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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
Ooooh: I love this dress. Sleeves! Pockets! Patterns laid in interesting ways! I like the flattering A-line shape enough that I wish they had it in other colors, but alas, right now this is it. It's available in sizes 000-16 for $158. A-Line Dress in Windowpane Tweed
A slightly more affordable option is here, and here's a similar dress in plus sizes.
Update: Annoyingly, the dress seems to have sold out — here's a similar style from J.Crew (sleeveless, though).
Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com.
(L-all)
Sales of note for 9.19.24
- Nordstrom – Beauty deals through September, and cardmembers earn 3x the points (ends 9/22)
- Ann Taylor – Extra 30% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off sale
- J.Crew – 50% off select styles — and 9/19 only, 50% off the cashmere wrap
- J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 50% off sale with code
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Friends & Family 25% off
- Rag & Bone – Friends & Family 25% off sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Anniversary event, 25% off your entire purchase — Free shipping, no minimum, 9/19 only
- Target – Car-seat trade-in event through 9/28 — bring in an old car seat to get a 20% discount on other baby/toddler stuff.
- Tuckernuck – Friends & Family Sale – get 20%-30% off orders (ends 9/19).
- White House Black Market – 40% off select styles
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Gigi
This dress looks good, but its already sold out.
Kat G
ARRRGH it was there last night! ok maybe 2 nights ago. in all sizes. so odd.
Anon
Looks like I will have to haul my butt in to a store for this!
On a tangent, I seem to be at like 20% rate of keepers when I shop online at Boden. Am I just really clueless or am I missing some great tip to decipher if a dress will fit properly?
I am about 5’2 and a sixe 6 Boden US.
Sarabeth
I think Boden is just cut for a pretty specific (short-waisted, moderate pear) body type. I can’t buy any dresses or fitted shirts from them. Sweaters and pants are fine.
Samantha
I am quite the opposite. I have a few perfect dresses from Boden that are my go-to numbers. I am short (high) waisted and pear-shaped with a small bust. Boden tops and pants do not fit me and I have (or should have, if I wasn’t lazy) returned every single one I got.
Anonymous
Which dresses? I am your shape exactly.
And I would appreciate any other recs!!!
Samantha
So many! The only thing stopping me from buying all of the Boden dresses is my budget.
The Maggie Ottoman dress is my gorgeous go-to for a killer day at work (big meetings, etc.). The Martha Tweed Dress is almost identical except for material, they dont have any left I think though.
I’ve gotten many compliments on the Beatrice Knitted Dress though it’s very memorable so I don’t wear it every single week.
The casual jersey dress is very comfy and flattering. The Pretty Jersey Dress is similar and has a high neck, it minimizes my waist and has pockets! I wear it with a blazer on fridays.
I only returned the Eliza Ponte Dress because the neckline was a tad low on my small bust, with a cami (or sizing down) it will probably be fine, but I’ve gotten used to not going for less than perfect on my Boden dress picks.
anon a mouse
Boden posts garment measurements on its website, which can be really helpful. The cuts aren’t always consistent from dress to dress.
I’m long-waisted, and I’ve found it works better for me to buy a tall version of a dress and then have it hemmed to the right length, so that the waist hits me properly. I guess British women all have really high waists.
January
I have the white sleeveless version of this that J. Crew was selling over the summer. It’s a great dress.
(Even if this were still available online, I’m not sure I’d feel quite right about buying it in the blue – they’re a little too similar. Even though this one has sleeves!)
Nancy Raygun
This dress is right up my alley.
SuziStockbroker
Me too!
Love languages question
Ooh, that is lovely!
Question for the hive: love languages – yay or nay? Did you find it helpful? Are you well aligned?
My husband and I took the quiz this weekend and found it fascinating (both score high on touch / quality time) but he is much more ‘words of affirmation’ than I am (me: 1, largely because I don’t like presents either in contrast to his 7). I would like to get better at the affirmation bit but not sure where to start.
anon
I don’t know how to answer the questions in that quiz. All of the options sound nice? Maybe I’m just needy.
Anonymous
Ha! Glad I’m not the only one who feels this way. On the flip side to being needy, maybe it means we’re easy to love because we’ll appreciate it in all forms :)
EM
What is a love language and where can I take a mindless quiz in the middle of the workday?
CPA Lady
There are five and its in the love languages book, but I bet you can find it on the interwebs somewhere…
The love languages:
1. Words of affirmation
2. Acts of service
3. Quality time
4. Gifts
5. Physical touch
There are ways people show love and ways people receive love. For instance, My husband likes quality time and he shows love with acts of service. However, I receive love by words of affirmation. So he can do all the acts of service he wants, but that’s not how I receive love, so it wont be as meaningful to me as he intends. Whereas if he says something nice to me, it changes my whole day for the better.
So its a way to figure out the way to give your partner what they need and to communicate to them what you need.
lawsuited
http://www.5lovelanguages.com/profile/
mascot
I found it somewhat helpful. My husband is a bit higher on touch than I am so when we going through a rough patch, I make more of an effort to connect with him that way. Neither of us are really into gifts (we prefer quality time) which explains why both of us are just “meh” about getting each other things for holidays/birthdays.
Anonymous
I’m a word of affirmation person and my husband is a quality of time person. It helps to really identify that. He knows it means a lot to me when he verbally acknowledges something I’ve done or how he feels “Thanks for doing the dishes” and “I’m proud of you for working so hard.” And I know that it means a lot to him when I shut my phone off at dinner or when I watch his show with him instead of watching my show in a different room.
For affirmation, the most meaningful thing my husband does is acknowledge out loud the things I wish he’d see. So he’ll say “Thanks for taking out the trash” or “You look really nice today.” And it doesn’t take over-the-top statements. It’s just the little day-to-day “I noticed this” or “I see you” type comments that make me feel so loved.
Love languages question
Oh that’s helpful – I kind of considered ‘acts of affirmation’ as schmoopy, lovey-dovey talk which I’m rubbish at. But the thanking and expressing appreciation is something I could definitely work at.
pockets
I actually did find it helpful, and I’ve been with my husband for almost 12 years. Although it only confirmed what I already intuitively knew, seeing it spelled out for me helped me articulate my intuition. My husband is a toucher, and I am an acts of service. Now I try to touch my husband more often (for example when we’re sitting on the couch I will try to hold his hand – it sounds trivial and silly to me but the quiz showed me that it would be meaningful to him) and once I explained the acts of service thing to my husband he started doing more around the house – one time when I was particularly frustrated he actually said, Look at how much I care! I’m doing all these acts of service for you!
SuziStockbroker
I found it somewhat helpful. I am “acts of service” and my husband is “time together”. You can see how this could create a disconnect if we didn’t recognize this. I am literally running around, DOING stuff for him and the kids, and really, he just wants me to sit and watch his show with him, or go golfing with him. And then that drives me a little crazy because I don’t watch TV or like golf, and he didn’t really think of doing things for me as a way of showing affection.
It is helpful to understand that we are different that way and we need to pay attention to what makes the other feel loved.
Babyweight
He’s acts of service. I’m words of affirmation. 10 years married and this was a lightbulb moment for us. I didn’t understand why he wouldn’t chill out. He didn’t understand why less than kind/ thoughtless words from him hit me so hard. We still struggle, but now I understand that him being a busy bee on the weekends isn’t wanting to avoid me/kids, but his way of showing his love. He also understands that the eye rolling and unkind offhand remarks about my side business of writing romance novels cut me deep. It’s a process, but much better.
Anonymous
And this is why I think it’s nonsense. Like, you’re a dad. Who cares if you like showing your love for your kids by obsessively doing chores all weekend? Bet they don’t feel it.
It’s just an excuse.
Anonymous
This is bananas.
People show love in different ways. People take care of each other in different ways.
CPA Lady
Well, I think one of the points of the book is that you need to change what you’re doing if you’re showing love in a way that is not meaningful to your partner.
Lets say I need quality time but my husband thinks I need gifts. In reading the book, we come to the conclusion that I need quality time. If he still insists on getting me gifts instead of spending time with me, that’s a problem.
Part of it is learning whether how you show your love is compatible with how your partner receives your love. I actually do think it’s a problem that he’s still a busy bee if your family receives love through quality time rather than acts of service. He’s not listening to what you need if he’s still insisting on doing it his way.
lost academic
I agree with CPA lady, but also offer this: you don’t necessarily need to change everything, but you can help get out of a mode where you blame your partner for not showing enough affection in a meaningful way if you can come to understand that he or she is just doing it differently, and vice versa. I think everyone needs to adjust a little for their partner, but maybe not everyone can make wholesale change. And understanding what’s being done and how it’s meant goes a long way. My husband and I really go about things entirely differently and we are better now at understanding that so we have many fewer hurt and unsaid feelings.
Also, this isn’t about showing love/affection for your kids, it’s about your spouse/partner relationship.
cbackson
That’s actually kind of…the point of the concept. The dad thinks he’s showing love; the kids aren’t feeling it. The dad would like to show love in a way that his kids feel. Thus, this information might be useful to him.
Anonymama
I actually always felt loved by my parents, who weren’t big on words or physical affection, but were big on acts of service: they would bring treats to all the soccer games and stay up all night making a Halloween costume or helping with a school project.
Anon
Tangent- This post made me have an epiphany about work lately. Yes, I know work isn’t a place for love languages, but my one of my ‘love languages’ is words of affirmation, and it just made me think that’s why I am so grumpy at work because I never (well, almost never) hear any positive feedback (or any feedback, really). I’m in law and I have heard that is just the norm- partners don’t really give out praise, but wondering if anyone in my situation has found ways to cope. I’m becoming increasingly resentful of this job.
NB- I say this as someone who has gotten great performance reviews and high bonuses- so I don’t think its a poor performance issue. That being said, hearing once a year I’m doing a good job isn’t really enough for me.
I’m sure someone will post that this is law and I should suck it up- that’s fine if its your opinion. I’m looking for positive ways to deal with my situation.
Anonymous
The money is the thank you.
Email yourself. When you do something you know is good, forward yourself a copy with “great job on this!”
Anon
Yes, I understand the money is a thank you. I can rationalize and understand this stuff objectively, but emotions are not objective. I still feel crappy even if I logically know that this is how law firms work.
Anonymous
Ask for feedback. Turn something in, let them review it, and then ask for feedback. My firm did a big career development project on this and the partners almost universally said they don’t *think* to give feedback unless someone specifically asks. They all assume that you know you’re doing ok if you don’t hear otherwise. But they’re happy to take a few minutes to discuss particulars of a project if a direct report asks them for their thoughts.
Money isn’t a “thank you.” Money is the company fulfilling their end of the contract.
Anon
Thanks for this- helpful. And I agree re the money is fulfilling their end of the contract..I don’t see it as a thank you but I thought that might come across as ungracious.
I think I might do something like that, and also ask about getting a more leadership-type running the file role on some new files we have
anon associate
I’m a young lawyer and agree with this. I also subscribe to the love languages concept. I think its very common for young lawyers to receive little to no positive feedback even if their work is quite good. Good feedback often comes in the form of “good job,” which I have been told by paralegals is rare at my firm. A partner said I did an excellent job on a brief earlier this week and I saved the email and almost shed a tear of gratitude. Once I got used to the idea that sending my work out without comment was praise, I felt a lot more secure in my job. A few years ago I left my first law firm and found out that a partner I thought was neutral about me loved my work and I was his favorite associate. Um, coulda told me that earlier, buddy.
I would advise focusing on the good performance reviews. Hang on to that, and the rare moment that a partner takes the time to give you praise or say “thanks for all your hard work.” Other partner “love languages” (lol, but bear with me) are a) bringing you to meet clients, b) asking about how you like your work and if you feel like your skill set is progressing, c) indicating that you have a future at the firm, and d) increasingly giving you more responsibility.
Meredith Grey
As a words of affirmation person, I get in this slippery space too. I’m not a huge fan of knowing I’m looking for any version of love/praise/whatever from work, so when I notice I’m getting irritated bc I’m not getting workplace validation, it’s usually a signal that it’s also not happening as much as I need it to in my personal life. With this realization, I’ve then gone to DH with something along the lines of “uh things have been a bit worse than usual at work, I might need a few more peptalks/TLC than usual.” It helps.
Anonymous
I think it’s mostly nonsense that needy people use to be demanding and men use to explain why they are bad partners.
Anonymous
This is so fascinating to me. You truly don’t believe people communicate differently? And that it’s not valuable to understand how a person communicates? It’s called “love language” because that’s s3xier than “How to communicate better” but that’s all it is.
Anonymous
Oh, no, I believe people have different communications styles for sure. It’s specifically this dumbed down short hand I don’t like. Gives people an easy out on something that shouldn’t be simple.
CPA Lady
It’s not an easy out, its a starting point.
Anonymous
+1 to CPA Lady – sure, it’s “just” a label, but it’s a label you can use to gain insight on your interactions. But if you don’t do the work, then it’s nothing but a label. Hence – a starting point, not the destination.
lawsuited
I wouldn’t call it an easy out, I’d call it an easy in. So no harm, no foul, IMO.
anon
But it’s not being a bad partner. Every love language is equally valid. No one is “needy” for feeling most loved when someone hugs them (physical touch) or takes out the trash (acts of service). And no one is a bad partner for expressing love by telling you you look beautiful (words of affirmation) or clearing their weekend to make plans with you (quality time). It’s really helpful for understanding how to show the people you love that you care about them.
Anonymous
Meh, I sort of think someone IS a bad partner if they think that taking out trash or doing dishes — things that they should be sharing in anyway — is a way of “showing love.” Nope, that’s just pitching in with household stuff that needs to get done, you’re not being “giving” to your spouse by doing it. And if you’re doing more than your share and then feeling resentful that your “act of love” isn’t being acknowledged, that is also silly and immature and you should just ask your partner to pitch in instead. Yes everyone has different ways of communicating etc. but I don’t think all of these ways are necessarily equal and to say that someone thinks they don’t have to show actual appreciation for their partner because they are doing household tasks is just another way of saying that person needs to learn how to grow up and be in a relationship.
January
No, but when I came home to a note that my (retired) dad had cleaned out my fridge for me, I felt warm fuzzies. (And a little spoiled).
Anonymous
That’s because doing things for others doesn’t speak to you as a show of affection. For those of us who do feel love this way, you are basically saying what we think and feel isn’t valid.
anonymous
Don’t be so myopic. No one is arguing that doing household chores is an exceptional act of love-it’s an example. Acts of service can include things that are “above and beyond,” like making sure my car gets its oil changed on time, picking up my dry cleaning for me when I’m stressed, making my favorite dish for dinner, taking public transit *to* park and ride at the airport and then picking me up (true story)….care taking.
The love language theory isn’t about making a conscious decision that you will show love in only one way and then feel resentful if your spouse isn’t acknowledging that you took out the trash. It’s about identifying the ways that you subconsciously express love and using that knowledge to better communicate with your partner.
ezt
So I get what you guys are saying and I do think “acts” can certainly be a valid way of showing love. But household tasks are a bad example because you’re not doing a favor to your spouse by doing them, much as you aren’t “helping out” or “babysitting” when you care for you own child. You take out the garbage because otherwise you would live in a house full of garbage. You do it for yourself as much as your spouse. Of course, if you do something special (like get up early and take out the garbage when it was actually my turn, because you know I’m tired or just because) that’s different and absolutely a valid way to show you care.
Anonymama
Nah, if I usually do the dishes, but had a particularly hard day, and spouse does the dishes for me so I can relax a bit earlier, that makes me feel way more loved than if he says “I love you” (which takes no effort) or buys me a gift (which is nice but sometimes feels… Wasteful? Impractical? Unnecessary?).
Blonde Lawyer
I absolutely loved it and it made me relate to my friends and family better, not just my husband. I realized my best friend and I have completely different love languages and that’s why we care about different things the other does.
lawsuited
In terms of the quiz: I got married young (23) and my husband and I found the quiz very helpful.We have completely different love languages from each other (I’m acts of service and gifts, he’s words of affirmation and physical touch) and it probably would have taken us a lot longer to figure that out but for the quiz. I imagine people who are older have figured out their own love languages and would be able to articulate them without the quiz.
In terms of love languages: I absolutely believe that it’s helpful to know what category(ies) you and your loved ones fall into. It’s not true that everyone feels loved by all of the love languages (some people hate physical touch, some people hate compliments), and to the extent that you are a person who enjoys all love languages it’s still helpful for the people who want to show you they love you to know what you need/appreciate the most.
I need a cool corporette commenter name
I found the love languages especially helpful for my kid. He is high on quality time (not alone in that I know) and also acts of service. It helped me see that doing things for him isn’t babying him but helping him feel loved and taken care of.
Jitterbug
My boyfriend has asked me to attend a couple weddings with him this fall. I’m pretty ecstatic, because this is an indicator the guy is serious about me and I haven’t gotten to this point in a relationship since college (long-term boyfriend planned to take me to his cousin’s wedding, but then we broke up). Here’s the thing, I’m 27 and I’ve only attended one wedding as an adult, and it was a relatively chill family wedding. I’ve never been someone’s wedding date, and I’m worried I’m going to commit some major faux-pas due to inexperience.
Obviously I know to dress nicely (although I have no idea which dresses I’ll end up wearing), be polite, and not get stupid drunk, but are there “rules” a wedding date is supposed to follow that may not be obvious?
Anonymous
You’re overthinking this. There are no special rules beyond generally being a good guest. Be prepared for everyone to ask you when you’re getting married, though.
Lynn
Yes. That is the worst. Just laugh it off and say “I’m in no hurry.” Don’t give them any reason to keep up that line of questioning. Also, I don’t think being a date at a wedding means he’s serious, although it probably means he doesn’t intend to break up with you anytime soon.
Observation
I am not trying to pile on at all re: the invitation being an indicator of seriousness, but I found it funny that you say you think that it is, then in the same sentence “long-term boyfriend planned to take me to his cousin’s wedding, but then we broke up.” Haha, doesn’t that mean that in the past, such an invitation has really not been an indicator of anything at all? Just found it funny.
Jitterbug
Well, I broke up with him. It’s not like he put me down as a +1 and bailed.
As for this guy, the save-the-date for his cousin’s wedding said they’d reserved one seat for him. They must have changed that once they realized he was in a relationship. I wasn’t even going to go since I’d registered for an event that weekend, but when his family said they wished I could go, I decided to sell my pass for the event and attend.
EM
I beg to differ–it is not an indication that he is serious about you. At all. If you want to know how serious the relationship is, you will have to ask him.
Having said that, don’t overthink it. Be polite and treat it like any other outing with family or friends, either yours or his.
Anonymous
There are no rules. Dress appropriately, be polite, don’t get stupid drunk. The perfect wedding date!
I guess the only tip I can think of is be able to move around the room and socialize on your own. At least to some degree. Introduce yourself to people. Small talk. Give him the chance to catch up with people without him worrying about whether you’re having a good time or feeling isolated.
Jitterbug
That’s a good point, and probably not something I would think about.
Impatient
Dress for the occasion (no white ballgowns, nothing too crazy, but seriously not that hard), show up on time, be polite, don’t get too drunk, and help give an appropriate gift. That’s it. You have nothing to worry about.
When in doubt, smile and nod.
Oh, and don’t use your cellphone to take photos all through the ceremony. They’re probably paying a photog big money to do that.
Jitterbug
“When in doubt, smile and nod.”
Ha! Yes, very important :)
anon
Disagree re gift. It’s the invitee’s responsibility to get a gift, not the +1’s (who probably doesn’t have the invitation or know the couple). That said, I’d ask my date if they’d like me to contribute to a gift.
Totally agree re: don’t take pictures during the ceremony, and I’d add don’t take pictures during the first dance or cake cutting or other key moments that you know are going to be covered by the photographer. Also, offer to step aside so your date can get a picture with the happy couple without you, but if the couple says you’re welcome then don’t make a thing about it.
Jitterbug
I was wondering about the gift, I figured he’d ask me for help picking or paying if he wanted it, but I’ll touch base with him about that.
And I know people find it annoying to take pictures during important moments, I wasn’t planning on it. I don’t even know the people getting married, so it wouldn’t make sense to pull out my phone to snap pictures instead of just enjoying the event.
Anonymous
No. This is a sign he has weddings to attend and doesn’t want to go alone. Don’t play these silly mind games, talk to him.
No rules to follow.
Anonymous
I guess I am a little old school, but I think it means he’s relatively serious, especially if it’s a family wedding. There’s no way I would bring a guy I didn’t see a future with to a wedding with all my extended family. I’ve attended plenty of weddings alone even when I had a plus one, and would much rather go solo than introduce my friends and family to someone I know is not the one. But I got together with my now-H before online dating was a huge thing, so maybe things are different now.
Jitterbug
Nope, thinking this was serious was stupid of me. I mean, there *have* been other indicators that he’s serious about me, other than being invited to attend weddings with him, (we also met each other’s parents recently, which I thought was big, but probably isn’t) but it’s foolish to think so. We’re only 5 months in, it’s not a big thing and I need to stop letting myself get excited about things.
Senior Attorney
No you don’t! Enjoy it! Don’t get yourself all tied up in knots, but I think it’s fun and perfectly fine to have that little shiver of “ooh! this might mean something” in a situation like this! Dating can be a roller coaster and I think it’s okay to put your arms over the head when you’re at the top…
MNF
+1 well said SA
anon
Not everyone thinks this way, though. And ime men are especially unlikely to think wedding date = she’s going to be in my life for a while. Men don’t get dinged for having a quick succession of relationships like women do. A man who brings a different date to the 8 weddings he has this year is a “player.” I think you know what people call a woman who does the same.
Anonymous
My (now) husband took me to his brother’s wedding in another state after we’d known each other for 3 weeks. He confessed much later that he “hadn’t really thought about it” and figured I’d “be a cool, fun date.” Obviously it worked out well for us, but he didn’t invite me because he knew I was the one and needed his family to meet me immediately.
Nancy Raygun
Thank you for putting this so well. I was just trying to explain this to a friend who was like “This guy says he doesn’t want to be my boyfriend, but he does boyfriend things with me.” But I don’t want to pile on about this tangent. Try not to hype the invitation up in your mind as “proof” of something other than the fact that enjoys being around you, which is awesome. Just have fun, I’m sure you’ll be fine.
Jitterbug
PS: I do agree with you, I personally wouldn’t take someone to a wedding unless we were in a serious, long-term relationship. But most modern people are more relaxed about that and will take whoever makes the most sense, because going stag is super boring.
Hildy
I once went on a first date to a wedding – I met him a couple days before, he was good friends with the bride and groom and so they didn’t mind him tacking on a plus one (I guess, I was much younger and not thinking about the logistics of wedding planning at the time – now that I think about it maybe it drove them crazy!) – and then never went out with him again, so not necessarily an indication of seriousness! Though he did ask me out again, so who knows.
Meredith Grey
While your list of rules is perfect, and ditto to all who’ve said not to over think it, two more tips:
– Offer to be the one to take the picture, particularly if said weddings are family related and someone wants a “family photo.”
– Be open to the possibility of an after party. If it’s an overnight, back an extra outfit and comfortable flats.
Senior Attorney
Oh, and don’t catch the bridal bouquet. I guarantee you the bride has somebody she wants to have catch it. Line up with the other girls if you like and make a half-hearted attempt, but there is no bigger buzz kill than somebody the bride doesn’t know catching her bouquet.
It’s happened to me twice now! LOL
Jitterbug
Yes, I read this somewhere else recently, that’s something I wouldn’t have thought of! Although I’m pretty sure I’d refrain anyway, since catching the bouquet might give my guy a heart attack. Or at least prompt a very obvious “hun, we’re not there yet” talk.
Anonymous
Don’t be surprised if they skip the bouquet/garter toss. I go to 8-10 weddings every year, and this is one of those traditions that seems to have fallen out of favor.
Idea
Thank goodness. I explained it to a friend as, “everyone who wants to be married and is sad about that doesn’t want to be called out on on it on the floor, and everyone who is happy about not being married doesn’t want to be cursed with being the next one.”
Senior Attorney
Yeah we had planned to present the bouquet to the longest-married couple, but by the time we got to that point in the reception, all the older couples had left! ROFL!!!
I didn’t want to keep it because I didn’t want to see it turn brown and wither away. So at the after party I tossed it to my best friend and somebody’s random girlfriend, and wouldn’t you know, Random Girlfriend caught it. Don’t be that girl, ladies…
Ellen
Yay Kat! This is a great dress, but I can NOT wear dresses with pocket’s b/c Dad already told me I have saddle bag’s and that would make it even worse when I put stuff in my pocket’s, even a hankercheif. FOOEY!
As for the OP, do NOT sweat it. Be yourself, dress niceley and do NOT drink at all. Many guys get drunk at wedding’s (and everywhere else), and you do NOT want to be a woman who drinks at wedding’s. Even when it is YOUR turn to be a bride, do NOT drink. You will look bad in picture’s long after you sober up. You will have a great time and try and keep your boyfreind away from the bottel, even tho the drink’s are free. With any luck, you will be planning your OWN wedding soon. YAY!!!!
Meg Murry
I think your rules are fine. I’d just add “make sure you can walk/dance/stand in your shoes” and “don’t wear pointy heels to an outdoor wedding, you’ll sink into the grass”.
If the weddings are being held in a church, you may want to familiarize yourself with that faith a tiny bit (for instance, there may be communion as part of a Catholic service, but as a non-Catholic you would just sit or stand quietly, not take communion yourself).
If you’ve met the family before at other events, you may want to ask your boyfriend for a crash course reminder in who is who, or to re-introduce you, because it’s awkward to be at a family event where everyone knows your name but you can’t remember theirs.
ER
in my experience “on time” to a wedding means 15 minutes early. Don’t be finding a seat when the bride walks down the aisle.
Have fun!
Diana Barry
OK, ladies, ISO more comfy slim ankle pants for work in black and grey. Right now I have 2 pairs of the J crew “eaton boy trouser” from a few years ago, but the sewn-in seam on the front is falling out and they are not quite slim enough through the leg. Any recommendations?
Also ankle pants on me = need tall sizes or regular length trousers. The 28″ length hits almost mid-calf and looks silly.
An
Have you tried the BR Sloan ankle pant?
Diana Barry
I haven’t. Is it more straight or curvy fitting? I will look up.
AIMS
I like BR, also Loft had a good pair called “skinny” something or other. I was pleasantly surprised by the quality. But I would wait for a 40% off deal for either.
pugsnbourbon
I am wearing the Loft “essential skinny” pants today – they’re slim but not too tight and they hit at my ankle, not mid-calf. They’re available in tall, but alas, no gray.
An
I think it’s more straight fitting, but they’re kind of stretchy.
Nati
Even if I size up, I find the Sloan fits like a legging and not a pant. Is this just me? I have never understood the fit but maybe it’s just my body because they seem to be popular.
Anonymous
I found the Sloan to be pretty curvy–too small in the waist and too big in the hips.
Anon
Strange, I found the opposite – fit in the hips but too big at the waist.
Cornellian
I feel like the above two replies sum up BR sizing for me.
MDMom
I think the BR Ryan slim-straight crop is actually better for work. It’s in more work appropriate fabrics and has a looser fit than Sloan. I have them in Gray and just got black too. The Sloan in the same size is very tight on me- fine for casual but way too tight for work (and I am not very conservative). I actually think I’m going to return the new Sloans I just got and try in next size up to see if that would be more work appropriate.
Nati
Yes, my feelings exactly. I am actually wearing a pair of Ryans today!
Thistle
Sloans are totally skin tight on me and so not work (or any other time) suitable. I have Ryan’s and Averys which are both long on me and I’m 5’9. Ryan’s pretty much hit the top of my foot and Avery’s (which im wearing today) are really ankle length. The models they use must all be 6′.
Anonymous
I have love, loved the Athleta Palisade ankle pant. It is perfection (I am a pear). The fabric is more casual, but I wear mine to work in BigLaw and not just on Fridays. I look like Big Thighs Ahead in everything else that’s not straight leg or boot cut.
pockets
Elie Tahari Callum pant. They’re technically exercise pants but I wear them to work all the time (drawstring tucked in, shirt untucked to hide elastic waist) (my office is business casual). I wore them to a lunch date once with a friend who works in private equity and she confirmed that they were completely work appropriate.
Diana Barry
Thanks. These last 2 look short, do you have the inseam length?
pockets
I don’t. I’m 5’6″ with long legs and the pants come to right above my ankles.
Runner 5
Try the Boden Richmond trouser. The straight cut one has a little notch at the hem which makes me think it would look excellent worn as an ankle pant.
Anonymous
Or the Boden Richmond 7/8 which is a true ankle.
ArenKay
Agree completely; they come in tall, are really well-made and flattering.
First Year Anon
The gap has a pair I know they sell online in tall. I don’t know how well they will hold up long term. The problem I have with black is that it fades depending on the fabric. I got them in olive green (so more casual look) but they might work for your needs.
Cat
I love the JCrew Maddie style and bought them in every color in 2014 (was disappointed they didn’t reappear in 2015 but I see from the latest catalog that they’re back!) Last time around they were offered in tall sizes as well, though I haven’t checked yet this year.
Anon8
I ordered the Exact Stretch Skinny Pants from The Limited. I’m on the opposite end of the spectrum and need petite lengths. I don’t recall if they had tall sizes, but they may be the style you’re looking for.
lost academic
They do, but wondering if you can comment on how the fit (waist and thigh) compares to the other exact stretch pants. I basically want to know if I may need to size up and then probably alter to fit that part of my body to get skinny or ankle pants of that type, bc I am in love with the exact stretch pants :) (And am a tall)
Anonymous
Try Talbots. I’m wearing black slim fitting ankle pants from them right now. I’m plus size, but I believe they have talls.
LawDawg
I bought perfectly fitting ankle pants from Talbots two weeks ago (I think they were Daltons) . I wore them once and by midday they were pilling at the thighs. They weren’t too tight and there wasn’t excessive rubbing. I loved them in the store, but returned them right away.
Greensleeves
Check out the Halogen Taylor Ankle Pants if you’re looking for a curvy fit. I have them in black and gray. They are work appropriate fabric and definitely fit like slim pants, not leggings. I’m not sure what the length is, but I’m 5’5″ and they are a bit longer than I’d like. (Mental note – get pants hemmed!)
Bonnie
I like the BR Sloans and the Halogen ankle pants. So many other brands stretch out in the knees during the day.
lawsuited
The Lord & Taylor Kelly pants are soooo stretchy and comfortable. They’re not ponte knit, so they hold their shape and colour very well. They’re so comfortable, I sometimes wear them on weekends, and that’s saying a lot because I usually live in leggings/jeggings on the weekend!
Diana Barry
Thanks ladies! I will try a few and report back. I need straight fit and NOT curvy so we’ll see how it goes. :)
Anonymous
Please do report back!
Signed, a fellow non-curvy person who can’t find flattering ankle pants
CA airport driving?
Work wants me to fly in/out of the Ontario airport and then drive to a meeting in TwentyNine Palms (not during rush hour either way). They say it will be much better than either PSP (limited flights to east coast) or LAX (too far, traffic drama). I have no idea — I prefer never to drive in/around LA (San Diego is fine). Rental car returns can always be dicey (BWI, I’m looking at you). If I had more time, I’d just drive from Phoenix b/c I love Phoenix. It looks like it should be fine, but I defer to the Hive.
Anonymous
I’d try to fly into Palm Springs, even if it involves a layover. Ontario is almost two hours, can be more with traffic. The traffic isn’t as stressful as LA/San Diego, and it’s certainly doable, but I would opt for a layover and a shorter drive if I had the choice and work was paying.
Don’t do Phoenix, that’s really far.
CA airport driving?
PSP doesn’t seem to have good travel options (maybe my days, maybe sold out, maybe not the right airlines (ulimate connection is back in CLT, perhaps to another military location on the east coast)). Would love to fly to there, but travel gods are saying no on that as an option.
Anonymous
Ah, ok. You’ll be fine with Ontario then. The traffic may be a little heavy but it’s nothing like LA.
SuziStockbroker
I live in Ontario and was so confused by this for a second.
More coffee is in order, clearly.
Nati
If you mean Ontario, Canada like I think you do – me too. For a second I was also thinking “HEY there’s more than one airport in Ontario, okay?! We’re not that small-time. Does she mean Toronto??”
SuziStockbroker
Exactly. I was like, WTH, we have more than one airport here. Too funny.
CA airport driving?
Ontario, California
not
Ontario, Canada (THAT would be a really far, but probably beautiful, trip to 29 Palms)
Nati
Have a coffee now and can now interact meaningfully with the Internet :-). Have a great trip! And if you ever need advice from us Ontarians (Canadian ones), maybe post in the afternoon? Hah!
lawsuited
Me too!
TO Lawyer
+1 – I had the same reaction.
Anonymous
My general rule is to avoid LAX if at all possible. Last time I had to go to San Bernardino County, I ended up flying in to John Wayne. Ontario looks closer.
Meg March
Driving from Ontario to 29 Palms will not be like driving in LA. I went to college in the Ontario area, and often drove home via the 10. It is a beautiful drive. I also preferred flying through Ontario when I could– it is a “real” airport (not dinky with only a couple gates), but is so much more relaxing that flying through LAX.
CA airport driving?
Pomona? Good to know it’s a pretty drive. I lumped all SoCal colleges together just based on people waiting at the LAX gate.
Anon
Ontario is a great little airport. When I lived nearby I often flew in and out of Ontario. Don’t do LAX. The drive should be relatively easy.
Senior Attorney
I couldn’t agree more. LAX to 29 Palms is folly.
Susan
It’ll be great. Ontario is a terrific little airport – so easy to get in/out. If it’s non-rush hour, the drive will be easy. Avoid LAX.
GirlFriday
Sorry you have to go to Twentynine Palms :P Definitely fly out of Ontario. Your company probably won’t want to fork over $300+ for a flight out of Palm Springs (but I guess you could ask), and Twentynine Palms to LAX is misery.
DC Style
Ladies I need some fashion help. Lately, I’ve noticed myself falling into the trap of “DC business casual.” You know what I’m talking about: pencil skirts, cardigans, and beige pointy toe flats. Or sometimes Blazers instead of cardigans, or colorful flats. But if you live in DC, I think you know what I’m talking about — there is simply a DC “look” that nearly every 20- and 30 – something in DC seems to have adopted. There’s nothing wrong with this look, per se — it’s professional and nice looking, but I find it oh-so-boring and a little amateurish. Why do professional women in New York (for example) look so much more sophisticated? I’ve studied it endlessly, and I just can’t put my finger on it. So: how do I transition my look from “nice DC girl” to “powerful, sophisticated woman”?
Anonymous
Do we? Cut out the cardigans, stop shopping only at JCrew, wear a more sophisticated color palate.
MDMom
Yea I think this is basically it. I fall into the same trap so I get it. I have banned the following from my wardrobe, which are things I don’t like much anyway and tend to typify this look: colored cardigans, colorful/costumey statement necklaces, round toe flats.
I never shop at jcrew anyway because their price/quality ratio has been crap on the few pieces I bought there in the past. I am petite and on a budget, so I still look to Banana Republic (best fit for me) and to lesser extent Ann Taylor for suiting basics. But I get a lot of tops and other pieces from h&m and Nordstrom.
I think you also have to consciously think about the work style you want, otherwise you end up with Ann Taylor default just because it’s easy. It will take a while to shift your wardrobe to fit that style/vision. I’m working on it now myself.
virginia
+1. I think you hit the nail on the head. That describes my style up until last year in DC. Now I have transitioned my wardrobe to:
-Only black/navy cardigans, and gotten rid of any oversized or colorful cardigans
-Added longer crepe blazers with straight-leg black/navy pants
-Structural or crisp white blouses and tops
-Sheath dresses in cobalt, burgundy, cream (think Claire Underwood taupeish), red, dark green, or black and white patterned. I love fit and flare dresses, but they made me look way too young
-Pointy toe shoes over round toe
The key to lose the frump is structure and fit, with a sophisticated color palette.
virginia
Or menswear textures too
Adele
Stop wearing beige flats, don’t wear ballet flats in bright colors, try more interesting shoes (lace up or block heels), stop with pastel or bright preppy colors (oxblood and dark green are very in now), do not wear those plastic bib necklaces from Jcrew and bauble bar.
EM
Oh yeah. One of the reasons I think for the similarity of styles is the (relative) lack of funds for younger people compared with what those in NYC earn (staffer vs. investment banker.) Also, in NYC there are a gazillion opportunities (sample sales, consignment shops, etc.) to dress well with less money. Not to mention, of course, that there aren’t as many places to shop in DC.
My recommendation is that you “up the basics.” For example, instead of a plain black pant, look for one with a tuxedo stripe. Or finely woven pattern. Add texture and look for stupendous materials, and get each and every item tailored to fit your body. Then add accessories…good ones. Quality jewelry. Or gloves and hats.
AIMS
I don’t think it’s just more places to shop. NYC is overrun with the same mall stores as most of America now and honestly almost no one I know shops at small well-curated boutiques that have directional, one of a kind goods, unless they have a lot of disposable income and/or work in fashion. And sample sales? There’s no time to sift through all that unless you are in school or you don’t work. I wouldn’t even say we have better vintage and thrift stores because everything decent gets picked up fast and is marked up to the point that it’s almost not worth it. My best thrift finds have always been in random charity boutiques in small little towns.
I think places like NYC just have more people and the people are diverse and often creative (some, anyway) and so there is always a wide range of styles in all budgets and people come here from all over the world and that just leads to inspiration. We’re all on the subway or walking around. Everyone interacts. There’s just a synergy from that. This may be sort of unkind to say but I had two friends who I always thought of as my super fashionable, know what looks fantastic friends, move away in the past few years and I am surprised by how much their style seems less interesting now. They’re still beautiful and I love them, obviously, but I no longer find their opinion on what I should wear to that special whatever to be that helpful. It’s all just a bit more provincial, for lack of a better word.
Anyway, sorry for the long post. OP, I’d try to add some unusual element to your normal uniform. Maybe it’s a statement necklace (I just got an awesome chunky amber one that looks very major and powerful with everything from jeans and a tee to a boring sheath) or fun shoes (suede block heels with a pointy toe in burgundy?) or maybe an amazing bag.
Anonymous
I have no idea about the NYC v. DC thing, because the NYC lawyers, judges, and nonprofit folks I’ve encountered in the course of my work have all been incredibly schlumpy, with the exception of the fund-raising people. But in general, it comes down to tailoring and shoes. Get your clothes tailored to fit properly and wear sophisticated-looking shoes.
Tetra
I find sheath dresses look a little fancier than blouse + skirt + cardigan, even if you wear a cardigan with the dress. Not sure why.
cbackson
I’m fairly down on cardigans, frankly. I used to love them, but lately they feel less…powerful, maybe?
Fishie
+1. I’ve ditched most of my cardigans for cute topper jackets. Cardigans for no-meeting days only.
Cb
Where are these cute topper jackets to be found? For not a million dollars? I wear sleeved dresses and wrap myself up in a blanket scarf at my desk but a jacket would be nice.
Anonymous
Yes, where do you find the cute topper jackets? All the blazers I can find are too long to wear with dresses.
CA airport driving?
The recommendation always used to be shop at Relish. But Relish doesn’t work on GS-9 + student loans :(
anon anon Armani
Try White House/BM for topper jackets? It’s hard. I tend to have about 3/4 solid jackets bc most of my dresses (I can only wear fit and flare) are patterned.
I wish more fit and flare were in solid colors, then I could have more patterned “fun” jackets.
Also look at Last Call and Off Fifth for interesting jackets.
Ally McBeal
I basically have two work uniforms – 1) a dress and a blazer; or 2) trousers and a jacket. I wear both with heels (though different kinds of heels). My favorite jackets are from all over the place – Dress Barn, Talbots, Classiques Entier at Nordstrom.
For whatever reason, I never feel particularly pulled together in a skirt. I love the look of a narrow pencil skirt and a white blouse, but it just looks disheveled on me.
I agree that NYC dresses differently. After I moved from NYC to the West Coast, I kept thinking that people in NYC dressed more sharply (not metaphorically, but literally). Toes were pointier, shoulders were more structured, pants were more tailored. It’s a very specific NYC look and I can’t even put my finger on it, but I know it when I see it.
An
The DC look is more preppy, I think? Maybe part of it is the colors people wear.
pockets
I think this is it. DC is preppier colors. NYC is black and more understated colors.
Anonymous
Please stop the beige pointy toe flats. I hate them, and I’m glad they seem to be on the way out in Boston.
1) you look barefoot
2) they aren’t actually comfortable
3) people often get the patent leather or plastic and don’t take care of them. Scuffed shiny shoes are so ugly.
NYNY
Are you married to flats? Because I find that heels up your sophistication quite a bit. I’m not putting flats down, but they can look young.
Overall, your uniform sounds a little too safe. You can dress conservatively and appropriately, but make one thing a little riskier. Lose the pearls (I know you didn’t say pearls, but this is just an example) for a bolder necklace or a couple of delicate layered chains. Wear your usual pieces, but in an unexpected color combination. Or wear all black (or all navy, or all grey) with colored shoes for contrast.
Anonymous
The key is more structured flats. Look into Cobb Hill, Aerosoles, Vionic…not cheap flats with no insole and toe cleavage. My pet peeve is flats that have such a narrow side that they don’t cover your foot and look more like sandals that could break in two.
Senior Attorney
Even a 1″ kitten heel seems a lot more sophisticated than flats, I think.
Caro
I was having these exact thoughts recently. If you’re willing to spend some money, try trunk club. There’s a location in penn quarter where you can meet with a stylist.
Alana
DC style has less leeway because in NYC many people work in creative industries. Perhaps you can explore smaller designers via the web and visit NYC for sample sales. As someone who prefers architetural styles without having the budget of a major gallery owner, sample sales are where I go to look for something interesting.
Anonymous
I’m in DC- I know exactly what look you mean.
I’d stay away from faded or wrinkly items always, and make sure that everything is tailored and fits well. I think that structured, tailored pieces look much more elegant and pulled together.
I’m staying away from the loft at all costs- everything from there hangs wrong and looks too casual,too frumpy, or too sorority girl to me.
Anonymous
You might check out Sara Campbell in Alexandria- their website is terrible but they have beautiful things, made in the USA, mostly professional, somewhat colorful, and not a faded cardigan in sight. Some of it skews a little old-british-lady but one or two pieces from there could brighten up some of the basics you already have.
Jimmyk
I had the same issues with cardigans so I have made myself stop buying them as well. You can try more interesting outer layers like light leather jackets or bomber jackets. You an even get away with the minimal biker jackets. Something like the jacket below would look great with a dress for the work week and also great with jeans on the weekend.
https://www.wilsonsleather.com/product/wilsons-leather-asymmetrical-collarless-leather-cycle-jacket.do?sortby=ourPicks&page=2&from=fn
Anon
Wear more neutral colors. Pick a couple neutrals that look good on you (black and navy work for me) and then organize your wardrobe around that with a few interesting accent colors.
Jewelry that looks expensive (i.e., real metals and stones) but also has some interesting detail to it and doesn’t look like something you bought at Macy’s. Definitely avoid bib necklaces.
Lose the cardigans. Try unstructured blazers and sheath dresses. Or structured blazers with slacks and a top underneath (not a button-down unless you are one of the few women it looks good on).
Anon
Also, no Michael Kors or Tory Burch… Much better to avoid shoes, bags, watches, etc. that are visibly branded and focus instead on a structured, sleek silhouette with materials that look high quality.
NYNY
NY to DC recent transplant here. Feel like I am surrounded by jcrew all day long. Also, it seems like there might be a thing here of wearing ‘boring’ clothes to appear serious. As in, my pleated khakis convey the fact that I am a Serious Thinker and work at an Important Job. Some differences I’ve noticed: 1.) A lot more color – NY default color is black. NY works with a deeper color palette in general, you’re more likely to see deep blue or cobalt than royal blue, oxblood or faded red than lipstick red, etc. 2.) The way clothes hang: NY has looser, flow-y-er clothes – a draping blazer rather than a tight blazer, etc. and almost invariably slim leg pants (or super wide leg to make a statement). Here in DC I see bootcuts often, which to me reads as dated. 3.) Heels more as a default, or a low wedge. 4.) DC has more ‘art & craft’ jewelry or pearls. You could experiment with more geometric or other jewelry. 5.) Handbags! Structured handbags are the norm in NY for work, here in DC I see a lot of employer-monogrammed totes. So, a dressier bag.
That name is taken!
Hi. I’ve noticed a few posts recently using NYNY that aren’t mine. I’ve been using that handle here for a few years. Can you change to something else, please?
OP
Of course! Consider it done.
NYNY (OG)
Thanks!,
NYNY (OG)
Thanks!
Anonymous
Love the colour of this dress! Any suggestions for other tops/dresses in this colour? I have a hard time finding this shade but I always get compliments when I wear it.
anon for this
How do you know when to stop going to therapy? I started earlier this year for the first time in my life, after a traumatic event…I’m not totally over the event, but at this point, I don’t think dwelling on talking about it is making me feel any better. I’m not in general a person who talks about feelings a lot. At the point I started therapy, I was so upset that I thought I needed an external sounding-board, and it was somewhat helpful but not super different than talking to one of my insightful/introspective friends who’s been through a lot of therapy herself.
It’s not that my life other than that is/was 100% perfect, but I don’t have a clear objective to continuing at this point, and spending so much money stresses me out (although I can afford it). I did have a chaotic family, so at the back of my mind I’ve always thought “hmm, I wonder if I should go to therapy just in case” even though I don’t have any major emotional problems that I am aware of. My life is generally very good.
I mentioned potentially quitting to my therapist last month, and she said people keep going after an external event is processed in order to gain more self-knowledge. But I think I know myself pretty well and don’t see why this is a better route to self-knowledge than thinking/reading/talking to friends and family/experiencing art/other things that aren’t costing me a lot of money and time every week.
I don’t want to be making a mistake just because I’m resistant to spending money and don’t enjoy talking about my feelings…but I’m having a hard time understanding the value I’m getting out of it.
Anonymous
I’ve reduced the frequency of my visits. At first, I went every week, then every other, now once a month. I’d suggest a similar weaning off schedule. Be upfront with your therapist. Weekly sessions are a significant investment of time and money.
Anon
Clearly it’s not doing anything for you. So quit. Use the money to do something to make you happier — whether it’s going on trips or out to dinners with friends.
I think the same way as you — not too talkative and don’t want external sounding boards and when I do, it’s more comfortable to talk to a friend who knows me rather than a perfect stranger. Just be careful though — don’t lean on friends too much. They have their own lives/problems too and you don’t want them to get to the point where they’re thinking — dinner with Suzy, great that means 90 min of talking her thru her job/family/boyfriend issues.
Anonymous
If the only reason you’d stop is because of the money, I’d say hang in there a little longer. When I think about all the money I’ve spent in my life on a fad diet, personal trainer, barre classes, athletic clothing and supplements, I wonder why I’m willing to spend so much trying to work on my physical fitness, but am so reticent to invest in improving my mental fitness. Therapy (t0 me) is like working out. You could probably live a long, healthy, happy life without it, but it definitely helps me feel better to get “mentally fit.”
Emmers
Is your therapist a trauma specialist? There’s evidence that traditional talk-therapy is potentially retraumatizing when it comes to people dealing with the aftermath of trauma; it might be worth trying again with someone who is specifically trained in how to approach the trauma in the most productive ways.
lawsuited
So, everyone is different – some people are more/less psychologically-minded, some people process things more quickly/slowly, etc. – so what works for someone else in terms of therapy frequency may not be a good fit for your personality at all.
That said, I tend to see my therapist in spurts of 4-6 sessions when something comes up that I need help thinking and talking through. A couple of years ago I had an acute work issue that was causing me distress, so I saw my therapist pretty intensively for several months and then stopped once the issue was resolved. Right now I’m having an acute issue with one of my siblings, so I’ve scheduled some sessions to work through that. During these sessions, we talk about my history, and I find that valuable because it is oriented towards working through a current problem, but I wouldn’t be interested in wading through my childhood every 2 weeks on an ongoing basis without some goal in mind.
LAnon
I have seen a therapist on and off for the past few years, and I know it’s time to switch to “off” when my therapy sessions become an afterthought.
When I need to be seeing a therapist, the therapy tends to be near the front of my mind – I think about things that we talked about last time or things I want to talk about next time; I try to actively apply and process suggestions from my therapist. Also, I feel like there is lots of material to cover in sessions and it feels like the time goes quickly.
When it’s time to taper off, I totally forget about therapy until I look at my calendar on an appointment day and think, “Oh yeah I’ve gotta go to that today.” And then the time drags a bit or it feels like we’re just filling the hour and trying to find things to talk about that might be meaningful.
Dress Me
Posted here about a month ago regarding what to wear to an interview in the music industry – big transition as I currently work in finance (not lawyer). Consensus was no suit, but sheath and blazer.
It’s a much more senior position than I’ve ever had (mid 20s, this is an upper mgmt role), so I still want to seem older than I am and capable. I have decided to wear a black sheath dress and this Crosshatch Tweed Peplum Jacket from Ann Taylor (link to follow).
I want to make the outfit a little funkier/hipper with some accessories. Thinking wine-colored shoes. But can I wear a necklace under this jacket, given its neckline? Maybe a longer necklace, hitting below the bust? Would I be better off just adding a belt (thinking leopard)? Help!
OP
http://www.anntaylor.com/crosshatch-tweed-peplum-jacket/416177
Anonymous
This is pretty conservative. Maybe wear it buttoned with a long colorful necklace over it?
Perhaps consider a colored skirt – eggplant? vs a black dress as a way to add more personality.
An
I think the sleeves are just the right length for a bold bracelet.
Anonymous
Bold Bracelet and colored shoes that coordinated or matched would be great!
Bonnie
The jacket is too closed for a necklace but would look great with an interesting bracelet. Avoid multiple clinky bracelets though.
lawsuited
One big bracelet/cuff and coloured shoes would be perfect (although I think it’s sort of early for burgundy and burgundy is not overly fun – maybe teal or emerald green instead?)
Anon_00
How does your SO react when you make a mistake? How do you treat yourself when you make a mistake?
I’m more of a “no use crying over spilled milk person”. I acknowledge what happened, clean up the mess and figure out what to do to prevent the issue from happening again. Make sure the cap is on the milk carton and stop at the store to buy more.
My husband re-hashes what happens. How could that happen? Do you know sticky milk gets when it spills? Now we’re out of milk, etc.
I find myself not wanting to tell him when something goes wrong. For example, a few weeks ago we went grocery shopping and I started to get a really bad headache. When we got home we got the groceries out as fast as possible and then I went inside to lay down. Problem is that I left one bag in the trunk that had expensive meat from Whole Foods. It had shifted to the back and I was in a hurry and missed it.
I found it the next morning and disposed of myself and stopped at the store to buy more without ever telling my husband. I just didn’t want to deal with his reaction of how expensive a mistake it was, I should have told him the bag was there, etc.
This morning I was running late and in a hurry and opened my car door into the side fender of his truck. It left small dent and chipped off about a pea size amount of paint. He left before me this morning an carpooled with a co-worker, so I’ll have to tell him this evening once he gets home. I’m dreading having to deal with this because I know he’ll be upset. I’m really sorry for what I did. I was careless and wasn’t paying attention. I keep replaying it in my head wishing I had been more careful.
There’s other issues in the marriage and I feel like I’ve lost sight of what a normal, healthy relationship should be like. How would you react if it was your car?
anon
I’m guilty of re-hashing mistakes probably too harshly with my SO. I do the same thing to myself. I sometimes lose sight of the fact that, hey, it’s not cool to treat yourself that way, and it’s SUPER not cool to treat SO that way. I make an effort to be aware of it and to stop and apologize when I find myself doing it.
Like over the weekend when I was literally crying over spilled milk – SO set an open container of milk on its side in the fridge. The next morning, I found a fridge full of milk and was not. happy. Correct way to address this: “Hey, honey, please don’t leave an open container of milk on its side, it will leak. Can you help me clean this up?” My reaction: “WTF HAPPENED TO THE FRIDGE THE APOCALYPSE IS NIGH!”
Lynn
I laughed so hard at this.
But of course no one likes to be berated, and it’s not fair. The person doing the yelling is never perfect either. I used to yell over accidents, not at the person, just an expletive at the circumstance in general, no matter who caused it (myself or someone else). Having kids cured me of that. I realize that is supremely unhelpful information.
Anomanom
Your instincts that this is not normal and healthy are spot on. You should not be afraid to talk to your significant other, and while you didn’t use those words, that’s the impression I am getting.
Would I be initially upset if it were my car? Absolutely, wouldn’t we all be? But, like you, I am a it happened, let’s fix it and move on type of person. Someone on here (it may be Senior Attorney?) has posted several times on the idea that you should assume good intentions. I have adopted this as a bit of a mantra over the last few months and have realized that I expect that from the people close to me. You didn’t purposely harm his car, or forget the meat, or spill the milk. We are all human, we all do dumb things sometimes, it’s part of the package deal.
Senior Attorney
Yes to this times a zillion.
In my last marriage my husband berated me for everything and I was like you — didn’t tell him things unless I absolutely had to, and dreaded telling him things I had to.
In my current (Day Three and so far so amazing!) marriage, Lovely Husband and I assume good intentions, we laugh and move on. Just last night I took some flowers out of a vase but got distracted before I dumped the water. He picked up the vase to show somebody the markings on the bottom and poured nasty smelly old-flowers water all over the kitchen counter. We laughed and laughed and sopped up the mess and laughed some more and went on with our lives. And Ijust kept thinking “Wow. With his predecessor this would have been a gigantic fight.”
Spouses, of all people, should treat one another kindly.
ArenKay
This completely. My husband accidentally shattered the rearview window of my car in front of me (was taking something big and heavy out, stopped to say something to me and then shut the hatch without looking at the car). Glass went EVERYWHERE, and it cost hundreds to replace. My response at the time was to burst into hysterical laughter. Having grown up afraid of my father’s temper, I cannot tell you how good it is to be in a marriage where you don’t worry about your spouse’s judgment for normal human stupidity.
Mrs. Jones
Dents happen to cars. I wouldn’t care much. I might say, Honey, be more careful, but that’s it.
Anonymous
My husband would give me a look like “Seriously? Come on.” And I would say what you said “I’m sorry. I was being careless. It was an accident.” And he would probably say something like “Please try not to do that again.” And I would say “I’ll be more careful next time.”
My husband and I have talked about this and agreed our #1 rule in marriage is “Assume good intent.” Assuming that the other person is trying, wants to do the right thing, loves you and you’re on the same team has been the saving grace of our relationship. If he forgets to pick something up from the grocery store, it’s easy for me to think “He’s so selfish. He never worries about what I want. How hard is it to just listen?” But instead I try really hard to consciously think “He forgot. That’s it. You forget things too.” Assume good intent. And ask him to assume good intent of you.
pugsnbourbon
+1. It’s work to acknowledge and address those thoughts in the moment, but it gets easier.
lawsuited
Yikes.
My husband gets angry when HE makes a mistake, although he doesn’t get angry with me when I make a mistake. I don’t like him getting angry period, so although we’ve obviously had conversations in quiet moments about why that bothers me, if he’s not responding in the moment, I raise my voice to match his which sort of surprises him and snaps him out of it.
But, this is pretty different from your situation, because your husband is rubbing your nose in your mistake after you’ve already acknowledged it. I think if he gets upset, you should match his tone and say “Look, I dented the car. It was a mistake. Of course I didn’t mean to and I wish I hadn’t. But it’s very fixable, it’s not going to bankrupt us, and so it’s not worth you making me feel terrible about. Please let’s stop talking about it, and just move on to fixing it.”
If he responds to that, then great, but I don’t think that loving relationships have room in them for demeaning each other, and that’s what he’s doing by making so much of little mistakes and oversights that we should be able to make and fix without incident.
Anonymous
You two went together to the grocery store. You had a headache. Why didn’t you say “I have a headache”? Wouldn’t his response have been “go lie down I’ll bring this stuff in? You probably know it wouldn’t have been. Why wouldn’t he have taken equal responsibility for the forgotten bag?
You’re afraid of him and his reactions, seemingly with good reason.
Here’s how this went for my happily married parents. Mom backed dad’s fancy new Audi into the garage door because she forgot to open it. A week after he got the car. Dad was sad, worried mom was so tired, and they got the car fixed. Mom was sad she damaged it, and they moved on.
You have not lost sight of normal. You know what you have isn’t healthy.
GirlFriday
None of the previous advice is really helpful. I don’t have any helpful advice either (sorry), but my SO reacts similarly, so my sympathies. I do the same thing as you: avoid telling him stuff that I consider minor infractions. He just cannot. let. it. go. He’s not mean, he just obsesses. WHY did that happen? HOW could you have prevented it. Well I DIDN’T dude; I’m sorry! Can we move on? I really wish he’d go to counseling or something. Once when he overreacted, I broke down in tears (I am not the type who cries at the drop of a hat). It was the state-change that he needed. He immediately apologized for overreacting and said it wasn’t a big deal. I don’t make a habit of crying because I feel that’s manipulative, but sometimes I wish he’d just snap out of it.
PHX
Are we married to the same man? (Ha. Not really.) No real answers here but I want to affirm the “not healthy” component of the relationship. I’m still trying to figure out what to do with mine. Hugs.
Senior Attorney
For me it turned out to be a dealbreaker. If you discuss it with him and he keeps doing it, and you still decide to stay in the relationship, I think what I would do is say “I said I was sorry and I’m not going to let you scold me like a child.” And then leave the room if necessary. Every single time.
PHX
Senior Attorney — I am memorizing that statement and practicing it in the mirror. Thank you.
AnonResponder
I have a similar issue with my spouse, though maybe not on the same scale as yours. My DH gets really frustrated and re-hashes it regardless of who it was who made the mistake (him or me). If it was him he would say “d@mn! how did that happen?! I cant believe I did that!” and if it was me, then just substitute “I can’t believe you did that!”.
I’ve told him many times that it’s blamey language whereas what we need is constructive language and moving on – as you say, how do we prevent it from happening, or how can we fix this very specific issue (clean up the mess or get the carpet shampooed or whatever).
He agrees but sometimes he forgets and has the same reaction in the moment. I am particularly sensitive to home related items e.g. when he says “how did we not use the veggie before it got spoilt in the fridge?!” I hear it as “how did YOU not use the veggie”. I assume he is blaming me but he’s really just blaming himself and doesn’t think (AT ALL) that the household/kitchen is woman’s territory or anything like that. I do hear that in my brain because I grew up conditioned that running the home is my responsibility (had a SAHM and still have very traditional role parents). So he has learnt somewhat to not criticize the house because I take it very badly as a criticism of myself.
No solutions for you except have a talk with him when you are both cool headed. Have many talks with him. And yes, having kids helps a bit because these things happen on a daily basis so he may learn to under-react a bit. Otherwise, it’s just a personality type and it may not be possible to completely eliminate his reaction.
Anon
I’ll add this since it hasn’t come up in the other comments and may be helpful. Your descriptions resonated with me. My SO has been seeing a counselor because I determined it was unhealthy for our relationship and me and it turns out he has anxiety (so it wasn’t healthy for him either). Knowing that is helpful and I understand him better, but it is still hard at times to work through.
anon
so, i am just going to suggest that these situations (and your husband’s reaction to them) might have something to do with money. like, someone’s parents may be comfortable enough financially that fixing a brand new car after it was backed into a garage isn’t a big deal. if you are stretched too thin financially, then, yes, every little thing is a big deal. i beat myself up about stuff like this, but that is because i simply don’t have the room in my budget to back a car into a garage. i have to be so careful, all the time. it is a consequence of not making enough money.
Susan
If it were my super fancy dream car that I had sacrificed and saved to purchase and I had just driven it home from the lot and was admiring how beautiful and shiny and new it was and then you dinged it, I would say, “That is a bummer.” and perhaps I might cry a little on the inside. If it was the next day or any other day after that, I would shrug and then give you the extra cookie I saved from my lunch because you’re my spouse and I love you and why would I ever want to make you feel shitty about a harmless mistake? You’re not in a good spot and I, internet stranger, am now genuinely concerned for you and sending you lots of virtual support to carefully evaluate your relationship.
Bellatrix
Hee, I already own the plus-size option in black. Just waiting for it to cool down so I can wear it. Yay, at least one piece of my wardrobe is Kat-approved!
Anonymous
I got offered a job as Executive Director (the big boss) of a new nonprofit starting in my area. Its a regional chapter of a national organization. The organization is an independent nonprofit, with a very small budget as it starts out. However, it wouldn’t be a bump in pay. It actually would be a slight pay cut. I’ve tried negotiating, but the organization won’t go up with salary. They cite its just starting out with a small budget. I’d be expected to do significant fundraising to grow the budget, with potential to grow my salary. I’m inclined to not take it. More responsibility for less pay doesn’t sound great, even though its career-wise the direction I want to move in as I progress in my career. Thoughts??
Bonnie
That job sounds really stressful. Fundraising isn’t fun, especially for a new organization.
PhilanthropyGirl
What direction is it that you want to take your career? Do you want to move into the non-profit sector generally, or is this particular organization in the service industry that interests you (ie, healthcare or education). If you’re simply looking to move into the non-profit sector, I’d wait for the job that pays the salary you need/want. If you’re looking to move into a specific area of non-profits, chances are good you’re going to need to relocate to find a similar position with better pay. Non-profits, especially small start-ups, don’t have the financial resources to negotiate on salary much. With the pressure on non-profits to limit their overhead, it makes it even more difficult.
If this isn’t a dream job/perfect fit, it probably isn’t the right move given the financial limitations of the position. Fundraising is hard, and fundraising for a start-up is harder. It sounds like a lot of stress, and you don’t sound excited about the role itself. I’d recommend passing and waiting for the right job at the right salary, or at the very least a job you’re excited enough about to not mind a small pay cut.
Anonymous
I work in the nonprofit sector now, always have. I’m a development director and would like to move into more senior leadership because I went back to school a couple years ago and got a MA in nonprofit leadership. This organization is very interested in me because they know I can fundraise, but its true that I’m not that excited about the salary. Frankly I’m surprised they want an Executive Director to come in at a low salary because they had a lot of job requirements in terms of experience and education.
PhilanthropyGirl
I think sometimes NPOs want the moon for very small salaries; it’s frustrating.
As someone below said, you’re looking at high risk/high reward. If this is a cause you feel strongly enough about you can dedicate at least 3-5 years to making it successful in order to move to something bigger and better – or that you care enough about to take a short term pay cut for long term pay offs – then go for it.
From your post, I’m not hearing the kind of excitement about either the position or the salary to justify making the move.
Good luck – from a fellow development director!
Libra
Non profit executive director jobs are really hard. Lots of complex work in a constrained resource environment. If it was me, I’d only take it if I was passionate about the job its self. Are you excited about fundraising? (Big part of any ED role). Are you excited about growing an organization?
lost academic
This is more of a high risk/high reward situation and you’ll have to weigh that. I’m not surprised at the salary cut, though it’s nice that you mention it’s not a big one. You don’t say what your role is now, but you did say this is the direction you want to go. So this could be amazing timing if you’re willing to accept the risks.
Anon
Trying to be intentionally vague bc I know my colleagues read here — big picture, how do you keep yourself from “regretting” the past esp. with regards to school or work? Long story short — I had certain goals for my career. Didn’t realize them. It isn’t tragic — it happens in my field ALL THE TIME that you reach up to a certain point in your 30s and there are no more promotions to be had (unless you are the type who is a big deal maker in the finance world) and then you pretty much have to leave that job and take your finance background and go do something else. As many people think in their 20s — I thought if I worked hard enough, made the right moves, it would somehow work out for me. It didn’t. I’m working someplace else now. I cannot get past thoughts that — the past 12 yrs were a complete waste of time (to the tone of 80-100 hrs/wk); school was a waste of time; I wish I hadn’t worked so hard bc if I hadn’t I’d be at the same result anyway; maybe I shouldn’t even have gone to college; no one should work too hard bc you just end up disappointed etc. I know it’s not rational and it’s not just pure emotion either (bc this stuff didn’t just happen yesterday). I’ve had mentors try to reason with me and convince me that I developed skills and interest that I carry with me. And all I hear is — blah blah blah, 100 hrs a week for skills and interests??
So when it comes to your life — how do you (i) not look back with regret; and (ii) how do you decide whether something was worth it and/or see the positives in something that didn’t work out the way you wanted?
Anonymous
Therapy. Listen to yourself. Maybe you shouldn’t have even gone to college? Girl nope that’s ridiculous.
anon associate
Wow, anonymous is in a bad mood today.
OP, your feelings are legit and we all realize you don’t actually think you shouldn’t have gone to college. No advise but empathy- I’ve definitely felt this way during times where my career goals and reality haven’t matched, despite best efforts. Pretty sure most associates who wanted to make partner in a law firm have felt this way.
Anon
OP here — yes I am not saying that I fully believe I shouldn’t have gone to college. It’s just that sometimes (most of the time?) the tremendous effort from age 18 onwards feels like a colossal waste. And I don’t know how to get past it. And I don’t want to do therapy — what are they going to tell me — move on; don’t think about it; get a hobby/husband. I know all that. I just don’t want to feel regret for the rest of my life bc something didn’t work out . . . rationally I realize things don’t work out and it isn’t the be all-end all.
Anonymous
Oh please. Of course they are going to tell you to move on. Because you should. You don’t want to go because you don’t want to move on.
You get past a destructive untrue thought pattern you can’t figure a way out of on your own by getting therapy.
Anonymous
Therapy can help change the thought process that is getting you to this point. It did that for me in re: to my anxiety and high expectations. But obviously, if you are going to go in with a bad attitude about it, it won’t help you at all.
Idea
I think you’re right though. You would never say that stuff to a friend. You would say, college was great, look what you got out of it, yeah it cost a lot but who knew then what you know now so do the best you can.
Change your self-talk (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy!)
MDMom
I want to say something more helpful than “just don’t,” but I just don’t. Whenever I start going down that road of what if, I remind myself that there is no point because the past is done. You cannot change it, you cant go back abd take another path, it’s just not an option so I dont let myself pretend that it is. It’s like wasting time worrying about what you need to pack to move to mars. Its a complete waste of energy. Of course there are lessons to be learned from the past, but I’m sure you’ve perseverated long enough to learn them all. Accept that you made the best decision (or at least a reasonable one) based on your knowledge and experience at the time and move on.
Then take that energy and focus on the present. You seem dissatisfied with your current career situation and possibly lacking purpose overall. Spend time thinking about that.
Read Alan Watts-The Wisdom of Insecurity. Its a zen philosophy type of book that I go back to when I need a little tune up (my issues were more with worrying about future than living in past, but its the same failure to live in reality).
Dulcinea
I agree with this. maybe therapy can help you keep from reviewing the same issues over and over in your mind, but the fact is you can’t change the past and dwelling on it is useless and will make you miserable. Here’s another way to think of it: have you ever lost someone you love? Did you grieve and then eventually come to some form of acceptance?
Just in the same way you came to terms with the fact that person is dead, grieve and find acceptance that you can’t change the past.
I very unexpectedly lost a couple people who were very close to me several years ago and the one thing I gained from that experience was that I learned no matter how much something $ucks, you can learn to live with it (because you have to) and there is no amount of bargaining, regret, beating yourself up, dwelling or wishing that can change it. So you might as well try to enjoy the present and focus on the future (while keeping in mind that you only have so much control over the future as well).
Time
You will gain perspective with time and effort.
So, I went to my Dream School. The ivory tower that I pined over. A place that suggested that it would open doors for you and lied about how easy it would be to get a job just based on the “prestige” while not preparing students with any actual “skills” because skills are for poor people, I guess? I made a lot of very good friends and met my now husband, I learned a decent amount, and I graduated with honors and a big snobby stick up my @$$. And then I ended up working in a coffee shop for four years while frantically re-calibrating my expectations, education, and life path. THANK GOD I didn’t have much debt. I was bitter for a while. I felt completely bamboozled. I decided ivory towers were stupid. But you know what? Years later, I’m in a better place and I’m glad I had that experience even if it didn’t end up going the way I thought it would. I’ve learned a lot, I have a different perspective, and overall I feel better having had the privilege to go to school there.
You really went for it in your career. You knew this career cap/ceiling thing was a real possibility and you went for it anyway. That to me says that you would have regretted not trying. You would have always wondered and been disappointed in yourself for not trying. I think it will take some serious time to gain perspective. Also think about what kind of person do you want to be? Do you want to be consumed by bitterness and negativity? Probably not. So start re-framing your experience in whatever way you can. You aren’t going to magically wake up one morning and feel perfectly fine about this tremendous disappointment. You have to work towards acceptance.
Senior Attorney
I love this response.
I’ve posted about this before, but not lately. I went to a good school and got top grades and went straight out of law school into BigLaw, and I was always the smartest lawyer in the room. And a few years ago (more than a few now, I guess) I applied for The Big Job that would be the capstone of my career. Everybody told me I was a shoo-in, and it was all very exciting, and… I didn’t get it. Didn’t happen. OMG it knocked me on my butt for I would say at least a couple of years. I was just really, really hard. I still stings a bit. The job I have now is pretty great, objectively speaking, but man! I really wanted that other one.
But life goes on and I started cultivating other things in my life and now I am the sublimely happy person with the awesome personal life, the Just Fine, TYVM job, and the career dreams that didn’t quite happen. I’ll take it.
And also? Careers are long and they have a lot of twists and turns. You really don’t know what the future might hold for you.
Anon
OP here — thank you SA and Time. Both of your perspectives resonated. I think it is like going to the top college/law school, working HARD for 12 yrs, and having certain “expectations.” And now that those expectations haven’t worked out (in finance – not law), it has knocked me down big time and I tend to be in these spirals of — everything is a waste of time. I know this kind of stuff takes time but I am tired of being a negative bitter person. It’s not who I was — I was happy with the work I was doing and that flowed over into my regular life — I was quick with a smile, joking around etc. Now you’re just as likely to see me tearing up. As ridiculous as I know it is bc it is “only” work. I know these things take time — I just wish it would be faster as it’s been quite a while already. I worry that I’ll never be the same again bc of 1 stupid job . . . .
Senior Attorney
I know people on here recommend it all the time, but… therapy can be really helpful.
Hugs to you. It sucks. It took me several years to get my feet back under me.
Also: “The only way out is through.”
Anon
Re-framing is the key.
And a good therapist–the right therapist for you, maybe? –wouldn’t say, “move on; don’t think about it; get a hobby/husband”.
They may help you re-frame your situation, though. Figure out why you’re stuck on it. Or maybe just not help with the “why” but the “how” to help you move on.
Maybe cognitive behavior therapy, or something similar?
Semi-regular going anon for this
My husband filed for divorce last Tuesday, which happened to be our second wedding anniversary and the fourth anniversary of the day we met and had our first date. He filed because I accepted a job offer in California and he didn’t want to move (we live in NYC). His parents worked for the government and from his birth until he turned 18 they lived in 24 different states as well as 5 different countries abroad.
After he turned 18 and graduated high school his parents retired and moved to the state of New York because both of their families lived there. My husband followed them there and went to college and law school in NYC, he had never lived in or visited the state of New York before. I’m originally from California and my entire family lives there but I also went to college and law school in NYC, although we didn’t go to the same college or law school and met later on. When we got serious in our relationship and were discussing the future and marriage my husband said he was never going to move again, for work or otherwise, because he hated always moving when he was a kid and wanted to be near his family after reconnecting with them (99% from both sides of his family live in the state of New York, all within NYC or a three hour drive of it) and put down roots for his own family and future children. I was fine with this because I never thought I would want to leave NYC but even though I wasn’t looking this job fell into my lap.
I can’t not accept this amazing opportunity but it would mean living in California for at least the next 5-7 years and my husband was not on board with moving there or doing a long distance relationship for that long. I knew going in that moving was his deal breaker but it still sucks. We don’t have children, we rent, we each own our own car and have our own retirement savings and our incomes are close so it won’t be a long or contentious divorce but I’m still reeling.
Just needed to get this off my chest. I start my new gig on December 1 so I’m busy wrapping up things at my current firm, planning my move and working on finding a place in California while also trying to find a divorce lawyer here. The current lease on our apartment is up at the end of November so my husband is staying with family while I live out the remainder of the lease because if I moved out I would most likely end up staying in a hotel. He’s not being difficult or hostile towards me at all but the divorce filing and coming home to an empty house still hurts.
Sorry this was so long. Thanks hive for letting me vent.
Anon
It’s for the best. You ultimately want 2 different things in life. He wants to be in NYC and near his family NO MATTER WHAT even if it means his WIFE is unhappy to forego an opportunity. So let him put his family first. You do you which right now is a new life in Cali.
Nati
+1. I lived through your exact situation this summer. I wasn’t married to my partner but we’d been together for the same amount of time. I went through a very long interview/testing process for my dream job in Ottawa, during which he was very supportive. Until I was actually offered the job, at which point he told me we’d celebrate over dinner and ended up surprise breaking up with me instead. It turns out living in Toronto for the rest of his life is his top priority, and that’s ok, but it’s not mine. Nothing wrong with Toronto, but I’m willing to go where the oppourtunity is.
Anonymous
Canadian here.
I’d live in YOW over YYZ in a second! Good choice.
TO Lawyer
+1 – I would make the same choice as your partner – I love living in Toronto and wouldn’t give it up for anyone. When you want two different things in life, sometimes you just have to cut ties and do what you need to do.
Nati
Yeah, people are different. My perspective is that there are so many amazing oppourtunities to be had over the course of a lifetime, and only so many of them will be in one city. My dream oppourtunity didn’t happen to be in Toronto and I’ve learned I need someone who’s willing to be a bit more flexible. My ex-partner is also 30 years old with no driver’s license or ability to ride a bike, and hated to leave the city even for weekend getaways. Meanwhile, I spent the four years of our relationship working for the province’s electricity transmission company and travelling to EVERY weird, wonderful corner of Ontario. Our worldviews were just not compatible and I’m happy my move brought that into focus. I would’ve been sacrificing a lot (not just the job, but my values) to stay with him.
Anonymous
I’m so sorry that this happened to you.
As you work through the pain of this time, remember you have a great opportunity for a fresh start. You have a new career opportunity and you’re moving closer to your family.
Also, because you don’t have children together, you will be able to move on much more easily. With children, he likely would have been in a position to force you to chose between moving or custody.
Anonymous
So, you didn’t want to be married to him anymore. If you did, you wouldn’t have applied for or considered a job in CA. Be honest with yourself. There are jobs in NY. You wanted out.
Anonymous
Eh, his unwillingness to move temporarily for her to take a dream job is super immature. I say all the time “I’M NEVER MOVING” – I love our current area and we have many reasons why this is the right place for us to be long-term: a beautiful (paid off) house, great friends who can help us with our pets and children in emergencies, lots of members of both our families nearby – but if my husband had an opportunity to take a dream job across the country, I would go because I love him and when you love someone you support their dreams even if it’s not an ideal situation for you.
Anon
at least 5-7 years is not a temporary move.
Anonymous
If you take the long-term view of things, it is. If my husband said “I want to move here for no more than 7 years and then we’ll return to [current area]” that would be very different for me than if he said “I want to move here permanently.”
Anonymous
Couldn’t you just turn around and say that if he loved you, he would sacrifice a dream job because of all the great things you have going for you where you live, even it’s not ideal for him? Why is it immature one way but not the other?
Anonymous
My husband and I are both high-achieving and ambitious so both of us would say a dream career opportunity is more important than having a nice house or being near friends and family. Those are our values and not necessarily ones shared by everyone, but if they’re not on the same page about the importance of careers in their lives, then that’s probably just another reason they are better off going their separate ways.
Anonymous
Right? Why take your kids away from all their family and friends? Just for personal career fulfillment? Wait until they’re in college instead of dragging them around while they’re in school.
Nati
This is over-simplifying.
Anonymous
I’m so sorry. I agree it’s for the best. You don’t want to be with a man who puts his parents above his wife. That kind of thing is never going to get better, only worse. What a cold-hearted move to file on your anniversary though. Hugs and love. You’ll get through this. I’m not sure what part of CA you’re moving to, but there are lots of us here in the bay area and LA. I’m sure someone would love to take you for a drink.
Anon
This. He’s choosing mommy and daddy’s happiness over his WIFE. Right now it’s about jobs and where to live. In a few yrs it would be about where to buy a house (close to his parents I’m sure); where to spend holidays (his parents more than yours); and fostering a relationship with HIS parents and his kids. I think the job thing is the tip of the iceberg and it’s better to get out now. I know plenty of men, born and raised New Yorkers in fact who DID NOT want to move. But when it turned out that their wife just could not deal with work life balance in NYC or raising kids in NYC, they mutually picked a place and moved — even though those men did irritate their mamas but leaving NYC – -they did it for their WIVES.
Anonymous
Here’s the thing though… OP is the one making the choice, not him. He told her before they got married that this was a dealbreaker. He’s being 100% consistent with what he told her. It’s OP that’s calling the audible and making the choice to prioritize her career over her relationship. Which is totally fine. As long as that’s what she wants.
Anonymous
But I get the sense that is his desire to stay in NYC is because he wants to keep his parents happy, which is troubling. If he was reluctant to move because of his own career or even just because he loved NYC that might not be as problematic. But appeasing your parents at the cost of your spouse’s happiness is never a good dynamic.
Semi-regular going anon for this
It’s all him. His parents don’t care where he lives. They are lovely and not pushy people. This all stems from him hating his childhood of moving around so much that now that he is near family and his roots he doesn’t want to give that up. He says he is never moving away again. I could deal with it if it was his parents because he doesn’t blindly follow them. It’s coming from him and that is where we hit the impasse.
@ anon 11:41
OP pretty clearly said that he didn’t want to move anymore and that’s why he wanted to stay in NYC -didn’t sound like it was to appease his parents.
Cat
So, you chose this job over your marriage (I assume it’s something like Google recruited you from NYC Biglaw, which is obviously an amazing opportunity, but you still chose this job over your marriage). If I were your husband I’d feel pretty bait-and-switched. But, divorce is such a nuclear option! I hope you both end up happy in your separate paths, and I really hope that deep down you both wanted out of the marriage anyway.
Anon Midwest
Husband also choose to only remember the bad about moving and never consider it ever again (which doesn’t sound mature to me) over his wife getting her shot at a dream job.
Everyone has choices.
Anonymous
If someone moved 29 times from birth to age 18 and never stayed anywhere longer a year and a half and had parents that were busy working and lived in new countries where you didn’t understand the language and you never met anyone family in person and only knew them over the phone or through photos (especially before the internet was common when it was more difficult to keep in touch with friends or family) I could see why he is only remembering the bad.
Semi-regular going anon for this
Thank you all. I told him it was okay to file on that date because I wanted to get things moving because I have lots to wrap up and deal with before I go. He wanted to wait at first.
I kind of knew it was a deal breaker, but he wasn’t a “mommy’s boy” or joined to hide family at the hip so I thought I could convince him. He told me before that he lived in 29 different places in 18 years (in 24 different states and 5 different cities in other countries) and that’s why he felt so strongly about it because he finally put down roots. I wasn’t looking but this opportunity fell into my lap via a network connection. It still hurts regardless though.
Anonymous
Yeah of course it hurts. I mean, yes, he told you exactly who he was and instead of listening you assumed he’d change, but it’s a cliche because it is human! Congrats on the new job, and on being true to yourself.
Anonymous
Let yourself be sad. Take time to really grieve. It will come in spurts. Take time to get excited about your fresh start, your new job, your new opportunities. In a year, your life will have changed beyond your wildest dreams. You’ll do amazingly well. Try to let this man go as gracefully as possible. You’ll get through this.
cbackson
I’ll say a couple of things.
First, the tendency (which is coming out strongly here) of people to have to figure out who was “wrong” when a divorce happens is so common. I absolutely understand your husband’s position, as someone who has decided that she’s unwilling to move again, and I absolutely understand yours, because I’m also passionate about my career. I’d encourage everyone here to step back and realize that there doesn’t have to be someone at fault in a divorce. Sometimes, what two people deeply want is not compatible, and that’s the case here.
OP, you seem like you’re not falling into that trap – good for you. Your path to healing will be smoother for taking that view. One thing that helped me during my divorce was to think of it as an opportunity to try to be my best self, even when I didn’t want to be. It’s hard, but again, you heal more quickly, in my view, by not allowing yourself to marinate in anger, resentment or blame, or to lash out or be petty.
Anon in NYC
+a million to this.
OP, it’s okay to feel sad about the divorce, even if it is the right decision. Hugs.
Lyssa
Well said.
Both parties had priorities. Neither of those priorities were really unreasonable, even if they were not what someone else would have prioritized. It’s sad that both parties decided that those priorities outranked the marriage, but it is what it is.
OP, hugs and I’m sorry that you’re dealing with this. If I may offer some advice, I’d say to do whatever it takes to make the divorce quick. You’re in a position where nothing that you have is really worth fighting over, particularly given that you’re moving across the country for a clean start. Offer a reasonable split of assets, let him counter, and meet in the middle somewhere, even if it’s somewhere that you think is a little unfair. The value of getting this done quickly, cleanly, and cheaply is far greater than any of the assets that he’s likely to get in the split.
Anonymous Poser
+1
Anon
OP – so sorry for this. It really sucks. People change and sometimes your priorities in life diverge. This happened to my ex and I. It’s good to hear that things aren’t contentious and that you guys are both being mature about it, which is really hard with such deep emotions involved.
Good luck with your new job and the move! It will be really exciting, congrats!
Anonymous
I think your husband is being ridiculous. If he moved that much, he should understand you go where the job is. Its 2016. People move all.the.time. His fantasy of a close family with roots in one place is naive. My family live in all different states, and that only makes our time together in person all the more special.
He is assuming some day: (1) you’ll have kids (2) his parents will still be around (3) they’ll want to be around (4) they’ll be good babysitters (5) you’ll both agree with his parents’ parenting style and accept them as babysitters…etc. Ad nauseum. So many assumptions.
Right now, you two as a couple breaking up is undoubtedly heartbreaking. I’m going through a divorce too. Four years of marriage, no kids. But please believe me when I say its lucky this happened at this juncture. He clearly is choosing his parents over you. You need to be priority #1 to your partner, especially when kids get involved. Best of luck with the move. Be kind to yourself. Hugs!
Anonymous
Totally agree. This is not a guy you want to be with forever and it is sooo much better to get out before children make things messy. (And I’m sorry about your divorce too, 11:12 am)
lawsuited
There’s nothing to suggest that OP has to take the job in California because it’s the only option other than unemployment. She’s taking it because she thinks it is an “amazing opportunity”.
There are a LOT of people who make career and other life decisions based on how close they want to be to family. Whether or not it’s naive is simply a matter of perspective and priorities. People have certainly called me naive in the past for people putting my career ahead of family considerations.
OP and her husband are entitled to have different priorities, and to the extent that they do you may be right that this divorce is coming at the right time, but to call the husband ridiculous and naive misses the point.
Anonymous
+1 that its naive. I live in the state where I grew up, but neither of my siblings do. This seems very common in my peer group, and I’m from a major metropolitan city in the northeast. Staying in one place and expecting your spouse to ignore fantastic job opportunities because you want to be around your parents for nonexistent kids is ridiculous. I don’t even think I perceive the putting down roots mentality as naive just because I’m from a city. My mom is from the rural midwest. All of her siblings, except 1, left.
cbackson
Just because it’s not how you feel doesn’t make it ridiculous or naive. They’re married. They’re expecting to have kids. It’s entirely rational to make choices that will facilitate the life you would like to have when you have kids, if that’s a near-term priority for you. It’s no different than deciding that you’d like to be able to afford to buy a house when you have kids, so you’ll choose a job and location with a COL that will allow that.
What is naive (in the sense of its actual definition, i.e., inexperienced or showing a lack of judgment) about making that choice? What makes that “ridiculous,” other than that it’s a different choice than yours?
Also, I’m not sure what demographic you fall into, but I’m a professional in her mid-thirties. I live in Atlanta, which is my home town, as does my entire family and virtually all of my childhood friends. I went to law school in the Northeast (and lived outside the south for a decade), and even going beyond my close social circle to my friends from law school and undergrad, virtually all of them have chosen to live some place that is close to one or both of their families.
Anon
I think the point isn’t whether or not his geographical preference/restriction is reasonable or naïve. He can decide that he wants to live in the same place until he’s carried out feet first, or that he wants to relocate every 6 months for the rest of his life, and either is acceptable as long as he’s honest about his expectations with any serious-contender for his life partner. Which he was. I think the problem here is that OP married him knowing this and thinking she could change his mind. I feel badly for her, but she knew this going into it.
At the end of the day, people can believe whatever they want to believe. He could have said “I only eat orange and white foods, and I only ever want orange and white foods in my home. No exceptions”. Which I personally find to be bizarre and off-putting and closing him off to a wide world of gastronomic delights – which is why I wouldn’t have married him. But you can’t marry him, and then be upset that he doesn’t want you bringing broccoli and lasagna into the house.
anon
I think the people who feel this way must not have experienced traumatic moves as children. Wanting stability and to keep roots in one place =/= choosing your parents over your spouse. This is sad for both of them, but it sounds like OP knew it was the price of admission.
Bonnie
Agreed. I spent my entire childhood moving around. As much as I love my SO, I would not uproot my life, leave friends, and quit my job to move cross-country.
Anonymous
They don’t have kids though. They could move to CA, have kids, and stay there forever and the kids would never be moved around. Even if they wanted to go back east in a decade or so, I don’t think one move before the age of 18 is “traumatic” to children. I would sympathize with him a lot more if they already had kids, but I think making decisions based on hypothetical children is insane.
cbackson
Insane? Really?
Imagine this: a couple gets married. No kids yet, but they’d like to have them. They’re going to buy their first house. They choose a house that’s near an awesome kindergarten and a great park, because they can imagine both of those being great to have when they have kids.
By your reasoning, that’s insane. Really?
anon
*He* experienced the traumatic moves, and he doesn’t want to do it ever again. That’s not a decision based on hypothetical children; it’s based on his own experiences.
Anonymous
@cbackson, the house analogy is not on point, because great school districts and proximity to parks are terrific for re-sale so it’s an objectively good decision even if the hypothetical children never come to be. I think making an irreversible decision that you would not otherwise make based on kids that don’t exist yet is what’s insane. The purchase of a house is a lot more reversible than turning down a dream job/getting your divorced because you won’t follow your wife to a dream job.
Anonymama
I think it’s absurd, although I suppose typical of the Internet, that Anonymous can’t conceive of other people having different priorities in life (perhaps you are very young?) It’s really totally normal to make life decisions based on a desire and presumed ability to have future children. It would be insane to want future children but make life decisions without taking that into account. Also I don’t know why people seem so stuck on the parents/kids thing as the reason for him not wanting to move, it’s pretty clear that they are factors but the big one is that he personally does not want to move because of his previous experiences. Which he was completely upfront about. It is sad but there doesn’t have to be one person that is at fault for something like this… Clearly there is something already lacking in the marriage for them each to make the decisions that they are making (re job, location, marriage).
Anon
I’d like to point out that it is not ridiculous, just a difference in values. My husband and I could both find way better, amazing jobs if we were willing to move, but we prioritize being near family and roots more than our careers. We would both rather stay in meh jobs to be near family. We have more of a work to live mentality. It works because we are both on the same page about that priority. I wouldn’t move across the country for his job nor would he for mine, but we knew going in that we both prioritized staying put because that is where we place our values. Not right or wrong, just what is personally important.
Anonymous
I am an American. My parents are both American citizens and they worked for the government. I was born on an American military base abroad. From when I was born until when I turned 18 we lived in 25 different cities in 25 different countries. The longest we stayed in one place was under two years. I only have one citizenship (American) but until I turned 18 I had never been to America once or met any of my family in person, before that all my contact with them through letters, photos and phone calls. When I turned 18 my parents returned to America and retired, just as it was for your husband.
I am sorry you are hurting but you knew this going in before you got married. Growing up in all those foreign countries may sound exciting and fun but it wasn’t. I was always an outsider, I had to constantly learn new customs and languages (which is stressful as a child), any American children I met would move all the time like us and my parents were so busy with work that I was often lonely.
I now live in the home state of my parents near them and their families. I have finally connected to them and have friends too. I one hundred percent understand where your husband is coming from. I am never moving from this area again and I will make that clear to any man I marry so he knows going in. Just wanted to give perspective from the other side of it.
I am sorry you are hurting. I wish you healing and wellness and hope you like your new job.
Anonymous
This. I don’t understand why the husband’s position is seen as unreasonable. He probably should have been clearer that he never, ever wanted to move but it was OP that chose to take a job on the other side of the country.
Anon
He told OP when they were discussing marriage that he was never moving again (after living in 24 different states and 5 cities in other countries) and she mentions it being a deal breaker for him, so he definitely made it clear. I’m not saying she shouldn’t be upset, my thoughts are with her and I am sorry she is hurting, but she knew this and still chose to marry him two years ago. She even mentions that she hoped she could convince him. She wasn’t blindsided here.
Anonymous
I understand why OP is hurting. Divorce is never easy. But her husband was really honest about this. He isn’t the one that made the choice, she is. Just because he filed for divorce, doesn’t mean his choice is the reason they’re getting divorced.
AIMS
Well, on the one hand, yes, you should not go into a marriage thinking you’ll change someone’s mind on something like this. I’m not sure that’s what OP was thinking.
That aside, I am someone who experienced some fairly traumatic moves growing up and I have no desire to leave Manhattan, much less New York City, much less New York State for the rest of my life now. Mr. AIMS knows this; yet, if he had an amazing,once in a lifetime opportunity come up that required moving to CA, I’d do it (Kansas, I’m not sure.. just kidding). And if I had some similar opportunity come up that required him to uproot his life, I can see how it would be hard for me to not be really hurt – maybe even irreparably so- by his utter refusal to even consider it.
I don’t think anyone is to blame here. OP, I get why you’re sad. But I think everyone who said its good that this is happening now is right. I wish you lots of luck.
lawsuited
I am very sorry that you are having to deal with this. It must have been a difficult choice to make, and I expect you made is carefully and thoughtfully. It is easier to find a job than to find a person to spend your life with, so I hope this job truly turns out to be everything you are hoping for.
Anonymous
What a b!tchy and unhelpful comment.
Nati
Well, it seems like the OP’s husband is not actually compatible with her in the long-term sense. I disagree that it’s always easier to find your dream oppourtunity than it is to find your dream partner. Both are rare.
Anonymous
Wow. This is really unnecessary, especially since the decision is already made and your post can’t be construed as tough love advice. Anyway, it may be true that “is easier to find a job than to find a person to spend your life with” (although I’m not actually sure that it easier to find your *dream* job than it is to find a partner), but I would rather spend my life alone than with a partner who was unwilling to move for me to pursue my dreams.
Nati
Same.
Anonymous
Not universally true. I’ve been happily married since I was 24 to the first person I seriously dated, but I spent 11 years trying out various jobs and careers, none of which made happy and some of which made me downright miserable, before I finally found something I enjoy. For me, finding a fulfilling job was a lot harder than finding a life partner. I have friends who have had the opposite experience. There are lots of great men and lots of great jobs and lots of terrible men and lots of terrible jobs. It really is just luck which one you will have an easier time finding.
Nati
Yeah, this struck me as something my 90 year old grandmother would say. Of course she thinks that being with any incompatible man is more important than pursuing your dreams. Because she’s 90 years old and that was the world she lived in when she was my age.
lawsuited
It may be unhelpful, but I certainly didn’t mean it to be bitchy. It’s the advice I give all the women I care about the most.
cbackson
People here sure seem invested in making the OP’s husband out to be a terrible, selfish, naive, ridiculous person. Except the OP herself. I’m guessing she posted because she’s hurting and wanted support, not because she wanted everyone to convince her that her ex is a terrible human being.
Anonymous
Exactly.
Semi-regular going anon for this
You’re exactly right.
I am sad. I thought I could change his mind but I was wrong. I posted because I am hurting. I didn’t expect that him (and his parents by extension) would get trashed and called naive and ridiculous. I said right in my post that he told me this going in.
I regret posting this. Thank you all who offered support without being unkind.
Anon
Well said CBackson. And, ultimately, the OP will be healthier as a result of this attitude. Good luck in healing – I can imagine sunny CA will be a beautiful place to start over.
cbackson
For what it’s worth, there will be a day (and it’ll be sooner than you think) when the pain of this will not be so fresh and you’ll feel like you’ve turned the corner. That’s what people here told me when I got divorced, and it was true. I’ll be thinking of you!
Anonymous
I said it’s good they split now but I don’t think that makes him a terrible human being. But the lives they want are clearly incompatible and I think it’s always good to realize that before there are kids in the picture.
Senior Attorney
I’m so sorry. This is just heartbreaking.
Lovely Husband is a divorce lawyer in So Cal. Email me at seniorattorney1 at gmail if you’d like to talk to him.
Semi-regular going anon for this
Thank you SA. I appreciate the offer but I have someone to take care of things here.
Congratulations by the way.
Senior Attorney
Good. Glad you are assembling your team!
And thanks!
bridget
Oh, wow.
Hugs and prayers.
Announcing this on your anniversary is disgusting.
As for the substance of the dispute: preferences are one thing, but it’s not right to put forth those types of ultimatums in a marriage. “We are not moving to Antartica” or “No, we aren’t moving so you can have the exact same opportunity that you have right now” is reasonable, but a pre-determined, unilateral blanket ban on moves is not appropriate. You don’t walk into a marriage dictating that.
Just a wild guess, but did you go to NYU or Columbia, and your husband went to somewhere not NYU or Columbia?
Semi-regular going anon for this
Thank you for the hugs and prayers.
As I said above, I told him to go ahead and file on that date. He was okay with waiting but I wanted to get things rolling have so much on my plate.
I’m not sure what it has to do with anything, but my husband went to Colombia and I went to schools that were not NYU or Colombia.
bridget
Different portability of degrees. My guess was that one of you went to a T14 and the other did not.
a Californian
I might be able to help you find a place in CA, as I know many people there so someone might know of something or need a roommate… comment with your email (or a dummy email) if you want and we can talk!
AEK
Just a shout-out to Gap / Old Navy. I ordered a bunch of stuff last night for my toddler and when I saw the confirmation email this morning, noticed it was way more money than expected. I had forgotten to enter promo codes. It took about 2 minutes on the phone this morning with a rep to apply two big promo codes and get free shipping. So glad I called and that it was so easy to adjust. (Also: real person!)
Anon
On a related note, I’ve been really happy with my purchases from Gap and ON recently. Good quality considering the price, and cute on-point styles.
pugsnbourbon
I’ve had a similar good experience with Old Navy – they even went so far as to give me a discount on a item that didn’t qualify for it when I pointed out that the small print was misleading.
Anon
Shopping help please! I will be at an outdoor wedding in early October, and it will potentially be pretty cold (mountain setting). I will likely wear either a navy or burgundy dress, and now I need something warm to wrap around my shoulders. Bonus points for anything from Nordstrom due to free shipping/good customer service. I’m thinking probably something cream colored since I haven’t settled on the dress color yet. Gray would probably work too. Any suggestions?
Wrap advice
I’m not in a good position to find a specific item right now, but I’ve had a light gray cashmere Nordstrom brand pashmina for probably 6 or 7 years at this point, and it’s been great. Still looks good, matches all kinds of things, appropriate for all kinds of events. I think they have one or two simiar things (sometimes a wool blend or something; it seems to change a bit) every season in lots of colors, and if I were you, I’d just go look at the scarves section on their website.
Parental Leave
My government organization does not provide any paid parental leave. The department head is making a very rare visit to our office, and we will get to meet her briefly. Each employee will take an individual photo with her. I would like to use that fifteen seconds or so to ask her what she plans to do about our lack of paid maternity/paternity leave. Can anyone suggest how I should frame this “elevator pitch” to be most effective?
pockets
Are you unionized? If you are, then it might be on the union to negotiate parental leave and the department head might have nothing to do with it.
If you’re not unionized, you could start with an example – NYC govt just instituted 6 weeks paid leave for its (non-unionized) employees.
Anonymous
Don’t? That’s not how the government works and you’ll look out of touch.
Anonymous
What? I work for the state government and we get paid parental leave. Not 12 weeks, but we get six weeks of paid leave plus we can use whatever sick leave and accrued vacation leave we have to pay ourselves for the remaining six weeks – and we have generous sick/vacation policies so lots of people get ten or eleven weeks paid.
anon
What horrible advice, anonymous at 10:26. How else do you think change happens? Yes, let’s all sit silent like little sheep because “that’s how it’s always been.” Working for any employer that doesn’t offer parental leave means the employer is out of touch– not the employee who wants to change it.
Maddie Ross
I think 10:26 Anon means that you’ll look out of touch to bombard a superior at a clearly ceremonial occasion (photos with said superior) about an internal policy issue. I do kind of agree with that…
Anonymous
Yup. Exactly.
Anon
Also agree with this. Unlikely to achieve any positive outcome. I’d instead introduce yourself, mention that you’d like to schedule a meeting to discuss some of the office policies, and follow-up immediately after the event by scheduling a meeting (with the assistant or other).
You’ll catch the superior off-guard, and you’ll either get brushed off or get a platitude response that will immediately be forgotten. Much better to schedule a time to actually talk about it when you have the superior’s attention and focus.
Em
I agree as well. My company has a policy that they don’t have parental leave. I think its BS and realize nothing is going to change unless people push back, so I asked for a couple weeks paid because I know that, in my position, I have a lot more pull than some of the other employees who are more easily replaceable. But I did it during a formal meeting that I scheduled with my supervisor to discuss my leave. If you what to try to instigate change, I would suggest setting up a meeting to discuss it rather than throwing a question at the person during a photo shoot.
Anonymous
I’m not 100% sure this is a great idea but if you’re doing it anyway, what about?
“Great to meet you. I love working at AGENCY. Talented colleagues and interesting work. If we offered paid maternity/parental leave we’d definitely be able to improve our retention and also be more competitive in attracting new talent.”
Anon
Do you really think YOUR department head influences policy for the entire fed or state govt? Bc that’s the level at which changes would have to happen for there to be maternity/paternity leave. Have you not been in gov’t for a long time? Bc gov’t change can’t just happen bc your dept wants to do something different.
The person is walking around to shake hands and do a 10 sec photo opp and you think it’s a good idea to complain about how things aren’t good enough for you??
Parental Leave
Yes, she is in a position to influence that policy. And yes, I think it’s a good idea to voice concern. I think categorical discrimination against women who have children by forcing them to use every minute of accrued leave, leaving nothing remaining for subsequent doctor appointments (and heaven forbid a vacation) goes far beyond complaining that “things aren’t good enough.” I have been with the government for seven years; long enough to understand it, and fortunately not long enough to become as jaded as you seem to be. Hope it gets better for you.
Anonymous
Oh good grief. Go right ahead then. Burn your bridges to the ground.
>^- -^
Greetings, my name is e-mail or letter requesting a meeting.
Blonde Lawyer
Know your audience. It might not be the right time/place and it might totally dilute your message. I’m thinking of a prior gov’t job I had. When the head came in for a meet and greet it was really more like meeting the pope or the president. You were supposed to stand in awe of their awesomeness, not ask questions. There are other avenues to ask that person questions. It would be super weird (at least in my old job) to do it at one of those quick meet and greets. If I had asked any question, the answer likely would have been “I can’t answer that now but feel free to let my assistant know your concerns during regular office hours.”
Anonymous
This.
pugsnbourbon
+1
Anon88
Re-posting b/c my original comment disappeared.
How does your SO react when you make a mistake? How do you treat yourself when you make a mistake?
I’m more of a “no use crying over spilled milk person”. I acknowledge what happened, clean up the mess and figure out what to do to prevent the issue from happening again. Make sure the cap is on the milk carton and stop at the store to buy more.
My husband re-hashes what happens. How could that happen? Do you know sticky milk gets when it spills? Now we’re out of milk, etc.
I find myself not wanting to tell him when something goes wrong. For example, a few weeks ago we went grocery shopping and I started to get a really bad headache. When we got home we got the groceries out as fast as possible and then I went inside to lay down. Problem is that I left one bag in the trunk that had expensive meat from Whole Foods. It had shifted to the back and I was in a hurry and missed it.
I found it the next morning and disposed of myself and stopped at the store to buy more without ever telling my husband. I just didn’t want to deal with his reaction of how expensive a mistake it was, I should have told him the bag was there, etc.
This morning I was running late and in a hurry and opened my car door into the side fender of his truck. It left small dent and chipped off about a pea size amount of paint. He left before me this morning an carpooled with a co-worker, so I’ll have to tell him this evening once he gets home. I’m dreading having to deal with this because I know he’ll be upset. I’m really sorry for what I did. I was careless and wasn’t paying attention. I keep replaying it in my head wishing I had been more careful.
There’s other issues in the marriage and I feel like I’ve lost sight of what a normal, healthy relationship should be like. How would you react if it was your car?
Anonymous
This doesn’t sound that healthy. You should be able to tell your husband when you make mistakes without fearing his reaction. Being almost afraid of your husband because he is so critical is not a good sign. Have you ever done couples counselling?
On the car, I’d think about telling him via email or phone before you get home so he has a chance to cool off.
Anonymous
This. Is. Emotional. Abuse. GTFO.
Anon
FWIW, I would also dread telling my husband something like that. I am the breaker-of-things in my marriage, and he will get really irritated in the moment. I apologize in the moment (if apology is needed), and then keep to myself for the next hour, it passes easily. I know I am hyper-sensitive to this kind of critique as well, so it’s a tough area for us both. Does he tend to dwell on it or bring it up over and over? That’s what I would look for. Otherwise some people just have trouble keeping cool in the moment when it comes to certain situations.
Car things always seems more emotional to me as well. When he makes a mistake like that, I just joke he’s stealing my thunder.
Anon
I don’t think this is healthy. If it happened to my car I would probably feel a little upset, but would not say anything critical or mean to my husband. We would probably joke about it and say something like “the gym must be really working since you opened the door so hard you must not know your own strength” or something silly like that. If I did it to my husband’s car he would not be mad at all. He would not say anything other than “that’s ok. It can be fixed.” I would offer to take it to the body shop and he would probably say not to worry about it. Accidents happen. There’s no need to get mad about it. Most things can be easily fixed.
Anon
I used to be like your husband. I was horrible to be around and took it out on my husband (then fiancé) and my mother the most. If my husband made a mistake (particularly one that cost us money) I would rehash it to death and berate him for it. I realized I had moderate anxiety (particularly in areas dealing with money, which led to the obsessing) and got a prescription for Lexapro. I am still exponentially more obsessive than my husband (he is just naturally laid back), but now when he does something, even if I initially get upset about it internally, I am able to check my response. If it is an important issue (meaning something that shouldn’t happen again), I can express disappointment in a calm manner, acknowledge the cost, but find a solution and move on. I am also able to “pick and choose my battles,” and not make an issue about minor things (such as if he charges a bunch of little items outside our budget). Coming from someone who engaged in similar behavior, your husband’s behavior is not acceptable and he should not be treating you that way. I would suggest he sees a therapist.
Sarabeth
This is not normal. At all. A few months ago, my husband totaled my car. I was furious – but I dealt with it by saying, “I’m really angry about this right now. It’s not going to be a productive conversation. I’m going to go for a run, and we’ll talk about it tomorrow.” And that’s what we did. He apologized, I told him that I was upset but that I accepted his apology and I understand that accidents happen to all of us. That is normal – being mad about something, but also being enough of an adult that you deal with that emotion in a way other than berating your partner.
Nancy Raygun
I grew up in a household where I was always afraid someone would see my mistakes and get mad at me. It took me years to figure out that it’s not OK to treat someone in a way that makes them afraid and anxious. Your husbands reactions are not normal and it’s affecting you a lot. You feel like you’re on eggshells with someone you should trust and feel safe around. I think you’re aware that it’s a bad sign that you feel so anxious over how he’ll react to what is objectively speaking, an extremely minor thing. This is definitely emotional abuse. I still struggle with feelings of guilt, so I’m going to tell you that you don’t need to feel super bad about this. You don’t need to feel guilty about being with a person who treats you this way. You just need to figure out how to get out of this situation. And to be honest, I’ve never known someone to suddenly change his behavior when they act the way your husband has acted. His reactions are not your fault and you’d be better off with someone who doesn’t make you feel bad for things like this.
Anonymous
Totally agree.
Please start addressing this with your husband, at a calm time. And please do not have kids until this is addressed.
Signed,
An anxious, insecure girl-woman whose father is like this, and who still brings up when I broke a toy when I was 5….. making me feel like a terrible person, every time. I will never get married.
Nancy Raygun
Aww man, people with perfectionist dads, unite. It’s a struggle, for real. Sometimes my husband still has to remind me that I’m not “terrible.” Shoutout to my therapist.
perfectionism is lame
THIS.
Oh so you mean I’m not responsible for the emotions of all grown men-father, grandfather, boss, boyfriends?
I don’t need to prioritize keeping a grown man happy over all else?
Someone loving me shouldn’t be predicated on whether I behaved properly at all times or didn’t make a mistake?
Great. Glad I know that now that I’m in my early 30s. Sweet. Better late than never? Also shout out to my therapist.
bridget
In the very short term, I would suggest swinging by the dealership this afternoon and getting some touch-up paint. Then send him an email explaining that you nicked his car and would he like to fix it or have you do it?
In the longer term, find a good therapist and go alone or with your husband.
Anonymous
I would totally yell at my husband if he dinged my car or ruined an expensive steak. I don’t think that’s emotional abuse. It does sound like you handle things differently and you might be better suited to someone who has a similar style of handling mistakes. Part of why I think my dynamic works with my husband is we both dish it out, but we both take it. So I can see how if it’s imbalanced, it wouldn’t be very healthy. I think “abuse” is a really extreme word to throw around though (referring to the comments, not the OPs post).
Apple Watch 2
Does anyone have the apple watch? I was waiting until the 2nd generation came out and it’s finally here. Just want to see with current owners of the 1st gen if there are any major cons/regrets. TIA!
College visits?
How do you handle college visits for your children if you are a person who is still sweating it out in mid-law? We are SEUS and have good state schools. BUT I feel the need to expose my children to more (even if it is not quite in the budget). Other than go to my school homecomings and places that are an easy drive, do public schools do field trips? Do you go to regional college fairs (I do not think that a ton of brochures are helpful and I’m sure all admissions people are lovely, which doesn’t help either)? Offer to brings friends of children and hope that their parents will bring yours along?
I feel the need to do:
State U our state
State U neighborhing state (alma mater)
Neighboring state small private college (other alma mater)
An ACC/SEC giant school with good football program (I have girls)
Somewhere cold (mid-Atlantic/New England)
Somewhere West Coast
Something NYC/DC (maybe just for a semester / summer program)
1 school somewhere else
Maybe if you start in junior high, randomly adding here and there just for flavor / exposure to different things, you can visit with focus when it counts? I am all of a sudden panicky that I may be too busy at work to ever do this and it seems so, so important.
If Tony Sporano did this for Meadow . . ., surely I can get away (I note that he, too, multitasked during this and it was a bit of a working vacation).
Anonymous
Is this a thing people do? Like starting in junior high?
Visit the first three when kid is in high school. Do other visits if kid initiates — kid becomes obsessed with marine biology at wants to look into the program at X school – maybe double it up as a family vacation if the location works.
An
Is it that important? That seems like a lot of college visits. I would wait until the kid has expressed interest in a career or school. I don’t think that taking them to colleges in different locations just because is going to add much.
pugsnbourbon
I think I visited six or seven, but a) they were all within a 5-hour drive and b) I tagged along with my big sister on a couple. You’ve listed a LOT of schools to visit, and while it’s great that you want to make sure your daughters get to see a variety of places, I would check in with them to see what they really want out of a school. They may not know, but you can help them think through it. It’s not necessary to fly to a school across the country unless one of your daughters is seriously interested in a program they can get there and nowhere else.
Maddie Ross
I’m only barely closer to doing this for my kid than I am to looking myself, but I think the list of places you “need” to visit may be lengthy and unnecessary. What does your child want? I think it’s good to expose them to multiple sized schools, but for instance if they want to stay in their home region, I don’t think you need to haul them up to NE or out west. When I looked, I took a couple of quizzes (back then written, but now I would imagine there’s stuff online) that narrowed down the list of all colleges to schools that had majors I was interested in and other “fit” categories. From there, my mom and I did some research on those (back then, requesting catalogs – again, all online now). My junior year spring break we plotted a trip to hit a couple of schools in a region I was interested in. What you are proposing seems unnecessarily hard and expensive.
Anonymous
In the fall of my junior year in high school, we made a list of colleges that my parents could afford to pay for (thankfully, anywhere in the US, but no trips home except for Christmas if I went to the opposite coast), that I had a reasonable chance of getting into, and that I had some preliminary interest in (I read through some big guide to the top 200 colleges or something). Then, we visited about 12 over the next two years. Did about 7 in MA on a Thursday, Friday, Saturday, took a couple other Friday’s for North Carolina, DC, Minnesota.
I don’t think you need to worry about exposing children to options before the time comes.
Anonymous
I don’t think most people visit that many colleges. I wouldn’t worry about it in junior high, but once your kid gets into high school I think you can start talking to about schools and see what interests them, and then make up a list to visit together. My parents weren’t that busy at work (my mom’s a teacher and has summers off) but they didn’t have unlimited funds, so we made one driving trip from our home in the Midwest to the Northeastern US and I picked five schools to see on that trip. It was expected from a relatively early age that I would go to an elite school so they didn’t even take me to see the State Us, although that would have been a nothing in terms of time and cost.
Anon in NYC
I honestly don’t really remember how I (and my parents) picked the random bunch of colleges that I went to go look at – some in- and out-of-state State U, some nearby private, and two far away private. Each of them had things that interested me. I didn’t tour schools until senior year of high school, I think, and it was a subset of the schools than I applied to. I didn’t tour schools with friends, although I guess if your kid has friends who are interested in the same schools you could try to pair up and trade off responsibilities with other parents.
I do not think you need an organized touring program that begins in junior high. You/they don’t know what they want out of college yet. If your kid knows that they want to be a computer engineer, great – that narrows your search. But if your kid doesn’t know and needs to figure out while in college, you’ll have wasted a bunch of time. If you really want to expose your kids to different college campuses I think you start by doing things like, “hey, we’re in Boston for vacation, let’s take a trip to see [insert college]” or “let’s take a weekend trip to DC and spend time in Georgetown.”
Anon Midwest
While I think that college visits are nice, the sheer volume that people are expected to do now is crazy. Since I grew up in the midwest and had my eyes on only east coast schools, plus a single mom with a lower middle income college visits are right out.
If you want other opportunities for your student to get a better idea of the school without visiting. Contact the Alumni office of the school and ask if there is a program or a way your child could speak with a recent alumni in the area.
Anonymous
This is apparently a Thing that private school counselors are now telling parents to do as early as middle school–take the kid to see colleges all over the U.S. so she can get a sense of what is out there. I have a colleague who has decided that whenever her family is on a trip and there is a college nearby, they will just stop by for a tour.
College visits?
I like this — see what is there when you are nearby. I also think of dragging a HS kid along on my work trips (NYC/DC/LA/Texas/Miami/Chicago/Minneapolis) just to show them what the rest of the world looks like.
They get to make a lot of big life choices before they really know what they’re picking. I cringe at the thought of them dating, but it’s not like I’m going to arrange their marriages if they don’t.
Anon
My parents did this. To be fair, my mom was a guidance counselor, so it was more on her radar than it was for most parents. I have really fun memories of visiting college campus during family trips. They did it in a totally no pressure way, though. We simply would take a tour, and they let the guides talk about the great parts of schools and what it took to get accepted. My parents would talk generally about what the requirements, and they also reinforced what great experiences they had at colleges.
For a middle school kid, it seemed like a dream to be able to live on your own with your best friends, so my brother and I really looked forward to touring the dorms, especially. I do think it made me more college focused than my peers – I was really excited about the prospect of attending a unique, interesting school that fit me, and most of my high school friends went to X or Y state school b/c that’s all they really knew was out there.
In hindsight, it was great – it set up a system of self-motivation that was not parent driven – I knew I had to work hard if I wanted to be accepted to the really amazing out of state school on the ocean. Ultimately, I found a great school when I was a Junior in high school, which was not one of the schools we visited growing up. But I already knew what I was looking for by the time I was seriously applying to schools.
anon
We had a joke when I was in high school that it wasn’t a family trip unless we did a college visit. Sometimes it was (literally) a drive by of a campus and sometimes it was more depth if it was a school that I might be interested in. It was good exposure and a low key way to see different schools. I also did a formal college tour junior year that my high school sponsored as well as targeted trips when it came time for applications/interviews.
Anonymous
Why do you want to expose your kids to options out of your budget – now or ever?
Anonymous
Because financial aid?
Anonymous
Financial aid? Stanford and lots of other top colleges are free to families who make less than $120k. Probably OP doesn’t fall in that category, but there are plenty of options for financing an education even if you don’t have $200k just sitting in the bank. I’d never discourage my kid from applying to a top school because I wasn’t sure how I would pay for it.
Anonymous
Education does not end at undergrad. As a lawyer, OP might consider helping her kids to pay for law or grad school.
Yes, there are options for financing education, but the tuition prices are out of control and many graduate with crippling debt that will impact their ability to pay for their own kids’ education and/or life in retirement.
There is an option for a kid from a middle-class family to get merit aid at a lower-tier school and thus make it more affordable, but… they have to be OK with going to a lower-tier school :)
Lalalalola
My 2 cents, having been through this twice: Let him or her drive the process. Do drive-bys if you happen to be near a college, but before the testing process starts, not much will sink in. Make three focused visits junior year: Giant state school, midsize rural or suburban, tiny private, to give a basis for comparison. Do not expect that any of the visits will be to the school your child decides to attend, and be prepared to make some visits in the weeks after acceptance letters go out. Many schools offer overnight visits with current students, which a HS junior can and should do alone.
Anonymous
My experience is that the school will steer her towards appropriate options given her grades and level of academic interest. For most kids at my public high school, that was one of the three large state universities. If you/she want her to go somewhere else, I’d try to combine college visits with vacations, but otherwise I don’t think you need to do a lot of college touring. Most people in my high school never did out of state college visits.
No Problem
Yeah…wait until your kid is a junior in high school before even thinking about this. That’s when she’ll start getting all the mailers from all the schools, because she’ll have taken the PSAT and gotten on everybody’s radars. Discuss what kind of school she’d like to go to (size of school, size of city, distance from home/area of the country, financial ability/restrictions on attending certain schools, schools she can get into based on grades) and if she has ideas yet for what she’d like to study. It’s a completely different search if she wants to do engineering vs. business school vs. art school vs. nursing vs. no idea right now but probably liberal arts.
For example, by the time I was a junior, I knew I wanted to be in a medium sized school in a city/suburbs vs. a big school/little school or small college town, did not want to go to an Ivy League school, did not want to go anywhere with harsh winters, and was probably going to land in the liberal arts somewhere. Luckily, financing was not an issue for me. So when I started getting all the brochures, I sorted them by yes, no, and maybe in terms of where I wanted to visit. I worked with my parents to cull the list and ended up visiting 8 schools over 3 trips: a flying trip with my Mom to Chicago and St. Louis, a driving trip to the Mid-Atlantic with my Dad, and another flying trip with my Mom to Atlanta. The first two trips were the summer between junior and senior year, and the last trip was early fall of senior year before early decision applications were due. The goal was to rank order the schools after I visited each one so that I could apply early decision to my top choice. That particular strategy might not work for your children, but it did for me because I had a clear favorite.
Anonymous
I had never been to a college campus before I moved into my dorm the week before freshman year of college.
Kids have so much exposure to options now. Kids can google schools, take digital tours, read about different programs, etc. Let your child tell you what they think they’re interested in and whether they want to visit in person.
Anonymous
I had tiger parents who would have died at the thought of me going to our mediocre State U and my high school guidance counselors weren’t equipped to talk about any other options, besides community college or trade schools. So my parents took me on two separate college tours, one in New England (Harvard, Yale, MIT, Princeton, Dartmouth and Columbia) and one in California (Stanford, Berkeley and Caltech). One of those trips was summer before junior year, the other was spring break of junior year. I ended up applying to most of those plus a few other schools, which I figured I would visit on the admitted students weekend if I was seriously considering going there. Even my parents didn’t start the college craziness until almost my junior year, so I definitely don’t think you need to drag your middle-schooler around to colleges.
College visits?
For a moment, I thought you meant you had parents who went to Princeton :) But I am not a Tiger parent, of any of the stripes they come in.
I do think that one child would probably go to an MIT-type school and/or get a BFA somewhere, if that is a combination that exists. The other child can burp most of the alphabet (baby of the family — she is smart, but not in an overt way, and would seem to have a wider range of places she’s enjoy). So I really want them to at least see the world, and if our budget can’t handle 4 years somewhere *2 kids, then maybe they can swing a summer somewhere. It’s all knowing about the world, a bit, before you have to decide things with consequences.
Anonymous
Ha, no, not those kind of Tiger parents. My parents actually didn’t go to Ivies, but I think that only made them more adamant that I would.
bridget
Whoa, that’s a varied list.
Let’s focus it a bit. Geography/football/weather just is not an issue. If your kid wants a big sports school, she will know. But that’s a big waste of time otherwise.
Likewise, other parts of the country just for its own sake. Take vacations there, and your girls will let you know if they really want to go to school elsewhere.
Go with the traditional reach/match/safety schools, all of which are of approximately the size she wants and have the majors she wants. Remember that a “safety” is a school that is affordable, she can be admitted to, and she would be happy attending.
It is FAR more important to find good match and safety schools than it is to tour a random assortment of schools for its own sake.
That said, I think it’s important to tour schools with a range of academic rigor. It’s not just a reach/match/safety thing… it’s important for young people to understand both that they can get a good education anywhere, and to understand just how much talent is out there.
Gail the Goldfish
Hey, don’t underestimate weather. Weather was a factor in my college selection and having basically the entire year be pleasant weather you could spend outside definitely improved my college experience. I picked my law school without regard to weather because I thought “how bad could snow be” and it turned out to be far more miserable than I imagined.
I can’t imagine touring schools until at least junior year, but for me, it was helpful in narrowing down what I wanted in a school, because I rally didn’t know. My mom and I did a big road trip up the east coast my summer before senior year to schools I thought I wanted to apply to. I think I ended up applying to maybe two of the schools after we looked at them all, so it was helpful as a deselection process more than a selection process.
bridget
But you don’t need to tour a school to know how you feel about cold or heat or snow – you just need to experience those things. That can include a trip to see family, a ski vacation, a summer trip to the beach, one of those school trips to DC, etc.
I mean, there just isn’t enough time to see it all, so you narrow down based on the easy stuff (weather, reputation, size, majors offered, cost) and then tour accordingly.
ORD
Oh man, my daughter is a junior in high school, and I feel like we are so far behind. She’s in a good public school, but they really don’t give much guidance on things like this. Talking about college used to stress her out so I never pushed it, and now she’s wondering why her friends have gone on these college tours and she has not. We’re visiting Michigan for a football game and next month and will do one tour then, but who knows if we’ll fit in others later. She talks about MIT, but I don’t know if she has a chance to get in there, so wouldn’t a college tour be an unfortunate waste of time before knowing if she has a shot? We don’t live at all nearby . . .
housecounsel
ORD, I have a senior and we didn’t start until Christmas break of junior year. We visited what she thought was her dream school and surprisingly found out she didn’t love it. It felt more like a city than a campus. We packed several more visits (two trips, one to each coast) into this past August. Like many kids in her high school, she is applying to 15-20 college. We told her there was no way we had the time or money to visit that many, so she focused her visits narrowing down to the school to which she will apply early decision. If your daughter is looking at schools in the MIT category, this could be really important. Find out if there is a competitive advantage to applying ED. In the case of my daughter’s new “dream” school the acceptance rate for ED is something like 20% instead of 8% regular decision. If my senior gets in to dream school, she has to withdraw all other applications. This is killing me because I see her being so happy and at home at her second-choice school and I think she is applying to dream school just because she thinks she should because it is a big name. I am saying ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about this, because I think my job right now is to shut up and support.
housecounsel
Please forgive the disjointed grammar above. To clarify, when I say I see my daughter “at home” at her second-choice school, I do not mean actually at home. Every school on her list including the first and second choices are far, far away.
housecounsel
And – there is always time later to visit the ones to which she is admitted, if she doesn’t get in ED to #1. Sorry. I could talk about this all day long by I try really hard not to IRL.
ORD
Wait, they apply to 15-20 colleges? I had no idea. So much to learn!
AdmissionsVeteran
So, there are calculators that can help you determine how competitive a student is for a school. (We had two of the massive college guides and each had one.) Visiting can make you more competitive (since colleges want to increase their yield numbers and there is a correlation between visiting and enrolling). Also, apply early action or early decision helps, for the same reason.
housecounsel
True. Our school uses one called Naviance. It tells you not only national stats but also for your individual high school. It’s a rabbit hole. Be prepared to lose a few thousand hours wondering why an unidentified student with an ACT of X and a GPA of Y didn’t get in to Princeton.
ORD
Ooh, thank you. I just logged into her school’s Naviance. I see a “College Research” tab — good to know.
Lalalalola
Use extreme caution with Naviance data, which I found to be unreliable. In our case the scattergrams were limited to acceptance data self-reported by students, and not a realistic profile of accepted students.
Beth
I agree with this- I did touring the summer between junior and senior year but only visited one of my reach schools- didn’t want to get my hopes too high. I ended up getting in everywhere (my reaches in hindsight weren’t reaches) and did tours then.
MIT Alum
If her daughter is interested in MIT, please encourage her to apply. She has nothing to lose except the $75 application fee. If she gets in, there is a Campus Preview Weekend in April when she can visit. Many students visit the school for the first time then. Also, unlike many of the Ivy League schools, MIT has early action, not early decision. So she can apply early and potentially have her college process all over by December of her senior year, but it’s totally non-binding and she can also apply elsewhere if she’s not sure where she wants to go.
I love MIT and I especially love hearing about young women who are interested in the school. I do admissions interviews for MIT and the women who apply are all ridiculously qualified and driven, but it seems like every guy who is even halfway decent at math tosses off an application to MIT. I wish more women would take that “what if” shot that so many guys seem to be comfortable taking (I also think this is why the MIT acceptance rate is significantly higher for women than it is for men, because the women who apply have already self-selected much more than the guys…although I’ve had a lot of bros mansplain to me that it’s all affirmative action and MIT takes dumb women to fill some sort of quota. Eyeroll).
ORD
Aww, thank you for posting this. My daughter loves math, stats, and computer science, so that’s why she’s thinking about MIT. I like the plan of encouraging her to apply but deferring a campus visit until after admissions.
January
I don’t know. I visited EVERYWHERE – nearly all eight Ivy League schools, all of the eight schools I applied to, including the state university, and probably nearly every random college within a 100-mile radius. It was overwhelming, and I’m not sure it helped me make a decision (for what it’s worth, I was and am very happy with where I went to college). But they almost all look the same (or at least enjoyable) from the tour. I didn’t do this extensive touring for law school, and again – I don’t think it mattered.
Anon in NYC
I didn’t tour law schools at all. I figured, I’m going to be in law school. Who cares what the campus looks like? I assumed that they would have the basics covered and they did.
Anonymama
This is crazy. Get one of those big college guides, visit a few nearby schools so they have an idea of what a big/small/public/etc school looks and feels like, and ask them about what they think about colleges they’d like to visit/attend. If there’s a particular one you think would be a great fit maybe take a vacation to a nearby place and stop and see it on the way. Show that you have confidence in their judgment and that you trust them to be okay no matter what college they go to.
Susan
I grew up in Philadelphia and my parents loved to drive all over New England for summer vacations, so we “visited” A LOT of colleges. It was great exposure for me. We didn’t necessarily “tour” or meet anyone, just poked around the town, strolled the campus, visited the library. Just a “what would it be like to live here?” It helped de-mystify some of the more intimidating schools and really helped me expand my ideas of what college could be. Depending on the geographical proximity of institutions of higher learning and/or your tolerance for road trips, you could also look into vacationing in the city and staying at the dorm (cheap lodging!) camps, sporting events, etc. to get a feel for different types of schools before narrowing down and focusing on tours/official visits.
Rei Hino
I agree with a lot of the other commenters in that I think middle school is way to early to be visiting that many colleges. However, seeing a college campus can be valuable for a child that age, it helps them visualize the reality and have a tangible goal to works towards. If it were me, I’d take a family vacation to my alma mater and show my kids all of my old haunts and reminisce about what a good time I had there. That way, it’s personal to your family and not all about the college race before they even get into high school. My dad did that with me when I was younger (though we lived only 20 miles away from where he went to college so we didn’t need to get a hotel or anything) and I still have fond memories of that trip.
afdshf
What do you wear when you’re working from home?
I’m working from home for the first time today, just started as a consultant, my team is in a different state and there was no good reason for me to go to the office.
I’m wearing a “blouse” and shorts. So splitting the difference.
Anonymous
I work from home every day. Right now I’m wearing gym clothes bc I didn’t make it there this morning and I’m hoping that by keeping them on I will be motivated to go before daycare pickup. Most days I wear a casual weekend outfit – jeans/shorts/skirt and a casual top. If I have a videoconference I wear business casual to match my colleagues’ dress code.
I have been known to wear pajamas all day on occasion – usually in the winter – and I don’t recommend it. It negatively impacts my mindset and motivation.
afshp
I also know from school how I work best, and while I know its good to get out of the house and focus, I also work well when I’m comfortable. So maybe no pajamas, but I’d much rather be comfy at home than uncomfortable and alone in the office. Obviously I guess. I will also feel less anxious and be able to get more done. Open floor plans suck.
Bonnie
Pajamas or sweats.
Meredith Grey
I hope people who work from home wear comfortable clothes!! -Signed, Very Uncomfortable in Suit Pants.
purplesneakers
i wear dresses, which are as comfortable as jammies but give people the illusion that I’m more put together than I am.
housecounsel
I work from home almost every day and wear casual weekend wear but not sweats or pajamas. I drop my daughter at school every morning and get coffee at a non-drive-through Starbucks so I am forced to look somewhat presentable. I hope my Starbucks never builds a drive-through.
new hire
How long do you take for lunch? Do you do small errands during lunch time if they’re close by?
Anon8
Depends on my schedule for the day, but if time permits I take an hour. I definitely run errands during lunch because it’s easier than going after work. My office is very laid back and flexible, so I can take a longer lunch if needed.
I think it’s a know your office thing. If you’re new, take a cue from co-workers to see what they usually do for lunch.
new hire
My office is pretty flexible. They’re okay with things like coming in early and leaving early, or the opposite, as long as you get your work done. I know someone a few years ahead of me who takes an hour for lunch every day because she needs the break in order to be focused again, and its fine and she just stays a bit later.
Houda
I take 30 minutes and might use that time to chat with family or do a couple phone calls
jwalk
I take somewhere between twenty minutes and an hour and a half, depending on how much work I have that day and whether I’m eating alone or going out with colleagues. I definitely run errands if they’re close by. I live on the outskirts of the city so going on the weekend is harder.
housecounsel
I do run small errands at lunch, not every day. It took me a while to feel comfortable doing this, but I figure I have been on the job long enough to show that I won’t abuse the privilege of working from home.
Barca/Paris
DH and I are en route to the airport for our honeymoon — a week in Barcelona and a week in Paris. So excited, but have done such little planning. Any recommendations for either city would be much appreciated; we’re totally open-minded. (And I would love to eat some fantastic food.) TIA!
Anon in NYC
In Paris: check out Rue Cler, pick up some food from the little shops and walk to the Eiffel Tower and make a picnic. Go to L’A’s du Falafel and Chez Omar. Check out Saint Chappelle and the Rodin museum. Paris has the original Highline (called Coulee Verte Rene Dumont, formerly Promenade Plantee), which is a pleasant elevated park.
Have fun!!
purplesneakers
I cannot recommend Sandeman’s New Europe tours enough. I went on the Paris one and the Versailles one, and it was a blast. Ask for Alex if he’s still around, he’s a slightly mad Kiwi who’s a complete hoot.
ezt
BCN: For food, a place called La Xampanyeria (also called Can Paixano apparently) – completely packed all the time, 2 euro cava bottles and delish cheap sandwiches. For sightseeing, Sagrada Familia and the Gaudi park are musts. Hospital San Pau is also cool and the Picasso museum is interesting. Have fun!
Anon in Biglaw
Picasso and Sagrada – get your tickets online before you to avoid the lines. Give yourself a couple of hours for sagrada.
I loved abac, they had the most interesting food. try for tickets (we didn’t plan far enough in advance) If La Xampanyeria is closed, the modern bar across the street is good too (we discovered when L Xampanyeria was closed for easter week).
Paris – oh Paris… enjoy!! Bring ziploc bags if you have any interest in bringing back french butter
DC Anon
3 restaurants you must go to in Paris:
1. Pierre Sang (Oberkampf metro): It’s a 6 course tasting. The food is French with surprising Korean elements slipped in. Definitely sit at the bar where you’ll get to watch the chefs cooking right in front of you. And you must get the wine pairing, of course. We liked dinner so much we came back for lunch the next day.
2. L’Esquisse (Lamarck metro): This is a neighborhood spot in the non-touristy side of Montmartre and I would go here constantly if I lived in Paris. It’s effectively a very modern hipster bistro. The guy who owns it (Thomas) is also one of the servers and handles the wine. Ask him to pair wine with your meal. He knows an absurd amount about wine and communicates it in an engaging, unstuffy way. And his wine choices are pretty much amazing. Also make sure you order the poached egg with mushroom foam if they still have it. It’s just so good I can’t even explain. Dinner service starts at 8 pm and I’d recommend getting there right at 8 pm. They got some great press recently and have started getting pretty busy.
Also, L’Esquisse is located at the bottom of the Montmartre butte. So you can climb the butte from the Abbesses side, watch the sunset at Sacre Coeur, and then walk down the backside of the butte to dinner.
3. Le Comptoir de la Relais (St. Germain): This is the best place in St. Germain. The dinner reservations are apparently impossible to get, but there are no reservations for lunch and usually there is no line or a very short line. The food is just really outstanding with some great people-watching as well.
Anonforthis
Random question of the day: Are you passionate about the substance of what you do? I don’t mean do you feel passionately about advancing in your career, but more like is the subject matter of your work something you have very strong feelings about?
I ask because I work in a very niche area of law where there is a pretty clear philosophical divide and people in this field tend to dedicate their whole lives to working on one side vs. the other. People at my firm strongly fall on one side of the divide, and often do speaking gigs, write op eds, etc. advocating for this view, even when they are not representing a specific client. But while I find this field to be very interesting and intellectually challenging, to be honest, I see both sides on most issues and would probably be just as happy working on the opposite side if the job was right. In some ways I think this actually makes me a better lawyer, because I think I’m more objective than most when evaluating my clients’ positions. But I do wonder if I belong in this career given that I’m primarily driven by achieving a good outcome for my clients vs. a bigger policy goal. (Note that I work for a for-profit firm, if that changes anything). Thoughts?
Anonymous
Are you by any chance a public defender?
Anonforthis
No, as I said, I work for a for-profit firm. Think something akin to environmental law – my field has stakeholders in the private, government, and public interest sectors.
anonymous
I’ll bite. I’m an environmental lawyer. I originally went to law school wanting to do public interest environmental law or work for a government agency. I was pretty pro-environment but still moderate and didn’t have the myopic “good guy/bad guy” view. I also entered law school with a good understanding of what environmental law actually *was,* i.e., non-glamorous solid/hazardous waste regulations, administrative procedure, toxic substance reporting laws, permitting, rather than saving the whales or wild flowers or whatever.
Found a job working in private practice (public interest enviro jobs are v. hard to come by). I simply love the substance of what I do. I love environmental law, admin law, regulatory compliance, due diligence. It’s intellectually challenging, engaging, and I love how it all works together and how the practice is so interdisciplinary. It probably helps that I don’t really disagree much with what I’m doing- my clients are generally more interested in compliance/ managing enforcement actions in a reasonable, cost-effective way rather than being the lead plaintiff challenging high-profile rules. I’m not nearly as desperate to get back to the public interest side as I once was, and yeah, there usually are good arguments on “both sides.”
There are a lot of people in my field who feel like I do. It’s not uncommon to spend parts of your career in private practice and the public sector/non-profits, and it’s not really looked at as weird. They all offer different upsides and downsides, and you learn different perspectives at each.
Anonforthis
This is good to hear, thank you. I feel very similarly.
Anon
I am an appellate public defender. The subject matter of my work is something I feel very strongly about, is part of who I am now, and is the reason I have stayed at this job for 10 years and will very likely stay in this job until I retire. There is no other type of law I want to practice.
a.k.
I work for a federal regulatory agency. I am absolutely passionate about what I do. I love the policy work and that I can point to tangible ways that my work has helped the lives of millions of Americans.
Gross belly
Guys, I have stomach issues. When I eat, my digestion noises are so loud people can hear them outside of my office. No exaggeration, like 10 feet away in a quiet-ish office. When I am hungry, same thing – like an alien is trying to escape from my belly. I take a probiotic daily before dinner, and several mornings a week drink a ACV/honey/lemon juice/water concoction to help with this. From what I can tell the probiotic does nothing but the ACV helps the gassiness a bit. Is everyone’s belly this noisy/active?
Signed,
Fartastic and not loving it.
Oh, and Trollnonymous let me save you the trouble: See a doctor. ‘Kay? No need to hear from you today.
Anonymous
Have you only tried the one probiotic? Different brands contain different bacteria. For example, activia yoghurt works for me but many other brands don’t. I also had to try about 5 different brands of probiotic before I found one that worked. Drugstore/grocery stores usually carry a few different brands. Buy a few and try each for a few days to see what suits best.
Anonymous
Probiotics make me incredibly gassy. Have you tried skipping it for a week?
anon
You might have some sort of food allergy or intolerance. This happened to me all. the. time. until I stopped eating dairy.
Anonymous2
Dairy is a big potential culprit as is wheat/gluten.
anon
No, no, no. Gluten intolerance is not a thing. Stop trying to make it a thing. #doyouevensciencebro
anon
PS, before anyone jumps on me, I have celiac disease. Gluten ALLERGY=a thing. “Sensitivity”=NOT a thing.
Anonymous
But a gluten allergy that is less intense than what shows up on the celiac test is a thing. My mother had many symptoms of celiacs, but over and over the test came back negative. An elimination diet determined that gluten caused her problems.
Houda
Happened to me as I was in a big meeting room alone with a very senior partner.
I just laughed it off and moved on. I couldn’t do anything about it but it is definitely embarassing
Gross belly
Thanks for commiserating, friends! I have tried a few probiotics but I admittedly haven’t done much research and don’t pay attention to which brands have what sort of bacteria. I’ll take a look at that. I’ve also done some elimination but haven’t found anything notably different regarding what I eat and the gassiness/noise. It’s pretty much constant. Weirdly, in looking into some stuff for my meditation practice I found information about Kapha, which indicates that most of the things I eat most regularly may be throwing my system off/weighing it down (bananas, avocados, pineapple). I don’t eat much dairy other than the occasional butter in cooking and sheep’s milk romano cheese (which I will not give up no matter how farty I get!!) Perhaps more careful charting is in order. Thanks!
Anonymous
Lol. It is not trolling to suggest seeing a doctor to deal with medical issues.
Also have you tried eating more? Like if you’re getting loud hungry noises, maybe a cracker or two a little before they usually start? And for post lunch ginger?
Anon
Yeah – I agree, definitely not trolling to suggest that you see a doctor or allergist. That volume isn’t normal or typical. My stomach only growls if I don’t eat, or if I eat certain foods on an empty stomach (black coffee, no food will cause the issues).
On a daily basis, my stomach does not make noise.
Gross belly
You remind me I have seen an allergist! He tested for foods b/c I thought dairy was causing other problems (skin redness). Also tested for environmental allergens and I’m only allergic to cats and dust mites. Didn’t show any food sensitivities. So it’s not likely an allergy thing.
Blonde Lawyer
Food sensitivities do not normally show up in allergy testing. Those are different responses they are testing for.
Gross belly
Ha, I know, but sometimes the fast-fired-off, common sense response takes the fun out of it for me. And, it always seems to be the first comment, always from an Anonymous, and never with any…feeling of community.
See a doctor.
Break up with him.
Get a new job.
Quit.
Move.
Buy the pants.
Get rid of the dog.
Don’t go to the party.
I mean, really. What’s the point?
Also, I am happy to take your recommendation of eating more! More cookies for me please :). Trying ginger tea lately too, but mostly at night so I’ll add it to the daytime routine maybe. Thanks!
January
(you should definitely do all of the above, though – maybe your stomach issues are caused by stress!)
T
speaking of teas, mint tea always relaxes any stomach problems I’m having.
afshp
Adult onset lactose intolerance? You could be lactose intolerant and not fart, just have an upset stomach.
Does it hurt, or just loud?
Also Gelusil works wonders.
Gross belly
I’m def. lactose intolerant, so I avoid dairy. Not pain, but so, so loud. I’ll check out Gelusil. I guess I’ll just have to accept I’m one of those farty old people who has to take fart suppression pills. Sigh.
Meg Murry
Many probiotics contain small amounts of dairy, and tons of foods contain more milk products than you may realize. You may be more dairy sensitive than you realize, or it might be dairy sensitivity rather than just lactose sensitivity. Have you ever taken lactaid, and did it make a difference?
Can you try *not* taking the probiotics and acid and see if that makes a difference?
Is it only noises in your digestive tract, or do you also feel bloated, burp-y or have diarrhea or constipation? Gas-X (simethicone) helps when I’m feeling bloated or like I have excess air somewhere in my digestive tract. And regarding fart suppression pills – Beano actually does work for foods that are gassy like beans, broccoli, seeds, etc.
Other things that make my tummy crazy: things with added fiber (like FiberOne bars), sugar alcohols/sugar free products. Eating too fast/swallowing too much air or too many caffinated drinks can also make me feel like my digestive system is going crazy.
I also agree to eat earlier/sooner rather than wait until your stomach is really rumbling. Could you do a mid-morning snack, smaller lunch and mid-afternoon snack?
Lilly
Following up on the possibility of being super sensitive to dairy and it being in foods where you don’t suspect it, look for the ingredient casein, it is a milk protein.
anon
yes, agreed. i developed a sensitivity to dairy later in life, and am surprised by how many foods which don’t seem to be “dairy” actually contain milk products. i feel so much better now that i watch this more closely.
EM
I get this too, but only at night when I am trying to sleep! It’s like my body waits for me to lie down and shut my eyes before deciding it has things to say. A relative says sleeping more upright, like in a lazy boy, mutes it (or rather, makes digestion easier.)
Very bizarre. Please keep us informed as to potential cures!
Godzilla
H3ll, I’ll tell you go to the doctor. Anyways, can you break down what you eat in a typical day? I’m curious to see what you’re eating.
Anonymous
Gluten? My celiac-having roommate (who didn’t know she had in college) was very gassy (which was also smelly – too her at least) prior to figuring out her diagnosis. Just be sure to watch for all the hidden gluten and cross-contamination.
Betty
If you suspect that you may have a gluten intolerance, go to the doctor BEFORE you cut out gluten. Once you have been GF for a while, the test will no longer detect the inflammatory response that is characteristic of Celiac’s disease. Also, cutting out gluten is a huge pain and not necessarily more healthy unless you have a sensitivity or have Celiac’s.
Ally McBeal
You might try some sort of elimination diet to see if you can figure out what’s going on with you. (In addition to the doctor, etc.) I did a Whole30 and felt amazing during it. Reintroduction helped me figure out that my body does not like wheat/baked goods, sugar, chocolate (who knew?), or dairy. This was all very sad, because I personally adore baked goods, sugar, chocolate, and dairy. But now I have a pretty good sense of what eating those foods will do to me. (Respectively, headache and hangry, epic energy crashes in the afternoon, shaky hands and jittery feelings, and stomach ache/bloating).
waffles
Not sure if this would be a medically recommended solution, but I’ve got the same problem and I find chewable Ovol (a gas control over-the-counter) has been really helpful. I found that I needed to go higher than the recommended dose to get the most effective relief. I’m definitely not a doctor though…
Anonymous
Anyone have PCOS? Have you taken metformin? I started taking metformin for it today. My gyn gave me 500 mg pills with the instructions to take 1 once a day and scale up to 1 three times a day. I was warned it can cause GI side effects, so of course I’m convinced I’m nauseated although that’s probably psychosomatic after taking 1 pill.
Anonymous
I have PCOS. I don’t take metformin, but there are subreddits on Reddit specifically for women with PCOS and there is a lot of discussion there about metformin.
https://www.reddit.com/r/PCOS/
Anon
I have PCOS too. I don’t take any medication. But I eat very less complex carbs and only in the afternoon and desserts only once a week. This helps me keep my weight under control which in turn keeps PCOS under control.
Meg Murry
I have taken it in the past for PCOS, and yes, it can do a number on your stomach – for me specifically it was bloating and diarrhea (sorry for the TMI). You may want to play around with what time of day you take it to see the effects (in other words, does it give you stomach trouble almost immediately, or does it take a couple hours). Or you might be lucky and not really have side effects or only minor ones. For me the side effects were worst if I took it something that wasn’t a good balance of fats, proteins and carbs – for instance, if I had a ton of cheese or a giant pile of pasta, so it kind of forced me into eating more balanced meals. I also found the extended release variety was gentler on my stomach than the non-extended release.
But metformin helped take away some of the worst of my hangries and my major blood sugar spikes and crashes. I’m not on it right now, but I should probably get back on it.
Anonymous
Metformin is one of the most common meds prescribed, and is well tolerated by most. It is tricky because GI side effects can happen, but as you even wonder…., GI side effects are very suggestible.
Are you starting with a dose at night? That often works, and taking with some food… something very bland. Even if there is a little suggestion of side effects initially, it should go away.
I hope it helps you. Good luck
GirlFriday
Yes I have [been diagnosed with] PCOS. No, I don’t take Metformin, but at my annual last week my obgyn suggested it. I’m not overweight. My insulin levels are normal. This just rings false to me (not saying you shouldn’t take it). The most frustrating thing about this diagnosis is the constant pill-pushing. We can make you have a period. We can make you get pregnant. Do you not care at all about my body and addressing the underlying cause of these issues? It’s like the pendulum swings from pill-pushers to some voodoo chant I’m supposed to recite to try to get pregnant. Has anyone else experienced this? Sorry for the TJ.
Anonymous
I went to 4 doctors before I found one who wanted to really look at whether we could address my PCOS without pills. Every doctor prior to my current one immediately told me metformin followed by clomid would be the only way I could conceive. My current doctor told me if I was willing to give her 6-8 months we’d do our best to get my body in the best place possible to hopefully conceive. She did say that it’s very possible we could do everything right and I’d still need to take some medications, but she wants to try to bring my period back naturally so that I have healthy hormone levels without the need to be taking things right and less to adjust levels up and down and up and down.
Anonymous
I’ve started taking it for prediabetes, 500 mg once a day. This is day 10. No noticeable side effects thus far. I take it with dinner, which is usually a balanced meal at about 8:00 pm these days.
moms site
is there no new post on the moms site today or is my browser just acting up? I’m using Chrome on a desktop.
Anonymous
Not just you. I don’t see one either. Internet Explorer.
Anonymous
I haven’t seen one yet either.
Lurker
There is not and I really wanted to post today. I keep checking for it!
Anonymous
Post on the afternoon open thread on the main site. Seems extra busy on the main site today probably because a lot of posters that frequent the moms site are over here.
Anonymous
On an iPhone and also don’t see a post.
Anon
This might out me. Meh. I’m just so proud of how I handled it and don’t have many people I can tell.
In late winter, I got out of an emotionally and verbally abusive thing with a guy (let’s call him AG) that only got physical once and could have another time had I not figured it out in time to get away. It had been going on throughout law school and he was a classmate. This was the time it’s stuck. My life is much improved. I do have PTSD; recent diagnosis. It’s been a hard few weeks in that regard.
A mutual classmate of ours visited for the first time since he moved away a few months ago this weekend and had a party last night. It was important to me that I go, even though I knew AG was going to be there, so I prepared accordingly: warned the guy who was hosting it that I might have to leave early, brought a friend of mine and we safety-planned that I should never, ever be left alone with AG. He knows me well enough to be able to tell without me saying how I’m doing. I planned to tell one or two people who already knew the story that I was struggling if I needed to (which I ended up doing). I recently just moved, in part so that he doesn’t know where I live (nothing ever happened in that regard, but I felt a lot safer knowing he didn’t know where I was, because he had shown up at other women’s houses drunk and angry), but I told anyone who knows where I live now to either not mention even the neighborhood or say I lived in a completely different neighborhood, miles away.
Plan A of Friend and I stick together went out the window immediately, when AG took the only spot by him. Friend gave me the “It’s okay, I’ve got this” look and I sat at the other end of the table, chatting with other friends, although I was hyper aware of what AG was doing (side effect of tracking how drunk he was for a few years so I could stay emotionally and physically safe), and always knew where he was.
We eventually moved to a different bar, and again, AG sat by Friend, but I was already sitting across from Friend at the time, so I just decided to do my best to ignore him. Friend and I were chatting about work stuff, etc, and then the conversation became serious; I started telling him about the process for organ transplants, something I’ll one day need. AG knew this, and I could tell he was paying attention. I was talking about how terrifying the process is, especially “dry runs,” when suddenly, AG popped his head over and set it on Friend’s shoulder. To Friend’s credit, he didn’t react at all and just kept engaging with me. AG is giving me this….smile? while not breaking eye contact and I tried to ignore him for a solid 45 seconds to a minute, but he was super persistent and just kept staring at me.
I finally finished the particular line of explanation, and turned to him and said with as much anger and hatred and vitriol as I could muster “Yes…?” “CONGRATULATIONS!” (we both just passed the bar on Friday). I was so angry- I was telling Friend about this super serious, scary thing, and AG decided it was his time to interrupt and attempt to exert power over me. He knew exactly what he was doing; he knew exactly the conversation he was interrupting, and he could have interrupted one of a dozen other conversations. But he tried to make it clear how unimportant this huge health thing for me is and how important his voice is. I snapped “You too. ANYWAY….” to friend and jumped back into the conversation.
I was so proud of myself; Friend said he’s never seen me so cold and self-assured, and AG was stunned. I’ve rarely stood up to him like that before, and especially with that amount of anger and disdain in my voice, and I’ve definitely never stood up to him and then been able to jump back into conversation. I had to step away a few minutes later to take some deep breaths, but AG didn’t see that. I could tell he got the message: Leave. me. alone. I am so, so proud of myself. It was still a hard night; thank G-d for Friend and others who kept me in the moment and did everything they could to prevent me flashing back and going into AG-Mode, but in that moment, I finally, finally felt like he doesn’t have the power over me he used to. I didn’t cry about it later, I didn’t shake from head to toe for 30 minutes afterwards, I wasn’t afraid of his reaction- I just did it and made clear he doesn’t get to dictate my topics of conversation anymore.
It’s the little tiny things.
Anonymous
This isn’t tiny. It’s huge. Awesome. This internet stranger is super proud of you.
Anon
Congratulations! Not just on the bar exam but on fighting your battle like a b@d-@ass! You rock.
JayJay
This is a big deal. You’re awesome. Good work!
Idea
It sounds like you did it exactly right! Great job!
Senior Attorney
Nicely done! Rock on!
Betty
Not a little thing at all! You are amazing!!!
lost academic
That’s incredible and HUGE. I’m stunned and I don’t even know you. GO YOU!
bgo
Completely Agree. This is NOT tiny – it is a huge step. Not only how you handled it – but that you can love yourself enough both to handle it that way and to be proud of yourself on your personal progress. This internet stranger is also super proud of you and is cheering you on!!
lawsuited
RAWR! Well done!
Anonymous
That’s HUGE! Congratulations, indeed!
Anon
Thanks all. :)
Anonymous Poser
This is not tiny at all!
This may be too late for you to see, but…wanted to say…way to go!
Congratulations!
RBF
I wanted to thank everyone who gave me advice about my resting b-tch face / interview demeanor on the weekend thread. As silly as this sounds, I spent the weekend practicing in front of a mirror so I could make sure that I always looked friendly and enthusiastic. I had an interview recently and I really focused on dialing up the charm and always being positive and energetic. It went great, and I got an offer!
Blonde Lawyer
That is fantastic!!
Anonymous
Well done! Go you!
Anon
Congratulations! Thank you for sharing your good news!