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Updated: Nov 1, 2018 205 Comments · by

Tuesday’s TPS Report: Sonar Knit Long-Sleeve Blazer

The Personal Shopper (TPS)

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Our daily TPS reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. Helmut Lang Sonar Knit Long-Sleeve BlazerI looove this cool inverted-collar blazer from Helmut Lang. The company offers a number of pieces (including a dress) in this “sonar knit,” so I asked customer service at Neiman Marcus what that meant. They responded: “Sonar-knit is a process of sewing that creates waves, or gathered areas of material; it is not a tight as a pintuck or a ruched pattern of technique.” So: there ya go. I kind of like it even more now! Very cool. Psst: Here's a $69 version and a plus-sized version. Sonar-Knit Long-Sleeve Blazer Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (L-5)

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Comments

  1. YouSaucyMinx

    Hmmm Not loving this one for $460. It doesn’t look very special to me. The $69 version one looks just as nice!

    6pm has a bunch of inverted or collarless blazer that have more interesting detail.

    • BB

      I love the orange top too! Totally stalking it until the goes on sale, although I kind of wish it had some sort of sleeve.

    • Ellen

      Yay! These are all Great pick’s Kat — but the Mango ($69) version is alot cheapear then the one selleing at Bergdorf for $920 — FOOEY! Not even the manageing partner would agree to let me buy this one, no matter how STYLISH I would look in it! I love to walk into Bergdorf and look at their shoe’s. But all are SOOOO expensive, even the one’s on clearaence! I think I would have to be MARRIED to a VERY rich hege fund guy who made so much money he would NOT care how much I spent, so long as I was availeable for him when he needed me. I think in a perfect world, I could live in the Hamton’s all summer, then in the City in the Spring and Fall, then in San Diego or Boca in the Winter! Yay! Where is that guy who want’s me to be his wife and let me do these thing’s?

      I should NOT have to deal with guy’s who are looser’s and cheat on me with other women tho. That is the problem. Even schmoe’s like Alan start drinkeing and once he had a few, he thought that all women would be attracted to him. I don’t know why b/c he was NOT objeactiveley handsome, and was terribel in bed (especialy when drunk). Also, he did NOT have a job b/c of the alachohol so what woman would want that sleepeing with her? Not me, no way, Hoze!

      Now Noah has posibilitie’s, so I will NOT write him off. Dad want’s to meet him also b/c he think’s this is the first decent guy I’ve found whose not a drunk or has a crappy job or is to old or to wierd for me. He say’s not to mess this one up b/c I am not geting any younger. FOOEY! I hate it when dad put’s pressure on me to get MARRIED! I think he just want’s some other guy to take over all the stuff he is doieng for me. DOUBEL FOOEY!

    • TO Lawyer

      I love this too but I wonder if it’s the type of jacket that will look better over pants, particularly jeans rather than a skirt?

      • AIMS

        I have a similar jacket and while it does look great with jeans, I also wear it to work with flowy dresses. It’s actually one of the few blazers that I think works well with otherwise hard to pair items.

  4. RR

    This is lovely. I also love the plus size option linked. I may pull the trigger on it.

    • 2 Cents

      Me too! I personally wish the plus size was a darker option, but this just gives me ideas (and makes my CC weep).

      Thanks, Kat, for the plus-size pick!

      • Anon Calif atty

        Has anybody ordered from Mango? The clothes are really cute, but don’t know about quality, fit. I see that they have a great plus size line too.

  5. Anonymous

    Has anyone used a body fat caliper and want to recommend for or against getting one?

    • Trying to love

      I’ve never used one, much less owned one, but if I’m being honest think It would probably just become a trigger for negative self talk. Personally, I would not want one around. But I’m curious to hear other perspectives or experiences!

    • k-padi

      I had one used on me once as part of a “goal setting” exercise at a gym. I agree with trying to love: it triggered way too much negative self-talk. And it really pinches!

      • Meg Murry

        I had one used on me as a before & after for a “lose weight or % fat” Biggest Loser contest. It seems like it could be difficult to use on yourself properly, and that it would be really easy to be inconsistent in how you measure.
        If you are really interested in using one, I think you are probably better off looking into having it done for you by someone who is trained in the proper use and spots to read.

    • LH

      Am I the only one who had one used on them in elementary/middle school PE? At the time I didn’t think much of it, but in retrospect it seems pretty effed up to get little kids worrying about that. Plus it was done publicly in front of the whole class, not alone in the nurse’s office or something.

      • hoola hoopa

        It was part of essentially mandatory federal screening program. When we did it, we weren’t told the results, so I don’t see it affecting my self-image as a youngster.

        Now the pull up count. That was demoralizing.

        • chilledcoyote

          We had it in Southern California in the 80’s – and it was linked to your PE grade. And done publicly in front of the whole class. Just like your mile time, your sit ups and sit-and-reach… all out there for the class to watch. It was so embarrassing. I’m not sure how accurate it really was, either, but it sure did hurt!

      • Red Beagle

        How about the old inch-pinch test (dating myself here). Use fingers, pinch waist, if you find more than an inch between your fingers (eyeballing it), you should start watching what you eat…

    • gouda

      Body calipers aren’t a very accurate tool. They were originally developed to detect under-nutrition and don’t accurately measure body fat for people of normal weight. You can probably use them to monitor your progress, but I wouldn’t believe the absolute numbers.

  6. Monday

    Vicarious shopping question: I want a super-warm winter coat (probably down/puffer, with a hood), and I’m all-around petite. In all the go-to brands for warm coats, the smallest petite size is still unflatteringly big on me. Ditto the major department stores. This is an item that can’t really be altered (right?) and that looks especially sloppy if it doesn’t fit, in my opinion. I’ve compromised in the past, but am now willing to spend more on a coat that truly fits and will last many years–I just can’t find one.

    Have any of you petites found a good source for down coats? Are there any winter coat brands known for running small? Thanks for any tips.

    • Anon

      Maybe an obvious suggestion, but have you tried children’s sizes from LLBean or Canada Goose?

      • Monday

        I had tried kids’ on a few websites, but not Canada Goose. I am looking for something around mid-thigh length, so that rules many out, but I may have a lead now. Thank you for the idea.

        • Anonymous

          I work with a very petite woman, very stylish and she bought a black child’s one. It comes knee length on her and looks great

      • tesyaa

        Sadly, the girls’ sizes tend to only come in pinks, purples and turquoise shades. Sometimes there’s a navy, but black is barely ever an option.

      • nutella

        I technically ‘fit’ into kids sizes, but man are they boxy and unflattering!

      • BMBG

        Second Eddie Bauer. I have a petite puffer coat (belted even!) that has gone the distance, and it looks great on a small frame.

      • hoola hoopa

        Another vote for Eddie Bauer petites. I even get complimented on it.

        IME, EB cuts their jackets smaller than LE.

    • nutella

      Petite lady here! ZARA!!!! I have a mid-thighcoat that is the perfect length on me, has a notched belt, and is XS. Everyone is always complimenting me on how my puffy coat is flattering! Not only that but it is WARM! I nearly fainted when I tried it on in the store! Mine has a puffy hood, too. The prices are also super reasonable; I think I got it on sale for around $70, but it retailed around $130?

    • C

      I’m petite in height and weight and got a very warm down coat from Lands End. LE carries petite sizes. While LE does not have the most fashion-forward styling but the coat is cute and has kept me warm.

      • Monday

        Yeah, I had a PXS coat from Land’s End and it was too baggy. This is exactly why I am having trouble. Maybe different cuts run differently since it worked for you.

    • AIMS

      Not a cheap option, but I have two tiny friends who both love (and look great in) their Burberry (I think London) puffer coats. They’re very warm, too, and both have had their coats for a few years now and they still look great. Maybe try those?

      Edited to add: I went with one of my friends to get hers a few years back at the Burberry store on 57th St., and I recall the sizes being Euro sizes (38, 40, etc.) — so I think those will run smaller too. FYI.

      • MaggieLizer

        Agreed. Burberry tends to run narrow through the shoulders, ime, so it’s a good option for petite folks.

        I’m not sure if a down coat can be tailored or whether alterations would be cost-prohibitive. If you’re going to check out some coats at department store anyway, it might be worthwhile to ask their tailor what they can do and for how much. I’ve had good experiences with the tailors at Nordstrom’s.

      • Flying Squirrel

        Burberry still tends to run large on me (typically 00p in brands like AT). I believe that even on sale, though, they will offer free alterations and the sales people always seem to suggest that they can alter anything (never took the plunge to find out, though).

        IME, after years of looking, the best fitting and most stylish warm coats I’ve found are from J Crew. I do have an older puffer down coat from Andrew Marc, but it still doesn’t fit that well. I don’t know if J Crew does puffers, but I love my Lady Day Coat (’09, before they changed the construction somewhat, but I think people still love theirs).

        I would add that if you have any sort of curve to your figure at all (and trust me, I’m not that curvy), then kids’ sizes are not a great bet for a well-fitting coat. Kids don’t have curves, so neither do their curves. Sometimes the proportions can also be off (e.g. arm hole heights etc). I have had great luck with kids sizes for baggier/boxier things like a North Face jacket.

    • Anonymous

      Kids size! Cheaper and will fit better. Try a Northface 3/4 length parka. If you really are as petite as you say a girls size 10-12 should fit you better.

    • tesyaa

      Try Express. I bought my short, slender daughter a down jacket from Express and the XS was too small for her – she’s wearing the S.

    • Fishie

      I found a great one by London Fog last year on amazon. It was cut to show off a waist – not quite as boxy as those I tried from a more “outdoor” brand. It looked more like a fashion jacket and i was concerned about warmth, but it was super warm, and I live in a part of the world that gets pretty cold.

    • Manhattanite

      I’m a petite xs (5’1″, BR 00p) and have found jcrew to be my source for winter coats.

  7. Anon

    Any good weight loss blogs? Looking for something with a fun comments section, and a blogger who isn’t following a restrictive diet. Tried the WW message boards but after the discussion of whether you can eat shrimp raw but wait isn’t it just liquid in the shell until you cook it? I just can’t anymore.

    • Becky

      I like NerdFitness a lot. It focuses on paleo, but the message boards are full of people with other diets, so you don’t need to feel restricted by the blogger’s food choices. His style of writing is a little hokey imo, but he’s created a really active and awesome community.

    • McGiggles

      Sorry hit report instead of reply. Probably not exactly what you are looking for – I think you need to be a paying member to read the forums – but I like checking out the Tone It Up girls (toneitup dot com). They post motivational stories, recipes, etc. and it’s all very positive and light hearted. A good pick me up compared to other weight loss blogs IMHO.

    • MissK

      I really like runsforcookies and skinnymeg even though their lives are very very different from mine.

    • National_Anthem

      I enjoy FitBottomedGirls and The Great Fitness Experiment (not really about weight loss specifically, but she focuses on being healthy, and despite her life being drastically different than mine I find her really encouraging)).

  8. roses

    Does anyone have an idea of salary ranges for attorney positions on the Hill? Or know of a resource that could give me an idea?

  10. Anonymous

    Question-if you were considering lateral offers, what are the questions you would ask at the firms you’re considering offers from?

    • preg anon

      The average people actually bill. How much non-billable time associates have to spend. How associates are assigned to partners or if it is free market.

    • Anonymous

      I asked a lot about things that impact my day-to-day life:

      – How is work assigned?

      – Whether you work with multiple partners or you end up working with 1-2 partners consistently

      – if you’re in a deal-based practice, I’d ask about what your group’s relationship is like with the other groups (I’m a “specialist” so I asked a lot about the relationship with the general corporate groups; even in a general corporate group you’d probably want to know this)

      – What time do people come in in the morning? What time do they leave at night?

      – What are the facetime requirements (no one cares as long as you get your work done versus being required to be in the office for X hours per day)?

      – Do people eat lunch at their desks? Eat together? Are you allowed to run out and grab lunch to get some sunshine?

      I also asked what the progression of work looks like (I’m on the more junior side) – so first years do these types of tasks, second years do other types of tasks, etc. etc. And I asked what people who had left the firm had gone on to do (i.e. exit options).

      And depending on your practice, you’d want to ask about the types of clients you work with, the type of work the practice does compared to at your current firm.

      Sorry, kind of scatterbrained but hopefully helpful.

    • Anon

      I’d have a very clear idea of why I wanted to lateral (eg what are my concerns about my current firm) and get answers to how those issues are addressed at the new firm in addition to the usual law firm questions. I’d also really try to get intel on the people. For me,people make or break a job. I wouldn’t be shy about having another informal coffee with a few associates you’d be working with once you get the offer.

      • MJ

        This is huge, because no one ever thinks about it…since they figure that if they are getting recruited, they are wanted. Find out how prior laterals have been treated, if any have made partner (if that’s your goal), how long they stayed. Many years ago, my whole hallway was laterals, and during the downturn, partners circled the wagons with home-grown associates and left the laterals out in the cold–all laterals were laid off first. I know that you’re not really thinking worst case scenario, but you should ask what percentage of the office is home-grown and what % is laterals, and whether it matters….

        • Anon

          Agreed – same thing happened at my old firm. And it really threw some longer term laterals (as in they probably didn’t think of themselves as laterals anymore) for a loop.

  11. Toffee

    Love this pick and need to add something like this to my wardrobe, but I always feel like I style it to look like a school uniform.

    Work pet peeve; repeated loud sighs. We get it. You’re over-worked and not thrilled with your current assignment. Repeated sighing won’t make your situation better and drives me crazy.

    Anyone else stressed and looking to vent work pet peeves?

      • PolyD

        Oh yes, this. When people say this to me, I give them a totally bland look and say, with very little emotion,”Oh, that’s too bad.”

        Have been burned too many times by falling for the busybusybusy people, only to find out that they are much more busy talking about how busy they are than actually being busy doing work.

        • Red Beagle

          This! If they spent more time at their desks working instead of at mine whining, maybe they’d have more time…!

    • Anonymous

      Sighing is actually a sign of being tired (similar to getting oxygen to your brain with yawning). But yes, I have a coworker who sighs SO much and it’s really annoying.

      • houda

        More than being tired, sometimes it’s a breathing difficulty.
        I had a severely asthmatic colleague (who was self-admittedly overweight and a heavy smoker) and sighing was very normal for him. Eventually, we got used to it.

    • Anon

      Eating all day. I don’t care what kind of diet you are on or how hot you’re going to look, if you crunch on carrots, celery, and popcorn all day in the next office I will seriously consider putting a bowl of really good candy on my desk.

      • Wanderlust

        This. And I CAN HEAR YOU CHEWING, cubicle-mate. You sound like a horse with peanut butter stuck on the roof of your mouth.

        • EduStudent

          People who chew on their pen. Sort of combines the chewing and pen clicking. Or people who feel the need to drum their fingers on their desk/tap a pen against their desk.

    • Sparrow

      Oops, I tend to sigh sometimes and don’t even realize I do it! I’ll have to watch out for that. I agree, it can be annoying.

      My pet peeves:

      – Giving a presentation and reading word for word from the slide.
      – Sending me an email and then stopping my my desk to tell me what the email was about.

      • Anonymous

        Definitely #2! There’s a counsel in my office who will e-mail me, and then stop by 5 minutes later asking for my thoughts (as in, a conclusion). Because when I received her e-mail, I totally stopped what I was working on, read it, froze time to spend the necessary 2-3 hours researching it, and am now prepared to discuss.

        • houda

          The few people who attempted #2 got the death stare and a good lecture on service level agreement aka minimum time for me to read and process any email before there is a need to follow up or escalate.

    • AIMS

      Anyone who says “that’s not my job.” It may or may not be “your job,” but me and the person who says that will never see eye to eye.

      • Anon

        Whenever a subordinate says any version of that to me, I just say “then delegate it” and walk away.

    • Anonymous

      chewing with one’s mouth open. More of a general pet peeve, but even more irritating when I’m trying to concentrate over the sounds of mastication.

    • Anon

      People in meetings who rock back in their chair, fidget, sigh, and generally look like a restless 5 year old in church.

      • Woods-comma-Elle

        In this vein – people in meetings constantly on their Blackberries/phones.

        • houda

          People on their laptops not listening to the answer to the question which they asked during the meeting.
          If you ask a question, have the decency to at least hear the answer before going back to playing solitaire. And don’t interrupt me because I will let you know when I made my point in full. By then, I’ve probably covered all your “smart” objections.

      • Anon2

        Oh…stretching and resting the legs on an empty chair during a meeting is a common thing I see in my office. What I considered as an utter lack of respect was, when I interviewed for the job here, one of the interviewer rested his legs on the table when I was writing code on the white board and explaining him a computer program. I didn’t have to work with him often but I was never comfortable with him.

    • Burgher

      I’m trying to take over a project from an information hoarder and it’s driving me nuts! It’s to the point that I have to just totally go around the guy to get anything done.

    • Bee

      TMI. If you need to come in late or leave early for, for example, a doctor’s appointment, just give me a heads-up and we’re good. I do not want to hear about the details of your colonoscopy.

      • 2 Cents

        I once sat by a woman who, after she came in from her trip to the Obgyn, proceeded to call her mother, boyfriend and daughter and recount the details of said trip. Needless to say, I never really looked at Miss Overshare the same way again once I heard how her pap smear went.

    • Brit

      Yes. I have a co-worker who also likes to groan really loudly when her knees are bothering her. I’m sympathetic to the fact that she has knee problems, but I’m at least 20 feet away from you and around some corners – I shouldn’t be able to hear you groan every time you stand up…

  13. Career TJ

    Reposting this coz I think the question was misunderstood in the previous thread: A couple weeks ago I saw a position I was interested in and applied. Incidentally I also knew someone in the same organization and when I contacted them it turns out the job I was applying for was partly to replace them (as they were moving on to something else) and had also been created to take on some new projects. My contact mentioned that the likely hiring manager was on vacation until the end of July. So the question is, is it okay to email the person and see if they can find out if they have started interviewing for this position? I am not presuming I am a shoo-in for the job but I had at least hoped to hear something from them since my qualifications are a pretty good match for what they are looking for. Thoughts? TIA!

    • Anon

      Not appropriate. If you want to find out the status of your application, contact HR or the hiring manager, not an acquaintance you’re trying to replace.

    • tesyaa

      If you got the email from your contact, I would definitely not email the hiring manager. If the email was publicly listed with the job posting, there’s a lot more latitude.

    • YouSaucyMinx

      Not appropriate. Not even a little bit. Email HR and just say “I just wanted to see if you needed anything other information from me”.

    • Anon

      I’ll disagree here and say it depends on your relationship with your contact. If it’s someone you know well and who you are positive is “on your team” I’d ask. My hunch is that isn’t the case if you’re wondering about whether it’s okay to ask though.

      • BB

        Agree. I’d only ask if they are really good friends or something similar. But on the other hand, if one of my good friends were in this situation, I would proactively offer to ask my manager about the status of the search without my friend having to bring it up. The fact that he/she did not proactively brings it up either means that they are not fully “on your team” or they are and they suspect the answer would be unfavorable for you.

      • Career TJ

        The contact is someone I know through work i.e. met at a conference, work in the same field, for context this is a research job. They are now working in a new position. So my hesitation is partly due to them probably being in the midst of settling into new role. As far as them being “on my team”, they seemed very positive in telling me about the work but yeah I am not 100% positive since this is not a personal friend. Thanks for the feedback

  14. Threadjack

    Last week I had a lot of heavy cramping (but just cramping) a week before my period is due. It is due tomorrow and usually comes a day or so early. I am going to buy a test so I can test tomorrow morning so that I can have an accurate reading. I’m married and have other children (and have had miscarriages before). I’m also almost 44, so while I can deal with another baby, I am seized with fear and sadness in case I am actually pregnant since I don’t think a baby would be the result.

    • Anon

      So let me preface this by saying that I’ve never been in your shoes, so if my suggestion is totally off-base, know that it was meant with compassion.

      Is not taking a test and just seeing what happens an option? That way, if you get your period soon, ignorance is bliss as to what really happened. And if you don’t get your period, and you have other signs/symptoms of pregnancy, you’ll know that soon enough.

      • Threadjack

        It is. Absolutely. The reading won’t be accurate until then (I was working overnight, so the first-morning test would have been too diluted to get an accurate no or an accurate yes reading). With PG 4 / child 2, the read was so faint that I could barely see the + and figure that dealing with that again might push me over the edge. This 24 hours (maybe just 18) will be very long.

    • Sue

      I don’t have much experience with this (no kids). But I would just say take a deep breath and try not to think of the worst. You may not be pregnant, your period could be also be a day late for other reasons like maybe your ovulation came a day later than usual for any number of reasons e.g. stress or some other change in your routine. The 2nd part I know from experience. Take the test tomorrow, as far as the results go, cross that bridge when you get there. And ((HUGS)) too, I know the anxiety is unpleasant.

    • Been there before

      {{HUGS}} If you are not pregnant you might want to consider the fact that you are 44 and could be entering an early menopause. You aren’t too young for that to be an option.

  15. Flying Squirrel

    Work TJ: How do you deal with establishing your competence to a new boss? I’ve never really been in this situation before, but due to a reorg and leadership changes I am working for a boss who didn’t hire me (for pretty much the first time ever).

    I’m looking for very basic things like how should I contextualize things when I talk to him about an issue/update him on what I’m doing? A caveat is that he rarely has much time, so I often get a maximum of 10 minutes to both give him history/context and seek his input/advice. I feel a lot of pushback from him that he disagrees with how I’m handling things. As an example, he’ll often say, “You should do Z.” In some cases, I would like to do “Z”, but don’t know the best way to make it happen. So I’m not looking for his input on what to do but rather on how to do it. In other cases I’ve considered “Z” but rejected it for some specific reason. I feel petulant telling him why every suggestion he has won’t work, but since he often starts offering solutions before I’m able to explain to him the current status of things that’s what ends up happening. I feel like if he knew me, he’d give me the benefit of the doubt that I have a good reason for getting to the point I have…but absent that, what’s a good way to explain myself without sounding defensive?

    • S

      I don’t think explaining yourself is the problem here. I think you need to adjust to his work style instead. Start off with less context, not more. Get to the point quickly and narrow down the options for him. If Z won’t work, don’t shoot it down, just ask how to get around the impediment and ask if Y might be a better option. If you feel petulant you probably are being petulant and that’s not a good way to establish a strong working relationship.

      • Anne Shirley

        Yes. This. You can’t work on sounding less defensive. You need to work on actually being less defensive.

      • Anonymama

        third this. and also, maybe you should give him the benefit of the doubt that he has a good reason for asking you to do Z, and just ask directly, what’s the best way to go about doing Z, I wasn’t sure about it because of X reason.

    • Clementine

      Would it be possible to schedule a series of transition meetings to discuss these topics? Include specific examples in these meetings and frame it as getting to learn their leadership style/approach to these issues.

      • Anonymama

        For someone who rarely has much time, this sounds like a terrible idea. Maybe better to just throw it in there when you meet, e.g., if something like this situation comes up, do you want me to check with you first before going ahead, or just go ahead with my best judgment? Or, is there someone I can go to as a first resource on how things are usually done?

    • Samantha

      If your narrative style is (like mine): explain the situation, different options, then outline what you selected and why, it sounds like you may need to change it. The build-up at the beginning might make him think you’re going to ask for his opinion/help at the end of it and he jumps in with it to speed up the process.
      Instead, try first stating the decision, then the background and the problems it is expected to solve. If you have time you can add at the end the other options you considered and rejected.

      Not sure if you have anything in writing when you meet him, but I’d also consider having a written or bullet point agenda. When I meet with my busy boss to report/update on recent events, I have a spreadsheet with 3 columns – topic, detail, status. The last column has the decision so if you hand the one-pager to him right away, before you start talking, he can see the topics for which you have that column filled out (dont need his input) and the ones you are still considering (I put “for discussion” or “in progress” depending on whether I need my boss’s advice).

      Also the last column could have the “considered but rejected” options in quick bullet points. So that way it doesn’t sound like you’re shooting down his ideas only when he suggests them to you, but he can see that they’re already written down and you had considered them. You’re also open about your decision making process so if he wants to re-evaluate you are willing to get his input on that.

      • Traditionalist

        This is outstanding advice. I definitely have this narrative style and have been looking for a way to frame the issue for myself so that I can work on it. “Instead, try first stating the decision, then the background and the problems it is expected to solve. If you have time you can add at the end the other options you considered and rejected.” THAT is what I have been looking for — thank you!

        FlyingSquirrel, could it be that you’re exacerbating the problem by trying to demonstrate thoroughness in order to build his confidence in you? I do this. Because you feel he doesn’t trust you (yet), you lead in with so much context trying to explain that you’ve turned over every stone… but he’s thinking, Why is she turning over all these unnecessary stones?!

        I also think this one-pager sounds like a great tool to prepare for these types of meetings, even if you wouldn’t end up giving a supervisor a copy (for whatever reason, e.g., I have a supervisor who is always trying to cut down on paper and throws his hands up like anything I hand him is a hot potato, “Don’t we have this electronically??”)

        • Flying Squirrel

          Thanks…this is exactly the kind of advice I’m looking for (and I think you are correct about my communication style). My issues are probably exacerbated by the fact that since he has so little time, I typically only update him on things where there are potential issues instead of what’s going well. I’ve tried to get in the habit of doing the “things that are going well” updates by email, but that means I don’t get any feedback on the things I’ve got under control. Maybe he likes what I’m doing and wants me to do that more often, or maybe he hates it but doesn’t want to rock the boat if it’s working…I have no idea.

          I don’t think I’m being overly thorough because there just isn’t time for me to be so. If anything, I’m not being thorough enough in getting across the things I’ve already done and rejected. I think along these lines, a good thing for me to do would be to make my problem statement more clear and succinct before approaching him. [E.g. “Project Y is stalled b/c Customer Q keeps changing the deliverables (pretty close to my actual situation right now). My initial strategy was to suggest that we deliver C and make a mock up/teaser for tomorrow to get initial feedback, but now I’m being told by Customer not to do that. Are you free to join a meeting later today with other internal teams who are supporting me on Project Y so we can regroup our strategy?”] I actually started with the last question yesterday, and it slowly unraveled…does this approach make more sense?

          • How to Style Question

            I second Samantha’s advice. I have a super busy boss and I go into every meeting with a single sheet, bullet point list of the things I want to cover. He has not only complimented me on it but asked the rest of the department to do the same.

            I’m also careful to phrase what I’m asking him for and why. If I want him to sign off on a decision I’ve made, I ask him: “This requires your input. I’m pretty comfortable with Y but wanted to make sure you had a chance to weigh in.” In contrast, if I need his advice or direction, I say: “I’d like your advice on how to handle X.” I don’t spend a lot of time giving him background first in either case because that takes up too much of his time and he just wants to get to the point.

            I may be misunderstanding your post at 1:27, but it seems like you’re looking for constant affirmation. If you have a “get the the point”/busy boss, you’re probably not going to get it and you may be banging your head against the wall looking for it. What may be more effective than seeking his positive affirmation on each project or decision would be to set aside a separate meeting with him to discuss generally how he thinks your performance is going and if there is anything you can do more effectively. Because of your new relationship with him, I would think such a meeting would be perfectly normal and appropriate. Asking him to bless everything that you’re doing and doing well, though, may just cause him to think you’re not confident or capable enough to work independently.

          • Samantha

            Glad to be of help! I use this approach myself because I tend to be too chronological in the way I describe things (we tried x…it didnt work…then I figured out that…) and while I think it’s more “orderly”, people with less time/short attention spans typically hate this approach.

            FlyingSquirrel, with your specific situation I would frame the question as: a) we need your input to discuss our response to Customer on project Y b) problem is that customer keeps changing deliverables c) we are now considering options A,B,C and meeting to discuss them.
            Also consider if you have a potential straw man solution that you can put up for discussion and mention in (a) – that makes it sound like you have a proposal rather than keeping it completely open ended (and, he may think) waiting for him to step in and solve it. Not at all saying that’s the case of course, but as a woman I tend towards collaboration, and this sometimes detracts from the appearance of competence.

            Finally, since y’all like my one-pager idea, I’ll go further and say, put your successes on that list as well as your issues. It depends on the purpose of the meeting of course, but mine is a periodic update meeting and having them all written down enables my boss to skip over things he’s familiar with, but sometimes he’ll want to ask questions about the successes even if he’s seen an email about them previously. If we’re short of time, then he just skips to the items on the list that have “for discussion” on them. But the rest are there for him to review later, or if he wants to pass on kudos or (even) highlight them in a meeting with his own boss.

            Aside – A previous boss liked my one-pager updates so much he kept the previous printed out version and brought them to our next meeting (despite having maybe 20 direct reports), and when I handed him the new one he liked to compare and see what was resolved, is still pending etc. But he was ultra-organized and great at what he does, and got promoted up so he sadly isn’t my boss any more.

          • Flying Squirrel

            Definitely not looking for constant affirmation, but given that we seem to be having trouble getting on the same page for the things I do bring to his attention in person, a little feedback on other things would be helpful in understanding how he operates/thinks.

            That said, I think I’m just having a hard time with the overall set up. I’m used to a lot more autonomy with bosses who are mainly invested in helping me implement whatever strategy/solution I’ve come up with (and this includes in workplace settings where the stakes were frankly much higher than here). This has always worked with bosses who personally hired me and trusted me. For example, my previous boss and I frequently disagreed on strategy, but he was always willing to hear and consider where I was coming from (and about 90% of the time came around to my solution). And he knew that if I asked him to attend a meeting with me or whatever, there was a good reason for it. I get that I can’t expect the same from my new boss yet, but I really don’t know how to go about getting to that place of mutual respect. I also feel a bit like I’m being treated as much less competent and experienced than I am…and I personally don’t deal well with feeling like I’m being spoken down to (not saying this is an awesome trait, just being honest). Again, may be appropriate from someone who doesn’t know me, but it’s really hard for me to handle. So concrete strategies are really helpful.

          • anon

            Can you set up weekly half hour one-on-one meetings with him? It seems like you need a dedicated time to go over more complicated projects. It totally makes sense that you need his input, and I don’t think it’s too much to ask. At some companies it’s standard. At many others, it isn’t. But it’s worth thinking about.

          • Philanthropy Girl

            I use the one page, bullet points with my boss and it works miracles. My very first week on the job, my weekly report to him was about 3 pages (bullet pointed) long. I learned in about 2 seconds that he wanted one page – maybe even half a page. If our weekly meetings run longer than 10 minutes he gets really antsy unless its a project he’s deeply vested in. Understanding his communication style has been really helpful.

            I understand that feeling of being asked to do something in a way you don’t think will work. I second the suggestion of responding with a question about how to overcome the obstacles you’ve identified. I’ve found it very helpful to say “I think that’s a great idea, but I’m not sure how to approach XYZ” – sometimes my boss has really good input, and sometimes it helps him realize his ideas won’t work the way he envisions them.

            At the end of the day – you will have to prove yourself, and that will take time. Hang in there!

    • Away Game

      I agree with S; you’re probably spending too much time on context and not enough on how you intend to fix whatever the problem might be. You may also be trying to update him on small stuff where you need to know All The Details, but he just needs to know Things Are Under Control. Practice before you meet with him if you need to; write notes on paper to keep yourself in check. If you just need to update him on something that is going well and you aren’t looking for a decision, keep it super short, and tell him at the beginning of the meeting why you are in his office. (“I’d like to update you on my major project for this week. I’m working on the marketing campaign for x client. We are on track for meeting our deadlines and should have an initial draft for you to review by the end of the week.” ) If you need a decision or solution, practice your short pitch and frame the question carefully. Be prepared with a couple of solutions, and what you need him to do. (“I’d like your assistance in addressing a problem we have with Client Y. Client called a meeting for 3pm because they are unhappy with the website we designed. I’d like to have a few drafts of other designs ready. However, Team Y says they can’t get us the data we need in time. Would you be willing to call Team Y leader and ask them to rush the data? Alternatively, we could have a few designs ready but put in notional data as examples, flagging that the final would look differently based on actual numbers. How would you like us to handle it?”)

  16. MollySolverson

    Random Q – just read an article in which the author was very upset about the use of double spacing after sentences. I used to use one space but switched to two b/c that was the preference at my current job. After a few years of this, I now always use two spaces, more so out of habit than preference. So the author’s passion for this subject kind of amused me (and I assume the article was at least in part in jest). Just curious – does anyone feel strongly about this either way and care to enlighten me as to why?

    p.s. This is not to say I do not have my own formatting quirks – I justify almost every final document, and an unjustified memo or brief just looks unfinished to my eye.

    • BB

      I’ve sort of heard that the one space was making a comeback. I always learned 2 spaces, and I type really fast (people always comment on it), so it would be a major pain if I had to re-learn to 1 space!

    • nutella

      Double spacing was for typewriters where each letter got equal space. To help the eye see sentence breaks, double spacing was instituted. Because I learned typing on a computer, it was always single space for me. Until of course law school, but that is only when local rules require it or where you are using Courier New, which is just like typewriter typeface in that each letter gets equal space. All this is to say, if you are using Times New Roman, if the local rules of a court don’t require it, or if you are typing up any old email, you do not need double spacing.

      • hoola hoopa

        This! Don’t double space unless you’re using a monospace font.

        I realize I’m a bit of a typography freak (blame my graphic designer mother) but essentially anyone who learned to type on a keyboard should not have been taught to double space after a period.

        • Anon Calif atty

          But even if the local rules don’t require it, to older judges, the single space may just look “wrong.” So our office sticks with the double space. In ten years when the bench has new blood, maybe they’ll reconsider.

    • Kathryn

      I’ll bite. I dislike double spaces after sentences. I think it’s uneccessary and old-fashioned, and I dislike the way it makes a paragraph look. Obviously I don’t have very good reason, it just bugs me.

      Interestingly enough, I think you only used one space after your sentences above :)

      • MollySolverson

        Ha, I think you are right! Clearly that article had some impact on me…

    • k-padi

      I am like you; I adopted two spaces because my reviewer demanded it. If people ask me to change it, (in my experience) the vagaries of the “find and replace” function in Word makes it easier to change two spaces to one space than to change one space to two spaces.

      As a reviewer, I never commented on the number of spaces unless it was inconsistent within the same document. Same with alternate spellings like “labeled” and “labelled”–neither is correct or incorrect but I just want it to be consistent throughout the document.

      • Mpls

        You can set your grammar function in Word to underline the incorrect spacing after a period (whether you think that is 1 space or 2).

    • Lynnet

      I use a single space, for the reasons outlined above. My boss will periodically edit my work and add either one, two, three, or four spaces after his sentences (and in the middle of his sentences). I think he uses spaces the way people use “um” in conversation. It’s not standard, so I can’t adjust my style to match. Then he sends it out without making sure all of the breaks after sentences are the same number of spaces.

    • Anon

      I’ve heard the typewriter / computer argument but as someone getting older and needing reading glasses, I have to say I loathe 1 space documents. It makes all the words blend together and that much harder to read. Team 2 spaces here.

    • ORD

      Our office style guide says 2 spaces. I learned to type on a typewriter, so I have to type 2 spaces or it messes up my typing speed because I have to stop and think. But the style requirements for some appellate courts specifies only 1 space (like 7th circuit) so once I typed a brief using 2 spaces so I could type normally, then changed all the 2 spaces to 1 space per the rules, then my reviewer saw that I had 1 space only and changed them all back to 2 spaces per our office style guide, and then I had to explain and change them all back again. What a pain! I’ve heard that using 2 spaces after periods can “age” you, because it’s a sign that you learned to type in the age of typewriters.

      • Brit

        I definitely learned to type in the age of computers and the first time I heard about the one space rule was when I joined the newspaper in high school, to help with article spacing.

    • Rachelellen

      Single-space is our official style too. If it makes you feel better, it was actually one of the easier habits I’ve had to break…

    • Anonymous

      I’m in my late 20s and grew up typing on a computer, but was still taught 2 spaces. I changed to one in law school because my journal’s editing convention required one–it was easier to retrain my typing than to keep switching my Word grammar check settings when I went from my writing to journal work.

      But, at my summer and post-law school firms I found myself the only one-spacer. I’ve mostly reverted back to two because it’s definitely not worth the time to convert documents that I’m using as a base, and I know even if I use one space in documents I initiate, it will end up with random occurrences of two spaces when the partners or assistants make edits. I prefer one, but it’s just not a battle worth fighting. Now, smart quotes over straight quotes? Absolutely worth fighting :)

      • Philanthropy Girl

        This. I’m a bit older than you, but also learned 2 spaces while typing on a computer. My editor friends say that 2 spaces is now out for most standard style guides – it took me years (and my editors gallons of red ink) to quit double spacing.

        It seems as though people who wordsmith for a living tend to get very passionate about these things (ask them about the use of the comic sans font sometime – you’ll be entertained), and the rest of us continue doing things the way we learned until we are corrected by office style guides or picky editors.

        Unless you office style guide dictates differently, slow down your typing for a while and switch to single spacing.

    • anon

      I am an editor, so I care about small things like this. AP Style and the Chicago Manual both say to use only one space after a period. These are the style books that all major newspapers and book publishing companies follow. Companies that use the “two space” rule are out of touch with modern conventions.

      I know many smart people who still use two spaces after a period. But it just shows that you are still following the conventions you were taught in high school. The world keeps changing. What you learned once doesn’t necessarily apply any longer. Using two spaces is like scanning your cover letter and attaching it to an email. Time to move on and upgrade your habits.

    • Red Beagle

      I read that article and was also surprised by the authors vehemence about the impropriety of two spaces. However, I did stop reflexively hitting space bar twice after a period after that.

  17. Anonymous

    TJ — developing new clients/contacts

    I work with a financial adviser to set up/periodically review my disability insurance, life insurance, etc. plans. We’ve been working together for about 5 years. I know his line of work (like many others) requires him to establish new contacts, and obviously a good way to go about that is to ask current clients. He is very professional, never badgers, but routinely asks that I let him know if anyone comes to mind. I always promise to do so, and genuinely would recommend him if I got the sense that a friend or colleague were in the market for his services.

    Now, he has come to me with a list of people with whom I went to grad school (acquired from… LinkedIn? Not sure). He would just like to “reach out to them, let them know what I do and that you and I have worked together for nearly 5 years, and see if they’d be up for a cup of coffee.” He’s emailing me to see if I “think highly of these folks.” I am expecting that when I say that I do, it will get framed to these potential clients as “Anonymous thought you might benefit from my services,” which makes it sound as though *I* gave these names to him. These are just acquaintances — for me to have given him these particular names, I’d basically have to give him my entire grad program roster. Which these contacts would know.

    Am I making too fine a distinction? I DO think people might benefit from his services, but only to the extent that they’re interested in them. I’m relatively young in my career and don’t want people to think I indiscriminately pass their names on for my gain (not that there is any gain for me here anyway). I sincerely think he would be a good adviser to them, I just don’t want to be viewed as some sort of marketer in this way.

    Should I ask him to tell these contacts that I’d be happy to answer any questions, so that they can contact me? Or does that make me seem MORE involved? It would feel really weird to email these contacts preemptively myself to give them a heads up — “Oh hi, I know we haven’t talked in 2+ years, but you’re going to be getting an email… ” Open to other suggestions!

    • Anne Shirley

      You pay this guy right? And now he wants to mine your network for business? I’d say I prefer that he not use my name in soliciting clients.

      • Samantha

        +1 This is a short and sweet way of putting this. I wouldn’t agree to his individually reaching out to my contacts.

        However, if you’d also like to be helpful to him in a more limited way, you could suggest that you’ll instead write him a recommendation on LinkedIn, or post something on your profile so that your contacts who are in the market for his services can see.

        • nutella

          This is what I’d do. I can. not. stand. it. when people I know do this. If I am in the market I will ask around. Otherwise, posting a recommendation so that people can read more if interested or move past is the best option.

    • McGiggles

      This is very normal for the line of work. In my experience it’s not framed as “anonymous thought you could benefit” but is instead permission for him to drop your name. “Hi I’m financial advisor…Ived worked / helped anonymous”. Gives him credibility. Give him names you are comfortable him using this approaching with. Do NOT be an intermediary and get more involved, that would be weird to me. And more unnecessary work for you!

      • AnonLawMom

        Yep. This is standard practice for these guys. I wouldn’t worry about it too much. I let mine drop my name but that’s the end of it.

    • Bewitched

      I would ask him not to contact them, or if he persists in wanting to contact them, to omit any reference to you in the email or in the phone conversation. Basically, I would tell him he’s not authorized to mention your name when speaking to these folks. Other people may have different views, but my line is this: if I want to refer someone to you, I will tell them your name and number. I don’t want you to contact them first. He’s doing a good job for you-great. But you don’t have to become his business generator.

    • momentarily anonymous

      I would say no to this. Since you’re happy with him, I would offer to connect him with the people that I’m still in contact with. So, I’d send them a heads up call/text/whatever and say “hey, if you’re ever looking for a financial advisor, I found a great one – do you want an introduction?” and then connect him with those who say yes.

      I wouldn’t be comfortable with my financial advisor reaching out to somoene I hadn’t spoken to in 2+ years and using my name to try to sell his services. I think it would come off as kind of weird. I can’t really properly articulate why, but that’s my two cents.

  18. Student Loans - need financial inspiration

    I need motivation! How much did you have in student loans, and how long did it take you to pay it off? What are your biggest tips for speeding up the repayment process?

    • In the Pink

      A long time ago, in a galaxy far away, $20k for ten years. Monthly payments. You have to know that the per credit hour rate for grad school courses then was approx. $15. Yes, another century.

      I have no idea on how to speed up the repayment. However, I remember regularly having to explain to friends and family (incl. my parents) that the reason why I did not have “a newer car” was that I had student loads. Of course, none of them had such problems…

      Best to you in the long haul. It was the best investment I ever made in myself and looking back at a long, successful career, I know it is all “mine.” My own doing.

    • Anon for this

      Regular poster going anon for this– I also need (a different type of) motivation. I’ve been working toward getting into a certain type of program to completely switch careers. It will eventually be a great financial move, and it’s something I really want. I was just accepted to a program (yay!) but the mid-5 figure cost is now eating at me (and my fiance– he’s much, much more risk averse than I am). It will mean the entire amount in loans, about half federal student aid and half private. Just, ugh.

      • Philanthropy Girl

        This was me six years ago. Perhaps take some time to review the financial benefits. Compare your current earning potential with your estimated earning potential with a new degree. Also compare job markets for current and potential fields. This might help your fiance understand that its a greater risk to NOT make the investment in a new career.

        Other than that, I think you have to just bite the bullet and do it. Training to switch careers is not going to become cheaper if you wait. Yes, ugh. Big ugh. I will be paying those blessed student loans for many years. However my financial situation without them would be much worse.

        And congrats on being accepted to your program! Don’t let the student loan burden take away your excitement over the opportunity to pursue something that you enjoy!

    • Anonymous for this

      Through a series of unfortunate events, a crappy job market, and compounding interest… $215k. I’m on income-based repayment and the interest that accrues per month (around $1400) is more than my required monthly payment (around $900 through Income Based Repayment).

      I debate whether I should throw money at the loan and live like a pauper, or just ride the IBR wave until my 50s. If I pay $2000/mo, I can pay it down in around 16 years. Insane.

      • Kathryn

        Can I ask what would happen in your 50s to change things? I’m just curious.

        Also, hugs. That sounds really, really difficult.

        • Anonymous for this

          Income Based Repayment “forgives” the debt after 25 years of payments, minus a giant tax bomb… I’ve been paying it since I’m 28 (I’m 32 now), so it’ll hopefully go away when I’m 53, barring the US government passing any miracle legislation to help out sad sacks like myself.

          I wish I could do the Dave Ramsey “snowball method” but all of my $215k is with one loan provider… at 7.5% interest. Sigh.

          • Gail the Goldfish

            Ouch. Can you refinance? I’m assuming it’s not federal since I think those rates are 6.8. If you qualify, SoFi may have rates lower than that.

    • Anon

      $200k, now down to $30k after 5.5 years. Plan to finish that last $30k in the next 3-6 months. My “secret” has been the “snowball approach”–start by taking, say, $500 extra each month, and put it as extra principal on the loan with the highest interest. Also throw any extra savings to it every few months. When that loan is gone, take the full amount you were paying for that loan (so, the $500 extra + your regular principal/interest payment) and add it as extra principal to next highest-interest loan. Repeat process above. I was on a 10 year repayment plan when I finished law school, but have been following this for the past 2 years and expect to be done paying in 6 years total.

    • roses

      175K. Have 30K left after 2 years. My biglaw job certainly helps, but so did 1) refinancing from a federal loan to a private lender (but only do this if you are in a very secure, private sector job and have no plans to go back to school or enter into public service), and 2) being frugal in pretty much all other areas of life. With the exception of travel and higher rent because I’m in a higher COL area, my spending habits are about the same as they were in law school.

    • Anon for this

      I’m not yet in the group of people who have managed to pay off all of their loans. I graduated from law school 4 years ago with over 200k in loans. I don’t recall the precise amount but I would wager that it was around 215-225k. My current balance is roughly 177k, so I’ve paid off somewhere in the ballpark of 38k-48k in 4 years. I work in biglaw, so I feel like I should have paid off more but there were various other things that needed to be paid first and I really wanted to build a solid emergency fund.

      My loans are across multiple providers, so the biggest thing I’ve done towards repayment is to follow something along the lines of Dave Ramsey – pick a loan and focus all of your spare cash at that loan while paying off the minimums on the rest. Once that loan is gone, take all of that money and put it towards a different loan. The loan that I’m focusing on now I’m paying about quadruple the minimum payment.

      • Anonymous

        Yeah. You should be paying more. You’re in BigLaw, making minimum 150k, and you’re only putting 10k into your loans a year. That’s absurd.

        • Anon

          I agree with Anonymous. I’m 8 years out from graduation and have paid off approximately 2/3 of my original loan balance (which was 175K). I’m now in-house, and I’m on track to pay them off in the next 18 months, but my biggest financial regret about my early career years is that I didn’t aggressively throw crazy amounts of cash at those loans when I was making BigLaw money and had very few necessary expenses.

        • Bee

          I’m not Anon for this, but I’ll chime in to say this comment seems misguided. Anon for this said she had “paid OFF” 38k-48k, meaning the principle amount of her loan, not that she had “paid” 38k-48k. The minimum payments for a 215k-220k loan would be in the 2500/mo range for a 10-year repayment schedule, so 30k/year in minimum payments. Federal loans carried up to 8.5% interest for Anon for this’s graduation year, so that takes a big chunk of her payments.

          Imo, 30k/year isn’t an absurdly low amount for a biglaw lawyer to pay. The high interest rate that many graduates have been stuck with just makes it really really hard to pay off the loans quickly, even if you’re lucky enough to have a high salary.

        • Lorelai Gilmore

          Oh please. She didn’t ask for advice; she’s offering a data point. Leave her alone.

    • HSAL

      I started with around 80K, and I’m down to around 33K after 7 years. I’ve aggressively paid some of them off but in May, I’ll be down to one remaining loan of around 25K, which I pretty much plan to pay off in the remaining 12 years since it has a very low interest rate.

      I always rounded my payments up, even if it was only a dollar, and I threw all of my “free” money at it. The biggies there were income tax refunds and the extra checks I get twice a year (we’re paid biweekly and my budget is based on two paychecks a month). I didn’t use the true snowball method – I paid off smaller loans first regardless of interest rate, but then applied those payments onto the high-interest loan left.

    • Going anon for this response

      Approx $175k – various loans from UG and law school across multiple lenders from about 2-7%. Paid it off a little less than 5 yrs after law school. Paid the minimums the first year and then upped my payments after starting at a biglaw firm. I would make the minimum monthly payment and throw any extra to one loan so I paid them off one by one. I tracked everything in a spreadsheet and it was really motivating to see my net worth increase (even from a negative number to a slightly smaller negative number) on a monthly basis as each loan dropped to $0. With a biglaw salary, I feel like I should have paid it off faster, but I was also building my emergency fund and maxing out my 401k. 90%+ of my bonus/tax refund went to loans. As for advice – I did not really upgrade my lifestyle from law school – shopped only on sale, no super expensive restaurants, etc. And I had a roommate and lived in a smaller, cheaper apartment than I could technically afford. You will feel SO GOOD when those loans are gone. Good luck!

    • Anonymous

      Paid off $160k in 2.5 years, courtesy of a BigLaw job and being very frugal. It was not a fun 2.5 years, but I was terrified of my student loan debt.

    • Gail the Goldfish

      I haven’t paid it off yet, but I’m at around $180k I think and the snowball/avalanche debt calculator informs me that at my current rate, I’ll pay it off sometime in 2020. I refinanced about half with a private lender to get a better rate, and I’m doing the snowball method (pay off highest interest rate first). I also moved to a lower cost of living area and got a new job that’s paying considerably more than my old one, which helped the most because otherwise I’d be paying this off until I was about 50. All the “extra” money from my new salary I’m splitting about half to loan payments and half to savings/retirement.

  19. Anon

    What is everyone’s opinion on the appropriateness of having a framed wedding photo on your desk of you and your husband kissing?

    • Anon

      It’s not the wedding photo I chose to display, and it’s a bit of a strange choice, but not “we need to have a talk – this won’t fly at work” objectionable.

    • Anon

      Fine if you’re the only person who can see it (I’m thinking private office really), but I’d probably choose something else.

    • Bee

      Inappropriate. No one wants to walk into your office and see you and your husband kissing. It’s just too close to PDA in the office. I could see it being OK in a super casual workplace I suppose.

    • Ginjury

      Not appropriate. I’m sure you have at least one wedding photo of the two of you not kissing. I suggest you use one of those.

    • Orangerie

      Pick a different photo. I would think this was super awkward if I saw it on someone’s desk.

    • LH

      Wouldn’t bother me but I can see why it’s not the most appropriate choice. Also depends on how zoomed in it is – two people kissing in the distance is a lot more appropriate than a closeup of faces with kissing. But if people who come into your office can easily see the photo I would choose one w/o kissing.

    • Anon

      This reminds me of a male associate who was very young at my old firm. His wife framed about TEN wedding photos, including several of them kissing. He then proceeded to hang them very prominently in his office. No one told him it was inappropriate, but the partners could not stop joking about it. Eventually, another junior associate told him that the photos were inappropriate and they were replaced by pictures of his dogs instead. Still…I don’t want to see my colleagues making out with someone. I just don’t, even if it’s your wedding day.

      • Playing DressUP

        That’s really funny, and I’m now thinking of THIS SAME FORUM, except for men. “How do I tell the new guy at my office that we don’t want to see the framed photos of him and his wife kissing?”

    • OP

      Thanks, this was sort of my reaction. Due to a crappy wedding photographer we really don’t have any other standard photos (really annoying). I don’t want to take the risk of my coworkers thinking it is weird, even though my office is casual, so I will probably just use an engagement photo or something – luckily we had a different photographer for that.

      • Nan

        Just for a contrary view, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it. One personal photo you like on your desk is fine. Kissing is not p*rn; it’s clearly a wedding pose. It’s not an overshare if it’s facing you. I’m surprised by these reactions, I feel like they are very stick-up-the-butt!

      • LH

        Can you crop a portrait photo? We had a similar situation, not with kissing specifically, but we had ZERO photos of just the two of us relatively close-up where we were both smiling and looking directly at the camera….not really sure how that happened but needless to say I wasn’t thrilled about it. I ended up cropping a family portrait for the newspaper and it worked fine.

    • lawsuited

      Kissing your husband on your wedding day is one of the more intimate moments of that day that it wouldn’t be my first choice to share at work. I wouldn’t say it’s inappropriate, but is there really no other photo of your and your husband that you might prefer to display for co-workers?

      • AnonLawMom

        Kissing my husband was definitely NOT one of the most intimate moments of my wedding day ;-)

        • lawsuited

          Lol, I was careful to say ONE of the MORE intimate moments. I hope there were others!

    • Wildkitten

      I have never seen a photo of people kissing that didn’t look awkward. Ever.

    • AN

      My direct report had this one….and each time I had to talk to him, it just felt like PDA at work….
      But I never did say anything to him, of course.

  20. alexander-terrible-no-good-day

    I got fantastic sleeps, and that’s about the only redeeming quality of the day so far. I managed to get deodorant on my blouse, and while I removed the deodorant stains with my h20 at home bar & cloth, I managed to ruin the blouse completely, with the iron. I’ve ironed this shirt before! Maybe I forgot to change the heat setting, but there’s a spot near my right flank that will forever be ruined. I was running late to get out the door, so I am wearing the blouse anyway. With a cardi, which was part of the plan, but now I’m stuck in the cardi, and it is supposed to be hot & humid today.

    Then I had to take my littlest in for well-child and he got vaccines, and his crying just broke my heart. And now I am working feverishly on a presentation for this evening, and one of my coworkers scheduled a meeting smack in the middle of the time that I need to be working. She didn’t take down the phone number for the client correctly, so when I tried to call to reschedule, I got the wrong number.

    And then my big work tote broke. It was old, and it was cheap, but it was, at least until this point, functional. So now I need to look for a new one. And shell out money that I was hoping not to need to spend (or spend on something else!)

    And I’m not going to see my kids again for the rest of the day. And I won’t see them tomorrow morning because I have a meeting I have to leave for before they get up.

    • Playing DressUP

      Sorry your day sucks. Have a shower, have breakfast-for-dinner, and start your day over again ASAP.
      Also, you have confirmed my instinct to never iron. So, you have helped a friend. Thanks.

    • Wildkitten

      I often find that when I feel like Alexander I am really really tired. Like, my tote breaks and I start crying and when I lay down I will fall asleep immediately (which I don’t normally do) and then it all makes sense.

  21. How to Style Question

    I couldn’t pass up this St. John Santana sweater dress given the collar, which I just love! It’s on super sale right now at off saks. Link to follow.

    Question for the hive: how would you style this for a business casual office (albeit on executive floor)? I won’t go sleeveless to work (both too cold and just not willing to expose upper arms). I bought it in both the ruby and onyx colors and will decide which one to keep once I get to try them on.

    I’m thinking I would dress it down a bit with tights and boots in the winter but am stumped about what kind of jacket or sweater I should pair with it.

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