can anyone recommend a memory care facility in the greater Denver area? We’re starting the process now but we’re getting very skeptical of paid reviews and promotional placement in aggregate listings. I’m hoping for a semi-personalized recommendation or two.
Anonymous
Applewood Place in Lakewood may be worth a look. We found them via “A Place for Mom,” and they have great recommendations locally. We’ve since moved my mom to another state, so my view is about 18-months ago.
Anon 2.0
No recommendations for Denver, but whatever you do, get every single thing they promise to provide in writing. A family member is going thru this now and even at a “high end”, well regarded facility, there has been a lot of issues. Having everything is writing has helped when making complaints. For example, paperwork upon move in clearly stated that accommodations would be made for food dislikes, inability to eat certain textures, etc. It became an issue almost immediately upon family member being moved in – ie, feeding foods he could not chew, and the issue had to be taken to the administrator. Facility was trying to claim “well, they can’t accommodate all food issues” when that is 100% against what was in writing.
Anon
Thank you both! I appreciate the responses.
Sasha
I borrowed a friend’s car to run some errands on Tuesday night and street parked it in the same area she usually parks it overnight when she drives it herself. I was going to use it again yesterday but when I got there, it was gone. It hasn’t yet shown up in the city’s towed cars registry so while I am holding out hope that it’ll show up there, I’m starting to think it might’ve been stolen. I am typically very paranoid around locking cars/doors so I am 99% confident that I locked it, but there’s always a chance that I didn’t. The street I parked it on is a side street in an urban but generally safe area but our city is relatively high crime in general.
I am checking the registry every few hours, and have called the city a few times to see if they have more information but no dice yet. She’ll be filing a police report soon.
I am obviously wracked with guilt and trying to think of what I can do to make it up to her. I’m not as directly culpable as if I had crashed it or something but I still feel responsible. Any commiseration or ideas? I’m planning on getting her flowers and a gift card regardless of how it shakes out.
Anon
Just to check, have you walked around the area to make sure you didn’t actually park one street over or something like that?
Sasha
I texted her the address I parked it in front of in case she needed it in the morning. So unfortunately I am very certain of where I left it.
Anonymous
You say ‘in the same area she usually parks’ does your friend also street park? Does your city have a permitting system for street parking?
Sasha
Yes, she parks on a street around the corner from her apartment in a permit area (for which she has a permit). I parked it in that permit area but there’s always a chance I unknowingly was in a tow zone/by a hydrant/etc
Anonnnnn
You need to report it stolen ASAP so there’s a chance of it being recovered. My friend had her CR-V stolen from a residential street in Montreal this year, and the cops were able to find it in a matter of hours. Apparently the group that is responsible will move the car to a different place in the city, wait a few days to see if it’s reported stolen, and then will put it on a shipping container to sell overseas. This sounds so outlandish, I know, but it’s a real thing (link to follow). Also, my friend’s car was locked, and the thieves had a universal key they unlocked it with.
Anonnnnn
This is specific to Montreal, but also happens elsewhere– https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/steep-rise-in-reports-of-stolen-vehicles-in-montreal-1.6244746
Sasha
That’s crazy! She is at the police station now filing the report so hopefully it’s soon enough. The universal key makes me feel better–I am sick to think that I left it unlocked and that’s how this happened. I have a distinct memory of clicking the key fob to lock it, but it’s possible I accidentally clicked “unlock” instead of “lock”, since it’s a fob I’m not familiar with.
joan wilder
Even if you accidentally left it unlocked (which is unlikely), that did not give thieves a key to start the engine and could have happened anyway (if it was stolen). By any chance, was there any emergency road work done? My car was once towed by the city around the corner do deal with an emergency gas line repair.
Anon
+1 You can’t just steal a car because the door is unlocked. I’m sure that removes some steps for a committed thief, but it’s not in and of itself enough.
Bette
Is this in Philadelphia? I’m which case look to see if it has been “courtesy towed”.
If so, they towed it several blocks away. I’d just slowly circle the neighborhood while pressing the lock button and trying to listen for a beep.
Anon
My husband’s car was once towed and it took several hours, maybe close to 24, for it to show up in the city’s towed list.
anon
What kind of car was it?
There are a few brands/models of cars that are being stolen like crazy right now in my area. Every day in my small suburb. They are usually just driven around for a day or less and left somewhere random. I think it may even be part of the social life/initiation in one of our local gangs. At least they have cut down on the car jackings…
I can imagine how you feel.
Anonymous
I posted the below comment yesterday and Tricia, bless her heart, suggested I repost today so that people might see it.
This feels so mundane compared to the discussions above, but I hate how I look and it’s starting to interfere with my life. I find myself canceling social engagements because I don’t want people to see me. I started crying when I got my new headshots.
I gained 25 pounds since 2020, in part because of a combination of infertility treatments, multiple pregnancy losses, depression (and antidepressants), pandemic isolation, and, most recently, perimenopause. The weight gain is a big part of why I don’t like the way I look.
I guess I am looking for two kinds of advice: first, any weight loss advice you may have; second, advice on how to get over this desire to hide.
Anon
The biggest recommendation I can make is to start dressing in a way that makes you happy. Buy some clothing that actually fits your body and makes you feel good about yourself. Also, don’t underestimate the confidence boost from a good haircut, mani/pedi, new accessories, etc. Next, get yourself to a doctor to run some labs just to make sure there aren’t any other underlying issues. Consider doing something like Noom or a simply food journal to track what you are actually putting into your body. If you enjoy it and can fit it into your schedule, start doing some type of movement that makes you happy or less stressed (like walking outside once or twice a day, doing a yoga class or at home videos, etc.).
Anonymous
I’m in similar situation – gaining even more weight – and just got a cute haircut and bought a few new items. It does make me feel better. I’d start there.
DeeDee
yes. get your colors done again by one of those “what color should you wear” people. go to sephora and get a makeover and buy their recommended colors and products. you will be whatever weight makes you comfortable some day, but now you are this weight and you deserve to be happy! if happy seems like a tall order, then what about satisfied? you deserve to be satisfied! if that’s too much- start with basics. you deserve clothes that fit and flatter the body you are in now.
Anon
To kill two birds with one stone, consider a new active hobby like cycling or hiking. They can be solo activities if that’s how you feel more comfortable to start, but they can also be a great way to do something social without a big focus on looks while you get your groove back. These will really help your confidence and help you see that life is about what your body can do, not how it looks. I have found that these types of outdoor activities have really helped me with my appearance related woes. No one cares (not even me) that I’m overweight as I zip down a black diamond trail, and no one is looking at my eye abnormality when the view of Half Dome is much more compelling. Getting much more active in activities that require focus also helped me avoid rumination.
In this case, I find the saying “feelings follow action” to be incredibly true. Good luck to you.
anon
I found that following women who have larger bodies on instagram has really helped me to be at peace with my body. I’m healthy, so the only reason I’d have to lose weight is for my appearance, and I’ve chosen instead to focus on what my body can do (just came back from a multi-day backpacking trip in the middle east, where I was one of the oldest participants but had no trouble keeping up, for instance – this kind of thing makes me really appreciate my body!).
Anonymous
I actually wrote something really similar a few months ago and got really good advice. Long infertility process, pregnancy, serious chronic illness, early menopause.
I focused first on “not hiding” and made some cosmetic updates:
1. Updated my hair – I grew it out a few inches, got a new more modern cut with more layers, and got highlights that bring out the reddishness in my hair
2. Fixed a minor issue with a front tooth that has always bothered me
3. Whitened my teeth using at home strips
4. Got a Nuuly subscription to try out new styles of clothes in sizes that fit me (may be size dependent as their plus size options aren’t great). Has also been useful for some weddings/vacations this summer.
5. Bought a few things that fit and are more stylish for my daily activities (wide leg jeans, a cute exercise dress for playground visits, stylish sneakers and a cute baseball cap for walking the dog, a few tops/earrings/hair accessories that look good on Zoom for work)
6. Spent some time on TikTok watching makeup tutorials and updated some of my makeup techniques/products. Small makeup tweaks make a big difference.
7. Exercise 2x a week for 30 minutes. It’s not a ton but it’s something. I do also walk the dog every day.
I’m only now starting to tackle the weight loss point and I’m working with a nutritionist (she’s a registered dietician) which has been great honestly. It’s more expensive but it’s a much slower, steady approach and I like that she gives me really customized advice for my lifestyle/eating habits. We are currently meeting weekly and I take photos of everything I eat and she makes suggestions each night so I can tweak my meals the next day. I’m only 3 weeks in and I’ve lost 3 pounds, I feel much better and it’s all very easy and has not require major changes – just small tweaks.
Good luck!
Anonymous
You don’t need to lose weight. Not for anything you listed. You need to go to therapy. If you’re already there, tell your therapist “I find myself avoiding plans and leaving my house because I feel too ugly to be seen.” This is not about the 25lbs. I’
Anon
+1.
anon
+100
Work on your mood issues. You need to work on the root of it, and the rest will come.
You’re going through a lot. Give yourself some grace.
For me, I started slow. Catching up on my healthcare needs. Good sleep habits. And then I started something for my fitness that also helps my mood. Yoga. I am stronger, getting leaner slowly. It has helped me dial down my stress level, and then I binge less.
Agree that a good haircut, and clothes that fit and you like help a lot.
You go girl.
anonshmanon
I think this is right, and I want to push back on calling this mundane, OP. This is a serious issue (not the weight but your mental health), significantly impacting your overall quality of life, and I am so glad that you listened to yourself and asked for advice! That is an important but fantastically difficult thing to do, so kudos!
It sounds like you could benefit from some therapy and you deserve to be at peace with yourself.
DeeDee
yes. even if you’re on mood stabilizers or antidepressants, call your prescriber and read her this post. she’ll ask some follow-up questions and hopefully get brain chemistry modified for you. tell a friend, too, or a partner. someone needs to check on you. be kind go yourself
Anonymous
I’ve been there, when you feel so bad about your looks you rethink leaving the house.
Since it’s not a constant thing, I would reframe it as something that will ebb and flow and, when the feeling is at its peak, it’s okay to bow out. I also handled it by hanging out with different people which helped because (1) those people were less focused on looks than my other friends and (2) I hadn’t seen them as recently so it wasn’t a stark contrast.
anon
Buy new clothes that you feel good in right now . Things that make you happy and a few pairs of pants that are comfy and fitted. Nothing makes you feel worse about yourself that a day in an “well, it zipped so I guess it fits” awkwardness. Get a few outfits that make you feel great. Also, hair. Highly underestimated how much a good hair day makes you feel good about yourself.
Nesprin
You deserve to feel about yourself the way your best friend would describe you.
You’ve come through 2 different things that can kill people, intact. That is an incredible accomplishment.
If you’re crying at pictures of yourself, and avoiding social engagements to keep people from seeing you, go back to your therapist/psych team.
Menopause is not fun
I can only speak to my own experience but I tried accepting my new body and failed miserably. I was already following a bunch of “mid-sized” bloggers on Insta, had unfollowed anyone considerably younger/thinner than I was, and was exercising so none of that had helped. The turning point was when I realized I did not have a single photo of myself with my kid at kid’s college graduation because I did not want to have my picture taken. So I finally got on a scale and realized that I really had gained 35 pounds since I turned 50 (I am now 55), which put me squarely in the medically obese territory, which given a strong family history of diabetes was a little scary.
So I did what a lot of people will tell you not to do. I went on a diet. In my case that meant the (old) South Beach Diet – so low carb but not keto. And I celebrated every milestone: a new pair of shoes, a massage, etc. It took four months but I lost 25 pounds. I am not completely happy with where I am now and I am not “thin” but any stretch of anyone’s imagination, but I am much healthier, I sleep better, and my clothes fit so my goal for the summer is just not to gain any back, which I have accomplished by limiting, although not eliminating, alcohol and simple carbs. In the fall when summer travel is over I will re-evaluate.
What I learned is that I cannot half-ass it. Small changes help me keep weight off but not lose it. Exercise is good for me and (probably) helps keep weight off but not lose it. Trying to mix body acceptance and weight loss definitely did not help. I was unhappy and the only thing that helped was being able to think that I was taking actual (sometimes hard) and appreciable steps to fix the problem. It was also important (for me) that I weigh every day. I do not angst over a few pounds up but that keeps me honest in terms of what I am eating and drinking while trying to maintain.
Again, that is what worked FOR ME. Obviously YMMV. Good luck with whatever path you take.
Anon
TW: dieting, weight loss
I’m overweight and have been losing weight. I’m working with my doctor and he says the key is to lose weight slowly. When I’ve lost weight before I’ve done things like south beach or Whole 30 where I cut out entire classes of food, and unsurprisingly and consistent with the statistics on weight loss, all the weight came back on when I tried to start eating normally.
You can’t lose weight and eat the same. Exercise is great for giving you a few more calories but you actually have to reduce what you eat. I use a calorie counter (I use my Fitness pal) and log what I eat. If I go over my calories for the day it’s ok, tomorrow is a new day and I just stick with it. Most days I’m under my calories which are 1500 a day, so generous – I’m not starving.
It takes a long time but it has been worth it to me. I am down 35 to 40 lbs since September. My doc said to aim for a pound a month, and obviously I’ve exceeded that. But on diets I did before, I might have lost this much in a couple of months, and that’s what was unsustainable.
Best of luck!
Anon
I’ve commented this on a few of these types of threads before, but whitening my teeth really makes me feel better about my appearance. I use a box Crest White Strips maybe once every 10-12 months.
Anonymous
Hi everyone, it’s OP.
I want to thank you all for taking the time to respond. It helps to know that I am not alone. I agree that I need to address the mental aspect first. Thank you all for your advice!
Anonymous
For those who have gone through fertility treatments: I have my first appointment with a clinic next week. I suspect I will be told that I should lose weight. But also I’m almost 40 and I’ll probably be counseled to start IVF sooner rather than later, which I’ve heard can cause weight gain. I absolutely cannot gain more weight, I’m already overweight. Will the clinic be willing to prescribe anything to help with the weight loss? I would assume no, since I’m TTC. I really don’t want to be shamed, I don’t want to be told “diet and exercise!” as if I’m not already doing that. Prior blood work says everything’s normal. Idk why I can’t lose weight. Anyone have any insight on what I can expect and what I should ask?
Anon
Let me preface this by saying I am all for the weight loss medications that are on the market right now. I don’t believe that a fertility clinic would prescribe them to you. If you are interested in that, you should consider going to a PCP, OB/GYN (where I got my prescription), or a weight loss specialist. However, those medications should only help you lose the weight at a reasonable rate (one or two pounds a week max), so it would be a long haul. Also, there are diagnoses, like PCOS, that can impact your weight and your fertility. A lot of women with PCOS do diet and exercise, but it’s not enough due to other factors. If you are going to a clinic that is shaming you for this, try another clinic.
Anon
what do you want them to prescribe? like ozempic? i believe that is not safe with pregnancy.
Anonymous
does their clinic work with a registered dietician? If not, can they refer you to one who specializes in fertility?
Anon
Isn’t this a conversation to have with the doctors? The risks of gaining more weight versus the risks of weight loss medication is a question that is specific to you and requires medical expertise.
Anon
How overweight are you? I have heard that clinics have a bmi cutoff point, but I’m overweight and no one mentioned my weight during the whole process. I think you might have to be in the extremely obese end of the table before it becomes an issue.
Also, in case it makes you feel any better, I didn’t gain any weight during IVF – I actually lost like 5 lbs. Some people do gain weight, but some don’t.
Anonymous
Idk I’m 5’ 5” and 215 lbs and all j got was the standard we encourage all of our patients to get 30 minutes of aerobic exercise 4 times a week and eat healthy. Some clinics have BMI cut offs and will be more aggressive but no fertility clinic is going to give you Ozempic since it’s not proven safe for conception/pregnancy.
Anon
No, I’ve never heard of an REI prescribing weight management medications and I think they have you stop them while in treatment. Some seem to have preferences about certain diets (keto vs plant based etc) but that seems very physician dependent. Some definitely have a BMI cut off (40 is the most common I’ve heard) for IVF but that’s also clinic dependent.
Anon
I’m pretty sure they prescribe Metformin routinely. If that doesn’t count as a weight management med, I feel it probably should!
Anon
Hi–One unexpected benefit of my IVF journey was that I found out I was wildly deficient in Vit D and my thyroid wasn’t working. Thyroid = very important for growing a baby. So, you may not need “weigh loss meds” per se. Go to the RE/clinic, talk to them about this. Being on the right thyroid meds helped my weight.
I also found a lot of motivation to be really healthy because I was spending so much money on IVF. I was walking more, eating cleaner and I did not gain permanent weight (you will gain water weight during the cycle). I also started exercising more regularly, even though I had a crazy job.
My body fat did shift to provide more nutrients for the baby (and I only did retrievals, no transfers yet). So I am a little smooshier, but not fatter, in terms of weight. Hope my anecdata helps.
Anonymous
I have a work meeting in Orlando next Feb, and hope to then rent a place on the beach for a week within a couple of hour drive from there – I will fly in and out of Orlando. Don’t really care if it is Gulf or Atlantic; just want a beach front place where we can roll out of bed and go for a long walk on sandy, clean beaches. Don’t need nightlife; being able to rent bikes, take long beach walks, have a nice dinner or two is the vibe.
Would appreciate recommendations of specific area to look for a VRBO; the choice is overwhelming and I need help narrowing it down. If you’ve got a beach, town, or even specific place to recommend, please let me know. I’m looking for at least 3 bedrooms, so older kids can visit if they want.
Thank you.
Cat
if you want reliable warm beach weather in Feb you need to go to south Florida – Miami or Naples. Naples will probably be warmest since it is the Gulf side. The tough part will be finding a 3BR place that doesn’t have a minimum stay requirement that time of year.
Leatty
Anna Maria Island is lovely
Beaches on the gulf are much calmer and prettier in my opinion. On the Atlantic side, you have places like Cocoa Beach or West Palm Beach, I’m partial to the gulf.
Anon
I grew up going to Cocoa Beach and my family still goes every few years. Look for rentals south of Lori Wilson Park – the big hotels are further north and it’ll be a little less crowded.
Anonymous
Do you have any restaurant recommendations? We will be vacationing in nearby Melbourne Beach and always have trouble finding anywhere decent to eat. The few restaurants around all seem to be greasy overpriced steakhouses.
Anon
For seafood, we liked Grills (there’s one on the river and one up by the port).
Squid Lips is serviceable, but has an amazing dock/outdoor space.
Taco City is solid.
Anonymous
Thanks!
Anonymous
late to reply, but not sure this was recommended: if you’re booking this far out, make sure you get something that you can cancel or will be refundable after October/November. you don’t want to book somewhere that gets hit by a hurricane in the coming season and not available in February (or might be open, but no longer has much open around it) but for some reason doesn’t give you a refund.
Anon
What shoes are we wearing with wider leg jeans? I bought some 90s relaxed fit jeans from Abercrombie (out of my comfort zone!). I like them, but I’m unsure about shoes. I’m seeing a lot heels with wider leg jeans but that is not practical for me for everyday wear.
Moose
Fashiony sneakers
Worried
+1 I now have a mini collection of fashion sneakers due to lots of foot issues…and I’m in a city so I walk almost everywhere. In the 90s I wore wide leg jeans with one inch heeled Mary Jane shoes for a stint, and low heeled boots.
Even then, I couldn’t walk too far so I decided I would shorten all the wide leg jeans for flats.
Sure, heels can make wide legs look very elegant, but it’s all about proportions and if the width of the opening and a fashion sneaker look intentional, it will certainly look good. When it starts to rain, I wear wide legs with flat boots, but in fall winter, I switch to tights and boots so my feet and hems stay dry. (I wear jeans/ pants mostly in shoulder seasons)
Shelle
I’m pairing them with platform sandals, somewhat chunky white sneakers, and Frye cowboy boots. Also kitten heels but those are only with a pair of cropped straight leg pants and might not look good with full length?
always anon
i’ve gone full 70’s and pair my wide leg pants with clergerie waelly loafers. they took about 1 week to break in fully (no real blisters as i wore them with hosiery) and they are soooo comfortable. https://www.gravitypope.com/products/clergerie-319387-blk-waelly
Anon
I have some extra savings (maxing 401k, not eligible for roth), and I’m conflicted about where to be putting it. I’ll need to replace my car in the next 1-3 years (I’m hoping to hold out as long as possible), and we are looking to do some extensive home renovations on a longer timeframe (5-8 years). I typically would invest the money for these longer plans. But, being able to get 4%+ in a high yield savings account makes me think we should keep the money parked there and avoid risking any losses in the market. Thoughts? Advice?
Anon
4% savings account. You may need that new car sooner than you think (I went from “car performs beautifully on 2,000 mile road trips” to “needs $7k of repairs” in 3 months), and you will need the money. Also, car loans are getting harder to come by just as inventory is increasing, so it’s possible that good deals are to be had at the end of this year.
Anon
I always keep a big cash reserve and am delighted with the high interest accounts available these days. Just put it there. Life costs money and investing is a different bucket, that’s long range stuff and you don’t want to have tax events or to take a loss based on the timing of renovations or cars or whatever.
Anon
Since you have some medium-term spending planned, high-yield savings, but also, backdoor Roth.
Anon
Look at t-bills for 6 months. They’re paying more than savings accounts in most cases, and you can time when you need the cash to be liquid.
Anon
I just started working on building a CD ladder for myself. Once a month Im putting 1k in each a 6 month and a 12 month CD. Im also parking extra cash in a hys and a money market (my brokerage firms sweep account where Im funding the cds from).
Ties up some extra cash but still liquid and available in those short to mid term horizons.
Anonymous
Does anyone else feel like they go through more Apple phone chargers – the USB A cord – than they should? I feel like I end up buying a new one every 6 months to a year. I have had ones that fray near the tip and don’t charge efficiently. This week I had one that wouldn’t charge at all – tried multiple phones in multiple outlets. When I looked closely it looked there was a smudge on the connectors, so I guess the connectors broke or wore out? Makes sense because last few weeks I felt like it was charging things sporadically – like maybe the connectors weren’t grasping the inside of the phone efficiently?
Am I doing something wrong or are they just made this way? I don’t throw it around or anything, in fact this charger doesn’t even travel in my bag or anything, it just sits on a table at home.
Anonymous
They are just poorly made
Anon
They do suck and you have to be careful with them because they’re kind of fragile. I think you could be more careful and they would last longer. But I’d buy some of the corded ones from Amazon or wherever. They’re way cheaper than Apple’s own cords and they’ll probably last longer.
Cat
that sounds unusually bad to me. I am still using the 6ft 3-pack that I bought in 2015.
AnoNL
+1. I have been usimg my iPad charger and high-speed iPhone charger for years without any replacement.
I keep the cables loose (vs tying them tightly in a round or around the charger) to prevent breakage. And I keep them in a dedicated pocket in my workbag. No other special care.
Anon 2.0
Yes! We go thru them like crazy. I’ve bought the good ones and the cheap ones and everything in between.
Anonymous
Can someone better at math help me think through this? It twists my brain in a pretzel.
I bought a house in 2015 for 2m with a 400,000 down payment. I put 500k cash into the house during a renovation and then sold it for 3.4m in 2022. I had previously thought of this as 1+1=3 type of situation, where having the vision to see past some glaring flaws at Purchase and doing the renovation allowed me to unlock extra return and turned my home into a decent investment.
I’m debating doing a small renovation to my new house and believe it will add a lot of value. However, my brother is insisting that I’m thinking about this the wrong way and in fact my return was less than it would have been if I had just invested in the S and P. Is this true?
I buy my houses to be a home and the primary function isn’t to be an investment (I can’t live in the S and P) but I do like feeling like I have some kind of appreciating asset and that I’m not burning money on my living situation.
Thank you!
nuqotw
Your brother is might be right about the dollar value and rate of return (my back of the envelope calculation suggests it’s close) and he might be wrong – it depends on what he means by “invested in the S&P.” However, I don’t think either of you is right per se, and it in no way sounds like you messed up. It sounds like (1) you made some money your way (2) you got more enjoyment out of your home for the money you put in than you would have gotten from investing in the S&P and (3) you have enough money that there is no wrong answer. Enjoy your home!
Anon
The exact dates will matter a lot because the stock market was pretty volatile in 2022, but let’s assume that you wouldn’t have sold stock when the market crashed and still own it now, whereas you did time the sale of your house for the peak of the market. Given those assumptions, if you invested 900k in 2015, you’d now have 2.3 million, or a profit of 1.4 million. That compares to a profit of 900k on your house, minus your time and energy and relator commission and all the transaction fees. Not sure how the taxes compare, though.
Anon
Reposting to avoid mod and also to add that you also need to include the cost of having a place to live in that calculation!
The exact dates will matter a lot because the stock market was pretty volatile in 2022, but let’s assume that you wouldn’t have sold stock when the market crashed and still own it now, whereas you did time the sale of your house for the peak of the market. Given those assumptions, if you invested 900k in 2015, you’d now have 2.3 million, or a profit of 1.4 million. That compares to a profit of 900k on your house, minus your time and energy and relator commission and all the tr*nsaction fees. Not sure how the taxes compare, though.
anon
Well, your brother may be right. We have no idea because you give us so little information. I have no idea if you are living in the house, or paying rent on another house while paying your monthly payments on this house. I have no idea what you monthly payments/taxes/other expenses were on the house are etc…
And I can imagine how much time/hassle doing half a million dollars of renovation might be. Your time has value. On top of all of the extra bills for utilities etc…
But yes, you might have done better with cash in the stock market instead.
Basically you have to take every penny you put into this house (downpayment/renovations/monthly paments+taxes+insurance/extra utilities/all housecare costs like lawn and cleaners etc…) + value of the time you invested in managing all of the repairs, and compare it over time to having invested in the stockmarket at a similar rate to how you paid your expenses.
I would never do what you are doing. Stock market mutual funds all the way. But many people do what you are doing and enjoy it! But they rarely do their math correctly….
You need to slow down and meet with a professional to do the math for you, if you don’t feel comfortable doing it yourself. Spending these amounts of money without bothering to figure out if you are being smart….. is not smart.
OP
Sorry, this was my home. I was living in it and am living in my new house. I view property taxes as less than private school tuition, so a separate cost (ie if I wasn’t paying my property taxes for a great public school, I’d be paying for 2 kids to go to private school). Same with utilities, cleaning etc – I’d be paying those whether I rented or owned. I forget what the mortgage rate was on the previous house but it was low, I think around 2.5% and my current mortgage is 2.75% for 30 years. I’m in an area where the mortgage payments are typically less than the rental payment on a comparable home.
This isn’t instead of traditional saving or investing and I wasn’t viewing it as a form of speculation, more like I can justify doing xyz because it adds to my enjoyment and has the bonus of adding value and making money.
Maybe this is a problem that’s impossible to solve because if I didn’t own the home I’d be renting something and it’s hard to untangle the various expenses and opportunity costs
OP
Perhaps worth mentioning that my brother literally lives in my parents basement and plays around with meme stocks so I’m somewhat sensitive to his condescension that I’m adulting incorrectly. And my mom thinks he walks on water, so agrees with the idea that renovating a 1950’s kitchen in my home with cash is somehow the height of indulgent and irresponsible spending
Anon
Oh my. I think the real problem is that your mother and your brother need to be on an information diet. They can’t be condescending about things of which they know not.
Anon
HAHAHAHA WUT?
+1 Anon above me. Stop talking to them about this and ignore your brother.
anonshmanon
The missing information is how much interest you paid in the years between buying and selling the house, and closing costs in both transactions. The numbers you gave suggest that between your $500k investment and general appreciation, you made $900k profit nominally, but you need to knock off a few hundred (I’m guessing) for those two cost factors, and therefore the net profit might be closer to $500k.
I am not sure that you would beat that with standard investments in that time frame, assuming your typical 4% return rate on stocks. A quick calculation indicates no. But regardless of pure returns, I agree with your other points, and that’s how I view it too.
Anon
Im not in a place where I can do the math for you, but if you enjoy renovating real estate, keep doing it as long as you’re covering your costs and breaking even or better. 1) you need a place to live, it’s not just an investment, and 2) presumably your retirement money is already invested in something like the S&P, so putting some of your money into real estate has a diversification effect.
Anonymous
You are both sort of right. If you took 900k and put it in s and p in 2015, assuming a 10 percent rate of return it would’ve been worth 1.75 mil in 7 years. So in that way your brother is maybe right. But you also need to live somewhere, so you offset what you would’ve paid in rent for something like that. You didn’t throw money away, but your house would’ve appreciated anyway without the renovation
Anonymous
The real estate market appreciated a crazy amount from 2015 to 2022, like double or more in some areas. You might have gotten the same or similar for your house even without the renovations. It’s market dependent, though; you’d have to look at comps.
Generally speaking you don’t get the money out of a reno that you put into it. Life isn’t HGTV. Do the work because you will enjoy it, not because you think future buyers will share your taste. I can’t tell you how many houses have horribly ugly “upgrades” that no one places any value on, but the sellers expect to get their money back for their brand new kitchen with a tiny bathroom-sized sink, a built in oven that’s too small for a standard roasting pan (and because it’s built in, getting a bigger oven means replacing all the cabinets), white marble countertops, and floating shelves instead of upper cabinets. In a 4 BR/3BA 3k sq ft house. No that’s all getting ripped out, you should’ve left the kitchen in its 1980s glory and saved yourself the trouble and expense of renovating a kitchen when you clearly have no concept of how a kitchen operates.
OP
Oh I completely agree generally! The majority of these renovations were for things that objectively increased the value of the house and I was closely guided by a good friend who is the number one broker in our city. Things like removing radiators and installing central air, renovating a kitchen so there was space for the traditional layout of a breakfast nook and pantry rather than a washer/dryer closet in the center of the kitchen. I replaced huge old pink 90’s jacuzzi tubs with normal ones, and did lots and lots of paint.
I think the other thing for me at least is that I enjoy the process and I also feel like putting money into the house avoids some lifestyle creep in a way that I’m not sure we’d be disciplined to do if the investment accounts had millions and millions of dollars at that age when most of our friends were taking tons of trips and having huge weddings and all that. So the house Vs S and P comparison is a little false because I’m not sure I would have actually kept throwing money into an investment account the with the same level of enthusiasm and excitement that I tackled house projects.
And at least in my area, the 2021/2022 housing spike was only for houses that felt done and move in ready. Nobody was eager for a project w labor delays and supply chain disruptions
Seventh Sister
Usually upgrades don’t add a huge amount of value, assuming you are upgrading from something that is usable/habitable to something that is slightly nicer. But as someone who renovated their 1950s kitchen, it made my quality of life improve dramatically since our old kitchen looked grimy even when I’d spent hours scrubbing.
Also agree on the information diet. My in-laws always have some bizarre idea about how we should or should not be investing/spending our money (my favorite was when they suggested my husband buy his office building!) that has no basis in lived reality.
Anon
I’ll be making a stop at Smart & Final after work today. I’m not familiar with the store’s offerings. do they have prepared meals? wondering whether I need to tell spouse to cook or not.
Anonymous
Huh?
Anon
Do you realize you don’t actually have to post everything you think, as you read things on this site? If you don’t have something substantive to say, just skip over the post and move on with your day. FFS
anona
If I remember correctly, they have more frozen and other bulk items and not so much of the prepared meals.
anon
Well, your brother may be right. We have no idea because you give us so little information. I have no idea if you are living in the house, or paying rent on another house while paying your monthly payments on this house. I have no idea what you monthly payments/taxes/other expenses were on the house are etc…
And I can imagine how much time/hassle doing half a million dollars of renovation might be. Your time has value. On top of all of the extra bills for utilities etc…
But yes, you might have done better with cash in the stock market instead.
Basically you have to take every penny you put into this house (downpayment/renovations/monthly paments+taxes+insurance/extra utilities/all housecare costs like lawn and cleaners etc…) + value of the time you invested in managing all of the repairs, and compare it over time to having invested in the stockmarket at a similar rate to how you paid your expenses.
I would never do what you are doing. Stock market mutual funds all the way. But many people do what you are doing and enjoy it! But they rarely do their math correctly….
You need to slow down and meet with a professional to do the math for you, if you don’t feel comfortable doing it yourself. Spending these amounts of money without bothering to figure out if you are being smart….. is not smart.