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And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
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- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
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- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Core Exercises
I have a really strong upper and lower body, but I realized recently that my core is pretty weak, and that’s probably because I generally don’t like doing ab exercises. I don’t think I’ve ever disliked a form of exercise before, and honestly, a lot of it is probably because I’m not good at them. Any suggestions for core building exercises that aren’t too difficult and are easy enough to do that I won’t be demotivated by how weak I am? Normally I just dive into the most difficult, high intensity options I can find, but that isn’t working with the core stuff and my supreme lack of motivation and/or discipline on this front.
Anonymous
Are you looking for things to add to your exercise routine or a class that’s more core-focused? Yoga and aerial yoga are great for core strength. If you have a strong upper body, aerial yoga would probably be pretty easy for you to pick up and, ime, is a better core workout than a mat-based class.
X
I have an app on my phone called Best Abs Fitness. You can schedule it so that it alerts you. Mine is currently scheduled for 6:00 pm MWF.
You can choose how long to workout and the rest interval. I usually choose 15 minutes with 30 seconds of rest between each workout. You even get the choice of straight abs, obliques or both.
I really like it. I’ve also got the Best Arms Fitness and Best Bu!! Fitness apps.
anonshmanon
For core strength, I found pilates very helpful. It can be very hard when you start with a weak core. If you take weekly classes, you definitely notice results after a few weeks. Besides accountability, being in a class also helped because I saw that apart from the coach, everyone was struggling with the exercises (so I didn’t feel bad about myself).
My motivation correlates strongly with the coach.
shadow
+1 re pilates! It’s great for core workouts
Ellen
Nice top, Kat and Kate, but something I would wear out at night after work rather then AT work. As for the OP, I recomend Tai Chi, which is NOT strenueus. There should be tai-chi people near you to help. When I was dateing Sheketovits, he used to laugh at my belly, telling me I needed to do sit up’s, but I said FOOEY to that. Beside’s, who was he to laugh at me, with his beer gut? He said that with our mutueal gut’s, we had dificulty “connecting” conventionaly, if you know what I mean, so we wound up doing other stuff that did NOT put us faceing each other’s belly. That was fine by me b/c of his alchohol breathe which was disgussting.
Anyway, I tried tai-chi in Central Park, and it was great. I think my midriff got alot firmer, and even tho I am NOT with Sheketovits any more, I continue with my tai chi instructor. He is great! YAY!!!!!!
Anon
Planks and Russian twists with a kettebell have felt pretty tolerable to me and you can do them at home. Planks are nice because it’s easy to measure your progress with holding it for longer.
Laura B
+1 to planks, and planks variations. Mix up plank holds, side planks, dolphin planks, and then stepping your hands out to the sides one by one during planks. Oh, and also when in a normal plank hold, dip your hips side to side – the first time I did that in a yoga class I just about died the next day (in the abs hurt so good way).
Definitely time your planks, too, to see your progress. I didn’t realize how long I could hold it until I got in a dumb bet with my husband one night, and he timed me. Except he kept lying about how long had passed, and so what I thought was 1 minute ended up being 3.5 minutes – now I know I can hold it that long!
CountC
You’ve gotten good suggestions so far. I would also recommend trying to engage your core throughout the day. For example, while I am sitting or standing at my desk, I engage my ab muscles and hold and release. I also catch myself slumping and use my core to sit up straight making sure I am engaging my ab muscles. It’s not going to make your abs amazing on it’s own, but it will compliment the other true workout/exercises you are doing. Think about pulling the muscles back to your spine for engagement – or at least that’s what I do!
Anon
Rock climbing works your core if you’re doing it right, and is fun enough to be motivating, if you like it.
Bonnie
You can also target your core in exercies you already do by using a Bosu or balance ball. Stability exercises will make your body use your core more.
Anon
I like Pilates for core work and Jillian Michaels Ab videos are hard, but doable.
pilates
I second Pilates – but then again ab workouts are my favorite.
If you want to work your abs while working other body parts though, up your weight and work one side at a time. If I do bicep curls with 5lb weights with both arms, I’m balanced. But if I do 10lbs or 15lbs and only one arm, my ab muscles engage to stabilize me. Full body moves like burpees also target your abs without be a specifically “ab” workout. The pushup/plank pose works your core, and jumping your feet in works the lower abs.
Anonymous
Also, don’t forget that your core also includes your lower back. Don’t overtrain your abs while neglecting the lower back.
anon
I’m right there with you. I find working w/ the TRX fun (and challenging). Like TRX planks, crunches, pikes, etc. Supermans out of the TRX for lower back. Windmills (with kettlebells) for obliques. And an interesting challenge my trainer always has me do. Lay flat on your back (legs in the air) and take note of the position of your lower back. Slowly lower your legs as far as you can without letting your lower back change position (don’t let it arch or flatten out). Keep working on that to be able to lower further towards the ground while keeping your back aligned. That is a good one because you get to see your progress. Side medicine ball throws against a wall (for obliques). That’s all I can think of off the top of my head.
Stormtrooper
I often do my upper body while sitting on a ball. This engages your core while doing upper body lifting that you seem to like, so not a huge change. I’d still add in some plank work.
Core exercises
Thanks all. On a semi-related note, I’d really like to get a stability ball to use as an office chair. Does anyone have experience with this or find it helpful for building ab strength (or anything else, for that matter)?
big orange drink
I tried the Gaiam balance ball chair (amazon) and ended up returning it. I did not find that it helped strengthen my core and in fact it caused a lot of pain in my hips and bu!!. In doing some googling to see if those pains were common with ball chairs, I found several credible articles that claim these chairs do not build core strength.
Spirograph
I don’t know about stability balls as a way to build core strength (at least just by sitting on them), but I do find them really comfortable and preferable to normal chairs. Mostly because I fidget and it makes me happy to be able to bounce and roll a little while I’m glued to my desk. Just like any chair, you need to watch your posture/alignment.
CountC
I finally did something fun to my hair again and it’s making me happy every time I walk into the bathroom and look in the mirror. I have deep red hair (dyed) and my stylist colored it in an ombre style, so it starts getting lighter around my ears (bra strap length hair).. It’s not so blonde at the ends that I can’t wear it down to work though. She did a great job. Extra bonus is that I can go one or two hair cuts without having her lift the ends again and just touching up the top on my own, saving me money.
It’s the little things!
Moonstone
That sounds super cute!
Laura B
That sounds cool! I’ve been pinning hair colors this week – I think I’m going to go to a much lighter ombre next time. Right now I’m medium brown to blonde, but it’s pretty subtle. I think I want to try out a strawberry blonde overall color, and now I’m trying to decide on ombre or not.
CountC
Thanks all! I had been dying the all over deep red myself for a while, but now that I work in a casual-leaning business casual workplace, I felt I could do something a little more fun. It’s not the stark dark red to white blonde that you see on pinterest, but you can absolutely see the lightening. I LOVE LOVE LOVE it and have gotten a lot of compliments on it today!
I say, go for it Laura B!
Devil incarnate
I have a hard time making friends because I’m always working and I’m just not that outgoing. I’ve hung out with one potential friend a couple of times and I love her to pieces. Recently she’s expressed that she basically thinks people who do the type of work I do – let’s just say generally, work for big corporations – are pretty much evil. I said that I feel like I do more good than a lot of plaintiffs’ lawyers because I can advise my client if they’ve done something not-that-great and help them fix it and prevent it from happening again. She didn’t really buy it but she dropped it. Now I see that she’s been railing against one of my clients online. I want to jump in and defend my client but of course I can’t and won’t do that.
This is the first time anyone in my personal life has had strong feelings about what I do for a living; generally if I explain what I do, the eyes glaze over and I just talk about beer instead. I feel a little bristly at seeing my work and my clients attacked like this even though I know it’s not personal and I really shouldn’t let my work seep into my personal life. How can I stop my advocate self from getting in the way of what could be a great friendship?
Anonymous
Just ignore her. Change the subject, laugh it off, move on. One of my closest friends think I basically work for Satan. Obvi I disagree, but aside from this one issue she’s a great friend and, like you, I’ve never had the luxury of having so many friends I want to be in a rush to prune. You don’t need to be an advocate with a friend. Her opinion doesn’t matter.
Edna Mazur
Can it be a great friendship though? Do you really want to spend time/energy/etc. having to advocate for yourself and corporate America (or wherever you are)?
I think a moratorium on this kind of talk between you two is the only way to make the tenable. That being said, I can’t imagine being close friends with someone who thinks my work is evil, whether or not we regularly discuss it.
Nati
I agree. I think I would have a hard time maintaining a friendship with someone whose beliefs about something as central as my career were very different from mine. Especially if they felt the need to talk about those beliefs frequently.
OP
I don’t know yet whether it will be a great friendship. If I said, “Let’s not talk about that,” and she insisted on continuing to talk about it, then no, she’s probably not friend material. But we’re not there yet and so far there’s been no indication that she’s going to disrespect boundaries. Regardless of how she acts, though, I can only control my own reaction, and that’s what I’m trying to work on for now. I don’t want to be a defensive jerk and I don’t want to harbor bad feelings against someone for expressing her opinion. I have other friends who disagree with me on hot button issues, we just sort of agree to disagree, so I’m a little surprised that I’m struggling so much here.
Nati
I’m personally very invested in my career and in a different way than I am in other hot button issues I care about. So I think your reaction is normal. Good luck!
KT
I worked for big pharma for a while and people acted like I served Satan himself.
Just keep the subject of work off the table
Never too many shoes
I practice insurance defence and I so get what you are saying, KT. Like I just sit at my desk raising their rates and offering to pay $1000 total for the accident that killed an entire family. Come on, people – let’s exercise some common sense.
Anon
I practice a type of law that a lot of people think is inherently evil (big firm environmental and regulatory). Many of my friends (mostly lawyers) get that client’s actions =/= my actions but a lot of non-law friends (especially some of my SO’s) are pretty shocked and will say something to me when they learn what I do. Typically, when I say I do environmental law, I get a lot of questions like “Ohhh, like Erin Brokovich?” And then I have to say, no, like the big fancy lawyers who were working AGAINST Erin Brokovich…
If people are clearly not interested in talking about it on anything more than a superficial level, I usually just laugh, tell them I’m totally evil but that someone has to bring home the bacon and change the subject. I play up the being totally evil thing in an over the top way and people usually just laugh and move on, because that is very at odds with my personality otherwise.
If people are interested in talking about what I do and why, I usually use the same type of line OP does, which is to explain that when clients bring us in, we are giving them advice on how to do better going forward, that everyone deserves a defence, etc. etc, that I feel I have done good things in certain industries. Usually people are like ohhhh okay cool, I get it, and we chat, but they back down. I have had a few people ask very existential questions like do I believe I’m perpetuating global warming and a fossil-fuel based economy by working for oil companies, but I usually say those aren’t things that keep me up at night and leave it there.
I think you CAN have interesting disagreements about issues with people who understand your clients =/= you. I have had great conversations and great friendships with people who I agreed to disagree with over these issues. Obviously you’re not talking about it all the time, but I don’t think it needs to be unspoken or not. If this new friend thinks you are evil (rather than the industry or the clients you work for), then that’s a different story and I think you need to consider it.
Anon
I am a public defender and have been for a decade, so I am really familiar with this. I typically say one time my go-to spiel on constitutional rights, etc and then if it comes up again I just say something like, well you know how I feel about this. If someone really pushes the issue, then we probably can’t be friends. Public defense and the ideas surrounding it are really core to who I am now.
TBK
Not that you were looking for this, but I just want to say thank you for what you do. You work to provide one of the most important parts of our judicial system, and by extension our entire legal and legislative system. You do work that is hard both mentally and emotionally. You could have done something else but you chose this life and I am grateful every day for people like you. You, as much as the prosecutor, are a defender of the people. Thank you.
Blonde Lawyer
+1.
ezt
Yes! I so automatically classify public defense as “noble work” that it honestly shocks me that anyone feels otherwise.
Anonymous
Agreed. And I’m a prosecutor.
Frozen Peach
+ 1 million.
anon
Ha! I spent years in one of the country’s most liberal prosecutor’s offices, and I got it all the time, too. I think in criminal law it’s a lot easier to have that quick spiel than in civil law.
Anon
Isn’t this part of the tradeoff? Aren’t people who work for certain “evil”employers highly compensated? It’s amusing the level of hyperbole used, by say, highly paid finance people in response to regulations, like Nazi, rape, socialism, communism, murder, etc. when there are people who actually risk their life, health and well being on the job.
After all, advocates on the side of the “little people” also face disdain without the hefty paycheck, and those who work for controversial entites, such as Planned Parenthood, are at risk of facing violence. I work for a federal agency and have to interact with government-haters, but the tradeoff is job security.
anonymous
No, we’re highly compensated because the work is challenging and the clients are demanding, and because clients are willing to pay top dollar for people who are highly qualified and willing to work long hours on demand. Not because people are “mean” to us.
I’m also a big law environmental regulatory attorney, with a public-interest past (and hopefully future!). I get a lot of questions like “oh, like Marshall on How I Met Your Mother??” (never seen it…), or people think it’s great that I am “working to save the planet.” It just displays a fundamental lack of knowledge about what regulatory compliance is like. But that’s ok….I don’t expect most people to understand hazardous waste laws or Waters of the United States rules. Most people who work in highly regulated fields know that it’s not black or white, evil v. good. Many people in my field are very public-interest oriented at heart. I actually don’t feel bad about any of the work I do. Our clients are less interested in rule challenges, which might feel worse, but on the whole they just want to figure out how the rules work, how to comply, and how to deal with issues proactively. They want to manage government investigations and potential enforcement actions in a cooperative manner geared toward risk-management, not raising a middle finger to The Man. Fine by me, glad to help! Lay people don’t necessarily get that, and that’s ok. I don’t know the ins and outs of all my friends’ fields. But I do listen when they explain it to me.
I’ve never had a friend actually disrespect what I did. I don’t think I could develop a friendship with someone who accused me of working for Evil, partly because it’s rude, and partly because it displays a lack of nuanced critical thinking.
Anon
Sorry for the lack of clarity. My point is not that the pay is high due to ideas about ethics or morality, but that the tradeoff for the OP is a high salary* in exchange for a controversial job.
*Assumption based OP’s participation in corporette and mention of a corporate job
Anonymous
“No, we’re highly compensated because the work is challenging and the clients are demanding, and because clients are willing to pay top dollar for people who are highly qualified and willing to work long hours on demand. ”
^ ugh, no. please see above, re: public defenders. challenging work, challenging clients, highly qualified, and willing to work long hours on demand. the only difference is that your clients have a ton of money. please don’t equate your high pay with the quality of your work. it’s insulting and inaccurate and i suspect you know it.
anonymous
Ugh, oh please. You know that’s not what I meant and that I was discussing regulatory compliance for corporations as opposed to public defense. Back off. I was responding to her apparent assertion that high pay is compensation for people being mean/doing work that you may not morally agree with.
Did ever occur to you that high pay and the demand for high quality work *can* be related, but are not always? Did you misread my post and assume that I said “we are highly paid because our work is high quality and people who are paid less by definition produce lower quality work?”
Why not just assume best intentions from my post and assume that I’m not trying to insult public defenders/other public interest employees or imply that your work isn’t quality? That’s insulting and inaccurate and I suspect you knew that. WTF.
Anonymous
I didn’t misread your post; I quoted it directly. You *did* say that you are highly paid BECAUSE x, y, and z. You did not say *can, but not always* though I appreciate your later edit, and I obviously agree with it (as was the point of my post), despite its crazy defensiveness and snark. So, wtf to you :)
Anon
Anon at 12:18, I mean that a job at a corporation has pros and cons, and just like high pay is one item on the list of pros poor public perception is on the list of cons. An assumption of general likeability or neutrality based on your employer goes out the window when the entity is controversial.
It is surprising that the OP did not realize that she might interact with people who are not fond of her controversial employer. I assumed that when people sign up to work for a controversial employer, they understand there will be negatives to being associated with their employer.
I hope you can assume the best intentions from my post. It’s not about a tradeoff of two things, but that two things are in larger categories that are tradeoffs.
MargaretO
+1. I probably wouldn’t be friends unless you/she can keep it civil or not discuss it, but this just comes with the territory if you do something even remotely controversial. I’ve faced much worse for far less money (not planned parenthood but similar, I got a lot of death threats).
Anonymous
This doesn’t usually happen to me with new friends, but one of my best friends from childhood is vehemently against the industry of the company I work for.
I generally just don’t engage, but if I met her now, the fact that her husband trekked to NYC to literally protest my industry would probably be a dealbreaker for me, friendship-wise.
anon
If you met her now and she and her husband felt so inclined as to trek to NYC to protest stuff, would you care if she never talked about it, or her feelings on the matter in general? Could you still be friends in that case?
Anonymous
I’m actually into constructive dialogue on the industry, so I think the bigger issue is that he’s actually very poorly informed on the topic, and is combative when we talk about it.
So I guess him going to protest wasn’t the issue, it was more that he’s kind of a band-wagoner on being a justice warrior.
Anonymous
Is he really, or by ‘constructive dialogue’ really just mean talking to people who affirm the corporate?
Most of what has been raised in this conversation doesn’t require ‘nuanced critical thinking’, it’s actually a clash of values.
Anonymous
I work at a firm that works to get death row inmates off of death row, and their sentences commuted to life in prison rather than death. My firm also often represents convicted sex offenders as they deal with appealing their cases and the other various legal issues they have.
If my work comes up in a negative way I simply ignore it or change the subject. It’s not always easy but I really let things try to roll off my back and not argue. I find it takes too much energy. My cousin recently married a woman who was attacked and nearly killed by a sex offender, who was also convicted of murdering other women and she fought for years and advocated for him to be executed. Things can get a bit awkward or heated at family gatherings so I find its best to avoid the subject and to disengage and ignore if it comes up.
Moderation
When is the moderation business going to be fixed on this site? It’s impossible to tell if your comment didn’t go through or to moderation and I’m not entering an email address only to open myself up to spambots. Readers have pointed this out time and time again and nothing ever seems to change. I would submit a bug report, but it’s not a bug.
Nati
I entered an email address for a post earlier this week and checked “notify me of follow-up comments by email.” I had never tried that function before. My post got stuck in moderation. And then I received emails EVERY.TIME. anyone commented. I had assumed that I was subscribed to the one particular thread of interest only.
Help – how is that function supposed to work? Did it just go weird on me because my post was moderated?
Anon
That’s how it’s supposed to work – all comments on the post you commented on.
Nati
Thanks! Definitely misunderstood that.
Elle
I like that idea though! Email comments for a particular thread only would be awesome.
MJ
Agree. I was super-annoyed bc I tried to reply to the Size 12 shoe-hunter yesterday…TWICE…and got eaten both times. It’s not like I am some crazy new commenter. I am a crazy OLD commenter. Don’t they have my IP address by now?
Meg Murry
I think any post without an email goes into moderation, at least any time it is from a new IP address.
FWIW, I created a gmail account related to my commenting name that I use as the email address for here and a few other s!tes I regularly comment on (AAM and a few others) and I’ve not received a single piece of spam from it – and if I did, I wouldn’t care since it isn’t going to my main email.
So if you really don’t want to go into moderation, try using an email address (heck, any email address, just keep using the same one).
Anon
I don’t think that’s true since I never do an email address and it’s really, really inconsistent when my comments get deleted. It’s also highly annoying that the moderators never do anything about this problem. Like another commenter said recently, I’d much rather see this issue get fixed than have a C’rette-approved day planner.
Daisy
PSA: 50% off everything on Ann Taylor today!
NYNY
Do other people have problems with the Ann Taylor webs1te? Both on my office computer (Windows OS, Firefox browser) and my iPad at home (Chrome browser), I either can’t see the images – which totally defeats the purpose of online shopping – or the pages load so slowly that I give up. Is it me?
JTX
If it’s happening at work, your IT department is probably responsible. I have had this problem in the past.
JTX
I’m dumb and should read more thoroughly. Maybe clear your cookies?
NYNY
You’re not dumb. My cookies are set to clear every time I close my browser. Wonder if the s1te uses plug-in banned by IT/not in iOS?
Anonymous
I think it uses a plug-in that’s not supported by Chrome. I always have to use Safari if I want to see images there.
Edna Mazur
Anyone have recommendations about vacations in the Ozarks? Would love a two bedroom modern (kitchen, bathrooms) cabin. Ideally under $200 a night. Near enough a beach to have a short drive to swimming but I don’t want to be right on the water.
Anonymous
Hold up. The Ozarks have beaches?!?
Edna Mazur
There is a lake. I assumed, perhaps naively, that you could swim in it… Or a river with a beach? Is that not a thing there?
Anonymous
No no I’m the naive one!! There prob are. I was genuinely wondering if the Ozarks somehow ran all the way to an ocean . . .
Anon
There are swimming places on the Lake. However, most of the Lake is for boating and as the boats have gotten really fancy over the years, it’s quite the show-off scene.
Lodge of the Four Seasons down there is surprisingly affordable.
Nelly
Are you talking about Lake of the Ozarks, MO? Because my in-laws live there and it is awful. Run away!
Bonnie
I love this shirt, especially in the burgundy.
Best Coast
I’m looking at getting a Groupon for an all-inclusive resort in Mexico as a trip to celebrate my husband’s upcoming milestone birthday. I’ve never purchased travel through Groupon before- what have been people’s experiences? How do I truly vet the resort and ensure I can get dates that I want? And as long as I’m already asking all these questions, has anyone by chance, been to El Dorato Royale and care to share your thoughts?
Anonymous
Vet the resort on TripAdvisor and Yelp. It looks like it has pretty mixed reviews on Yelp, which I’ve found to be a lot more reliable than TripAdvisor. No experience with Groupon Travel but I’ve had a lot of problems with Groupon in general (with businesses refusing to honor them). Groupon is good about issuing refunds, but not sure how that would work with travel.
MargaretO
Not a review website but I have had good luck booking discounted trips on Cheap Caribbean. I like the search function where you can look by price/dates instead of specific location (because sometimes all you want is a beach and unlimited drinks).
Anon
I got so excited about that function but then realized it wouldn’t search for just one person on that particular search.
Meg Murry
The few times I’ve considered getting one of the Groupon or other similar deals for travel, I’ve found that there was a similar rate offered directly through the resort website.
So before buying the Groupon deal, I’d check to make sure you can’t get the same thing through the resort itself. Or you may be able to call and ask if they will price match the Groupon rate – they probably are actually better off giving you the price on the Groupon without having Groupon take their cut.
Anonymous
I’ve been to El Dorado Seaside Suites – good experience. A smaller resort with not a lot of nightlight but that’s what we were looking for.
Never too many shoes
I loved the Seaside Suites. I have done about 15 all inclusive vacays and that one ranks in my top 3 for quality of food. Nightlife at resorts is not a thing I really care about, to be honest, so it impacts my ratings very little. My friends have stayed at the E Dorado Casitas and they also raved, so there is a reasonable likelihood that the Royale would be good as well.
Advice re debilitating menstrual cramps - young teenager
Hi Hive,
My almost 14 year old has really bad period cramps, sometimes (as last night) even 4 days into her period. It seems to come and go though. Last night it was so bad she was crying and wanted me to sleep with her (I can’t even remember the last time she asked me to do that).
I know that some hormonal methods of birth control work but she’s not even 14, and I know there are side effects (disclaimer, I was only on the Pill for a year when I was 19-20. I didn’t like it and it made me puffy, but that was 30 years ago).
We’ve been looking at home remedies. One article we looked at mentioned Vitamin D is large quantities 4 days before onset but she is not really super regular yet, I give her ibuprofen and get her a hot water bottle, it is definitely less debilitating on the days she has dance or martial arts so she knows exercise helps, but that is not an option at 11 pm. The article also mentioned having an org*sm, which was hilarious and awkward. Her face!
I have a call into our MD, but wondering if any of you ladies have ideas of things she could try.
cbackson
How long has she been having her period? Anecdotally I remember my cramps and those of my friends being worse in the first couple of years.
Anonymous
Dear god put her on the pill. If Advil and a hot water bottle are still leaving her debilitated with pain, there is a reason hormonal birth control is the standard treatment not Vitamin D. Your experience for one year 30 years ago isn’t relevant. At all. And get her a good checkup with a gyno to make sure nothing else is going on. Your vague worries are no reason to leave her in pain.
cbackson
Actually, good point – OP, has she had a standard gyno workup yet? It would be worth it to make sure that there isn’t another issue if she’s in that level of pain.
Anonymous
Every girl is different. I had horrible cramps starting when I was 12. Every symptom — vomiting, po0p issues, thighs in knots, lower back pain. It runs in my family.
I did finally go on the pill in college (for other reasons — pls make sure you daughter doesn’t treat this as license to make really bad decisions in a consequence-free zone, just b/c pregnancy is off the table can put every other stinking thing on it). It didn’t really help other than to make it 100% predictable (and it still involved heroic doses of advil throughout the day, something that may not be possible in today’s schools even if carried in a labeled bottle). I basically needed a steady infusion of Advil all of the day before + first 3 days.
I went off the pill at 38 and felt that I could better sense my body’s rhythms then and the cramps weren’t really worse (and I was pretty regular off of the pill), but the non-cramp GI side effects had gone away.
Having children also change things too much.
This aspect of being a kid was just awful and I missed a lot of school growing up. I have daughters and hope that they don’t have these genes from me.
Anonymous
Please put her on the pill! I had similar cramps but because my mom didn’t take it seriously and because my family was devout Catholic, it wasn’t until law school that I got on the pill.
That pain is awful. When I was finally old enough to describe the pain, my mom was shocked–it sounded worse than her labor pains! I still hate to think about that pain.
Please put her on the pill. I am tearing up in sympathy for your daughter right now.
Anon
As a teenager, I also had debilitating menstrual cramps. I would frequently have to take days off school due to vomiting and other digestive distress, would be rolling on the bed in pain, etc. I got prescription strength ibuprofen from the doctor, and used heating pads, but they were not under control until I started taking the Pill at 16. I wish I could have skipped those years of pain prior to that. The pill really changed my life.
They have such low dose pills now for young girls (and bonus, it may help her with things like acne) that I think you should consider it if your MD recommends.
Nati
Yes. Please put her on the pill. It completely changed my life. I was in the same spot as Anon from 10:08.
Anonymous
Pill does not work for everyone. It did little to relieve my cramps and caused me all kinds of side effects including crazy hormone swings, irritability and depression. I went off it and now look back on the year I was on it as one of the worst of my life.
KT
But just because one pill gave you that reaction, doesn’t mean all pills will. I’ve tried 3 or 4 in my lifetime, and only 1 works for me. The others I had horrible spotting and depression, but the one classic is my unicorn.
It’s common to have to try a few different forms until you find one that works.
Nati
Medical scientific studies have found that most women can find a pill that works for them and that’s why it’s the most recommended treatment for this.
Scarlett
Another vote for the pill. I had the same issue with cramps and it was life changing. You don’t have to connect it with s*x.
pilates
Please put her on the pill! I went on the pill at 14 for the period cramps and pain I was experiencing. There are so many options available. I’d also ask about getting an ultrasound of her ovaries, she may have ovarian cysts that are rupturing, which the pill would also solve as it’ll regulate her hormones.
Nati
I’ve been on the pill since that I was that age and never experienced side effects (except positive ones like fantastic skin). I’m not really sure what “puffy” means but it is absolutely possible for most women to work with their doctors to find one that fits them just right. I only needed to try two before I found my match. And I’ve never looked back since. It has made such a huge improvement to my general quality of life.
anon
I assume she was euphemistically talking about weight gain. I lose all ability to gain/maintain muscle and just balloon up and get squishy-fat on hormonal birth control.
Blonde Lawyer
+1.
Blonde Lawyer
Also my very Catholic mom had a really hard time agreeing to me being on “the pill.” I had ovarian cysts too so the other option was surgery. My doctor said she wished they would just rebrand a new drug that is essentially just “the pill” but called something else for menstrual issues to get rid of the stigma. It’s like how Viagra came from a high blood pressure medicine and how some doctors prescribe prozac for pain. People don’t want to be “on prozac” even if it is as a pain killer.
Anon in NYC
Second the recommendation for prescription strength ibuprofen. My cramps in the first few years of my period were horrible.
Anonymous
Dude – I still take 800 mg (4 pills) of ibuprofen for my first day cramps now (at 35). 400 mg (2 pills) doesn’t even touch the pain for me. But it’s usuually just the first 36 hours, then I don’t need anything else.
Snick
+1 on prescription strength ibuprofen, 800 mg. For years I took four over-the-counter tablets, per doctor’s recommendation, for my debilitating cramps. I needed to start taking it at the first twinge, before the cramps really kicked in, and usually only for the first 2 days. I hated being on the pill (only took low-dose pill briefly, stopped due to mood swings) so I’d be wary about putting my teenager on it. OTC pain meds did the job at low cost, no effect on mood etc.
Ally McBeal
Me too. 4 tablets of Advil at the first twinge of discomfort. (Sometimes I took 6. Not advice! Just truth.) For years I carried the Advil bottle around with me in my purse just in case.
You’re a good mom to support her through this. I got my first period when my grandmother was dying and my mom was super checked out. I don’t blame her for it. But I want it to be different for my own daughter.
OP
Thanks, my doc’s office called back and we have an appointment for this afternoon.
I am not against putting her on the Pill. I didn’t have a great experience with it. But as I noted, that was 30 years ago.
I will ask about an ultrasound.
BB
This is just going to echo what everyone else said, but this is EXACTLY the convo between my mom and me when I was 17. I had borderline-disabling cramps for 6 years, and my mom had one bad experience with the pill 30 years ago. She was so against me going on them, but I did it anyway. I LOVE my pills – I get absolutely no side effects and my cycles are not just a random blip. I practically don’t even notice it.
Anonymous
There are multiple types of pills, so just because you have a bad experience with one pill doesn’t mean you will have a bad experience with others.
Anonymous
No advice, but I think you’re a wonderful mama for asking about remedies, and I’ll be following this thread with interest. I used to get horrible cramps during high school — would spend the first 2 days of my cycle vomiting — and my mother just didn’t care. She also wouldn’t let me stay home from school. Now, I have a young daughter, and I would NEVER make her suffer like that!!
OP
Aaaww, thanks. I am dragging my butt today because I did sleep with her last night.
Fortunately she has only missed a few classes (like the first two of the day) a handful of times times due to this. She dances at school every day, and I think that helps.
Never too many shoes
If you need one more anecdata story, OP, here goes….I had similar issues from when I started my period at the age of 11 and missed several days of school almost every month for *years*. My mother did not want me to go on the Pill because it was “bad for you” (this was the mid 80s). It never got better. I was prescribed Naproxen (anti-inflammatory) which helped a bit. Fast forward almost 20 years – I got diagnosed with PCOS and put on the Pill and my life changed immeasurably for the better. My period arrived regularly with far less drama and I truly mourn all the years that I suffered. If it doesn’t actually help your daughter, and it might not, she could just stop taking it…but if you never try, how can you know for sure?
Anonymous
Hahaha when I had terrible cramps as a teenager, my mom who otherwise NEVER talked about $ex told me about the org*sm thing and told me I could self-garden to relieve my cramps. I was MORTIFIED. And fwiw, I still have bad cramps as an adult and haven’t found that old wives tale to be particularly true. The best thing for me is the maximum dose I can take of extra strength Tylenol. Calcium and magnesium are supposed to help, so make sure she’s drinking lots of milk and eating bananas. I like to drink hot tea and then I can hold the tea mug against my abdomen so it serves both the “hot drink” and “hot water bottle” functions. My old dance teacher told me that there are some positions you can sit in that are supposed to relieve cramps, like lying on the floor with your legs elevated and your knees bent at a 90 degree angle.
Definitely see a doc though. She may have endometriosis, which can require surgery.
OP
Yeah, she was totally mortified, LOL. Her face when she read that was priceless.
MargaretO
Another mortifying idea – marijuana is the only thing that makes any difference for me (even now as an adult). I had the full set of symptoms – debilitating cramps, horrible gastro issues, vomiting, even fever, and that is the only thing that made me feel better when I had my period. There’s probably no way you would be ok with this but…any chance you have medical marijuana in your state? My other controversial suggestion is a hormonal IUD. Once I got one I stopped getting my period besides occasional cramping and spotting once every few months (probably half a day of misery 4 times a year) and it improved my life so much. I was 19 when I got it, I wish a gyno had suggested one to me earlier. If you’re concerned about her having one at such a young age check out the Colorado program to give IUDs to teenagers – here’s an article about it: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/06/science/colorados-push-against-teenage-pregnancies-is-a-startling-success.html?_r=0.
Amberwitch
I’ve had the same experience with hormonal IUD – next to no period, and no more pain. Recommended!
Laura B
I’ve never heard of this (org*sm for relief) – hilarious!! Usually I try and stay out of that area when it’s that time of the month but I might have to try something next time just to see.
Anonymous
That is not true for everyone — I tried that once and it just made things accutely worse.
I thought that if I ever birthed a baby it would come flying out — stupid muscles contract too d*mn hard
Anonymous
just put her on the pill. Crying is way worse than puffy. Cramps in the early years of menstruation are the worst.
Anon
My sister and I both went on birth control at 14 for this reason. FWIW, I didn’t have s*x until I was 18, so putting her on the pill has no correlation with that and isn’t necessarily going to make her think you are condoning that (not saying you are or are not). I was on it for 14 years with zero side effects and went off it when we started TTC and got pregnant within 2 1/2 months. I know that isn’t everyone’s experience, but the pill works wonders for a lot of women.
Suggestion
In the UK they used to put teenagers on me phonemic acid before they tried the pill.
OP
I will ask about mefenamic acid, thanks!
Cat
If you don’t want her on the Pill (my parents didn’t either, when I was at the age when I might be tempted to rely on it…) I would recommend maintaining a steady dose of ibuprofen as soon as she starts her period, whether she feels like she needs it at the time or not, because once those horrible cramps set in, they’re really impossible to treat with typical remedies. Taking 3 ibuprofen every 4 hours (including in the middle of the night, lest I wake up with vomiting/diarrhea), for me, keeps the worst, nausea/pain-inducing cramps away, leaving only mild discomfort.
I speak from 20+ years of experience with similar symptoms — in junior high, I went on the Pill and my worst symptoms disappeared, but then ages 14-20 I faced it on my own before going on the Pill again… now that we are trying for a baby, I’m again stuck with my non-regulated horrendousness, and found the above to work for me.
Anonymous
Yes — I needed the equivalent of a constant drip of Advil to keep the cramps at bay.
Meg Murry
Yes, when I’m not on hormonal birth control the only way I can be functional is to take the maximum allowed amount of ibuprofen at regular intervals – waiting until I’m in pain is too late, it takes too long to kick in. Teach her to start taking it as soon as she has twinges of cramps, and to keep taking it round the clock for a couple of days, and to take it with at least a little bit of food. However, read her school handbook and teach her to be discrete – I remember when I was in high school having any kind of pills (OTC, prescription or otherwise, labeled container or not) was considered a major offense, and being caught taking them or giving to another student was grounds for an automatic zero tolerance suspension. Luckily, my parents agreed this was stupid and told me not to be flagrant about it but they’d back me up if I got in trouble, and a couple of kind teachers basically told us “I’m going to parrot the rule to you and then I’m going to turn my back for 5 minutes and I don’t want to know”. Because for many of my friends and I, the only way we could make it through a school day plus after school activities was heavy OTC painkillers – otherwise we all would have missed 2-3 days a month or more.
Electric heating pads are more effective than hot water bottles, and when it’s not a million degrees out the Thermacare (or CVS or Walgreens generic equivalent) stick on heating pads help too (just wear on top of underwear so you don’t accidnetally turn them into hair removal pads). The ones for back pain work just as well or better for me than the ones specifically marketed as menstual, and are slightly larger.
At 11 pm the other thing that could potentially help is a warm bath, and/or if you give her a firm back massage (or upper thigh massage if that’s what hurts). Sometimes stretching (alternating curled up like child pose and stretched out) can help a tiny bit- although I think that is more of a distraction/placebo more than anything.
If she’s having gastro-intestinal distress as well, Pepto Bismal or similar might help.
But yes, please talk to the doctor about whether the pill makes sense for her – I missed a lot of school in high school due to cramps and/or from being up all night in pain and unable to function the next day – going on the pill in college was such a game changer.
gov anon
Taking the pain meds before the pain starts is the only thing that worked to take the edge off my horrible cramps was the only thing that kept me semi-functional at that age.
KT
In all that is good and holy, get her on the pill.
I had debilitating cramps at 13, where I would cry in agony. Going to school was a nightmare because I could go right through a super absorbency tampon AND a nighttime pad in an hour or 2.
I ended up having to take a day or two off every month because it was so bad.
My mom thought maybe it was just because i had JUST started, and it would calm down, but after 6 months, she took me to the doctor and I got on the pill and it was like angels started singing.
I still had my period, but instead of DEATH FOR 10 DAYS, it was mild and normal and lasted for just 5 or 6. I could get out of bed. I could sleep. I didn’t vomit. It was amazing.
I’ve been on the pill since 13 and I still think it’s the greatest invention ever.
Emmer
She should be screened for endometriosis as well. The remedy may still be the same (some form of hormonal birth control), but it’s important to know for health reasons if that’s going to be a problem.
Laura B
+1 to being aware of endometriosis. After watching a cousin and friend struggle with getting a diagnosis and then treatment for endometriosis, it seems like something that doctors are not looking for actively. Definitely try the pill (or a few different ones if the first one she tries doesn’t work for her), but keep that in the back of your mind. My friends had really painful/debilitating periods that they just gutted through, and didn’t realize they had endometriosis until they tried to get pregnant and couldn’t.
endo
Yes, OP’s daughter sounds like how I felt at 14. I actually missed a lot of school because of it. I went on the Pill in college (for birth control reasons) and it was life changing. When I went off the pill because I didn’t like being on hormones and thought I was gaining weight, my endo got out of control and I needed extensive surgery (and dealt with infertility as a result). Endo is a tough disease and is hard to diagnose even with an ultrasound (only works if one has endometriomas (cysts) visible.
Even on the pill I have cramps, but prescription strength naproxen or 3 of the big liquid gels at the first hint of pain usually did the trick.
Anon
+1 to this. Apparently the average time to diagnosis is 10 years. Some of my friends who had horrible, debilitating cramps as teenagers were diagnosed with endo decades later. Unfortunately endo won’t show up on an ultrasound though.
Anon-tastic
+2 To screen for endo. Her experience sounds much like mine as a teenager. I would be crying and puking until my mom would finally drive me to the ER. Surgery, medication (Lupron, hormonal bc, pain meds), nothing helped. I finally had a hysterectomy at 25. It was amazing! I have had a normal life and felt like a real person ever since.
Anonymous
You should put her on the pill or if for some reason she can’t, you need to give her prescription strength doses of ibuprofen. I think at that age I needed 800 mg to feel any relief, or it would sometimes progress to the point where I’d throw up. She will probably grow through it eventually.
Anonymous
A 3-pill advil dose is what I consider a dose. Repeat, repeat, repeat.
AKB
Talk to her OB. Like many commenters I had the same issue. I was completely debilitated 1-2 days out of the month. In fact, years later when I went into labor, the contractions felt familiar – it was the same level of pain and intensity as menstrual cramps when I was young! Nobody should have to go through that on a monthly basis – I would rather be on low dose BC than suffer like that again.
Ally McBeal
Yes! I had the same experience – when I went into labor, I was like, “Oh yeah, this feels familiar.”
Anonymous
Actually, labor was much better (the epidural thing didn’t happen when I got induced). 6 hours (birth #2), not days. And when the baby was out, it disappered entirely, like flipping a switch.
Now, 3 days a month, I’m like “will the period baby just come out already? surely you have crowned by now”
Blah
I had debilitating cramps and a crazy heavy flow from the start and I don’t think my mum realised how bad they were (hey, I didn’t realise that how bad I had them was unusual) until I was 17 and snapped about it at the breakfast table. I went straight on the pill and am coming up to 5 years on it now. I had taken it before (from 14) for summer holidays to make me period-free (because they were bad and I hadn’t managed tampons) which gave my mum a while to get comfortable with it.
Anon
Another plug for checking on endometriosis. I have it and get incapacitating cramps. I know a lot of people have recommended the pill, but I will say that the pill didn’t help me at all. Now I have an IUD and don’t get a real period anymore, and it’s amazing. It’s the only thing that’s actually made a difference. I just take ibuprofen the first few days of my period–which is 90% lighter than it used to be and half as long–and I can be functional.
Anonymous
Epsom salt baths or magnesium flake baths. You can also buy or make a magnesium spray that might help her miscues relax a little and possibly she’ll sleep a bit better even if the pain is still there. Light exercise, and calcium/vitamin d help me also but I need that consistently for other health and geography reasons
Anonymous
An NP recommended Naproxecen daily 2-4 days out from my period to prevent GI distress and it’s been an amazing difference.
b
I’m not pro or anti pill, but please take her to the doctor and look for underlying causes. I’m no longer on the pill because I hate messing with my hormones, but I also have a very regular period and almost no PMS, but I’ve dealt with issues of sinusitis related to my period and have found that if you’re flaring up, your body is communicating to you that something isn’t quite right. The pill might be a solution to what’s wrong, but please please don’t just slap a band-aid on it without finding out what’s underlying.
Beth Childs
+1 to the Pill. I had terrible periods as soon as they started at 13. They continued to get worse and worse over the years, with severe debilitating cramps and bleeding that caused monthly bouts of anemia and hypoglycemia. My doctor started with prescription strength naproxen and Thermacare menstrual wraps, which got me to the point where school was kind of manageable. Alas, the symptoms continued to worsen and I ended up fainting in school a couple of times. I started the Pill right before I turned 15 and it was the best decision my parents and I could have made.
halp
Is she otherwise active, in terms of exercise?
I was in a lot of sports in h.s.–probably worked out 5-6 days per week. I didn’t even know what a cramp *was* until I was a lawyer and stopped being as active–I literally thought that “cramps” was something that people made up to get out of gym class until I actually experienced them in my late 20’s (and was like..WTF is THIS? I can’t eat garbage AND I’m getting cramps?)
Obviously, not the solution for *today* when she’s doubled over, but maybe a thought for when this passes to see if regular exercise helps!
Anonymous
I was much more active as a kid (walked to school, biking, school sports) and my craps were at their worst from ages 11-15.
lucy stone
The only thing that helped me with this was the Pill. I got my period much earlier than most girls and the 9 years of having it without the Pill were excruciating. I regularly ran 4-5 miles a day in high school…except when I had my period and couldn’t get out of bed. The Pill made it so that ibuprofen kept it manageable. I went off the Pill when we started thinking about TTC and it wasn’t much better 10 years later. I’m dreading figuring out how to treat this while breastfeeding.
Things that helped marginally while TTC: ibuprofen in massive doses starting four days before my expected period, magnesium supplements, Vitamin D supplements, heating pads.
Anonymous
Just an FYI – my doc said no ibuprofen until I actually get my period while TTC. Apparently it can prevent implantation. No idea if she is right or not. If you are taking massive amounts 4 days before your period that might be during implantation time depending on how late you ovulate. Ask your doc! I had no idea.
Anonymous
-10000 to the pill. I had similar issues as a teenager, went on the pill and had horrible side effects from almost every variety until I finally got on one that had crazy high levels of estrogen, which isn’t a great idea at that age. The pill can also deplete vitamin levels and throw hormones out of whack more generally. Worst, it can mask underlying symptoms that may need to be treated and just kick the can down the road–I’m now dealing proactively with what turned out to be PCOS and doing much better without any hormonal BC, but it’s been a long process and I would have been able to get my health together earlier if not for the years of the pill/hormonal IUD covering up what was really going on.
Certainly get a full gynecological workup + ultrasound, and I would also recommend getting looked at by someone who does functional or integrative medicine, and/or a naturopath. Many larger cities have functional/integrative gynecologists. Acupuncture/Chinese medicine works wonders too for a lot of these issues. Don’t rule out the pill, but I would use it as a last resort and with full knowledge of its pros and cons rather than a first line of defense.
Blonde Lawyer
If you do go the natural route, read the book Woman Code. (I’m still on team pill though but we all have very different experiences.)
EM
I had the worst cramps (well, it seems they were everyone else here!) I was “cured” after a visit to the gyno, who tested me for endodemetriosis. (I didn’t have it.) But during the exam she really (ahem) stretched me out down there and I’ve been fine ever since. Well, nothing that Alleve can’t cure. The Pill was my next step, though.
So I agree with everyone else, really.
Best of luck. The cramps were awful and I can commiserate.
anon
Talk to her doctor about endometriosis. But before you do that, educate yourself a bit because if that is the issue, your doctor may not be well informed. (For example…do not let a doctor convince you she’s too young – that’s inaccurate.) My experience is very similar to how you describe your daughter’s symptoms, and it took me over TEN YEARS to get diagnosed. The vast majority of physicians are not up to date on endometriosis, including many who claim they are. I’ve had two surgeries. The first was a physician who told me he knew what he was doing and clearly didn’t. The second was an expert; that surgery was life changing. http://www.endofound.org is a good place to start. Nancy’s Nook on FB is sometimes a lot to weed through but her files include great lists of good doctors.
anon
If it is endo, don’t let anyone do ablation on her. Laparoscopic excision surgery is the gold standard. Post surgery I’m on the Mirena IUD and a progesterone only BC pill (though that may go away after my 9 month post surgery check up). Excision surgery by an expert changed my life.
anon with endo
Definitely go to the GYN. Also, heat seems like the most comforting, but ice can also be really helpful. Symptoms could be endometriosis or could be something indirectly related to her period that is flaring up due to the inflammation and hormones. The pill will likely help.
NYNY
Can anyone speak to the fit of Coach shoes? After my cobbler told me he couldn’t redo the heel tap again on some MK Flexes, I’m looking for new red pumps. It’s hard to find red leather as opposed to suede or patent, and I’m in love with these:
http://shop.nordstrom.com/s/coach-seline-pointy-toe-ankle-strap-pump-women/4324433?origin=category-personalizedsort&fashioncolor=BURGUNDY
I have high arches, narrow heels, and wide forefeet. I can’t wear Cole Haan shoes because they are too narrow at the toes and ball of foot, but if I try wide, the heel swims on me. Do Coach shoes run wider at the toe?
Simplify
I can’t say about Coach but I have similar feet so I have to use heel pads to get shoes to fit me that accommodate my arch.
NYNY
I use heel pads in regular-width shoes, but sadly, there is no heel pad big enough to make a wide width shoe fit.
Cat
Not in my experience lately — also, fwiw, I tried on a few pairs of their high heels last fall in-store, and found the leather to be incredibly stiff and uncomfortable. Like, scraped the skin on my ankle bone stiff.
NYNY
That sounds terrible!
Anyone have good suggestions for other red/blue-red – not orange – pumps in non-patent leather? Size 8, 2.5-3.5 inch heel?
anne-on
Sadly no, that is my unicorn shoe and it is RIDICULOUSLY hard to find. I’m seriously considering designing my own at Shoes of Prey.
AZCPA
Do it! I love my Shoes of Prey so much it is not even funny.
AZCPA
I have mostly sworn off heels in order to encourage myself to walk more during the day, but my Coach ones (the newest is 4 years old) were always very comfortable and still look like new. And I’m actually wearing a brand new pair of Coach flats today, that while needing to break in a little are pretty good. I have very flat feet, but wide forefoot and narrow heels. So I’d order them and give them a try around the house. I also love Shoes of Prey, and find they fit my feet quite well.
twitterpated
6 months after a bad break-up and a long chain of lackluster first dates, I went on a really promising date, with plans this weekend for a second. Which is great, but I’ve gotten stupidly emotionally invested in this proto-relationship! Any tips for bringing myself back down to earth? It’s the first time I’ve felt happy or optimistic about a potential relationship in half a year, and I know it could easily come to nothing, but I keep feeling excited and thinking about him.
Anonymous
Girl what? Enjoy those feelings! They are the reason we date. Don’t like change your life for him on a second date but enjoy feeling excited for a change.
Anon
+1 I’ve been with my husband for 6 years now and love him and love being married to him but it’s kind of sad that I probably (hopefully) won’t ever feel the excitement of a new relationship again.
Anon
I don’t mean to pick on you but this is exactly why I don’t talk to my married friends about dating. It’s so frustrating to have them “live vicariously” through me or be excited about the prospect of a new relationship when (usually) the reason we’re all dating is to find a life partner.
Anonymous
Yeah this comment is kind of the definition of #smugmarried
anon
Right? No, friend with loving husband and house and dog and baby on the way, you don’t want to be in my position so that you can have 1 exciting date out of every 10 or have strangers propositioning you on the internet. I’m glad that they all think my stories are “so funny,” and I’m happy to try to turn lame dating experiences into something positive, but damn, I’m tired of my “love life” being a funny joke for everyone else when everyone else gets a partner.
/rant
J
Thank you for saying this. I don’t want to be a Smug Married (Bridget Jones reference) but I also want to be in a *friendship* where we’re both able to freely share thoughts and emotions. It can be hard to know where the line is.
Jen
You can share your thoughts and emotions, but you need to be sensitive to the fact that when someone wants what you have, it’s not OK to respond to something like this with “wah, I have what you want but I’ll never get to feel first butterflies again.” That’s not what was said, but that’s the implication, and it’s so hurtful to those of us who have been searching for our partners and not finding them. It’s akin to responding to someone who’s desperately searching for a job with a complaint about some tiny thing you don’t like about your otherwise fabulous job (like “but they don’t stock the kind of coffee I like”).
Jen
This was directed at J (and the anon at 10:33)
twitterpated
Thanks! They are very enjoyable feelings, so I guess enjoying them seems like the best thing to do!
cbackson
Thanks! They are very enjoyable feelings, so I guess enjoying them seems like the best thing to do!
twitterpated
It’s a deal! Hope the date goes great!
Nati
So happy for you and cbackson. Hope both of you have fantastic dates! These feelings are great. Just enjoy. (And let us know how things progress…)
twitterpated
Aww, thanks. I will!
anonymous
It’s ok to get excited! If you didn’t there’d be no point in dating, ever. Noticing your excitement about someone is how you know they’re worth spending time on. But to bring down your level of investment…. just remember that you’re filling in all the blanks of things you don’t know about him with your best case scenarios. You don’t know what super fun info could come out on the second or third or eighth date. I wrote this here a few weeks ago, but *for example,* you might discover that dream boy 1) still owns property with an ex 2) has an incurable STI 3) is moving out of state in a few months 4) isn’t sure he “believes in” monogamy 5) has an actual micropen*s 5) recently kicked a narcotics habit 6) “hates fat people” (wtf?) or 7) isn’t sure he’s a feminist.
If we didn’t laugh we’d cry.
twitterpated
Thanks, anon, for both sides of it. That is some bad date bingo there!
anonymous
Ha! To be fair, that’s my “Worst Of” collection for the past 7 years or so. It’s not all been a total bust!
I spent last night making out with a really cool biochemical engineer on a park bench………I’m right there with you on second date excitement. It’s so rare to find someone that you’re actually into that you’ve gotta allow it. But I’m holding off investment until I know he doesn’t have an all-consuming My Little Pony fetish.
twitterpated
Ha. And, well, if he does turn out to have that MLP fetish, you can pass him along to me. It was my favorite childhood toy, so maybe we would be able to work it out… :)
January
Aw. Enjoy. Those feelings don’t come around every day (as you know!)
And you’ll live if the second date (or third, or sixth, or tenth) goes pear-shaped. Promise.
January
I’m afraid that might have come across as dismissive — let’s just say I felt twitterpated, too, in the not-too-distant past, and it didn’t work out, but I still think it was (mostly) a fun experience. Or, anonymous at 10:26 am has good advice.
twitterpated
Thanks! It didn’t feel at all dismissive. If it does go pear-shaped, I don’t want to rocket back down into my post-breakup “I will never love anyone againnnn” mode, but then again maybe I won’t!
January
Yeah – what I liked about it was that it was fun to feel like I’d clicked with someone, especially after SO many un-fun dates. And I do think it helped me learn to live in the moment a little more, which is something I struggle with, too.
Anondc
I’m dealing with the same exact thing right now and what I’ve heard from others is to just enjoy it! Its really rare to find someone you click with (whether it’ll end up being a long term relationship or not) so I’m just going to be thankful and live in the moment – especially after a series of duds.
twitterpated
Enjoying it certainly seems like the most enjoyable thing to do…so I’m going for it and trying not to worry too much about the potential crash. It’s hard for me to live in the moment, but probably a good thing to learn…
Cute Blouse - How do you wear it to work?
Does it look right with a blazer over it? I like to keep a semblance of a waist and fear that wearing a cardi would just make me look like a shapeless blob.
In the Pink
This. To add, I have an hourglass figure and all the draping isn’t going to do anything but exaggerate the top portion of the hourglass and conceal my waist…not for my shape. I imagine it’s good for an athletic or column shape, those who also wear dropped waists. Good luck!
mascot
I’m a busty hourglass and these tops look awful on me. The draping just hangs straight down from the widest part of my chest for a lovely blob effect.
soaps
I bought two of these types of shirts and they looked awful on me. The only way I can wear it and look decently okay is tucked in. I only wear it with skirts that sit at my waistline. Otherwise I feel unpleasantly boxy.
pugsnbourbon
I was really excited to find a Pleione top at Marshalls for $15, but dang was it boxy. It wasn’t the wrap-look, though.
Anonymous
Advice needed! I’m a midlevel associate in a niche practice area and have an offer for an in-house position, working with a prior client. The catch? The company is a few hours away from my current city (think NY to DC).
I’m not motivated to be partner and am frankly a little burnt out. I’m also realizing that in-house roles for my skill set are hard to come by, especially the longer I stay at a firm. I think this job would be a good opportunity and give me experience to leverage in finding my next position. However, we’d like to start a family in the next 2-3 years, and my fiance wouldn’t be able to relocate for work/family reasons. We would probably have to wait on having a baby until I could return to the area, not to mention starting off with a long-distance marriage.
What would you do? Take the job now, hope that I can find a position back in current city after a year or two, and then build up enough credibility before getting pregnant? Or stay at the firm and keep waiting for other local opportunities?
Anonymous
I would examine this part more closely: “my fiance wouldn’t be able to relocate for work/family reasons.” In-house jobs are almost as rare as tenure-track jobs in academia. They’re the kind of thing that frequently necessitate a relocation. Unless he’s an academic or in-house or in a similar crazy-hard-to-get job, I think you need to take this job and he needs to relocate to be with you within a year or so. You may have to do a little long-distance but it shouldn’t derail your timeline for TTC.
Blonde Lawyer
His family reasons could be kids from a prior relationship. Custody orders often keep people in state.
Triangle Pose
Totally agree, especially if you are in litigation. Litigation in-house roles are like unicorns and if you don’t want to be partner your days at the firm are numbered (unless you are okay rolling the dice on being pushed out or relegated to being of-counsel). I jumped in-house as soon as I could call myself”mid level” at the firm and I’d never go back. Evaluate if your SO’s work/family reasons are as strong as your in-house position. Absent a tenured university professor position, an inmovable cushy federal government in DC, or a custody order to stay in state (never thought of this before!) I would take the job and move.
Anonymous
Absolutely not. I never get this. There is more than one job. There is only one family. You have a perfectly acceptable job. Yes, keep it and keep looking for something where you can live with your husband.
Killer Kitten Heels
But what about her husband? Doesn’t he also have an obligation to look further into whether that “can’t relocate” is really a “won’t relocate”? Why is the burden 100% on OP?
The type of job OP is up for sounds rare and hard-to-come-by, and it also sounds like her current “perfectly acceptable” job is actually a dead end, since most firms are up-or-out and she’s already realized she doesn’t want to be a partner.
OP, I think you should really closely examine whether your H really “can’t” relocate with you (it’s hard to imagine an obligation/job that he could have in NY that couldn’t be done from DC, short of something like daily physical care of someone), and also look into whether you could make it work without going full-on long distance through flexible work scheduling (could one of you work from home part-time? could you arrange your hours so that it’s possible to live in the middle somewhere? etc.).
Anonymous
She is the one who asked.
Killer Kitten Heels
Right, so the answer is some version of “make sure *can’t* is really CAN’T before turning down a rare and important opportunity over geography,” not some version of “OMG no” + not-so-subtle shaming for even considering an option that might require her to move somewhere her H can’t for a limited period of time.
Your “family uber alles” thing is, frankly, a really good example of the type of attitude that leads women to lean out of the workforce and ultimately to not have the careers they deserve, which damages not only women (and their families), but companies/the economy.
OP
Thanks to both of you for your feedback. This is exactly why I’m struggling with the decision. My fiance’s limitation is that he recently took on a new role where he has the opportunity to lead a team, and has aging parents in the area. Looks like we will have to have a heart-to-heart this weekend.
Anonymous
Would his aging parents be open to relocating closer to your new city down the road/in a few years?
What kind of managing opportunities would fiance have in your new town if he came in a year? Temporary long-distance, but gives him sometime to get the leadership experience under his belt.
Triangle Pose
Burning out and not wanting to be partner does not seem like a “perfectly acceptable job” to me. Also, in-house can be a dream job. It is for me. Priorities shift and it’s not an all or nothing black and white family-before-everything.
Anonymous
I’m transitioning from a business formal environment to a casual side of business casual one. I currently wear mostly sheath dresses in suiting fabrics and mismatched suiting separates (e.g. a navy suit jacket with gray suit pants and a blouse or sweater). I think most of my suiting pieces are way too formal for the new office, even if they’re dressed down with cardigans and flats. Suggestions for what I should buy to build up my new wardrobe? Don’t worry I’ll hold off on major purchases until I’ve been there a few weeks, just trying to gather ideas. Budget is pretty low, think Old Navy/Target/H&M or Limited or Ann Taylor on sale.
Betty
I made a similar transition from business formal environment to a completely casual environment. A few thoughts/suggestions: You probably can use those business formal pieces to go from business formal to business casual. Try pairing your suit pants with a t-shirt (from BR or somewhere similar), flats and more creative jewelry. Use you suit jackets with jeans. I have found Loft to be a great place to find pieces to dress down my more formal wardrobe. Think cotton and other less formal fabrics to pair with your more formal stuff. I think you are right not to buy too much ahead of time. Even though my company is completely casual (many are wearing shorts, t-shirts and flip flops today), the management and legal department still tend towards business casual.
increasingly casual
I cosign this advice: flats and a nice t-shirt can really make suit pants a lot more casual. I just got a couple of Caslon tees from Nordstrom (the Caslon Ballet Neck Cotton & Modal Knit Elbow Sleeve Tee if you want to search) with which I’m very happy. Or, if you find some casual pants you like, particularly ankle pants (folks here seem to like Old Navy Pixie pants), you can do those with a blouse or a sweater (or maybe a t-shirt/jacket combo) and either flats or heels, depending on what you think works better in terms of your office.
Laura B
I work in the casual side of business casual. Dark wash jeans, black jeans, and white jeans are my favorite bottoms, and I’d mix those with the suit jackets. The sheath dresses in suiting fabrics are going to be harder to make casual, but I think it might be doable with the cardigan, flats, and funky long necklace. For the flats, go more formal or even open toed. I get away with sandals, which really brings it more casual.
I’d focus on a couple pairs of jeans you feel awesome in, and funky jewelry that you couldn’t wear in your business formal environment.
CKB
I work in a casual side of business casual office. I still wear pencil skirts, but with a tee and cardi. My fave pants, though are cotton ankle pants from Old Navy (Pixie) or Gap Factory. I also still occasionally wear my sheath dresses, with a cardi. Sometimes I wear jeans with my nicer blouses as well. For reference, I’m the controller, and I’ve been enjoying making my wardrobe a little more casual, but still dressing up sometimes.
Weekender bag?
I’m looking for a weekender bag. I don’t really know what I’m looking for other than the soft-sided duffle shape. Is there one y’all love?
Calico
Everlane
Cb
Try men’s shops, particularly at outlet malls. I bought a really nice one with leather accents at the store whose name is escaping me (like WH Bass but less expensive – maybe Van Huesen?). Bass had a really slick looking one but it was a bit pricier than I had hoped.
KateMiddletown
I used to have a semi-structured one from DVF purchased at TJ Maxx. They tend to have an interesting mish mash of fun and boring types of weekenders – def take a look!
Anon
LeSportSac. I think it’s called Casual Weekender. I love mine and it looks like new after three+ years.
Tieks
Any reviews? Looking for a comfy ballet-style flat and they have shoes for big feet!
Daisy
CapHillStyle reviewed them a while back. My takeaway from her was that they were fine, but that teal sole shows way more than you might think and she opted to not get another pair (first might have been a gift, I think).
MJ
I find them a little casual. Because they are elastic, they look a little less formal for work. I also think they are crazy overpriced. A lot of the Cole Haan size 11s fit me, and I am a true 12. And those are often on sale, so much, much cheaper. But my SIL loves Tieks and thinks they are the bees knees.
Scarlett
I have them but only wear to yoga or as an emergency shoe in my work/ travel bag. They are like slightly better versions of the Dr Scholls emergency flats in the drugstore. Not worth the money, I wouldn’t buy another pair and continue my quest for the wonder flat.
Emmabean
I don’t own a pair because I’m afraid to shell out that much cash for that little shoe and have it not work out (I’m a weird size, would probably buy if I had some extra cash and could try on), but I was in a wedding a while ago where the wedding photographer was wearing them. I asked her about them, and she said they were so awesome that the pair she was wearing was her second pair, she wears them for all of the weddings she photographs, they hold up well, and she wholeheartedly recommended them. So, I guess they work for some. And I thought the teal sole looked nice, but I love that color.
Anonymous
I don’t think they have any support, so they may not be that comfortable.
shadow
I don’t know about Tieks but I love my Dexflex Comfort flats from Payless – they were cheap ($15 maybe?) and super comfy. And they’ve been lasting me quite a long time (bought them over a year ago) – I pretty much wear them almost every day! Not sure if they have your size but definitely worth checking out.
Delta Dawn
I bought a skirt from J.Crew about a month ago. Today is my third time to wear it, and the hem completely fell out (after I got to work, naturally). Currently held together with tape and prayers. Just a heads up to anyone who thought J.Crew’s quality issues may have been resolved– they have not.
MJ
Return it! They should fix it for you or refund. That’s one thing they are still good at.
I have found their No 2 cotton pencil skirts to have seams fall out ALL THE TIME–both the back seam (whoa, work emergency!) and the hems. Won’t buy those again. It was a chronic issue, and the skirts at issue were nowhere near too tight.
Ally McBeal
I feel like every hem I own has fallen out. It’s profoundly annoying.
CorporateInCarhartt
Same thing happened to me with a J Crew skirt at work! Ridiculous. I have double-sided tape now, just in case, but we shouldn’t have to worry about that. Good luck!
KateMiddletown
Ughhh. I just spoke with a client of mine whose husband has been battling bone cancer for a few years and is not doing well. I’m relatively new to my industry and have never had a closer relationship with a client who has died, but I can feel myself getting emotional about this one. How do you guys deal with 1) not saying the wrong thing and 2) not bawling when you have to attend funerals for work?
Senior Attorney
Really, the only wrong things to say are “everything happens for a reason” or “I know just how you feel” (unless you’ve actually lost a spouse). Okay, and “OMG I could never go through something like this!” Other than that, just stick to “I’m so sorry” or “You’re in my thoughts” or similar and you’ll be fine.
And crying at funerals is allowed.
anon
+1000 It’s incredibly trite and offensive to tell someone that “everything happens for a reason.” As an atheist, I found it extremely offensive and presumptuous.
Laura B
Specific to business: When close family members of our clients die (and we know about it), my company sends flowers to the funeral. Maybe get prepared/find out if this is a thing at your company now, so you’re ready?
In general: On not saying the wrong thing to people in this kind of thing, I read an article a couple years ago that stayed with me. I tried to summarize it, but wasn’t doing a good job so I googled and found it – I think it was this one: http://articles.latimes.com/2013/apr/07/opinion/la-oe-0407-silk-ring-theory-20130407
That concept really helps me in these kinds of situations keep my perspective. Comfort IN, dump OUT.
Senior Attorney
Wow, this is great. Thanks for posting it!
Betty
This is one of my favorite articles of all time. And one that I wish I could send to members of my own family sometimes.
MNF
Read the book “No Longer Awkward” by Amy Florian. She is a grief expert and also experienced losing her husband at a very young age. I saw her speak last year and she was phenomenal. I do estate planning/administration and there are so many helpful tips that I would never thought of on my own.
(For example, people dealing with grief often feel out of control. She suggests when meeting with a grieving client, to remember that you’re there to empower them to make decisions. Don’t thrust tissue boxes at them when they cry, just indicate where the tissues are located so that they can take one if they want to. It seems silly, but these little things can make a big difference).
MNF
Miss edit – ^”never have thought”
Ugh
Vent. My job is killing my soul. I have to do a couple things that, while not unethical at all, just go against my personal belief set so so much.
On top of that, one of my bosses is literally giving me anxiety attacks because of their general power crazed inflated sense of self. Oh! And 25% of our department is leaving this summer. I wonder why guys???
I’m here because the promotion opportunities are incredible, but sweet lord. Today is hard.
(Don’t worry, posted from my personal phone.)
Leatty
I’ve been in a similar situation, and I went into therapy because I was having such bad panic attacks. Because I was so unhappy working for a borderline unethical compay that was managed by illogical managers, I moved to a different company. Have you considered changing jobs? In the meantime, take care of yourself. You’ll be stronger on the other side of this.
dc
Anyone have experience in DC Superior Court? I’ll be working there temporarily for a few months and am interested to hear any overall impressions, insights, etc. I’m also wondering what kind of clothes I should invest in between now and when I start. Thanks!
Bonnie
It’s a stereotypical city criminal courthouse. Don’t invest in clothing yet and wait to see what your officemates wear. You’ll see that too many members of the bar do not even wear jackets for court matters.
dc
Thanks, Bonnie — I appreciate the advice.
Anonymous
I did a detail there (working for the government) and wore a suit every day — most of my colleagues did, too, but some women wore blazers with skirts/dresses. Defense counsel often dressed more casually, though.
anon
Ugh I had to move to a new cube at work, and this guy I sit next to whistles and hums all day. I wear earplugs but they only help a little bit, and I’m not allowed to have noise cancelling headphones. there isn’t anywhere else to move.
Anon
Put on your big girl pants and say something like, “Jim, you may not realize it, but you hum and whistle all day and it’s really distracting. Would you mind not doing that? Thanks so much.”
anon
So whenever I’ve done things like this in the past, I find that people really don’t know when they’re doing things like that, and unless I want to keep telling him to stop every 5 minutes, it’s doomed to fail. I’ve never actually seen someone drastically reduce an annoying habit like that.
Runner 5
I’ve changed out of being an annoying hummer. I now press my ankle against my chair instead.
anon
Did it take a lot of effort? I’m thinking people can change things they really want to change, but if it’s just because some coworker asked them nicely once, it’s probably not going to happen.
CMC
I too stopped being an annoying hummer/whistler because someone said something to me. Yes, I would still do it without realizing it initially, but eventually, after being reminded gently each time, I got to where it would take less and less time to catch myself and stop without being prompted. And yes, I’m embarrassed to say that I was initially a little pouty about being asked at all (though I kept it to myself). I got over that, too.
Meg Murry
Are you allowed to have regular headphones/earbuds? I’ve had luck with white noise mp3s – even putting in just one earbud helps a lot.
NY CPA
This. I have the beats earbuds and find that they block most noise. Sometimes I just put them in with no music on so I can focus.
WWYD?
A former of colleague of mine referred me for what’s basically my dream job. I had an initial call with the recruiter for the role, which went well, and I am now scheduled to speak with the hiring manager next week.
Since the conversation with the recruiter, I accepted a buyout from my current firm. As part of the buyout, I no longer go into the office, but I am still technically employed by the company for the next few months. I am not precluded from accepting another offer and starting a new role within this time frame, though.
Would you volunteer the buyout information to the hiring manager during the next interview, since I’m still technically employed by Current/Previous Firm for the next few months? Obviously, if asked about the duration or status of my employment with my current (soon-to-be previous) firm, I’ll explain about the buyout. I want to be forthcoming and honest, and I don’t want this to come back to bite me by not disclosing it. However, I’m also concerned that the hiring manager may view the buyout offer in a negative light. Any thoughts or advice?
Anon
I would totally not disclose this. I would find out what your current work would say to a job reference and take it from there. Particularly because you are not working (so no actual conflict) and it’s fine for you to accept another position during this time.
I would also not disclose bc I feel that your gut is right–it might make the new firm question why you were offered a buyout specifically, even if it was an across-the-board thing.
CountC
Disclaimer – I have no experience with this, but my instinct is to say do not volunteer any of that unless a starting date is brought up. Even in a discussion of start date, I wouldn’t mention the buyout? Wouldn’t you just say, I have committed to staying with my company through X date, I can start on Y date.
CountC
Oh derp – I missed where you said you could accept and start another job during the time period. Yea, mention nothing about the buyout.
Anonymous
I’m confused why you have to mention it at all.
WWYD?
I don’t technically have to mention it, unless asked. I guess my concern about not mentioning it is that Potential New Firm may find out about the buyout if things progresses, and it may reflect negatively on me that I didn’t disclose that my situation had changed after my initial call with the recruiter.
Anonymous
No no no, do not explain about the buyout. You are employed. You are eager to start a new position. If you get an offer for a firm date, you can negotiate (“I am committed to current firm through X date”) or start right away. Do not disclose the buyout UNLESS you are asked to sign some sort of non-compete agreement.
Anonymous
I was negotiating an offer with New Firm when laid off from Old Firm. The hiring partner at New Firm called my extension at Old Firm before calling my cell phone.
I was upfront and open about being laid off, reiterated my interest in the offer and let him talk me down $10k in salary (ouch! but I made up for it in bonuses). So be prepared for them to try to talk you down salary-wise if they find out.
Anon
I just paid off my last high-interest law school, hooray!
For the past 8 years I’ve put most of my ‘extra’ income towards loan repayment. My remaining loans have an interest rate of 3% or less. I currently max out contributions to 401K. From here on out, should I continue to put my ‘extra’ income towards my loan payments (around 20K remaining) or should I start paying just the minimum on those and redirect towards retirement / investments?
Senior Attorney
Hooray!
Do you have a good emergency fund? If not, I’d direct the extra income towards that. If you already have a good cash cushion, I’d go ahead and hammer out the remaining loans.
Sydney Bristow
Congratulations!
If you have a fully funded emergency fund, I personally would get the rest of the loans out of the way simply for the emotional relief that would come from being debt free.
Julia
How is your emergency fund? Do you have 8 mos to a year of loan payments built in so you have a low risk of default in the event of a hardship that would not qualify for forbearance or allow you to keep paying in an emergency to avoid extra interest? If so, I would keep paying the loan and invest extra cash. If the debt keeps you up at night, I say pay it off.
Anonymous
Retirement/investments. If you’re at least 8 yrs out, you’re likely ~32 yrs old. Time to start maxing out or getting as close to maxing out your retirement. If you want to hold some in cash, that’s fine. But otherwise I don’t understand the whole theory of getting loans out of the way for “emotional relief.” It’s a business transaction — what do emotions have to do with it? You’re likely going to make more than 3% in the market on average so why focus on the loans?
Ally McBeal
In a similar position and I decided to invest the “extra” money instead of throwing it at my low-interest loans.
ace
Ditto the advice on emergency fund. Do you have any other major purchases on the horizon, e.g., home purchase?
If you have a healthy e-fund already — or at least the start of one — you could explore other retirement investments too. Remember it doesn’t have to be all or nothing, as you could split the $20K between retirement, beefing up an established emergency fund, and other goals.
Solo
I’m a Dave Ramsey girl so I’d kill the loans ASAP.
Anonymous
If you decide to invest (which was my decision–still have $34k in loans at 1.6%), I’d wait a bit. The market has been mostly flat for the last year and some big name investors are predicting a huge crash ala 1929 and 2008.
I’m holding a lot of money in cash right now and waiting for a sale if/when the market goes down. In October or so, I’ll put money in again if the market is still flat.
gov anon
Thanks for the Kindle advice yesterday. I decided to go ahead with the Paperwhite, figuring I’ll adjust to the touchscreen.
ace
I didn’t comment yesterday, but I love the paperwhite — good choice!
cyclist
Can anyone in the DC area recommend a CPA/tax expert? We have some money to invest, and while we are both well-informed on the investment side (we both work in the industry), we want to make sure we are making good decisions based on our full picture from a tax perspective.
Thanks in advance!