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The scorned
Recently left biglaw for a small firm less than five years old that no one heard of. While I’m personally happy with this decision, many of my “friends” who are still in biglaw seem to look down on me for leaving biglaw. Eg one person who a year ago was begging me to help her lateral to my biglaw firm now seems especially snobby towards me. The bright side is that I can better see who my real friends are. However, I can’t cut off contact with the judgmental ones because most of the work at my small firm comes from partner referrals from biglaw firms and we are told to keep in touch with ex-biglaw coworkers.
1) did anyone else have similar experiences? 2) how would you deal with it?
Anonymous
Honestly, remember that everyone in BigLaw hates it (and if they don’t, they are there for the $). I don’t hate it most days myself, but I envy people who have broken free of the golden chains. Grass is always greener.
Anon
I don’t agree that everyone in big law hates it (I actually like it a lot), but I will say that anyone who is giving you a hard time about leaving is most definitely not happy in big law and is trying to make themselves feel better about staying by trying to frame things in their mind that they have it better than you.
These types of comments say way more about the person speaking them than the person on the receiving end.
Anonymous
Think long term about this and keep in contact.
The original Scarlett
Give it a few years. I saw the same thing when I went in-house (back then it wasn’t the holy grail it is now). People need to feel like giving all their time to a job matters so you’ll run into it for a while. It’s a phase.
Anonymous
Work on mentally shifting from looking at these people as “friends” to looking at them as potential referral sources. Make sure they know what type of work you do. Invite them to attend bar association etc. events with you. If you have a marketing budget, use it to take them to happy hour/dinner before or after the events. If your firm has events for their lawyer friends, invite them to that stuff (and if your firm doesn’t do this, they should, it’s really not that expensive to have a wine tasting event in your office/at a local wine store). Basically focus your energy on work related things with these people. It’ll make them slightly more tolerable.
The scorned
Thanks! It takes a lot of emotional energy to deal with their unpleasantness, but I can’t afford to cut them off either. Inviting them only to work related events is a good way of making it tolerable to “catch up” with them.
Anonymous
People don’t like being confronted with the alternative to their own choices. IME, it is part of human nature. There is always going to be someone mad at you for doing something different. Be polite and bland when they’re being rude and let the friendship whither and hopefully keep those referrals.
anon0305
The reality is that once you leave big-law, it is very hard to get back into big-law (not for everyone, but for most people), but really, that’s ok, especially if you are happy at your new place of employment. Truth be told, most of those folks will get bumped from big-law (either voluntarily or involuntarily) at some point, so just take the high road and be professional with them- you never know when a relationship might be useful in the future, even if it isn’t at the moment.
Anonymous
They’ll get theirs. What % of people in biglaw get to stay, even if they want to? To act all snobbish about it now because they’re doing SOO great as 4th years or whatever just shows how naïve they are because there were plenty of excellent 4th years who were told things like — you’re going to be partner here etc. — who kept toiling away and guess what it never happened because when that time came firms were quick to say — nah, we don’t think you’re THAT great; not great enough to share profit with, you have a year to leave, thanks. This is the story more often than not. Ask me how I know. And then those people are often begging to get jobs at quality small shops — many of whom don’t want to hire 10th years and would rather stick with the associates that wanted them as 4th years.
And btw these people aren’t friends. They’re your network. Treat them as such — the way you’d network with professional colleagues, going to professional events etc. I’d pull back from birthday parties and brunches with these people; not saying you should never go to those — but when you have time on a weekend and want to grab a drink, don’t always call these people; call others who’ve shown they are actual friends.
The scorned
Thanks! I really need to start drawing a distinction between friends who happen to be lawyers and lawyers who are part of my work network but not friends.
LaurenB
I think the thing to remember is that while people in biglaw are impressed with themselves, no one outside of that world really cares all that much about the distinction between a lawyer in a law firm and a lawyer who is in-house. It’s not the “drop in prestige” that a bunch of self-important people think it is. It’s sort of like investment banking – investment bankers tend to think that everyone wants to Be Them, but in reality no one cares and no one is remotely jealous.
Senior Attorney
OMG that is so true! Most people in real life just feel sorry for the BigLaw people who are working all the time.
LaurenB
People just aren’t impressed by BigLaw. Ok, you’re a lawyer and you work for a law firm. That’s nice. I don’t even remotely see how that is “better” than being a lawyer who works in-house for XYZ Company. In fact, at least XYZ Company produces goods and services that are real and of use to people.
Anon
So much this!!! I work in big law and am mostly happy but this attitude/snobbery is soooo prevalent and it drives me batty. Literally no one cares outside of a very small group of people who have chosen to also (self-interestedly) think that your job (and by extension theirs) is soooo important. Every time people make these comments it reminds me of Andy on the office being obsessed with Cornell.
anontosharedetails
Ok, so. I left a large, prestigious firm after what I viewed as years of mistreatment and the inability to live the healthy lifestyle that is very important to me. I was much more senior than you and in a niche practice area. The firm’s response was to offer me partnership. I declined. My former colleagues at the firm and my lawyer friends thought I had lost my mind or was having some sort of personal crisis, and some definitely flat out mocked me and my new firm.
I am vastly happier at my new firm, which is a small firm that focuses on my niche area in which every lawyer came from biglaw. I make about 75% of what I made as a senior associate, work 40-50 hours a week, have much more responsibility on my cases, less annoying clients, and work with people who are of a similar mindset (enjoy the job, but also have a life outside).
I agree with others to just take these comments with a grain of salt, and keep these people in mind for future referrals. I did corporate defense in biglaw, and my new firm focuses on plaintiff’s work, so I have already gotten a few referrals because there is no way large law firms could take our clients on due to conflicts/fee structures.
Should I Stay or Should I Go?
Need advice – I’m an in house attorney who has been underemployed for about 4 years. It’s been an EXTREMELY easy job, literally 0 stress but soooo boring. My boss is in another state, so I can come and go as I please. I barely work. This has been great for having two kids (ages 3 and 1), but professionally, it’s completely stagnant. I have just been offered an opportunity to join a big pharma company, way, way more pay, but obviously it’s a real job now. I’m nervous about trading my flexibility with such little kids, but I feel like if I pass on this opportunity, I will regret it in a year or two. Side note – spending the last 4 years basically standing still professionally, I’m suffering from major impostor syndrome (i.e., I’m not good enough for this new job, they will figure me out soon enough). Do I hold on to this amazing but boring flexibility with an iron grip or is it time to move on?
Anonymous
I can’t speak to the legal side of pharma, but the science side tends to be very good with flexibility. I’ve worked for three different pharma companies now in technical leadership roles, and while there is a lot of work, it has always come with a lot of understanding for parenting of small kids – both in terms of institutional policies and actual on the ground practice.
Anonymous
So I recently did a switch that is very similar with the same age kids… it’s only been a few months and I can’t tell if I ‘regret it’ yet but I have definitely regretted it on a few occasions, if that makes sense. On the plus side, my days go by super quickly where they used to drag by and I find myself intellectually challenged in a way I haven’t in a LONG time. On the other, I have cried at work, had to work at night and on the weekends regularly, and every sick day, snow day and child care emergency fills me with anxiety and dread. Also, I took for granted how much I could do at work with my old gig: both in terms of stuff for my family and myself (online shopping, groceries, Amazon, school research, doctor visits, etc.) and in terms of just getting a break for myself because now work is a whirlwind and home with two littles is crazy so I have practically zero breaks in my week. I think it would be better if the people I worked with were better, so that’s maybe another aspect of it. It’s also required my husband to rearrange his schedule more and to pick up more kid responsibilities, which he can do mostly but I can see this being another stresser depending on your family situation. All in all, I’m not sure I have advice but wanted to share my experience. I think in retrospect I wish I could have waited another year or two maybe to do this, but then again not sure if that would really help or just bring different challenges.
Anonymous
I don’t have any advice, but this is me right now, too! Following with interest.
tesyaa
How secure is this amazingly flexible, no-work job? Won’t management eventually figure out they’re paying you to do basically nothing? If you have an opportunity now, TAKE IT.
Anonymous
This would be my concern: at some point the unicorn job vanishes and then what will you do?
In the meantime, provide value, go above and beyond. The worst that can happen is that you confirm your suspicions when you leave and they are able to leave the position unfilled.
Anonymous
Go for it. You’ve got this and you’ll regret not taking it.
Anonymous
I’d keep the boring job. People often think kid stuff gets easier in the school years but in many ways it gets harder because there is no daycare with long opening hours, there is just a lot of scheduling with activities and helping with homework etc.
To address the ‘boring’ part, I would work on journal publications, teaching CLEs in your area, or possibly teaching at a local college in law or law adjacent areas. This allows you to have a more interesting work life without jumping to a new job. That way you can scale up or down depending on how busy your main job is and still give yourself flexibility with your family. These activities involve keeping up to date in your area of law and could be an appropriate use of work time as they are related to your area of the law.
Anonymous
Move! Take it. You will be fine, and you can find another smaller company job if the new job proves to be too inflexible.
Anonymous
Coming back to respond to my own comment because I’m surprised to see the chorus of people telling you to stick with your current job. You obviously have enough appetite for a change that you interviewed for this new job — don’t let fear of the unknown hold you back. As I said above, you can take a step back if you need to down the line, but you will likely find it challenging to take a step forward if you’re already feeling stagnant and imposter-y. If you don’t want this particular job, don’t take it, but do keep looking.
Em
I am a big advocate of not having to constantly be climbing the ladder and believe it is ok to take a job that has good hours and isn’t your whole life, especially if you have young kids. My job is mostly 40 hours per week, good pay, flexible, and moderately challenging, but there is limited upward mobility. There is a difference between that and what your are describing though. I personally wouldn’t be happy with a job that provided no challenge, and that is what would make me move on.
Housecounsel
Agree with Em. I’ve scaled back and am grateful every time there is a snow day, etc. This is right for me at this stage in my life, and if I never get back to running at full capacity, I can live with that.
Anonymous
You’re not agreeing with Em. Please read her last two sentences.
Housecounsel
You’re right, I read too fast.
anonanon
I have the job you have now. The pay is good not great, but I am topped out. However, my flexibility is incredible — telework, lots of autonomy, and my days end when I sign off for the day.
A close friend has a big pharma job (marketing) and works all. the. time. She is constantly lamenting how she never has a chance to catch her breath and see her kids more than an hour a day. She works weekends routinely. I joked that I wanted to leave my job for something that paid more, even if it meant I had to hire a nanny. She commented that she would take a 50% pay cut to have the flexibility I have, and wasn’t kidding.
I don’t know what’s right for you, but that comment cut me to the quick and helped me appreciate my current gig so much more.
Anonymous
My two cents is to stay where you are for now. I took a challenging job that required travel and long hours when my two sons (now adults) were babies. Although my husband was very supportive, it was a very hard road. Looking back, I was exhausted all the time and felt I shortchanged them and myself for the sake of the job. For me, it was not a good tradeoff. I moved to a less challenging job when the boys hit elementary school, after one day realizing that it seemed everyone but me was raising my kids. I never regretted that move and wish I had done it sooner. Later on (they were in their teens) I moved up to the big leagues of my profession again. (I’m CEO of a nonprofit). Other jobs will come but time with your kids won’t come again. Make the change when you feel you’re ready in terms of the kids and your own needs for time, not your profession.
anon0305
I have the job you have & have a friend that has the job you’ve been offered…. I have a 3yo & am soon to have a newborn. I personally would not trade my boring, well paying job, for the stress, and $100k more that my friend is making (I make about $150k, she makes about $250k). On a mental stimulation basis- I figure I can always ramp up later when I have more capacity. On a strictly financial basis- the $ would be about 6k/mo extra after taxes- most of which would end up going to me hiring a full time nanny plus other convenience services. My friend doesn’t have kids, does want kids, but I honestly think by taking this job she has probably moved away from ever having kids as a reality (which is totally cool, just isn’t for me). HOWEVER, I would take this opportunity to absolutely interview and potentially ask for the sky if you get an offer (would the new job let you telework either part or full time? Would they give you even more $ than you’d expect?) and then make an informed decision with your partner from there. You can also use it to negotiate at your current job if there’s anything you’ve been meaning to ask for.
Friend
I’m actually in a similar boat, non-legal. So glad you asked this! Thank you!
Never too many shoes...
I am honestly surprised by the comments on this. I feel like the tag of this blog “for overachieving chicks” is sometimes a bit of a misnomer.
Friend, you are intellectually board and your skills and career are stagnating by your own description. Take this job, challenge yourself and kick ass while doing it. Kids are stressful no matter your job but your own desires matter too.
anon0305
Sometimes, you are an overachieving chick in your 20s… and then you burn out with life + kids & that’s just where you are at (speaking for myself). It’s ok to make trade offs for various other benefits in life if that’s what you want… it’s also ok to keep reaching for the starts if that’s what you want.
Housecounsel
Thank you, anon0305. I overachieved until I was a mom of three traveling all the time and missing Mother’s Day brunches at preschool (it’s been seven years and I still remember and I am pretty sure the kid doesn’t). Do I have to resign my Corporette membership?
Rainbow Hair
I am normally pretty far on the side of “uuuugh don’t work too hard (unless it makes you happy)” but something about OP’s question makes me think she really *does* want this new gig, and is just scared of the change. Of course change is scary! It will be hard! Ramping back up to speed after a stint in an easy/comfortable job is tiring! But then once you hit your grove, you’ll have the job you want.
This morning Kiddo (just turned four) was wailing at me “why do you have to go to work?!” and I told her, “I hope one day you have a job like this — I get to use what I know to help people, and people are nice to me.” Sometimes, day-to-day, I wish I weren’t here, because home would be nicer, travel is a drag, etc., but I think I’m setting a good example for her, and I am (somewhat, like, as much as blah blah capitalism blah blah allows) fulfilled by my work.
Anon
Boring jobs drive me crazy and really make my mental health suffer. I would take the new job in a heart beat.
Anonymous in Texas
I think you should stay. Others have suggested you try to do more at this job to make you more marketable later. Do that! You’ll regret it if you don’t!
Stay or GO?
OP Here – My boss is a terrible manager, so I do not think she will ever notice how little work I do. It’s been this way since I started, which was a big change from Big Law and took me a long time to adjust. I’m very responsive to the emails and calls I do receive, so people like me. My current company is downsizing heavily so stability is unclear but there is definite writing on the wall yet. New gig describes itself as super flexible, but I guess I’m afraid of the change. Right now I am the default parent and also spend a lot of my time doing housework, chores, caring for the kids. This change will require me to pull them from daycare and hire a nanny and outsource a lot of this, so it’s a lot. I’m afraid of regretting making the move but also regretting letting the opportunity pass by.
Thanks for the all the input!
Stay or Go?
*No definite writing on the wall yet
KTA
If the new role claims they are super flexible, and your current company is downsizing, HELLO! take the new job. you have the skills. they want you. Do it.
Anon-nah-nah
I could have asked this question with these changes: I am being lowkey pressured to get a higher-paying job from my attorney husband who started his own practice almost two years ago (and is doing well, but if I made more, we would have an easier go of it financially). I would like to make more money, too, but I am not sure I am willing to pay the cost in terms of time and capacity.
I currently work for state government and make pennies but we have a 3-year-old and I have near-boundless flexibility in terms of when I come in, hours I work, working from home, flex time, etc. I have no interest in having less time to spend with our child and being stressed out about scheduling and outsourcing childcare and not having a life outside of work. In addition, and perhaps more importantly, I have time in the office to do non-work things and to have outside interests and it is very rare that I feel pressure in terms of producing at work. My job is meaningful and I have enough influence and responsibility so that I do not feel like I am spinning my wheels here.
I am afraid to make the jump to in-house counsel although with my background I would be attractive to a large regulated industry. Are in-house counsel jobs generally inflexible and demanding?
Signed,
Afraid to leave, but afraid to go
Housecounsel
My in-house job was sold as flexible, but as the company expanded the job got huge. There was a also a 24-hour culture that I should have picked up on but didn’t. I am going to watch my kid read at Mass in a few minutes. I almost didn’t go – have so much to do, even in my at-home job – but this is why I leaned out.
Stay or Go
Just an update – thank you all SO much for your input. I really appreciate it. I realized my fear was really of the unknown, and I decided I did not want to let that hold me back. I accepted the job! I’ve been standing still in my current role for years, there is no opportunity for upward mobility, and my boss is so hands off that there is no mentorship or learning. It was definitely depressing me how little gratification I received from my professional life, so I needed to make a change. I hope I made the right decision! Thanks again!!
In-House in Houston
Ladies, I’d like to take a poll. How many of you wear mascara on your lower lashes? My niece recently told me that I shouldn’t wear it on my lower lashes; she said it’s “dated.” Since she told me that I noticed that some women don’t. I tried not wearing it on my lower lashes and it just doesn’t look right to me. I guess it takes time getting used to it…? I’m in my mid-40s. Wondering what the rest of you do….TIA!
Anonymous
Never lower lashes my whole life (late 40s). It just gets all over the place like a raccoon by the end of the day.
Anonymous
I will say: I am a fair-skinned brunette, so this is the one area where I can go completely without mascara and have plenty of visible lashes.
#blessed? not so much — I also have Eugene Levy’s eyebrows and have paid a good fortune out in waxing, etc. since puberty hit.
Ms B
LOL “Eugene Levy’s eyebrows”. Perfectly specific!
anon
As a fellow Eugene Levy eyebrow haver- I think we are having a moment with big eyebrows on trend!
I stopped wearing mascara (& most makeup) entirely because it irritates my face. I always thought if I had pale/minimal lashes, I’d dye them or get extensions. Everyone is always so happy with them. They’d make me look like minnie mouse.
Z
Yeah, never ever. Smudges like crazy.
Anonymous
I stopped applying mascara on my lower lashes a few years ago because it would always smudge off onto my skin and give me raccoon eyes. Now, I just apply to the upper lashes and then blink hard a few times when it’s still wet so a little transfers to the lower lashes, but not enough to smudge. I’m wondering if she’s thinking of the Kim K spider lashes that were so popular a few years back? The kind where your lower lashes looked almost as long as your upper lashes. That to me reads dated, but also probably isn’t the look that you’re going for when putting mascara on lower lashes.
Anon
I do because my lower lashes are invisible. But not very much.
Anon
Someone’s teen daughter told her last week that long necklaces were out. Ladies, let’s stop listening to teen girls and trust our own meter enough to know what works or doesn’t.
I wear a tiny bit of mascara on my lower lashes – not enough to look like Twiggy, but just a coat for definition.
Diana Barry
+1, this is what I do. Otherwise they are invisible.
Never too many shoes...
Me too.
Anon
Agreed. I cringe at some of the things I wore and did during my teenage and even college years. I wouldn’t have trusted my advice back then
Anon
+1,000,000
Anon
+1 I don’t wear mascara on my lower lashes but I also don’t take fashion advice from teenage girls
Em
It isn’t clear from the post if the niece is a teen, but this was my initial reaction too. I wear mascara on my lower lashes because it makes my eyelashes look fuller. I have never had problems with it smudging around my eyes, even when I have been crying. Do whatever makes you happy and looks best on you.
Anon
I’m 37 and have never worn it on my lower lashes except on the rare nights I was going for a clubbing look.
Anonymous
This. I’m 38.
LifeScienceMBA
This. I’m 38.
JDMom
This, I am 34. Mascara only on lower lashes when I am doing a full-on glam look for a night out / party. It does not wear well during the day, it is the equivalent of heavy foundation to me.
JDMom
Oh, and mine are invisible blond.
Anonymous
It’s been out so long it’s about to be back.
The original Scarlett
Ha! I actually think it’s back again – I didn’t for years and recently noticed a bunch of bloggers wearing upper and lower lash mascara so I tried it again and I have to say I’m a fan. My eyes look much better with both. In or out, see what looks good on you.
Aggie
I brush my lower lashes with a spoolie spritzed with Fix+ to remove any eyeshadow fallout. Otherwise, I agree with the above. Lower lash mascara just turns into raccoon eyes for me.
Miss
I never put mascara on my lower lashes, but I agree with the poster above that blinking gets a little on my lower lashes and that’s enough definition for me. If no mascara on your lower lashes looks weird to you , keep doing it. Or you can sweep a little bit of eyeshadow instead of liner under your eyes for softer definition.
Anonymous
Makeup things like this go in and out of style but I think it’s really individual. Some people look better with, some without. Some people look better with thicker eyebrows, some with thinner eyebrows. Same with blush color, lip color (I CANNOT do the nude lip that I fear is coming back this spring), eyeliner, pretty much anything on your face.
Personally, I do not wear eyeliner or mascara on my lower lid/lashes unless I’m going somewhere it’s appropriate to wear, like, club makeup. It’s a lot of look for me. I’m very pale, blonde, blue eyes, so ymmv.
Anon
All of you complaining about raccoon eyes – get Glossier Lash Slick. It is the best mascara I have ever used.
Vinyasa
Shrug. Agree with the teen girl. It can look spidery and dated.
Cat
I do, with a light hand. I’ve tried the no-lower-lash mascara look and it wasn’t as flattering; it emphasizes the tiny crease I have that runs underneath the lower lashes. I’ve never had any issues with smudging.
Mrs. Jones
Yes mascara on lower lashes. I like it to define my eyes.
Anonymous
I don’t, because I feel like it really brings out my dark under-eye circles. On the rare occasion I want them to look a little more significant, I use clear mascara. But this is rare – I’d have to go buy it for the occasion because I don’t even have it in my house anymore.
Anonymous
My eyelashes are pale, so it looks odd to me to have mascara on the top and not the bottom (as if I only have top eyelashes?). Only tube mascara behaves on the lower lashes though.
anon
I’m 36 and have used it for as long as I remember…probably since I upped my make-up game in my mid-20s. I do use a light touch and sometimes use my finger to remove some of what I put on.
Anon
Yes to one light coat of mascara on lower lashes for me. Blonde hair +fair skin=invisible lashes without mascara.
Lana Del Raygun
I don’t at work, because I think it makes me look ~~pretty~~ and I want to look more serious, but I do if I’m wearing makeup outside of work.
anon
I’m crap at applying it on my lower lashes, so I just don’t!
Houda
I have never worn bottom lashes mascara and do not know anyone who does. It makes a lot of people look tired and wrinkly or ends up smudgy
ValkyrieLawyer
I haven’t done the bottom lashes mascara thing but literally pulled out my mascara from my desk to try it after reading this thread. Aaaaand…nope, it looks terrible on me. Try it out and if you like it, do it! But it’s definitely not for me.
Anon
No I don’t. I get my makeup look updated from time to time by one of the lines with real makeup artists. They haven’t been doing lower lash mascara on me for a long time, so I don’t do it at home.
anon
Never (I’m 24 and brunette.) My lower lashes are insanely curly so it gets everywhere and I do not have time to deal with that. I also think it makes your eyes look smaller the same way dark liner on the lower waterline does. Also, to everyone saying they look unbalanced with only top mascara, try some brown mascara! It’s much more natural looking on blondes and redheads and helps with the balance issue.
Inspired By Hermione
I am not religious, so this isn’t “for Lent,” but these 40 days are as good a time as any to declutter. Gretchen Rubin’s new book about organizing/decluttering comes out today, I just moved, and all of this together means I can get rid of some stuff I don’t need/don’t like/don’t want.
But, not religious. Not “for Lent,” just…because it’s a set 40 days.
Inspired By Hermione
This is the wrong spot for this comment.
journo
I’m 27 and I started wearing mascara on my lower lashes maybe two years ago. Only rarely is smudging a problem for me and I love the look. I’m a brunette and my lashes are dark and I use black mascara. I put it on my top lashes first then use whatever is left on the brush on my lower lashes. I recently noticed a cosmetics advertisement for mascara and a brush specific to the lower lashes but that is unnecessary. Just use your normal mascara.
Dan Markel murder
Has anyone else been following this? I am hooked on a podcast now called Over My Dead Body.
Anon
I love it too!
Anonymous
Honestly, I would not go to these people for dental work — if they will wack a family member (granted, a then-divorced former SIL/BIL), I can’t imagine what they’d do with a drill in my mouth.
The original Scarlett
Thanks for the red! Sounds great.
Anonymous
I first read about the case on the Tax Prof blog. I hadn’t realized that he was not a tax professor (but a criminal law one). At first, I had no idea why someone would kill a tax person, so I have followed ever since it happened. It comes through how broken up his parents are — they have lost their son and now their grandsons (I cannot imagine how it will be for the grandsons once they are old enough to get on the internet).
Anon
I read about it when it first happened on AtL but haven’t been following it closely. It seemed obvious at the time that the wife’s family paid someone to do it. Does the ex wife still have sole custody of the kids?? That’s kind of crazy.
Anonymous
Yes, but she is the only parent left and seems to be not involved in the murder (maybe she wished for it to happen but didn’t hire the really-bumbling hitmen). Being kin to some awful period could disqualify a lot of people from custody.
Anon
I graduated from FSU Law and live in Tallahassee. I have been following the story and will listen to the podcast.
Anon
Share your Lent ideas (or for non-observers, favorite 40 day challenges)? Some years I give something and up other years I try something new, i.e., meditate daily, avoid candy, do 10 pushups every morning.
Anon
I’m so glad you posted this! I was going to ask the same question. This year I think I’m going to try to write a little every day. I used to journal as a teen, and it was really helpful introspection when teenage life was a bit much. I don’t know when I stopped, but I think it would be good for me to start again.
Cb
I gave up facebook 3 or 4 years ago and still haven’t gone back. I think I’d like to focus on gratitude, I think it’s easy to be caught up in the frustrations of everyday life and I’d like to push myself to focus on the good things.
Housecounsel
Remove one thing from my house every day, preferably to donate. I am making my kids do it too.
In-House in Houston
I love this idea!!
Tippins
I challenge myself to create as little trash as possible – use all the produce I buy, avoid excess packaging, don’t buy random stuff online, etc.
Anon
One of the churches in my area is challenging parishioners to – instead of giving up something personal for Lent – to give up plastic. They’re requesting one week to give up single use plastics (like plastic forks/spoons, dinnerware, cups) another week, they’re asking parishioners to give up straws; another week it’s plastic packaging, etc. I thought that was interesting.
Anon
I love this. This is a great idea.
Anonymous
Periodically I’ll implement a month of good routines to get back on track for things that have slipped. That means 30 days (could be 40 for Lent) where I don’t skimp on the things I should be doing. Get up, eat a real breakfast- no hitting snooze and grabbing a doughnut at the office. Plan my outfits for the week on Sunday night. Wash and dry my hair properly, according to my schedule- no wet hair buns or 4th day hair dry shampoo. Meal plan for the week, including bringing lunches to work. Basically all of the things that I want to do but let slip when I get lazy. I pick a month and pledge to do every single one of them. It reminds me how much easier life is and how much better I feel when I’m disciplined about these kinds of details.
Vicky Austin
I think this is gonna be mine too – high five and go you!
Miss
I really like this idea. I’ve been unsuccessful in the past because I end up cutting into my sleep schedule, so it’s unsustainable, but maybe I can figure out a better way to fit everything together. Right now I spend too much time “unwinding” with my phone so maybe I’ll give up evening phone time for Lent and add in habits I want to adopt.
Anonymous
When I’ve done it in the past, getting 8 hours of sleep is part of the whole thing. I know I have enough time to do everything and get enough sleep, it’s just a matter of being intentional about making it happen. Try not to add too much brand new stuff into the routines. Just focus on things that you don’t always get done, but when you do, your life is easier and better.
Lana Del Raygun
My husband I are planning to go to confession weekly and give up TV. (PSA to other Catholics: a lot of dioceses expanding their confession times for Lent! Check out “The Light Is On For You” in DC, Arlington, Boston, and others!)
Anonymous
Try not to get too annoyed at my husband (too Catholic to get a vascectomy, no so Catholic that he didn’t know it was Mardi Gras today (so Lent tomorrow)). I’m not Catholic at all and don’t get why he doesn’t get that in my home state of NJ, you eat pizza every Friday but no pepperoni in Lent!
Anonymous
Ha yes classic Jersey.
anon0305
LOL- Total atheist here- it was mcdonald fish sandwich fri in my (very very very lax) catholic house growing up.
Anonymous
My actually-claims-he’s-Catholic husband was all “why are the fish on Friday block of the calendar”?
Not Catholic, but from NJ, so Catholic by osmosis?
Anon
My grandma is from a small town with only one restaurant. When she came to visit our larger town, she was always very psyched to have Long John Silver’s on Friday’s. Drive-thru no less.
Anon
*Fridays
Anon
Your husband is not too catholic to get a vasectomy. He’s too chicken to get a vasectomy.
Anonymous
I think she knows that.
Anon
Devout Catholic… and tempted to agree with you. “Too Catholic for a vasectomy” means too Catholic for artificial birth control, premarital sex, and a whole host of other things that most people rather enjoy. You don’t get to pull the “Holy Roman Catholic Church disapproves” card only when it benefits you.
Anon
+1 also I’m a laspsed Catholic and generally nonjudgmental about cafeteria Catholics but if a man is fine with other forms of artificial birth control but not a vasectomy, I have a very hard time believing his resistance is religious
Anon
I like the traditional way to celebrate, which is giving up a luxury that you will miss. Maybe sugar, meat, plastic packaging, or makeup?
Anon
I usually give something up – Facebook and alcohol are two I can’t recommend enough.
One year I did a service theme where I had to do one random act of kindness each day. That was a really positive experience as well.
Anonymous
I’m giving up chocolate. I also find it incredibly strange that so many people make a big deal out of giving something up for Lent and yet won’t attend church once between Christmas and Easter. If your Lenten sacrifice is more about your skinny jeans than Jesus, cool, but maybe hush about trivializing a holiday you don’t believe in?
Anon
Whoa judgmental much?
AnonLawyer
Eh, I don’t know. I’m a lapsed Catholic and growing up, Lent was about sacrifice, not self-improvement. If you’re not religious and want to spend 40 days for self-improvement as the OP suggested, fine — but I think that’s pretty different from the intent of lent (I may be mis-remembering; it’s been a while since I practiced).
Anonymous
That’s all I meant!
Anon
I kind of agree, I think anything around self-improvement is missing the point of Lent.
Anon
Do you also chastise people who attend church on Christmas? I am a sometimes lapsed sometimes not Catholic and this type of attitude strongly contributes to the times I’m lapsed. Honestly the church is seriously lacking in members, and it makes me sad to see parishes have to close but part of me thinks attitudes like this contribute greatly to it. Of course Catholics should be encouraged to fully participate and attend church each Sunday and every high holy day but we should also be welcoming and kind to those who aren’t currently on that path. Someone coming to church just on Christmas and Easter or only participating in Lenten sacrifices isn’t a model Catholic but why push someone away who appears to at least attempts to be connecting back with the church. Your attitude makes me sad
Anonymous
I’m not Catholic. I don’t mind however people observe, but giving something up just to lose weight and bragging about it irks me.
Anon
But why? How does it affect you? Of all the things people do that’s inconsistent with the religious meaning of something , this is pretty innocuous. It’s not harming anyone or injecting capitalistic/materialistic things into religion.
Sure lent is not supposed to be about bettering yourself but if someone wants to use it to get healthier, I don’t really care.
Anon
I’m not her, but sometimes it seems like cultural appropriation. There’s definitely a gray around around the evolution of religion vs appropriating traditions just for celebration and entertainment, but I can see how it would genuinely annoy people. A lot of the self-improvement stuff is vanity. It’s not materialistic but it’s along the same lines. But then you could also argue that some of it is overcoming sloth and gluttony, so again, gray area.
anon
I’m not Catholic either but I’m Anglican so we celebrate Lent too (just a little differently – more about meditation and preparation, like Advent).
It irks me too when people use Lent as a fun Instagram holiday, or to brag about losing weight. If society tried the same appropriation of another religion’s sacred holiday, there would be mobs in the street.
Anon
Meh to appropriation. Christians are a majority religion in the western world. I also think most of the people “appropriating” lent probably are/were Christian or have relatives who are. So appropriation really isn’t the appropriate word
Anonymous
I don’t think it’s appropriation, but it would be cool be to be “since Ramadan is happening seems like a good time to try out intermittent fasting!!”
Idk, I just don’t love my deeply spiritual practice being used as a diet. The pitchforks aren’t coming for you or anything, just something to consider.
Anon
“Honestly the church is seriously lacking in members, and it makes me sad to see parishes have to close but part of me thinks attitudes like this contribute greatly to it.”
The opposite is true. When the Church sells the same thing as the secular world, membership plummets. Also, it’s important for the Church to stand for truth, far more than it is important for the Church to be popular.
If I have kids, they will learn that Lent is about abstinence and almsgiving, not pushups and Instagram. We will go to a church that teaches the same.
Anon
I have kids. They are baptized. Our church teaches that lent is about abstinence but that also teaches that being a Catholic is about being kind, forgiving and welcoming. I fear that when we move out of the city we will have a hard time finding a church that teaches both. And the second part is far more important to us. If we have to look for non-Catholic churches to find that, we will.
Anon
One of my favourite lines is: when asking “What would Jesus do,” remember that overturning tables and chasing people with a whip isn’t out of the question.
Jesus’s death was ugly, brutal, and horrific. He died that way for for being a criminal, but for being the only truly good and sinless person to walk in earth. We abstain during Lent in penitence for our own sins. Acknowledgement of those sins is a necessary step to becoming more like Christ.
You can’t teach Catholic kindness without Catholic penitence. Gently, I suggest you find a Catechism and learn about the faith.
Anon
Thanks, I understand what Lent is about (thanks Catholic school). What I don’t understand is “overturning tables and chasing people with a whip” for not properly participating. In my opinion, anyone attempting to come back to the faith should be welcomed and kindly steered in the right direction not chased with a whip or berating them for doing it wrong and reminding them why the left in the first place. I don’t believe in purity tests. We are all sinners.
Anonymous
Statistically, I would guess that my peasant ancestors attended church primarily on Easter for hundreds of years. It was a pretty big deal when the Vatican first required one confession and one day of church attendance annually. But maybe the majority of Christians for hundreds of years just didn’t “believe” as much in those holidays as people who attend church weekly today?
Anon
But how can the poster feel literally holier than thou in the face of facts like this? How dare you! /s
Anon
Your ancestors didn’t have access to modern transportation or churches within walking distance.
I go to Mass, even when I really don’t want to, because I am aware of how many people throughout history and around the world today don’t have that privilege. God isn’t asking a lot of me to hop in my station wagon, turn on the heated seats, and get my rear end in a pew.
Anonymous
That’s not at all my point. If you actively don’t believe, then please don’t call your latest spring diet Lent. That’s all!
Anonymous
To me it sounds like we’re edging away from Catholicism and towards Protestantism if we focus so much on belief and intentions when the practice is the same? The Lenten fast has always served the purpose of dieting and of conserving resources at a strategic time of year in northern hemisphere agrarian societies.
Religious
As a great man said once, “Judge not, lest ye have terrible comments written about ye on the internet forums”
Anonymous
this atheist agrees with you.
Anon
I’m not even Catholic anymore (raised Catholic but now total atheist) and I agree. I find it so bizarre when people who are not religious at all “give things up” for Lent.
Anon
Do you also find it weird that these people celebrate Christmas or Easter?
...
Yes, especially Easter because it is weird! Easter is the most religious and holy holiday. It is 100% weird when people are all in on the jellybeans, but not the religious aspect.
Anon
I mean, yeah? Like somebody mentioned above, do your spring diet if that’s what you want to do, I honestly do not care. But to be all over social media talking about what you’re giving up for Lent when you probably don’t even know what Lent really is is weird to me. But I don’t think I care as much about this issue as you do, so you do you and I’ll do me and we can both live happily ever after :)
A different anon
Yes.
Anon
Thanks for responding- I wasn’t meaning to be snarky so sorry it came off that way, I was genuinely curious. I personally think the Christmas/Easter only Christians are a bit weird too. I was confused that people cherry picking participating in Lent was sooo offensive when it seems like lots of people are totally fine with trivializing Christmas/Easter as something that’s fun to participate in (although maybe the people objecting find both weird).
Anon
Every year, I give up Starbucks and donate the money I would have spent to a food pantry.
I will likely be doing the “bag of stuff a day” challenge to get rid of “stuff” that I don’t need, and use that to remember that I don’t need more stuff.
Still trying to figure out what to give up this year. I try to focus on bad habits that need breaking; it seems less daunting when it’s “only” for 40 days, but it’s easier to continue the good habits after Lent.
cbackson
Cutting way back on my social media and using the time I spent on that to pray and read my Bible; also working on my task of finding a new parish to join since my current one isn’t meeting my needs.
Walnut
I’m getting my rear end to church this Lent. No excuses. There are a gajillion masses every weekend and I will be in a pew at one of them. I realize it’s a low bar, but I’ve fallen off the wagon.
Anonymous
Mine too. I haven’t been to church in a few months because I’m grieving and church opens the floodgates. Going to try going back.
NOLA
oh, that’s so hard! After my mom died, my brother and I were going to a big Methodist church and, whenever I walked in, people would be so nice that I would burst into tears. <3 to you!
ValkyrieLawyer
Giving up my two favorite foods in the world, sweets and cheese, for Lent. I used to only do sweets, but my (now-) husband observed (rightly) that I would use cheese as a “crutch” during Lent, and that made me realize I was just switching one dependency for another, so doing without both has been my standard lately for Lent.
Inspired By Hermione
I am not religious, so this isn’t “for Lent,” but these 40 days are as good a time as any to declutter. Gretchen Rubin’s new book about organizing/decluttering comes out today, I just moved, and all of this together means I can get rid of some stuff I don’t need/don’t like/don’t want.
But, not religious. Not “for Lent,” just…because it’s a set 40 days.
OP
Checking this late but didn’t expect such a response – thanks to all who responded! And to maybe clarify (not intended to fuel fires), I’m a 2x/weekly churchgoer in a denomination that does not observe Lenten practices, but still observes the season (aka we’ll have an Ash Wednesday service and special Palm Sunday/Easter activities). I have periods of fasting and prayer throughout different seasons of life, but as I’m not Catholic, do not adhere to the sacrificial season. Instead, I try to use the time to implement a change in my life that’ll bring me closer to the practices my beliefs dictate. Giving up candy was, for me, a huge change – I always, always have sweets around my desk. Similarly, adding a meditation time to my daily prayer time helped me center myself and calm my thoughts before I prayed. I believe that decluttering, eating breakfast daily, other routine-type tasks can improve my own life, my attitude, and help increase my gratitude. I in no way intended to bash Catholics or others who follow traditional lenten practices; but admittedly I use the time as a 40-day period where most of the people in my geographic area are changing something about their lives and daily habits at the same time, and it’s encouraging to make a positive change at the same time.
journo
I’m giving up alcohol. It will suck. I’m also trying to pray a daily rosary. That will not suck.
Long Commute
Starting a new job with a bear of a commute soon, so I need all of your recommendations for staying calm in traffic, the best things to listen to, and anything else that will make a 1-2 hour drive each way tolerable! The commute is just for a few months until I can move closer to work, but I’m transitioning from a 10 minute drive, so it’ll be quite an adjustment.
Anon
I did something similar for six months due to life circumstances. Audible and podcasts were my friend. I can ive you some recs depending on your interests? Also making sure to check a traffic app every morning and making it part of my routine (rather than hitting some huge backup I didn’t expect and adding even more time to the commute)
Anonymous
I agree with listening to podcasts and the like. Can you learn a language?
Long Commute
I love the idea of learning a language! Can you recommend any good audio resources for that? I’ve used Duolingo, but obviously that doesn’t work while driving.
Right now I listen to The Daily every morning while getting ready, but I’d love to mix in some humor with the news. I’ve tried mystery and story podcasts before and they weren’t really my style.
Anonymous
You could revisit a language you once knew – there are podcasts like “News in Slow French” out there.
Anon
Second Audible — recently listened to Dr Brene Brown’s The Power of Vulnerability (audiobook/actually live lectures) during my commute and loved it.
anon a mouse
Do any of your friends have commutes that overlap? I have a weekly morning commute catchup with one friend, and I always talk to my siblings on my drive home depending on their schedules. It helps pass the time and I love hearing their voices.
Equestrian attorney
This. Phone calls with friends, podcasts, Audibles. I also signed up for an industry-specific class and listen to the lectures in my car – not sure if this would apply to you, but it’s been surprisingly great!
The original Scarlett
+1 – I loved commute catchups. I also used to take conference calls from the car, so I’d still be working but driving (depends on what you do of course, but my work is conducive to this)
Anon
I wouldn’t recommend this because even hands-free chatting is considered distracted driving (and yes, chatting with a passenger in the car is also distracting). Obviously it’s unavoidable much of the time, but it’s the safer choice not to sign up for it willingly.
Ms B
This is how I talk to my two besties. They both know when I get in the car to head home; I talk to one while she drives home as well and the other one while she walks her dog or (on Wednesdays) during her son’s therapist appointment. Knowing I actually will have adult conversation that has nothing to do with my job makes me look forward to my Wednesday afternoons!
Anon
I listen to audiobooks, though mostly through my library app (Libby) so they are free.
However, lately, I’ve been just listening to classical music. I studied music in college and somehow got away from really listening to long form music in a concentrated way. I’m finding now that often the news is too stressful and an audiobook is not what I’m I the mood for, listening to a symphony or a sonata or some such is the right balance between concentrating on the road and concentrating on something else.
Anon
I have two apps with my local library that have audio books. One is Hoopla (4 free books a month) and the other is Libby (unlimited but they loan them out like regular books so often popular titles are not available or are on hold). Most libraries are partnered with these apps.
I love Podcasts also.
anon0305
I had a bluetooth system put in my car (if you don’t already have one) and use the time to call up my mom or catch up with friends. I don’t particularly love talking on the phone… but still enjoyed the drive a lot because of this.
CR
I’m obsessed with Louise Penney’s Inspector Gamache novels. (The first one isn’t as good as the rest. A little slow.) You can download fee audio books with your library card.
Anon
I’d like to lose my last 5 lbs, and the issue is that I just eat for recreational purposes rather than because I’m hungry. What are some tactical tips to stop doing this? I work out a ton and participate in a physically demanding sport, so I think that makes me feel like munching isn’t a big deal (and in any absolute sense it’s not) but I am really working on some six pack abs and frustrated that my recreational eating is getting in the way. Anyone have any advice for being more mindful about how much I’m eating and sticking to the regimen?
Anonymous
Get the snacks out of your house. And away from your desk.
mascot
This. I don’t buy the narrative that we need to eat every 2-3 hours so I’ve pretty much sworn off snacks. This also makes me much more deliberate in making the most of balancing my meals while also allowing me to relax a little if I want to eat something more indulgent.
Anon
Track it. I started WW recently and am so much more aware now of what I’m actually eating. I’m also more aware of what an appropriate portion size is.
Anonymous
This. Until I started paying attention via WW I didn’t realize how often I was eating way more than a portion size on a package.
Anon
Are there any “mostly air” snacks that would satisfy the habit, but not really add calories? Like rice cakes or popcorn or puffed vegetables? I started drinking cans of sparkling flavored water, just to have something in my hand, and it’s really helped me cut the mindless beverage-drinking calories.
Katie
Do you drink tea? When I’m trying to cut back on extra snacking, having a cup of tea at my desk gives me something tasty that my mouth enjoys, but no calories that my waistline doesn’t. It also helps with hydration and sometimes helps me feel fuller longer. A few sugar-free hard candies can also help when I want a little treat but they don’t do much damage.
Penny Lane
everything I’ve ever read suggests you have to identify that as a habit and replace it with another one. At those times when you know you’re going to munch (mid-afternoon at work, after dinner, whatever), consciously replace it with, say, making a cup of tea, walking around the office twice, etc.
Anonymous
Are you sure you aren’t hungry?
S
Intentionally develop a taste for healthy snacks. Pickled okra is a great one. I also like thinly sliced cucumbers with a sprinkle of salt. Frozen berries.
kay
I like this one! This is what I do as well. I’d add guacamole, pickles and sugarless chia pudding to this list as well.
Try high fat and lower carb food. My snack craving went away when I went HFLC.
Anon
Your last 5-10 is always hard to lose simply because you are already close to your healthy weight, if that is the situation you are in. So the calories you are burning should be relatively close to what you consume every day already (cal in=cal out). Unfortunately the only way to lose weight is cal out > cal in, so you can either work out more or consume calories at a deficit. In your shoes I would do a combination of both, calculate my TDEE and eat a deficit (no less than 1200kcal/day). If your deficit is too small to see progress (so say you are 5’2, 130 lbs and sedentary and your TDEE is 1400 and eating 1200 puts you at a 200kcal deficit… ~ 1.5lb loss per month), I would supplement with HIIT exercise.
Anon
Does you husband/boyfriend has a strong fetish of certain outfit(s) that you wear? My husband(29M) recently has been asking me(32F) to wear my business casual/formal attire at home, even when we’re having sex. So I has started to wear business formal one day every weekend. Do you think if it’s okay to comply his request like that?
Sorry if this sounds weird. I just want to know if I’m alone.
Anonymous
This is sort of awesome — suits may be cool again if you can rebrand as fetish wear.
Anonymous
Please note: many recent threads have been started about shirts, and particularly collars. I have sensed that these are coming from one person, and the reason has nothing to do with fashion advice or advice for what to wear to an interview. My instinct says this post is by the same person.
Anon
If that is true, then it is not right to involve unwitting members of this site with your fetish. No one else should ever be forced to participate.
tesyaa
Yeah, and it’s funny how many responses his/her threads have gotten! People really like to talk about themselves.
Vicky Austin
I also find the use of (29M) as an identifier to be odd. Most of the time we don’t do that here, and the main place I’ve seen people use that convention is Reddit, of all places.
Plus the grammar errors are very similar to all the shirt posts.
anon
Yes, this is a reddit convention. (32F) is particularly odd here– we know you’re a woman, you’re posting here. Plus, the grammar is off and we usually use LGP/garden instead of s3x.
And yeah, it’s not cool to involve other people in your fetish.
Anon
+1
Cat
lol I am dying that we may have all been inadvertently contributing to some guy’s — preferences — by commenting on business attire. Of all the explanations for the weird number of shirt & collar questions, my mind definitely did NOT go that direction.
Candidate
This is a super weird explanation! I’ve found a bunch of the threads helpful personally, I like a more masc look some days but I also have the sense that collared shirt under suit jacket or blazer was out of style for professional women. I also have interviews coming up so have been thinking about best interview looks. lol what a weird world we live in.
Vicky Austin
To be fair, the fetish factor is new – all the previous shirt posts seemed like an odd sort of poll or market research.
Anonymous
None of those sounded like market research to me. They all sounded like a weird dude sitting in a basement somewhere.
Anonymous
IDK — I feel like we grow up thinking we should wear them, that it is professional, etc.
I was in the Junior League with a woman who just rocked them (and they were some sort of bespoke button-up, with french cuffs, monograms, the works). It took a lot time to accept that my hatred of them was warranted, that they did not work for me, and that that was OK. I donated them and haven’t looked back (but that took until my 30s, after spending my 20s feeling like I was being strangled by the collars).
Keeky
Thank you! The syntax is the exact same. But happy to see that everyone has become fodder for an online fetishist by replying to all of these posts ;)
anon
Maybe this explains it. I can’t figure out why someone would post so many times about collared shirts.
OP- why on earth wouldn’t it be okay to “comply” with a request like this? Live your sex life how you want as long as you’re not hurting anyone (who hasn’t consented to it). <–makes me think you're posting this to get a rise out of people here. Why not just confine your efforts to getting a rise out of your husband.
S
People can really turn anything into a fetish! I wish I had seen some of the older posts, because that is actually hilarious. I guess we’ve been overdue for another E11en!
Miss
Do what you’re comfortable with. It doesn’t matter what other people think.
anon
I don’t think this is weird at all. My husband (28M) hasn’t asked me to wear stuff for that purpose, but he frequently comments on how I’m hottest in my business professional wear because he digs the whole high achieving woman thing. Which is sort of adorable and awesome. I think if it doesn’t bother you and you have a good relationship and he enjoys it, why not?
Anonymous
Yeah this is a real weird question for this blog.
Inspired By Hermione
This makes me sort of kind of super uncomfortable…
Anonymous
This seems pretty vanilla to me as far as a fetish goes. So he is into powerful women? Not uncommon at all. Why wouldn’t it be okay to “comply”? Unless you’re extremely uncomfortable and turned off. If that is the case, DTMFA.
anon
Lol, I just want to point this person to a Savage Podcast (which my husband and I enjoy together on road trips)- their mind will be blown to pieces.
Idea
Any regular reader here knows that business casual and formal attire are two very different genres that don’t get “slashed” //// together!
This is hilarious. Have fun, you crazy kids!
Anon
Haha exactly!
Anon
Exactly!
Just make sure your business formal wear is hand wash or “dry clean,” not “dry clean only,” unless you want to spend far too much money on laundry bills. And report back about anything particular wrinkle – resistant.
Anon
What are your best interview tips?
Anonymous
Stay positive and keep your energy level up. Speak in an even, measured tone and pace – don’t let a fast-talking interviewer make you feel like you need to quickly blurt out the first thing that comes to mind. Think of a couple of “fun” things about yourself to weave into the interview. Basically, act like someone you’d want to work with everyday.
The original Scarlett
Be honest. I’ve heard all the canned answers and things suggested by sites like AAM. I want to actually interview and talk to the person I’m considering hiring. The overly polished/canned/fake answers just make me suspicious and wonder what you’re hiding.
Anon
AAM doesn’t suggest canned or fake answers.
The original Scarlett
What I’m referencing is the kind of answer you find online for “hard questions” that are prevalent in a lot of advice places. I don’t personally like AAM, so maybe I’m unfairly picking on that particular blog, but the sentiment is the same – be real, give real responses that you thought of to questions.
NotAlisonGreenJustAsking
ok I’ll bite – why don’t you like AAM?
Any other career- or job-oriented blogs or advice sites you do like?
The original Scarlett
Eh, it’s not terrible advice overall, but I think it steers people to the middle or to the “expected” way of doing things and it can be great for someone junior or new to the workforce. I like more individuality and honestly, I like people to challenge the status quo and traditional ways of thinking more & I think she takes a conservative view and advocates against that. There’s an art to doing that, of course, and it’s not easy to write a blog telling the masses how to behave at work how to do that. Perhaps it just doesn’t speak to me.
NotAlisonGreenJustAsking
Fair. I get it – basic, entry-level, how-to-be-a-good-employee-or-manager advice, not how to shine or step out or lead. Makes sense! (glad I asked, thanks for answering kindly)
The original Scarlett
@not allisongreene you said it better than I did! That’s it exactly.
Z
It doesn’t hurt to practice your answers to common questions in advance though, or at least find lists of common questions and write down some bullet points about what you’d say. That way you’re bringing more experiences to mind and talk about clearly.
Anon
+1 you shouldn’t have a canned response but it’s good to have a few examples front of mind to reference for common questions. Don’t memorize answers word for word.
anon8
Check out Ask A Manager. She has a free interview guide for download.
anon0305
Practice with a loved one- practice SPECIFIC examples that can be tailored to multiple questions. Youtube Ramit Sethi interviewing videos… they have landed me multiple jobs.
Small Firm IP Litigator
Be honest. No canned answers. Be yourself.
Anonymous
Have good questions for the interviewer. Take notes.
Anon
Hopefully a fun thread – If you could have any career, pretending that they all provide the same salary and decent lifestyle, what would it be? In other words, what is your dream career regardless of how much money it makes?
Housecounsel
Rock star, Beyonce in particular.
Monday
Backup dancer for Janet Jackson during the 90s.
anon
I’d want to work at a garden center. Let me water and tend to pretty plants all day, please.
RegularNonTroll
Oh. a *garden* center. OK.
anon
ROFL. I didn’t even think about how that would read! I swear I’m talking about actual plants!
Vicky Austin
Presenter on America’s Test Kitchen.
Z
Ohhh yes!!
Anon
I would lead kayak tours of wetlands / estuaries somewhere in the coastal Carolinas.
anon0305
Professional icecream/wine/cheese taster or bartender (although the last time I did something similar was in my 20s and I’m not sure I’d have the patience I had then). Stranger advice giver- like dear prudence. Professional walker around towner.
Rainbow Hair
Milliner!
RR
Milliner!
Anon
I’d run a luxury clothing and goods store aimed at women of all sizes. Everyone would be welcome to sit on our plush couches and chairs and have a glass of champagne or tea even if they’re not buying anything. My customers would become friends. I’d travel to Europe a few times a year to find new things for the shop.
Gail the Goldfish
Are we assuming you magically have the skill for said job? If so, National Geographic photographer and/or travel writer. Or horse trainer.
Anon
I’d open a mini golf course. Not really kidding – I’ve run the numbers and written a business plan and it works if I can find the right parcel of land.
Belle Boyd
TV show host on a show like Rachael Ray’s – lifestyle/cooking/fun interviews.
Radio personality – minus all the BS I put up with back when I actually was a radio personality.
Something to do with music in Nashville.
Or, my actual life goal right now: move to the mountains where my family’s camp is, live in a cabin along the river and do voiceover work to pay the bills. Oh, and there’d be critters, lots and lots of critters. I’d get to live in a beautiful place, not really have to deal with people, and love on all my animals.
Flats Only
Secret shopper for luxury hotels and tour companies.
S
Curator/buyer of antique furniture and textiles.
Anonymous
Camp trip counselor. No “adult” job has ever matched that one!
Vicky Austin
I take my original answer back – anything that lets me have the summers off so I can live at camp from May to August.
anon
Yup. Professional summer camp counselor. Sounds great to me! Although I haven’t done this since college and I had way more energy then. I remember not getting a ton of sleep.
Anon
Finish carpenter! Or I’d have a stationery store.
CountC
Butler to my dogs? Honestly, there is no such thing as a dream job to me. I would prefer to never work again and be able to laze about, do my hobbies, and contribute to charity.
I guess maybe a trail running gear tester and promoter?
Senior Attorney
Stranger advice giver, for sure. Preferably on TV or webcast.
Anonymous
Physical therapist. I think my personality aligns more towards helping people, and I really like working out. So it would be literally the best of both worlds. If I discovered my physical therapist anatomy professor earlier than senior year of college I might have actually switched careers that way too, but by then I was too risk adverse and had committed to law school.
Lobbyist
My current career is pretty awesome. But if I couldn’t do this, I’d be a TV pundit on Sunday morning TV shows where I was paid to give my witty opinion about topics of the day, and I’d be a semi professional athlete, paid to compete in bikes and swims. Then I’d also do book reviews on the side.
Anonymous
I would book vacations. I love research different locations and accommodations and obsessively research every trip. I would do it in real like except there’s no $$$ in being a travel agent.
Or staging mid range houses using what people already have. Real estate listing pictures for mid-range listings ould look so much better with basic reorg/better use of furniture or art. Not the kind where they bring in all kinds of furniture but just better using what people already have.
Lilly
Baking cakes and pastries.
Inspired By Hermione
Librarian. I know it’s not all fun and games, but I so want to be surrounded by books every day, recommending books, and helping people learn to love reading!
Anon
Probably what I went to school to be: Art History Professor.
Seventh Sister
It’s a toss up between museum curator (textiles of the 19th and 20th century) and clothes buyer for a high-end department store.
Anonymous
I’ve been seeing a guy for about two months. He has a piano and…well, many books, but one in particular I’d been reading a library copy of that I had to return just before finishing. A couple weeks ago when staying over, I expressed admiration for his piano and he encouraged me to play it. I didn’t because I was rusty and didn’t want to play badly in front of him. We also talked about the book in question, which he loves, and he offered to lend me his copy, but I didn’t follow through then.
This weekend I stayed over again, and he had to go to work earlier than I did. He said it was fine for me to stay until I had to go (I didn’t ask him). In the time before I left (under 2 hours), I finished the ending of the book and played his piano a bit, making sure everything was returned to its original place afterward. Later I texted him that I had done those things, thinking he’d be happy to hear it, but he said he was a bit taken aback and that I should have asked permission first, that I should have known they were private to him.
Did I really mess up? I thought since he offered to let me play his piano and read his book 2 weeks ago it would still be okay if I did so now, and I didn’t want to text him at work to ask about something that seemed clear to me. So I apologized to him but also said I had thought I had permission already from our earlier conversations…and he hasn’t responded. I feel bad and am not sure if I should write again or just let it go. I think of myself as very unlikely to take advantage of others or ask for unwanted favors so I’m surprised and hurt to be in this situation.
Anonymous
This is too weird. He offered to let you read the book, play the piano, and stay in his place. But the combination felt like a privacy issue to him?
Did he somehow think your text was a confession? I can’t understand where his head is at. Did he just backtrack on his decision to let you stay later than him and get nervous?
Anonymous
I don’t know! :( I am glad at least someone agrees that it’s weird. I wondered if he offered those things (piano/book/staying later) when he didn’t really mean them, but I didn’t even ask for them first or put on any pressure or hints about them. He said he was more upset not asking for permission, not the fact that I used them…but I really though I had permission to the extent that it was needed.
Anonymous
I think you did have permission, since all three of these things had already come up. It’s also a social norm that people can look at books that are placed out in a room they’ve been invited into.
It kind of makes me wonder if there’s something in his house he really doesn’t want you to see, and he panicked? Hopefully it will become clearer if you get a chance to hash it out in person! Personally, I’d want to hear him explain what bothered him and why in terms that more more sense to me.
Anonymous
There are love notes from ex-girlfriends in the books and an actual ex-girlfriend in the piano. This guy sounds touchy and high-maintenance, I’d cut my losses
Anonymous
He’s being weird. You apologized once, which was fine, now move on and see if he does.
Ellen
I cannot believe this guy. You’ve slept over a few times, likely in his bed and probably had good $ex, and now he’s worried that you played his piano and read his book? My god, you’d think he’d have been more protective of his flute! I think he may be bipolar, and you will need to sleep with one eye open if you decide to bunk up with him again. I would take a time out from this schlub and let him come crawling back to you, once he figures out that other women simply are NOT going to give him good $ex like you did, and his complaining is ridiculus! FOOEY on him!
emeralds
You did not mess up. You weren’t snooping through his stuff, rifling around in his underwear drawer, or even firing up a laptop where you may have accidentally seen something private that he’d left open–you were killing some time with two things he’d already told you that you could use. He is being super weird, and I would also be hurt if I were in your shoes.
Anon
You didn’t do anything wrong. He sounds super weird.
anon
+1 And possibly very controlling (in an unhealthy relationship dynamic way).
Monday
+1. I consider myself incredibly uptight about my space and my belongings, and even I cannot guess what his problem is. I think you handled it well with your text, and it’s on him to either let it go or explain how this is an issue.
lsw
Agree, this is sort of weirdly alarming to me, too. Like it’s okay if he’s there to observe/control your interactions but not if not? I would have done exactly what you did in that situation and I don’t think it was off base in the least.
Anon
I’d be leaving him, but I am paranoid about any behavior that could lead to being controlling
Lana Del Raygun
I don’t think you did anything wrong, but his response is odd enough that I suspect he’s expressing himself badly, and really means that because these things are special to him he wanted to share them with you, not for you to do them while he was gone, or something like that. Text isn’t a great way to clear up a misunderstanding because tone is so hard to read, but if it’s still bothering you next time you see him I would say something irl.
Anonymous
Sounds like he hasn’t responded to her in over a day. That’s not a texting miscommunication, that’s just no communication.
Anonymous
He’s being weird. I started to say, well maybe he forgot about the prior conversation, but no, neither a piano nor a book that’s sitting out on your bookshelf is “private” even if there had been no prior discussion. If he doesn’t want people fiddling with easily-accessible stuff when he’s not there then he shouldn’t have suggested that you stay there when he had to leave. Like what else is private? His shampoo? His clean towels? His coffee maker? His TV? If you let someone hang out at your house then you have to expect that they’re going to entertain themselves in some not-creepily-snoopy way. Dude sounds like a commitment phobe – he was cool with you spending the night and leaving in the morning but not cool with you being reasonably comfortable in his space.
SSJD
You did nothing wrong. These are bizarre red flags. I might be old fashioned, but the idea that you have been intimate and slept at the home of this person but aren’t trusted enough to play his piano is incredibly strange to me. I would think that physical intimacy and sharing a bed and allowing someone in your home after you leave imply a level of trust that allows picking up a book from a shelf and reading some of it. I don’t play piano so I don’t know if that is a super personal thing, but my kids touch the piano keys of almost every house we visit that has a piano. It never seemed like a super private thing.
Anon
It sounds to me like he was worried you were going to find something he didn’t want you to find.
I probably wouldn’t break up with him over this if he is otherwise an awesome guy but I would definitely call him out on his ridiculousness.
nutella
Yeah, my thought is that he said you could stay until you had to leave, figuring that would be just the time you need to get ready for the day. But because you played piano and read a book, you stayed longer than the 20ish minutes he thought and he freaked out about you being in his home for that long – either due to commitment issues, weirdness over how long that was, or worries about you finding other things in his home.
Anon
You have done nothing wrong and you have already apologized once (unnecessarily, in my opinion) and explained your actions to him. His initial reaction was bizarre, but I would pay attention to how he handles things moving forward to decide whether this was really a miscommunication or is a red flag issue.
Anon
How is reading someone’s book or playing their piano taking advantage? What a weird thing for him to say. You shouldn’t feel bad at all.
Anon
Or on second thought, maybe it was an attempted joke that fell flat?
Anon
Dump this guy. He’s testing you with weird, controlling, gaslighting behavior and is now giving you the silent treatment. Do yourself a favor and get out now. This isn’t going to get better or go away.
Inspired By Hermione
Yes, this. All of this. This is gaslighting, it’s controlling, and it’s putting you in the position of apologizing for something that you aren’t quite sure what you did “wrong.” Get out. Get. Out.
Anon
I think I’d feel weird about it too if I were him. If I said stay until you need to leave I would assume you’d just keep sleeping until you needed to get up, not, like, hang out in my house. It would be the disparity between what I assumed you were going to do (sleep in bed) and what you actually did (hang out, poke around just a little bit) that would catch me off guard. So I don’t think his reaction is totally unwarranted. That said, I do think he owes you some more communication.
Senior Attorney
That’s weird and disappointing. I hope it gets cleared up but I think it’s on him to make the next move.
AIMS
I really like this! Wish I saw it yesterday when BB had 25 percent off for everything. It’s a cool juxtaposition of feminine silhouette and traditionally masculine pattern.
Anonymous
Cute dress, but I am on a dress moratorium until I wear a few things out.
Anon
Eh I saw a woman wearing this dress silhouette yesterday with a short jacket and I thought it looked weirdly outdated.
Anon
Yeah, I wouldn’t wear this dress with a short jacket, but I would wear it alone. It looks great.
Fix My Face
I am a 30 year old in the LA area and am ready to give injectables a try– I’ve held out for a long while but I am ready to go for it. Interested in any advice about Botox– I have minor horizontal lines on my forehead and neck that I would like to minimize, but my absolute priority is remaining as natural as possible. I don’t want people to look at me and say “Oh, Botox.” Also, I am not quite ready to take the leap on this, but am interested in learning about options for lips. I have extremely thin lips, especially on top, and would love a very natural looking improvement– but my worst nightmare is having the dreaded duck lips. I have booked an appointment with a doctor (rather than a medspa or discount Groupon) who comes well reviewed. Any additional guidance? Thank you!
Suburban
I think the trick with injectables is to go to a doctor that does a ton of them. Mine does nothing but injectables. In my experience, Botox is less of a commitment than a lip injection in terms expense, discomfort , and longevity so I might start with a bit of Botox and consult on the lip injection.
Also, you’ll probably get push back for doing this, especially if you’re honest about it. It makes people angry for some reason but im personally a huge fan of how I look with Botox and don’t mind talking about it. I’ll probably have it done in the next few weeks, get a ton of compliments about how lucky I am to look young, explain it’s botox and people will get mad. Oh well.
Michael Jackson
I was never a huge Michael Jackson fan, but I love Smooth Criminal and the whole Off The Wall album (and maybe also Billie Jean). But, ugh, Finding Neverland has me wanting to wipe that stuff off of my iTunes. I used to excuse it with “that was before he was weird,” like Kevin Spacey/Woody Allen’s earlier work is OK somehow?! At any rate, the ick factor now is just overwhelming with Michael Jackson.
[And, as a parent, I am shocked at how trusting people were of things that ought to set off alarm bells. I know the parents and families of kids that my kid plays with (so is at their house without me). One wiff of “we are in bed with Daddy/Mommy/Uncle Bill/Brother Tom” and I’d be calling 911, not planning more events with them. It explains so much of the Penn State scenario, too.]
Ugh. Want a shower now.
Anonymous
What gets me is that all of this was common knowledge back when it was happening and it was still allowed to happen.
Anonymous
he Preyed on children who didn’t have the benefit of healthy families to protect them.
Anon
+1000 so did the Penn state guy
Idea
He also groomed parents and divided families so that they were no longer healthy – just tragic.
Anon
I don’t know if I would blame it on lack of healthy families. Families can’t protect kids from everything. I know I wouldn’t allow my kids to sleep over at a man’s house when he doesn’t have kids, but it’s important to remember how famous he was and how they probably had no idea anything bad was happening.
emeralds
The NYT had an article a couple of days ago that grappled with that question: “Michael Jackson Cast a Spell. ‘Leaving Neverland’ Breaks It,” by Wesley Morris.
I don’t know what the right answer is, or even if there can be a single right answer. He was an astoundingly talented and important performer and artist. At the same time, he was a predator. It’s up to every individual to decide how they want to handle men like him, and where there personal lines are for separating the artist from their art. And if we removed problematic men from the world’s artistic and literary canon, there wouldn’t be much of a canon left. I’ve never liked Woody Allen’s work, even before I knew he was a pedophile; nor have I ever been a huge Michael Jackson fan, outside of the occasional Thriller arm and getting pumped about Billie Jean. It’s an easy choice for me to wash my hands of both of them and put Michael on my wedding DJ’s no-play list. But there are other artists and writers that I struggle with a lot more, because their work has been more important to me.
I’ve basically decided that I’m focusing the most on active support for women and other historically marginalized artists and writers.
tesyaa
I loved the Cosby Show when it first ran and I can’t watch any of the reruns now, just cannot.
Anon
With the caveat that I have not seen “Leaving Neverland” the Michael Jackson accusations I find are kind of ridiculous and out for money from the family’s estate. Not because the accusations are unbelievable on their face, but time and time again, he’s been accused because he was weird and he’s been found innocent and the victims have admitted to lying. He’s one of the few, especially since he’s been dead and gone, that just seems like an easy attention and money grab seeing as he’s been put on trial in court and the trial of public opinion for darn near 30 years. We get it, he was weird and a bit too obsessed with childlike things, but did he hurt or molest children? The answer seems to repeatedly come up no. It’s convenient for the pockets of the proposed victims and documentary producers to line their pockets on the backs of real metoo victims for an alleged predator that can’t defend himself. Just let his children live their life in peace.
Anonymous
I used to think this (that conformist people were ganging up on a brilliantly talented, wealthy, outlier minority), but there’s actually a lot of official evidence that’s unpleasant to face.
Chi Squared
I did watch the documentary, and found it compelling. I am indifferent to MJ, despite growing up in the 80s/90s. After the documentary, I am 100% convinced that he was a serial pedophile and sexual predator. He got away with it b/c of the cult of his celebrity, people’s preconceptions and biases (such as one of the jurors from the case that went to trial who “didn’t like” the accuser’s mom’s demeanor), and how good he was at preying on vulnerable children and their starstruck families.
Anonymous
I’ve been really surprised by all the people who are defending him and who think these men are lying. Obviously that could be the case, and I’m not necessarily minimizing that. But there just comes a point where you have to decide that there was just no way his behavior was normal. He had all these young boys over all the time. Sleepovers, etc. Guess what, if you’re not preying on them, that is not normal and doesn’t happen. I think the situation largely speaks for itself.
Anon
Anyone that grew up in LA and saw all the trials KNEW THEN that he was a predator. The prosecution just didn’t put on a good case. Great article on this in Slate. I am 40. He’s skeeved me out for decades. DECADES.
Anonymous
+1
Anonymous
The evidence they assembled was damning. It’s not well covered in the media because it requires so much brain bleach.
Anon
In terms of job satisfaction, to what extent is liking/respecting your bosses important? I’m a second year in biglaw and I like the work, but I’m not fond of the partners I work for. This is largely due to personality, the lack of management, and their treatment of and regard for associates. A lot of this is colored by the conversations they have on speaker phone about associates. Because of the office layout, half of the associates can hear these conversations (note: I’m not sure if they know or care about this). The comments are never positive, and they’re unnecessarily harsh–insulting competency, personality, appearance, discussing firing, etc. I think some of this is just venting because I’ve heard negative comments about myself but my review only contained positive comments. Based on this and other factors (management and expertise), I know these aren’t people I want to work for long-term. But I’m wondering to what extent that matters–the work I do is fine, and I’m still learning and growing as an attorney. Does having a favorable view of your boss make your job better? And is that something achievable, or is it merely idealistic? I know what I’m working with at this firm, and I worry that I don’t know how solve for this at another firm.
Anon
I don’t equate liking and respecting. I think it’s really hard to work for someone you don’t respect. I’ve definitely successfully worked for people that I didn’t much connect with on a personal level or have anything in common with. These partners sound really toxic and hard to work for.
Housecounsel
Exactly. It is much more important for me to be able to respect my boss. These bosses don’t sound very respectable.
anon
This is so true. These people sound really toxic, and that’s going to wear on you over time, even if the rest of the job is great. I also think there is some danger in normalizing bad behavior, because that’s the kind of stuff that can mess with your head and follow you into future jobs. Even if you don’t engage in that behavior, you start to see that as normal — and I don’t believe that behavior is normal or OK at all. I have seen this in a colleague who escaped from that environment. It has literally taken years for her to believe that people aren’t talking behind her back and are out to get her. As a result, she is very closed off, which hurts her in other ways.
I currently have a boss that I like as a person but do not have much respect for as a colleague. It has significantly affected how happy I am on a daily basis and makes my job much harder. If she weren’t 12-18 months from retirement, I would be working to get out.
The original Scarlett
Personally, I need both. It’s important to me to enjoy what I devote 40+ hours a week to, and a giant part of that is who I work with.
anon
At my former firm, I primarily supported one partner in a niche practice. He was known for being a jerk. Apparently he treated me better than anyone else who worked with him, but I wasn’t particularly loyal to him as a person. In some ways, I feel like that helped me draw boundaries between work and the rest of my life. I never had to remind myself that work is work, and that’s what they pay you for. I conscientiously did my work, looked for appropriate opportunities for growth, but then didn’t stress it. Some of my peers definitely took things way more personally because (in part) they were convinced that “the firm” cared about their futures. Even with good bosses, “the firm” doesn’t care about you.
Anonymous
I don’t think it’s about liking or respecting. I mean of course work is happier if those two factors are present, but if they aren’t, you can still work there at least for several years. BUT in your case, I’d be more concerned with working for people who won’t turn on me. It sounds like these partners are about to turn on everyone at all times for virtually any reason. Generally speaking — it’s a bad idea to tie your future to people like that. All it takes is one recession — and we’re due for one in the next 1-3 years — and their lack of interest/loyalty means you could be out the door asap. If I were you, I’d casually start looking to lateral. It’s not urgent and you don’t have to stress about it, but just get on a recruiter’s radar.
Anon
This sounds like a very toxic environment and similar to one I was in. I didn’t realize how toxic it was until years later/being out of it.
These are people who may turn on you at any point in time. I would not count on their support or help with your career.
I’d start a casual lateral search. My guess is you’ll be much happier in a different environment. I know I am. And a lot of your post read to me like something I could have written five years ago.
Anon
Just a note on your performance review, managers are perpetual chickensh!ts. They complain about their reports but never muster enough courage to actually include their criticism in the review because they don’t want to have an uncomfortable conversation. I’ve had waaaay too many conversation about terminating so-and-so, or counseling them out, and there’s not a peep of anything in their personnel file.
...
+1 from an employment lawyer. Those vents are probably more indicative of how they actually feel about your performance than what ends up on your review.
Standard Recruting Practice?
Seeking advice on standard recruiting practice:
Friend is being recruited by an in-house recruiter, who asked for references before she has even gone through the in-person interview process. Friend is reluctant to provide current employers as references, as Friend doesn’t want current employer to know she is job hunting. Friend is also reluctant to provide past employers as references at the prior to an offer/acceptance, because she works in a tightly knit industry (people tend to move around quite a bit globally, and she works for a prominent large company in the industry) and doesn’t want anyone finding out about her job hunt before she decides to accept an offer.
As a side note, she has had a rough time with her current team (issues were poor communication, boss who didn’t like/want to work with outside hires (she’s in a post-MBA role), and general sidelining) and is sensitive to negative feedback due to being employed on a renewable yearly contract basis. She *thinks* she heard her boss mentioning to another team member about “A role in B industry in C country”, which fits the job that she is interviewing for (she admits that she may have misheard), so was concerned that the recruiter may have been talking to people in the industry about her application to the job — they do have some Linkedin connections in common.
QUESTION: Is it standard practice to ask for references in the pre-interview/pre-offer/pre-acceptance stages — I note that the recruiter is based in Singapore (so understand that it might be regional practice), but advice on standard hiring practices would be much appreciated. Is Friend being unreasonable in her reluctance to provide references at these stages?
Also, is she being paranoid with regard to possible office gossip/how it could affect her contract renewal? Would appreciate any advice on whether it would be acceptable to push back on the request for references/possible unofficial contacts in the industry (word gets around fast), and how to go about it (esp if recruiter insists that they need to check references before making an offer)!
Anon
I am in law in a mid-size city, and this would not be normal for my area. Generally, recruiters/employers only contact references prior to giving an offer. I have anecdotally heard of references being contacted if employers are trying to choose between two people but have never had that happen to me.
I also do not think this is weird to not want her current employer to know about the job search. This is pretty standard. I have never used a current employer as a reference. Actually, for my most recent position, they did not call any references. (They knew the people I worked with pretty well and generally assumed that if I’d worked for them for as long as I had then I must be decent at my job.)
Anon
I think saying that she’d rather not advertise that she’s looking and will happily provide references once things progress farther is perfectly acceptable and common.
Anon
I don’t think you get to withhold references until an offer. Reference checks are a part of the decision making process. I certainly wouldn’t give somebody an offer before checking their references and if they told me they wouldn’t give me reference info until an offer was made, I’d just move on to the next candidate.
Equestrian attorney
Agreed, but I also think it’s fair to not give references until you passed the in-person interview stage.
LAnon
It is not uncommon to check references before making an offer. People often do not list their current employer for the reasons stated but should be able to provide other references. I would find it surprising if a candidate said that they did not have any references who could be trusted to not gossip about them. I think your friend may be feeling a little bit of a “spotlight effect” – that she thinks everyone is paying a lot more attention to her than they are. A recruiter would not randomly discuss who had applied for a certain role because they would not want to jeopardize hiring someone they want. Unless she is either a very prominent person or in a very prominent role, it’s unlikely that people care as much about her applying for this role as she thinks they do.
Anon
+1 People always think everyone is paying way more attention to them than is really true.
Betty White
This is a bit specific, but any NYC peeps have a recommendation for a chill restaurant where I can celebrate a special occasion with a group of five? Open to any cuisine, but want a place where we won’t feel rushed, where the cocktail/wine menu is great, and where we won’t run into any St. Patricks Day revelers (looking for a March 17 reservation). Thanks!
Ms B
Not full time in New York any more, but I like Esca after 7:30 pm (once the pre-theater crowd leaves) for this. The cocktail selection is not broad, but the wine list is strong (I would get the 2004 Gravener, personally) and I recall that their somm is very good. Also, with five you can get the large whole branzino, which is a treat.
Senior Attorney
+1 to all of this. Love Esca and once I observed the somm being just ridiculously lovely with a very young couple who were asking questions like “is Sauvignon Blanc red or white?” and making them feel respected and special. Also they make a mean Manhattan.
NYCer
I have generally been able to get reservations for a group at Narcissa. It’s at the Standard in the East Village, but the restaurant itself is very chill and the food is great. The may be some St Patty’s day revelers in the general vicinity though…
A bit old school, but I always enjoy Locanda Verde in Tribeca as well. A few other random suggestions: Augustine, Claudette, Alta, Bar Boulud, Lafayette.
Katie
Just FYI – because the 17th is a Sunday, the parade will be on the 16th (Saturday) instead, so most of the revelry will be on Saturday.
OP
Oh thank God! :)
Anon
Locanda Vini e Oli in Clinton Hill, Tinys & the Bar Upstairs in Tribeca, Frankies in Cobble Hill
...
llama inn in BK. delicious, fun and great cocktails.
OP
Sorry to respond so late in the day, but thanks so much for all of the great suggestions!
Anon
Friend drama. It has become clear that someone I thought was a casual friend has been intentionally excluding me from friend group stuff – most recently our mutual friend asked why I didn’t come to her birthday lunch. The person in question organized the lunch and the mutual friend specifically asked her to invite me, but I was not invited and didn’t know about it – and it has happened too often to be a coincidence. The lunch was a group of 4 people including the birthday girl so it’s an obvious and intentional snub.
I have no idea what I did to piss off this person. I have other friends and a life but I do like two of the people in the friend group really well, so I guess I will continue to be friends with them outside the group.
Since we all work in the same industry, I know I have to maintain a friendly professional demeanor around this person. But would you unfriend her on Facebook? I don’t really love seeing her salty face pop up when I’m on. If I unfriend her, won’t her Facebook page start showing me under “people you may know”?
Sorry I know this is petty AF but I’m nursing hurt feelings and resentment.
anon
You don’t need to unfriend on FB, but you can unfollow if you want to stop seeing her posts.
Anon
No advice on the actual situation, but anyone who annoys me on Facebook just gets unfollowed. This removes them from my feed. Then I literally never have to see them again as they won’t show up under “people you may know” since we’re technically friends
anon
Also, I think if you unfriend someone (like an ex), fb knows not to put them in the people you may know list. Their new gf, on the other hand, may show up. Super awesome.
anon
I don’t think this is accurate (unless it very recently changed). I shamelessly defriend people – none of this hiding business unless it’s a cousin who i just legit can’t unfriend because blood and holidays – and people show up as recommendations to me all the time.
Anon
All my ex boyfriends constantly show up- we were definitely linked as dating on the site, broke up and Unfriended one another (back when people put stuff on fb). I actually find their ‘friends you may know’ algorithm incredibly stupid.
Junior Associate
Oh that sucks. Sorry you’re dealing with this, I would be so angry and hurt. She had no right to mess with your friendships.
To answer your question: I would 1) unfollow her (to avoid seeing her posts) 2) but not unfriend (unless I want to – and can afford to – make a statement, which you might not be given you work in the same industry. Also to keep her from popping up on people you may know). 3) I also keep a customized facebook privacy setting, for groups of people I don’t want to be close to at a personal level but can’t afford to unfriend (bosses, that weird guy from college who happens to be a resource in the industry, etc.) — they can’t see any of my posts/pics.
Anonymous
I would probably ask this person – in person – what happened with the birthday thing? She’ll probably say she flaked or something but I would still ask. Also suggest (to more than just her) that invites should be through some medium that everyone can see who is (and isn’t) invited in case someone is left off accidentally. Also, you can unfollow her on fb without unfriending.
LAnon
+1 – ask her about this before you do anything else. Don’t be super confrontational but just say, “Hey, Mutual Friend told me she was bummed I missed her birthday brunch! I was bummed too because I actually didn’t even know about it.” And then just see what she says.
Is there any possibility of a miscommunication – like she sent an Evite and it went to your spam folder, or she doesn’t actually have the right email/phone number for you, or something like that? Are you sure your mutual friend was as explicit as she thinks she was in wanting you to be invited?
Anon
I didn’t want to be too specific because i don’t want to out her, but it’s clear I was intentionally excluded. The birthday girl followed up with the organizer and it is confirmed.
Anonymous
You can hide her from your newsfeed if you don’t want to actually unfriend her, then she won’t show up when you scroll.
anon0305
just an fyi- you can unfollow on fb without unfriending.
anon
Unfollow her on fb and dismiss her from your private/personal life. Keep her in your professional life if you think you need to/it will benefit you.
Anon
I had a friend that did this to me in college. We were actually roommates when it happened. (Was related to some boy drama that she never told me about. Just stopped talking to me, and I found out what was wrong months later from other people.) I don’t really know the right way to handle this because my decision to be the bigger person and be friendly still resulted in me not being invited to a lot of things with my friends. I’m also not sure there is anything I could have done to resolve the situation with this girl. She later did the same thing to other people in our friend group, and looking back, she was very controlling of our friendships with each other and fairly manipulative. So, I’m not upset that I’m not friends with her anymore, but I do regret that I wasn’t able to salvage some friendships from that friend group.
Ms B
Brooks Brothers: Why have sizing for 16 petite on your size chart but literally zero items in that size available for purchase? Is this something to watch for, or just bad marketing?
Houda
I am 4 petite and they have had the same 15 or so items on the website for years. Very frustrating
Anon
I am so unhappy in my job that it’s making me physically ill. This is my second job in the industry and I know I need to get out of the industry all together. I hate what I majored in (criminology) and feel like I’m only qualified for this niche area and that I’ve backed myself into a corner. How do I start over without going back to school? I feel overwhelmed.
you're ok
If you are physically ill, please feel ok to quit your job. Go to your doctor. Get some psych medicines. See a therapist.
For job, when you are able, talk with a career counselor or career-minded friend about the skills you have – analysis? problem-solving? and in what industries those are applicable – and where it’s easiest to get into. For you, maybe a paralegal or legal assistant job to start with, or some research analyst positions. It’s not too late!
It IS overwhelming but baby steps will get you there.
Anonymous
You will get through this. You’ve taken the first step, which is recognizing that your current industry is not for you. Now you can work to find one that is a better fit. This can be a long process, so prepare yourself for that. However, if you’re physically ill, I’d consider taking a leave of absence (and a loan if needed to make that happen). Your health and sanity is not worth it. This can get to a bad, bad place quickly if you try to “tough it out” too long. Use any and all resources you have to take care of yourself – employer’s EAP, your regular doctor, a therapist, friends, family. When I was in a similar position, I also used a career counselor, which was incredibly helpful. In terms of a new industry, I suggest checking out linkedin or other industry job sites to see what appeals, and then get the training required to get those jobs. The fact that you’re talking about your major suggests to me that you’re young; know that you DO have time to make a change and that there is a lot in front of you. I made this kind of change (left BigLaw and practice altogether), and I’m not young. Symptoms of illness I didn’t even realize I had disappeared. It was a long and often painful process to get there, but I am so glad I pushed through and I am so much better on the other side. Good luck to you!
Anon
Can you let us know what you do now and about where you are in your career? (If you are in your late 20s or early 30s, it’s actually a good time to find a new career. You have enough experience that you know how to operate in the professional world and don’t sound like a flake when you explain why you want to move, but aren’t so advanced that you won’t get a long stretch in a new field.)
What skills do you have that are transferable?
Are there “adjacent” areas that you can transfer into?
Do you have a mentor in your industry whom you can speak to about potential other jobs?
anon
what do you do within your field? no matter what your current job is you likely have some transferrable skills that can be used in a variety of fields. what do you hate about your job and your industry? what industry or job do you think might appeal to you? how many years out of school are you? many institutions offer alumni career services free of charge.
Anonymous
Do you have a bachelor’s in criminology or a master’s? What are you doing now? What courses did you take in quantitative methods?
There are lots of jobs for which someone with a criminology degree and a quantitative background is qualified. You could work in the research department of a state administrative office of the courts. You could be a case manager in a court clerk’s office.
Senior Attorney
Gently, a lot of us felt that way early in our careers. When I was a young lawyer I wanted to chuck it all and be an elementary school teacher. (Ironically, my mom was an elementary school teacher and she says she felt the same way early in her career.) I don’t know how long you’ve been working but things are just tough for the first couple of years in most professions. If you’re less than two years in, I’d really suggest giving it a bit more time before throwing in the towel.
Cl
Even though it may feel narrow, you can spin and apply a degree in so many ways! Since you’re just 2 years in (this is nothing in the grand scheme of things) you can still EASILY change the path without having to go back to school. I’m sure you could work anywhere from policy, to research, consulting, insurance etc., no? Just leverage that degree and go ahead and apply! I’m in consulting and we hire people for entry level type positions coming from all kind of backgrounds but they’re all young / recently graduated (0-3 years or so of experience). Once you become more senior in your niched industry, this will be so much harder, so get going. Work shouldn’t make you physically ill.
CI
Sorry – I read second job as second year but my thought are the same either way.
Anon
I really need to stop biting my nails. It’s embarrassing, I’m an adult, and it’s time. I know I won’t bite them if I get a gel manicure, so keep telling myself I’ll grow them out enough to get one, but I can’t even stop myself for that long. Any suggestions are welcome!
anon0305
I get gel manicures regularly on short nails & think that is more in style- go for it! Also, there is bitter tasting nailpolish you can buy that will taste gross when you do biting.
anon a mouse
Get the gel manicure even when short. Get another one in 2 weeks when they are longer. Repeat.
Take the hair & nails vitamins because the manicures will soften your nails underneath.
lemon
You could try getting a “dip” manicure which is similar to gel but makes your nails thicker. I’m sure I’m not explaining it well, but you can find info easily. It makes my nails so thick that it’d be impossible to bite them down. And bonus, it lasts for 3+ weeks instead of the 2 with gel alone.
Anon
I have short gel-manicured nails. You don’t have to wait for them to grow out. Do it now! Or get acrylics for a while until your real nails are longer.
Lana Del Raygun
Here’s my grand unified theory of nail-biting, based on twenty-some years’ experience doing it myself: you bite your nails because you want to, and you aren’t going to stop unless and until you want to stop *more than you want to keep going*.
Get the gel manicure now, apply lots of hand cream, take care of your cuticles, and compliment yourself on your pretty nails; hopefully you will enjoy having nice unbitten nails enough that you’ll want to keep them more than you want to bite them.
Anon
Clip them short and file them with a crystal nail file so that they’re smooth.
Cat
Just get the manicure now. If I have unpolished nails, I am definitely tempted to bite. But with a fresh mani I don’t want to ruin it, so I don’t. Even if you feel like your nails are too stubby, you have to start somewhere to help them grow, and you’d be surprised how fast nails really grow when you leave them completely alone.
JuniorMinion
Nailbiter from the age of 10 until recently. For me it was an anxiety response. I picked my cuticles as well and I noticed upticks in these behaviors during stressful life periods. What worked for me was 1) Trying to minimize pressure / stress on myself other than the immovable (ie work stress is work stress) 2) Trying to develop other coping mechanisms for my stress – calming cup of tea, walk up and down the stairs, go outside for 2-5 minutes 3) Outside of work hours I chewed a lot of fun gum flavors 4) As soon as my nails were almost long enough I painted them. I didn’t ever find the bitter nailpolish worked for me because I didn’t like biting them it was a soothing self sabotage ritual / response to anxiety for me. Even if they tasted bad the act of doing it made me feel better.
Best of luck – I feel like people look at nail biting as some sort of childish habit / lazy thing you are doing because you want to. For me though, it went in the same category as people who pull their hair / pick at their skin and I didn’t have much success until I was able to address at least some of the root cause.
Suburban
I have powder gel nails- the first time they do a little extension so your nails are longer. It’s pricy but worth it to me. I go once every three weeks for a fill. It’s not everyone’s style but I’m from Long Island, land of nails, and a longer than the fingertip nail in a pinky nude reads classic to me. I can’t get my actual nails to look this good for all the cuticle oil and biotin in New York.
Anonymous
What’s your ideal amount of texting with a new love interest? I’m talking to one guy who texts too much and one guy who doesn’t text enough. I feel like Goldilocks!
The guy who texts too much – he initiates contact several times a day at all hours. I can never initiate conversation because he texts so much. He also responds to my texts immediately. I do not; it might be several hours or the next day until I get around to texting back. I prefer very short texting conversations, so I’ll excuse myself when he wants to go on and on.
The guy who doesn’t text enough – he told me in person that he’s not a big texter. I thought I wasn’t either but I’m pretty smitten and I really miss daily contact. When I see something funny that I think he might like, I find myself holding back because I don’t want to always text first. I’m starting to feel like he’s not interested because he can go days without wanting to even say hi. He’s very attentive in person, though. Idk if this is something that will change over time or no… I just feel a little ridiculous to be so concerned about it! Especially when I’m annoyed at the other guy for texting so much!
Broadway help
I’m taking my 63 year old mom to see a broadway play in NYC in a few weekends. Any recommendations for good Italian restaurants near the theater district? She wouldn’t be against more commericial options that serve bigger portions.
Mrs. Jones
Becco is good.
Anon
+1 I love Becco for theater meals. It’s also pretty reasonable, including their $33 wine list (I miss the days when it was $25…). It gets pretty jammed so make sure you make a reservation.
Theguvnah
Honestly, I love Carmine’s for that.
Anonymous
Suggestions not to go crazy on a soft food/liquid diet? I did an idiotic thing and sprained my teeth via tripping and falling this weekend and am probably looking at 2 weeks until I can have salad. I had gotten really used to a paleo/mediterranean diet over the last year with roasted vegetables, salads, baked chicken/potatoes, and occasionally korean food like kimchi and beef stews.
For the last 4 days all I’ve had are protein shakes (vegan protein, spinach and blueberries, almond milk), Ensure, ice cream, and if i’m pushing those boundaries, Indian curry takeout. I also got sick the same weekend and haven’t had time to cook my own Instantpot curry.
Just choked down a Starbucks breakfast sandwich on the half of my teeth that are not sprained and am about to go crazy. Is there something I can buy, short of baby food, that will at least take me through to this weekend so I can cook?
Anon
Soup!
Anonymous
Bah, time to stock up on Campbell’s jarred soup I guess X_X
Lana Del Raygun
Wow, I’m so sorry! I had no idea teeth could get sprained. I would look for congee recipes with thick broth and super soft/stewed meat.
Anonymous
I am really dying to know, how did you “sprain” your teeth? They aren’t a muscle? Was it your jaw?
Inspired By Hermione
I also have this question.
Oatmeal with peanut butter, soft baked potato or sweet potato, soup, pho, rice (may be pushing it), mac and cheese (not paleo, but soft).
Anonymous
Hi, this is OP. Tooth “sprain” is the colloquial term and I didn’t know it existed, but apparently the medical term is “subluxation” of the tooth ligaments or “mild laxity.” There are ligaments, they don’t behave the same as muscle ligaments, but nevertheless they exist and hold the teeth between the jaw/for use. I am neither a doctor nor a dentist but am a PI lawyer by day, and as far as I understand that’s how the oral surgeon at the ER explained it to me.
Basically, I tripped while running and skimmed the ground with my lips open. So the tooth took a partial impact and bled for about the first 15-20 minutes, which was enough to make them a tad loose but not enough to break them. This is what I get for trying to work out on 3 days of 5 hours of sleep each I guess.
Lana Del Raygun
Oh man, “skimmed the ground with my lips open” sounds like an absolute nightmare horror show. I’m so sorry.
Anonymous
Sorry … that sounds awful. Apple sauce? Yogurt? Avocado? Mashed potatoes? Cottage cheese?
Anonymous
When my daughter had her wisdom teeth out she lived off of egg drop soup from the local chinese restaurant. I also made her potato soup which she ate.
Anonymous
I will have to look into egg soup. Getting really sick of sugary things, even if I regularly took protein shakes for breakfast before this.
Agent99
I had a similar situation last year and got so, so sick of sweet milkshake type things. You want vegetable soups. Actually any soups should be fine, depending on how much you can chew. Bean/lentil soups will be filling and savory.
Anonymous
Hi, it’s OP again. I just went and half chewed/half slurped down a Chipotle bowl with white rice, pinto beans and carnitas. I feel so much more alive even if my teeth paid a little soreness.
It’s a little crazy at work these days but I will absolutely stop by like a…Wholefoods or Ralphs to stalk them for bean/lentil soup. I’m a regular exerciser who’s used to more like 1800-2000 calories (am also tall at 6′) so I’ve been waking up at night to eat white bread out of desperation.
Anon
If you live near a Zoup, pay them a visit.
Anonymous
Wow, I have never heard of Zoup, but I just looked and they don’t exist in CA.
pugsnbourbon
When I had gum surgery I ate a lot of very soft scrambled eggs, plain Greek yogurt, soup, cottage cheese and those little mixed veggie baby food pouches. The pouches sounded really gross but they actually weren’t too bad and I got my veggies.
I hope you recover quickly!
Anonymous
Wow sounds good! Are the baby food veggies with the regular baby food? Its almost laughable how much I want vegetables. I guess I’ll go make a big thing of soft eggs tonight and season them well, nobody said I couldn’t have hot sauce.
I already put home made kefir into smoothies and cream in my coffee so I’d like to hopefully pass on the other dairy stuff.
bb law discount
years ago i received a state bar Brooks Brothers discount. has anyone used this? is it worth it to try and dig this back up?
anon
Did anyone get one of those crazy southwest hawaii deals yesterday? It just didn’t work out for me because I’m having surgery soon + recovery … but please tell me about your plans so I can live vicariously through them. :)