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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. I was perusing the Banana Republic website recently and this skirt caught my eye about five separate times because it was paired with different sweaters and blazers that were actually the featured item. I think it's a fun and eye-catching skirt that is also professional. I'd wear it with all sorts of toppers — neutrals like navy, black, cream — or go for a bit of contrast with olive green or red (as styled here), or else just pick one of the less prominent colors in the skirt (pink, light purple, light blue) to pull out for the top. It's $98, full price, available in regular, tall, and petite sizes 0-16. (Good news: You can get free shipping on all orders over $25 through 1/24, no code needed.) Banana Republic Watercolor Pencil Skirt Two plus-size options are here and here (the watercolor print). Psst: Ann Taylor is offering 50% off select full-price suiting and blouses — use code SUITUP through 1/22 at 3 AM EST. Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (L-all)Sales of note for 10.24.24
- Nordstrom – Fall sale, up to 50% off!
- Ann Taylor – Friends of Ann Event, 30% off! Suits are included in the 30% off!
- Banana Republic Factory – 40-60% off everything, and redeem Stylecash!
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
- J.Crew – Friends & Family event, 30% off sitewide.
- J.Crew Factory – 40% off everything
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Up to 30% off on new arrivals
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 40% off entire purchase, plus free shipping no minimum
- White House Black Market – Buy more, save more; buy 3+ get an extra 50% off
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
anonymous
What do I wear for a meet and greet with employers in a fairly conservative industry? Any general rules? Is a suit too formal for this? I’m a student and have never done this before….
Cat
Suit, definitely! If you feel like you’re playing dress-up in a suit (which I totally did at your age), I’d recommend wearing the jacket around the house for a little while — it will help you get comfortable in that structured of a top.
General tips – read up on the companies you’d like to meet (and the individuals, if you know who they are), and perhaps bring printouts in your tote (you could refresh your memory during a bathroom break if needed). Look at K@t’s interview tips from a few days ago — e.g., have nicely printed copies of your resume, and a pad and pen, in your tote to grab if needed.
TBK
Suit suit suit! Also not all suits are created equal. Look for something in navy, gray, or black, with classic styling (1-2 buttons, single breasted, no ruffles/bows/buckles/weird pleats, knee-length skirt if it’s a skirt suit, and nothing tight). Depending on location/industry, if you really want to play it safe, wear a suit with a pencil skirt (not pants or an A-line skirt). Wear plain pumps with a mid-height heel (3″ used to be the top, but these days I think up to 4″ is fine if you can walk well in them). J Crew and Banana Republic have some decent suits for a reasonable price (~$300 or so for skirt/pants and jacket). If you want something more affordable, Macy’s has a line — I can’t remember the brand now, is it Calvin Klein? — of mix and match pieces that are in classic cuts and colors, and that will only run you maybe $150 for the jacket and pants/skirt.
Killer Kitten Heels
The Macy’s line that looks good is the Calvin Klein line, so good call TBK. Their Arthur Levine line there is also good. Additionally, add The Limited’s Luxe line to your “decent suits for a reasonable price” list – their regular suits aren’t great, but I just got a couple of Luxe line suits and they are actually nicer than my BR suits – the fabric weight is heavier and the lining is better quality. Lastly, if you’re really on a super-tight budget, the Jones Studio line at Dress Barn is a good buy for the money.
anonymous
Thanks for the advice! What do I wear under the suit? Does it need to be as plain as interview attire would be, or a step up in terms of interesting/patters? Also are kitten heels okay? I have a pair of black kitten heels that are ~1.5-2″ and I think they look good/conservative. I’m normally more of a flats girl, so that feels like as much as I could do comfortably without practice.
Cat
Kitten heels are completely fine.
I’d try on a few tops under your jacket (if you haven’t already) to make sure they work well and are comfortable under the jacket. Button-front shirts are a classic choice, but if they don’t work for you (e.g., gaping at chest, inability to stay neatly tucked in), a silky or dressy knit shell top is perfectly appropriate.
Basically, you don’t need to stick to a “white blouse, navy skirt suit” uniform, but you also shouldn’t wear, for example, that silk blouse from JCrew last year that has chickens on it.
Diana Barry
I would do a more interesting top – NOT a white or blue button-front. If you wear a colorful top, my chances of remembering you go way up.
TBK
Sorry — I said mid height heels meaning not too high. Erring on the lower side is always fine.
anonymous
Thanks all! One last question- for interviews I plan to wear a skirt suit per the discussion I’ve seen on here and elsewhere that it’s more “formal” and better for conservative industries. Should I match that level of formality for a meet and greet, or should I feel fine wearing a pant suit?
Mpls
What do you feel more comfortable in? Go with that. I am of the personal opinion that skirt suits and pant suits are equally formal on women, regardless of what the Crusty White Man Brigade might think.
Help...
I’m struggling with how best to address a completely frumpy wardrobe. I don’t have that many clothes, but 90% of the items I do have are frumpy, ill-fitting, cheap, and/or unflattering in some way. It’s a product of not liking shopping, not caring much about fashion, and not wanting to spend a lot of money on it, but I’m increasingly realizing that something needs to change! I hope to begin by getting rid of the worst offenders and buying some classic pieces, but I’m having trouble finding quality basics at my price point (i.e, things that will actually look good for more than 5 wears). I would classify my style goals as kind of artsy-classic; I like some of the styles from Everlane, for example, but their quality has been lacking in the items that I’ve tried. Can anyone recommend other places that I should try for some great quality basics just to get started with all of this? I’m a pear-shape size 10 with larger arms (jackets with slim arms do NOT fit me) and I desperately need help – any recommendations would be greatly appreciated!
Help...
And actually, just to provide a bit more context, I’m really a jeans-and-T-shirt or simple dress kind of woman – I’d just like those items to not be from Old Navy!
Runner 5
I’ve found that the simpler your clothes, the better the quality and fit need to be. I agree with lsw’s idea of a personal shopper.
S
If your price point is Old Navy or just slightly above that, you likely won’t be able to find high quality basics. You may need to adjust your expectations on either quality or money.
Help...
That’s not my price point – it’s just what I already own :) I’m aiming to pay more like 80-100 for a great sweater. I’ve heard good things about Vince and have seen that brand at Nordstrom Rack. I’d love to upgrade to nicer brands at this point in my life while still maintaining a small wardrobe overall.
Thanks everyone for the tips so far!
lsw
Do you have a Nordstrom accessible? I suggest using their personal shopper services. You can set a budget for it and let them know what range of prices you’re willing to entertain.
BeenThatGuy
+1 sounds like you don’t know where to start, so let someone else do the work for you.
R in Boston
Seconded. Get thee to a Nordstrom personal shopper. This is one of the things they are super useful for.
Help...
I think that sounds like a good idea (there’s no Nordstrom in my city, but it might be worth a Zipcar trip to the suburbs). Just to confirm, they’re commission only, right?
lsw
Right, it’s totally free. I found my experience to be really low pressure. I’ve since recommended it to friends who have all had good experiences (in different cities) so hopefully it would be the same for you!
Anonymous
I’m not even sure if they work on commission. I never felt pressure to buy from them. I think they might just be salaried and this is one of the jobs.
Senior Attorney
They definitely work on commission. But generally they are pretty low-pressure.
Anonymous
I think they receive bonuses for hitting certain sales targets but I don’t think it’s pure commission based. I think they’re incentivized to keep you as a long term customer vs. getting you in the system once under their name with a big transaction that you return 90% of and then never come back. At the very least, that’s how I feel like I’ve been treated there (with one anomaly makeup salesperson and I think that was just her personality to be pushy).
Senior Attorney
Not to get into a pi$$ing contest, but a close friend of mine worked at Nordstrom and yes, it’s commission based. For all sales reps, not just personal shoppers. The incentive to do a good job so you don’t return 90% is that if you do, they get 90% of their commission deducted from the next paycheck after the return. It drove her nuts because she was always at risk of having commissions disappear months after the fact.
Anonymous
SA, your first post wasn’t showing up yet when I added my comment so no need to read it as argumentative (which I thought “I think” and “At the very least, that’s how I feel…” conveyed, but ok). I will certainly defer to an employee venting to a friend vs. an employee giving what is possibly the company line to a customer.
Senior Attorney
No worries! Sorry to bristle.
Anonymous
Another plus for Nordstrom: they do minor tailoring for free on full price items. And if you get a Nordstrom card, they will give you store credit for more extensive alterations. There’s probably an upper limit on how much $$$, but I don’t know it off the top of my head.
Anonymous
Is there something that you love and is of decent quality and could just use a little tailoring to be less ill-fitting? That may be a good place to start. Then wear it to a Nordstrom (I have liked Banana Republic’s wool suiting, which are good basics as separates; always OK to wait for a sale; I am a pear) so a real person can help you find ways to make multiple outfits with your “good” piece and find similar items that you might like.
Also, look at MM LaFleur’s website. Their pieces don’t always work for me, but show how related pieces work together. Finally, google “vivienne files” and her blog is good about capsule wardrobes and has links. It’s good for brainstorming what pieces / colors work for you and what scenarios you need to dress for.
MarieC
Wow. I had never heard of The Vivienne Files… excellent recommendation!
JP
If you can find some old episodes of What Not to Wear (especially one that is for a professional woman), they actually give pretty good advice about wardrobe overhaul and de-frumpification
Anon
+1. This is fantastic advice! Definitely seek out the episodes featuring professional women or women shaped like you are.
When I was 25, I got out of the military and had NO idea what to put on my body. I’d worn uniforms to work and jeans and t-shirts on the weekends. I watched WNTW and learned so much. (And the makeover parts are really fun too :) )
Susie
So sad this show is no longer on, I love Stacy and Clinton! :(
Anon
They each have their own new shows on TLC! (So ashamed to admit I know this lol.) Clinton does one about making over your online dating profile to attract the right type of man (SO fun) and Stacy does a makeover more like WNTW used to be.
Anonymous
Macy’s and Lord & Taylor have decent quality and the prices, with sales and coupons, can be really low.
Ellen
Yay! I love Bannana Republic and this pencil skirt, tho it is not formal for me so I can NOT get reimbursment from the manageing partner. FOOEY! If I EVER got a date, I could wear this out and love it’s cut b/c guy’s would have dificulty trying to do anything w/o my permision with this on. YAY!!!
As for the OP, you MUST dress well if you ever want to get ahead or meet an eligibel batchelor. Peeople judge you by what you wear, and if you are lookeing schlumpy, they will treat you schlumpey. It’s OK to dress like you do on weekends, if you are NOT trying to date a guy, but other then that, FOOEY on schlumpey. Get some self esteem by dressing up nice, and guy’s should follow, as long as you bathe regularly.
I knew a girl from the international dorm who was VERY pretty, and guy’s were very attracted to her until they got close and figured out that she NEVER washed her clotheing. So once they got to close, they did NOT like the smell, which was like dirty laundrey. I told her to use WOOLITE, but she did NOT and no man to my knowlege ever did anything with her. FOOEY! That is not you, but just warning you to keep yourself and your clotheing FRESH! YAY!!!!!!
Idea
My suggestion is to have your colors “done” by a professional. I sent 2 photos to a blogger and she declared me a Cool Winter palette – at first, after wearing earth tones all my life, I was completely dejected and depressed. But I picked up a few new pieces in bright jewel tones and loved the complements and have slowly replaced my wardrobe to my featured colors. No matter what style, I know what colors I need to wear, and that has made me feel less frumpy, and saved me money, that I love what I wear and I wear what I love, rather than letting it languish in the closet.
Jp
Can you post the name or web address for this blogger? I would like to have my colors done but not enough to seek out and then pay someone to do it in person.
Idea
OK but it’s not a cool blog at all, it’s very suburban mom. But it worked for me when I was using it.
It’s (all one word) Missus Smarty Pants dot com
Not Mrs.
Hope this gets by moderation and also I hope it’s helpful.
Anonymous
There’s a book (Color Me Beautiful) from the 80s that your library probably has.
90% of brunettes are Winters. Primary colors, icy pastels, etc.
It’s why my auburn-haired friend could wear a blush/ivory wedding dress that would look like death on me (ruddy-skinned brunette who lives in gray, white, black, red, and very light blue).
The book is a fast-fast read (and you could probably get away with just reading the reviews on amazon).
Anon
A clarification for people reading this who might be unfamiliar: fair skinned brunettes are often winters, but olive-toned brunettes are not. My Mediterranean complexion looks like death in icy pastels, but I look amazing in strong jewel tones.
CKB
I think 90% is overstating. I am a fair skinned brunette that is a spring. Not olive toned, but I definitely have a warm complexion and cool pastels are the absolute worst colors for me to wear. Black is also not great, but I still wear it sometimes.
Runner 5
And, confusingly, you can be pale and olive toned. My Mediterranean ancestors moved north generations ago so I’m pale but olive toned. It’s as much as a nightmare for foundation shopping as you might think (though not as difficult as it is for my Sri Lankan friend)
Anonymous
Also a pale olive toned brunette! I can’t wear pastels to save my life.
Idea
And…. this is exactly why I paid $10 to a stranger on the internet rather than to a book to figure it out myself. I couldn’t figure out a thing from looking at pictures on the internet.
“In this picture, she’s wearing the dress! But in this color, the dress is wearing her! So clearly, go with the color in the first picture!” W.T.H.
YMMV
ChiLaw
My gift to myself (for getting through a year of motherhood and six months of working at a new job) has been an upgraded wardrobe. I’ve made my price point $50-100 for dresses, but I’ve accomplished that by avidly reading the comments here, stalking sales online, finding brands that fit me well, and — this has been key — making a resolution to return “anything imperfect.” I try things on standing with heels and whatever I’d normally be wearing under it (does the line at my waist from tights show? can you see the edge of my bra?) and sitting down, and leaning forward, and if there’s even a hint of “ugh I wish it didn’t…” back to the store it goes. My problem had been saying to myself “welllll it’s a little low cut but it was only $20” or “I love the color and it’s just a little short” or whatever. NOPE! If it’s not right it doesn’t matter how good a deal it was. Anyway, it has been a kind of fun project, and I’m now the proud owner of 5 dresses I never have to tug on. Almost a complete work wardrobe!
Idea
+100
Higher standards and getting rid of what doesn’t work (whether that’s cleaning out your closet or not buying it in the first place, and then knowing what to buy)
Anonymous
I also like Old Navy for my weekend stuff and I pretty much rely on Loft & Ann Taylor for work stuff. The pieces are mixed in quality- but the things tend to go together well together & always make me look polished. They ALWAYS have 40 %sales.
needing a sanity check
TL;DR version: 1) How do you know when it’s the right time to buy a house? 2) How much do you take your SO’s preferences into account if you’re the one with the down payment, you are not yet married/engaged (but feel as confident as you can be that this is in your future), but would be cohabiting in said house?
I really want to buy a home, which is feasible when my lease is up this year. The numbers work, but really I want to do this because I just—do. I want a permanent place where I can put down roots, and I want to build equity in something. According to the plan, I should be in my current job and location for long enough that the upfront costs of homeownership make sense…but what if I’m not? I like it here a lot and don’t want to go anywhere for 5 years at a minimum, but long-term I want to be back in my hometown. What someone said a while ago about renting reserving you the right to change your mind resonated a lot with me. What if I do change my mind? Anything I’m looking at would have potential as a rental, so I wouldn’t necessarily have to sell. But it still seems so permanent, like such a commitment.
I can afford a condo or (maybe, probably not) a townhouse in my preferred neighborhoods. I’m okay with a condo but my SO wants a single family home. That’s doable on the budget…just not in the neighborhoods that I want. A large part of me says “It’s my down payment, we’re not engaged yet, my decision,” (which my SO acknowledges and accepts) but I’m entering into this decision within the framework of a committed relationship, with the expectation that my SO is moving in. If we’re planning for a life together, shouldn’t he get some say? I’m open to looking at single family homes in my budget, but I’m also leery about the maintenance if my boyfriend and I should ever break up.
And then I also look at what we could afford if we live together for a year, save more money, and have two incomes on the mortgage application. That would be enough for a starter house in my top neighborhood. But having a mortgage that requires both of us to be employed makes me nervous, because life. And if we’re planning to be here 5 more years, it also reduces the amount of time we’d have to cancel out the upfront costs.
Wise women, what are your thoughts? I feel like I’m at an impasse where I can make a strong argument for or against literally every option that I have.
Anonymous
A mortgage is a 30-year commitment to a bank with a high exit cost. I wouldn’t involve a guy in the process unless he made a similar commitment to me and went on the note and the deed. That’s just me though. I’m not a living-together kind of girl and think that unless you’re married (or acting as if you are — deliberately and with frank discussions that you are on the same page about how you view your partnership), it is too easy to get wrong *renting,* so I wouldn’t do a purchase with a mere SO (or factoring in much with the SO).
Is there a rush? Would it make sense to have a serious conversation now? If your future is just moving in vs forever, I’d just get what you want. If you want to eventually leave the area, or buy something bigger later elsewhere, it looks like this is not a forever house for you in any event, so I’d get what I wanted now.
S-non
It does not sound like you should buy. You say you can afford a condo, do you actually want a condo? Are you already living togeher now and have tested that out? I would continue renting in your top neighborhood and potentially move in together first. Buying a place knowing the five year rule shouldn’t be contingent on your plan to only live there for five more years exactly.
OP
I’m totally fine with a condo. In an ideal world, I’d want a townhouse with a backyard for my dog, but the minimal maintenance of a condo is appealing and my dog has lived in apartments for years (and is a total Houdini so couldn’t hang out in the backyard unsupervised anyway). For me, neighborhood > the difference between a townhouse and a condo.
My boyfriend and I haven’t lived together yet, so that’s a whole giant question mark.
Toottoot
It sounds to me like right now is not the time to buy a house, if only because the situation with your SO is heading toward marriage, but not yet there. If you think that relationship is headed toward marriage in the next year(s), just wait it out and buy after you get married, with the backing of two incomes. Then you can have a more equitable discussion about the style of home you both want to share together long term.
Anonymous
Yes, this. I bought my townhouse about a year before my fiancé and I started dating. He’s since moved in, but he hates, HATES not living in a SFH. It’s stressful for both of us because he’s constantly annoyed by townhouse living and I’m annoyed by his criticisms. I can’t imagine how much worse it would be if I bought the townhouse after we were talking about moving in together. You don’t buy a house to accommodate a non-cohabitating SO’s preferences, but you also don’t buy a house knowing your SO wouldn’t want to live there.
OP
That’s fair. He lives in an apartment now, has said he’d be okay in a condo, and is overall a mellow enough person that I can’t imagine him relentlessly nitpicking a condo (unless we had crazy neighbors who you can clearly hear through the paper-thin walls like he currently does…seriously they start screaming fights at 8:30am) but I know how much he would prefer to have a SFH.
Anonymous
“If we’re planning for a life together, shouldn’t he get some say?” Yes, I think it’s silly to buy a condo when he feels strongly that he wants a single family house and you see a future with him. I also think it’s silly to buy a single family home in a neighborhood you’re not enthusiastic about. If you are committed to this guy and see yourself marrying him, I wouldn’t buy now. You can buy together a single family home in a better neighborhood later on (once you’re engaged or married and you’ve had more time to save) or you can buy a condo on your own if you guys break up. But for now it sounds like you need to rent.
(Also, while I know $$ wise it may be a good deal to buy a place you intend to stay in for only 5 years, I would never do it personally. Finding a house, buying the house, and moving is a big chore, to say nothing of managing the house as a rental property. It’s just a hassle I would never want if I knew I wanted to be in a different area in ~5 years. But YMMV and I know plenty of people buy houses and successfully flip them at a profit five years later.)
Anonymous
I would buy a condo. You do not want to be trapped in a house you can barely afford if things do not work out. Not sure how your SO feels about your intention to move back to your hometown eventually but I think that a single family home vs a condo makes it less likely that you will do that.
Not the right time
Based on everything you are saying, this doesn’t seem like the right time for you to buy. You won’t even build that much equity in the first 5 years – most of the mortgage payment goes to interest. Don’t forget all the (substantial) fixup and maintenance costs associated with ownership, either.
anon
He can get “some say” when his commitment (financial, legal) is equal to yours. Reading your post, it seems like you are really leaning (for some very smart reasons!) towards getting what you want, but you’re pulled in another direction because you think you should compromise your plan for your boyfriend’s preferences. Don’t do this.
Stormtrooper
100% buy so that you can pay the mortgage on your own and will be totally happy if the relationship ends.
Context: my best friend bought a house in a neighborhood she didn’t want because her long-term, live-in boyfriend insisted on that neighborhood even though she was paying the down payment. She liked the house but the neighborhood was not her first (or second) choice.
Three weeks after closing… he surprisingly and completely unexpectedly broke up with her. She was stuck in a neighborhood that wasn’t as convenient to her job as she wanted AND as a kicker, he bought a home about five blocks away two months after the breaking up.
Moral: never buy a house you can’t afford on your own if you’re buying it AND if you’re buying it, get what you want. It’s one thing to consider his preferences if you’re indifferent or on things like wall color, but it’s a whole different thing when you’re talking a single-family home v. condo v. townhome.
Anonymous
“Moral: never buy a house you can’t afford on your own”
You know this is not realistic though, right? In many high cost of living cities the only way many people can afford homes is by combining their earnings with their partners’ earnings. And although I agree that the relationship should be very serious before you even think about buying together, I don’t think you can make a blanket rule that you shouldn’t buy until you’re engaged. Engagements and marriages end too. There are no guarantees in life.
Anonymous
True, but real estate has a high exit cost. A mere relationship has $0 exit cost. I think you want equivalent breakage fees, especially if one person isn’t on the mortgage. So: co-own, co-fund, whatever. If he’s not in a position to make a promise to you, at least let him make a joint promise to the bank.
Anonymous
Also, if it takes 100% of two incomes to afford a place, you can’t afford that place.
I am not 100% behind the analytics, but I think that the basic premise of Elizabeth Warren’s The Two-Income Trap is spot-on.
I think that if you go in on a house together, it’s not sustainable except when you can afford it on something like .66 – .75 of the combined total. It’s like stress-testing your budget.
Anonymous
I agree that you shouldn’t buy something if it takes 100% of your income to afford, whether the relevant income is two incomes or one. But even if you can afford it on 66% of the two incomes, it doesn’t mean that one person can afford it alone, especially if the incomes are similar.
Anonymous
That is definitely true.
Anonymous
I absolutely have a blanket no buying together until you are married / within months of a scheduled wedding rule. What happens when you split up? How do you divide that house? Why are you going to make a huge expensive commitment when you’re not ready to commit to being legally bound. If that means you can’t buy, oh well!
VicT
We had a legal agreement beforehand that spelled out who provided what at the beginning and detailed that we would each get that ratio at time of sale (or if there was a split / buyout, etc…). When we divorced, this contract dictated what happened with our house.
Stormtrooper
In my 40 years, I’ve seen too many people break up or get divorced (myself included) who bought too much home depending on dual incomes, only to face major hardship and difficulties when those relationships end. Let’s face it – you can’t just put a house on craigslist and sell it in a day. It’s a huge commitment both in terms of time and money. I can think of at least five examples of people who bought as an unmarried couple and later broke up.
It may not be feasible to buy something you can 100% afford on your own, but the person doing the buying needs to be prepared to have a way to pay if the partner exits the relationship unexpectedly, including getting a roommate if that’s what you want to do. Selling a home takes time, so if I’m the buyer and I’m paying the downpayment , but I expect my SO to pay 35% of the mortgage payment and I cannot pay 100% of the mortgage payment, I’m totally screwed if SO ditches me and takes his 35% mortgage payment (Longest run-on sentence ever).
Emmer
Or just keep renting until you are more certain of your long-term plan. Guy aside, you say two conflicting things – you want a place where you can put down roots but you’re not even totally sure you want to be in your city for 5 years. Figure that part out, and by the time you do, your relationship will be in a different place too.
Anonymous
Either buy the condo or nothing. You’re not married. You’re not engaged. Do not buy a house dude you are dating likes.
Senior Attorney
Yes, this. And if he doesn’t want to live in a condo, he is more than welcome to keep living where he’s living.
KT
Buying a house with an SO is incredibly messy–if the relationship goes south, dividing up a house is a nightmare.
The only way I have seen it work is one person buys the house and pays the mortgage, and sets up a renters’ agreement with their partner to pay rent, which is their share of the mortgage cost. That way if the relationship ends, it’s very clear who the house belongs to and that the other person needs to find different accomodations.
Anonymous
The only times I’ve seen this work when the relationship ended (and when the house didn’t sell) was for the orthodontist (so: $) to buy out the trainer (so: wild income disparities).
I have seen divorces where the guy tries to give the house to the ex and her credit is so bad that she can’t get a loan just in her name and in 2009 you can’t sell a house, even at a loss. Now with tighter ATR standards in mortgage underwriting, I’d be reluctant to assume that even married people buy a house on >1 income b/c if they split up, they will *have* to sell the house even to afford one person to move out into an apartment.
Anonymous
Yeah, my mom was in this wild income disparity situation, and luckily her boyfriend was able to buy her out of the house they purchased together.
I can’t tell from the OP’s post whether they *already* live together, or whether they’d be moving in together for the first time after she buys the house. In my mom’s case, she didn’t realize how truly awful this guy was until they bought this house and moved in together. She would have left within a week or two, but finances kept her stuck for almost a year. Just some food for thought.
Either hold off on buying until you can afford the neighborhood and house you both want, or consider this your decision and buy what you want, then invite boyfriend to move in. Be aware that the dynamics of boyfriend moving into “your” house will probably be less-than-ideal, though.
FWIW, I’m married and still hated when our house wasn’t quite affordable on only one income (incomes have since gone up, though). If you don’t need to, I would not put yourself in this situation.
Anonymous
FWIW, my husband and I owned houses that we bought 2 years before we started dating and 1 year before we got married. We now have an “our house” (in my neighborhood; his was way too far away and was also within blocks of his ex).
Is BF from your city? Does he want to stay there long-term? Does he know that you don’t? I vote for renting and saving your $.
Walnut
If I were in your shoes I would: 1. Move in together and break one of the leases. See how it goes. Put the saved money in a joint savings account. Use it for a future downpayment or as a travel/fun fund. 2. Browse zillow, wander through open houses, talk about wants versus needs. 3. Have some serious conversations about the future of the relationship. Is marriage in the two year or the five year picture? Where are kids (if you want them) after that? How about pets?
EB
OP, do I feel for you. I’m married now, but my then-boyfriend, now husband was in your shoes. He wanted to buy a house and had the down payment. We felt quite strongly about not jointly owning things prior to marriage. He needed to have a single family home. I mean, condos weren’t even on the radar. Townhouse? Nah. So, he set the budget and I went to all the viewings with him. However, my opinion was super important. To the point where we didn’t look at houses that were outside my acceptable commuting radius. And we didn’t ever look at neighborhoods that I wouldn’t feel safe in. It left us with (no joke) six houses in our city. Six. But he bought one and since then we’ve gotten engaged and married. If he hadn’t taken my preferences into account, well, that would have been quite disappointing to me. However, if I’d have pushed him towards a condo (my preference) because he could afford a way nicer condo for the money, then he would have been justifiably upset too. I guess it was an exercise in compromise for both of us. He respected my non-negotiable preferences with respect to location and I respected his non-negotiable preference for a single family home.
Anonymous
I was in a very similar situation around this time last year. Here’s how it played out for me. Boyfriend moved in with me in my rental. We talked a lot about what we both want in a home and ended up agreeing on most of the basics (want to live in the city proper for at least 5 more years, then both open to moving elsewhere — either suburbs in a single family home or another location entirely). He really wanted a garage and we both really wanted outdoor space. We ended up in the top floor of a triple decker (in true Boston style…) with no garage but a roof deck and a fenced in backyard for the dog. We both fell in love with a place during an open house, and I bought it — my name is on the mortgage and deed alone, I funded the down payment. But we’ve both contributed to the home since we’ve lived there, and we’re happy. We bought before interest rates went up and have been aggressively paying, so I now have about 30% equity in the house.
When we buy our next place, I assume I’ll defer a bit more to what he wants, since he gave up a garage for street parking for our first home.
Anonymous
You’re asking the wrong question. Instead of “Is this the right time to buy a house?” you should reframe it as “I want to buy a house. Is this a solo decision or a joint decision?” Only you know how likely it is that the relationship sticks, or how soon you might be in a position to buy a house together.
DH and I bought a house before we were engaged, but we were very much on the same page that engagement was imminent. We contributed equally to the down payment and both our names are on the deed and the mortgage. If I had ANY QUESTIONS about the relationship, I would not have bought property together. It is very expensive to sell a house and you have very little control over the market.
So, if I’m reading you correctly, you want to buy property. Does your desire to own something outweigh waiting for a period of time to see if you can find something that’s mutually agreeable?
OP
Thank you, Anon. That is a really helpful reframe. The answer is–I don’t know! But I’m going to talk to my SO about it in those terms this weekend.
OP
Okay I was going to try and go through and respond to everyone individually, but I’ve had an unexpectedly busy day and won’t have time. So thanks to everyone for sharing your thoughts and experiences. Rationally, it looks like continuing to rent makes the most sense…but I’m not sure if my desire to own a place of my own is going to end up outweighing that.
Care
I’ll be the voice of dissent. I’d buy the condo or a townhouse – you want to own a place, but don’t want to live in it for that long so a SFH doesn’t makes sense (you’ve admitted you aren’t putting very deep roots down). I also feel like condos and townhomes are easier to rent if you decide to move but aren’t ready to sell.
For the SO, figure out what exactly it is that makes him want a house. DH kept telling me he wanted a SFH and not a condo, but it took until I understood that he wanted a private garage for me to understand (and decide that a townhouse would be perfect). If his main problem is the shared walls because he has noisy neighbors now, a townhouse may eliminate a lot of that if there isn’t anyone above you. Also, I feel like condo/townhome walls are thicker than apartment ones (could be totally wrong though). You can also ask around in the condo to find out if people think the walls are thick or not.
OP
I think he wants a house 1) because of his current neighbor issues, 2) because it’s more status-y and established, but primarily 3) because he can be an antisocial curmudgeon whose dream house is a chalet on an uninhabited mountain, and if he can’t get a 15-mile radius for practical reasons then by God he wants at least a yard on four sides. But he accepts that might not be happening, since he also appreciates the practicality of his current five-minute drive to work and three-minute trip to the grocery store.
padi
So I did this. I was the one who wanted an SFR in a family-friendly neighborhood and the now-ex wanted a condo in an exciting neighborhood. He was putting no money down and wasn’t very interested in the whole house hunt except to be disappointed that I wasn’t richer and that I was using the money to fund his startup idea.
I bought the SFR in the decent, not great, neighborhood. The boyfriend became lazy, messy, and unwilling to grow up. So I broke it off 6 months after moving in.
Looking back, I am so glad it turned out the way it did. I had a house that I liked and got to learn all about home ownership. I dodged a bullet with a guy I thought I would marry.
I have since sold the house and moved to a condo in an exciting neighborhood. I am really enjoying this too.
One more thing, SFR ownership takes work (alot of work) and money (so much money). Unless I was married to a guy, I wouldn’t buy an SFR that I didn’t want just to appease a guy who has nothing to lose if you break up.
Anonymous
I think you’re dating my husband. Either that or his long-lost brother (maybe we can wave to each other from neighboring mountains). :)
S-non
Like the skirt, would never pay full price at BR.
What kind of experiences have people had with Cole Haan customer service? I’ve never bought anything direct from them, but my DH bought dress shoes that wore out in 2 weeks. Will they accept a return?
KT
At least Banana almost always has a coupon, and if they don’t, just add the item to your shopping cart and then leave the webpage. Within a day or two they’ll send you a “don’t miss out!” email with a special coupon code as an incentive.
M
Call them. I had a pair of oxfords that tore up my feet on the second wear and they took it back.
houda
Vicarious wardrobe shopping anyone?
I am starting at a top 3 management consulting firm next week.
I will be relocating with one suitcase so I get to start my wardrobe from scratch.
What would you buy to have enough clothes for a 2-week rotation?
So far I have:
– Black Flat shoes, Black Pumps
– Black interview suit: blazer, pants, skirt
– 5 silk shirts: white, beige, navy, light color and chartreuse
– Ankle pants: Black & white printed, black, cobalt blue
– Blazers: navy, black
– Dark red structured bag
– Black coat
– Black & Gray dress, black & white dress
That’s all I have in my suitcase.
Any must haves that you think would complement a work capsule wardrobe?
Sydney Bristow
I’d add in a gray skirt. That would work with all the tips you mentioned.
Congrats on the new job! I’m so glad things are looking up for you!
Sydney Bristow
And a couple of neutral cardigans (and maybe one fun color) unless you wear jackets every day.
mer
Second the grey skirt, otherwise you’ll never wear that navy silk top.
DC Anon
Eh, I wear navy tops with black pants all the time. It looks really chic as long as the pieces are well-tailored and you look otherwise polished (jewelry, makeup, nice bag).
anne-on
Red pumps! They’ll go with everything. I’d also add a grey or red top piece – blazer or sweater that will go with the dresses, and your pants. I’d also add in 2 skirts (one grey, one fun color or print) and a few more dresses (one sheath that you can mix in with blazers, and one more fun printed option?). A small handbag to carry out for lunch? You’ll probably also need a laptop bag if yours won’t fit a decently large laptop. Some jewelry or scarves to change up the looks of your outfits?
KT
I’m all about blazers to make any outfit more pulled together and structured. How about a gray/tweed version, and maybe a colored version? I have a deep burgundy blazer that looks great with my skin and always makes me look chic, no matter how boring the rest of my look is.
Some sheath dresses that can be worn with blouses underneath or cardigans/blazers on top can also give you variety without having to purchase a lot.
anon a mouse
Definitely another blazer – something in a multicolored pattern (tweed or other).
Idea
What are your accessories? I love to wear scarves with different colors and patterns to mix it up – your outfits sound like pink, purple, chartreuse(?) and/or teal and black/white scarves could really change up your looks.
And, of course, you can use them for your next outfits when you buy them.
Anonymous
Wait a while to see the trends at your firm for women, and what it is like at your clients. If you are going to have automotive clients, it’ll be a different wardrobe than entertainment clients.
(Former) Clueless Summer
Black and white tweed blazer, if you’re into that kind of thing. You can wear it with basically everything you listed.
Another few coloured blazers that will work with the tops you have. Maybe another plain black dress.
DC Anon
+1 — I agree that a tweedy black/white blazer would be my first addition.
houda
Thank you all, I am taking notes. I will be buying items one at a time to slowly complete my current capsule.
I didn’t think of scarves, so will look into them too.
Anonymous
I’d also say a pair of leopard print flats, a grey suit where the jacket and the skirt work as separates too, and a black sheath dress is a huge closet staple of mine.
If you are starting with a small wardrobe, I’d also take the time to get all of the pieces tailored as your add them. It can make a huge difference in the perceived quality of the item.
Anon
Oh you are living the capsule wardrobe dream! I think many of us would love to have our wardrobes as pared down as yours.
When I first read your list I thought oh didn’t have enough skirts but I see you have two dresses so that seems enough.
I really think you have enough clothes to get started. If I were you I would probably wait to get to know the new office culture before buying more. You might find that it is a bit more causal on non-presentation days so you might end up buying a nice sweater-jacket or other structured cardigan to wear on those days. You might also want a couple of non-blouse tops, like a scoop-neck knit top in a couple of colors that coordinate with your current items.
But your pared down wardrobe sounds wonderful to me. I would love it if getting dressed were that simple!
Bonnie
I’d add a few printed tops, a colorful cardigan, and black wedges.
Dagne Dover Mini Tote Review
I ordered the Dagne Dover mini tote in Midnight blue. It was on final sale. DisenchantedinDC was spot on about the color — it’s lovely and works well with black. Three things I’m not happy about: 1. It’s very heavy. While I read the reviews about this I didn’t fully appreciate how heavy until I got the bag. I wouldn’t use this for travel and would rely on my nylon Tumi tote instead because it’s much lighter weight. Because I commute by car to work, I think (hope) the weight will be ok. 2. While the organization is great, I find the outside zip pocket useless. I hoped to store my Ipad there but it won’t fit — maybe because of the cover? 3. While I like a structured bag, this is so stiff. I hope it softens up with wear.
Bottom line: it’s a well constructed bag but I’m glad I didn’t pay full price. I hope I like it more with use.
Blue ink pens
Does anyone have experience shopping at 6pm? Do they change their selection frequently? And are the clothes in as good a quality as if you buy from a more mainstream store?
Anonymous
I mostly buy shoes there, the selection often shifts, but I will see similar items there on repeated visits.
My understanding is the brands they are carrying are overstock/previous seasons versions of whatever was in the stores, so, yes? I don’t think they have a house brand/factory store brand they are selling.
Diana Barry
I shop at 6pm if I am looking for something specific – like a specific brand of clothes or shoes that I know I should be able to find for cheaper than full price. Like Cole Haan shoes or Patagonia – I bought my Tres parka at 6pm for maybe $300 in a last-season color (full price is more like $500 I think). All of the name brand stuff is brand-new, good quality, not ‘made for outlet’ or a second, etc.
Jules
6 p.m. is essentially the outlet site for Zappos. Shipping is fast but not as awesome as Zappos, and IIRC the return shipping is not free. I’ve bought a lot of things from there, Tahari and JNY dresses, shoes of all types, esp. for my college-age son (who is a skater and kills his shoes fast). So the quality depends on the brand you are buying, not the site. The downside of 6 pm v Zappos for me is the lack of reviews on 6 pm. If I’m looking at a new style or brand I will search for it on Zappos also and check for reviews; you often can find the same item in different colors, say, or a similar style from the same brand to help buage quality.
Jules
Also, 6 pm has a 30-day return policy, I think (which is why the last box I took to Clothes that Work had two brand-new pairs of pumps — I missed the return date), while Zappos is a full year. t
MJ
I shop for shoes there. They are Zappo’s overstock site–they are sister companies. Note that you have to pay for any return shipping, which is a huge pain, so I only buy stuff there that I know I love.
You can often find the same items on Zappo’s site for a smidge more (to account for free return shipping).
I have never shopped there for clothes.
Meg Murry
I buy things off 6 pm that I already know I like and should fit so I don’t have to return them – for instance, another color of the same style and size shoes I bought at Zappos 6 months ago, or a style that I tried on at DSW and liked but 6 pm has it in a color I like better (or like as much but way cheaper).
Baconpancakes
Yeah, the return shipping can really bite you in the rear. I had to return a pair of knee-high boots, and because the box was so huge, it was over $30 in shipping costs. Considering the boots only cost $60, I was pretty miffed.
New Anon
I second all previous comments, and will add that I recently encountered 6pm selling via Amazon with free shipping and returns for Prime members. Prices a bit higher than from the 6pm site (dollar or two) I think, but I got fast Prime shipping and an easy (and free!) return. So, in addition to checking Zappos before making a 6pm purchase (which I do also recommend), I’d take a look at Amazon.
Relationship Q
Thanks for all of your advice the other day regarding whether to agree to a cruise with my new boyfriend and his dying dad – I am going to go!
As I mentioned, we are heading to the Caribbean in a few weeks. It’s one of those all-inclusive packages (I actually received it as a free gift!), and it’s a whole week. I’m eager for any wisdom you have about a first vacation with a new SO. Luckily do to the nature of the trip, there won’t really be decisions or planning to do, but I am a little nervous/excited about spending eight whole days with him.
Relatedly, favorite beach hair/makeup/packing tips?
Idea
When I first met my husband’s dad, it was in his hotel room in a foreign country, and I had an upset stomach and spent quality time in the bathroom and I was so embarrassed I let the water run for privacy.
I hope your visit goes better.
Clementine
Oi. That sounds terrible!
A frequent traveling family friend suggested that I always carry with me a tiny ziplock with some Immodium (anti-diahrrheal sold under this brand name in the US), a few bouillon cubes, a couple of tea bags and a few spare feet worth of bathroom tissue.
I’ve only used it ONCE, but man- when you need something for ‘digestive ills’- you need it NOW and don’t want to worry about translating the name of OTC medicines.
Anonymous
what are the bouillon cubes for?
Wildkitten
To drink soup when you need food but can’t keep food down.
Ems
Adding pepto bismol tablets and pain reliever of your choice (e.g. advil) unless you want to be at the pharmacists explaining indigestion in croatian, or spanish. Oops.
Senior Attorney
And on that note, our first joint vacation was to his (tiny) ski condo, and I took a little bottle of Poopourri (google it) and said it was a housewarming gift and explained how it worked. Made it much less awkward to be in such very close quarters for a long weekend.
Senior Attorney
Hostess gift, not housewarming gift. D’oh!
Idea
OH. Not as funny, though!
Anonymous
Sunscreen, hat, bathing suit, chill. I don’t do my hair or makeup for the beach because a) that’s cray and b) between swimming and reapplying sunscreen, what’s the point.
Tip: let there be alone time. You want to go snorkling and he wants to be at the bar? Split up for a few hours.
Other than that, this really isn’t hard. You just go and have fun.
Sydney Bristow
I think vacationing together is an amazing way to predict how you’ll do together long term. It’s a chance to see what the other person is like under some stress (although maybe a bit less if you’ll be somewhere that doesn’t require decisions or planning). But something always goes a little different than planned so you’ll each see how the other reacts in that kind of situation. You’ll also learn each other’s airport habits (are you a 2 hour early person or right before departure person, pack by a list or throw together at the last minute, etc). Plus it’s likely to be the most time you’ve spent together all at once before. Just have fun and take notice of how everything goes.
Have fun!
Woods-comma-Elle
I totally agree. SO and I unexpectedly ended up taking a two-week vacation six months into our relationship (he won it and invited me after we’d been together for two months or so) and it really made it clear to both of us that were doing well together.
Cat
Don’t worry about beach hair and makeup if you are not a Real Housewife or a Kardashian… the most I’ve ever done is waterproof mascara and a tinted sunscreen-lip-balm. If you want to practice anything, it would be a pretty braid or something you can do with your hair for lunch or dinner that involves minimal blow drying or other fuss — I hate spending time preening on vacations!
Seconding Anon at 10:46 to not be afraid of some alone time, and seconding Sydney that travel is a great “reveal” — it’s like everyone’s personality becomes more concentrated/visible, albeit more so on more complicated trips.
Sounds really fun!
ml
+1. beach hair and makeup are for people who are super high maintenance and for photo shoots. There’s nothing I hate more while I’m on vacation than waiting for someone to primp and preen. Unless your SO is also a preener, I would be careful about how much time you devote to it.
Double-check the weather before you go! It may be colder/windier than you’re expecting at this time of year, and you should definitely bring a light jacket. Otherwise, you only need at least 2 swimsuits, a cute coverup, sunhat, and a couple sun/maxi dresses in case you want to eat dinner at the fancier resort place. Flip flops, wedge sandals, and you’re done. I always bring sneakers and one workout outfit, and a long sleeve rashguard that I can wear for snorkeling, but I’m super pale and don’t trust waterproof sunscreen.
nutella
You should be yourself. If you want to go makeup free, then do it. If you like doing your hair and makeup, then do it. You should be yourself in front of your SO.
Senior Attorney
Yes. One of the things I love about Gentleman Friend is that he’s super chill even when I feel like I’m taking way too long to get ready.
So yes, as Cat said above, travel is a great “reveal” — it might reveal that somebody takes a while to get ready, and it might reveal that somebody is impatient with people who take a while to get ready. Which might reveal the very valuable information that those somebodies are not a match.
lawsuited
I definitely agree with others who say you ought to skip the makeup, but I am one of those crazy people who actually does wear make-up to the beach and my favourites are:
– Tarte Tarteguard 30 Sunscreen
– Lancome Hypnose Waterproof Mascara
– Estee Lauder Double-Wear Light Stay-in-Place Makeup (if swimming) or Lancome Miracle Cushion Foundation
– Cargo Swimmables Blush in Cabo (if swimming) or Lancome Blush Subtil Creme
Anonymous
You wear blush to swim?!?!?!!!!
Wildkitten
I wear blush every day or else my face looks extremely white and two dimensional.
lawsuited
Yep, I wear blush when I’m going out for the day, including to the beach, and if the beach is swimmable and I figure I might swim, then I’ll wear Cargo Swimmables blush in Cabo. The colour is so beautiful and glowy and the formula is water (and sweat) resistant!
Little Red
Even blush and foundation?
lawsuited
I fill my brows too! But don’t really have a particular favourite brow product.
Anonymous BigLaw Associate
I didn’t know there was “beach” makeup. Learn something new everyday.
I go the other way on this, and wear a pretty heavy zinc oxide/titanium dioxide sunscreen, even and esp. on my face. But at the beach, I am generally surfing, swimming, snorkeling, playing volleyball, or otherwise running around getting sweaty. It would feel like wearing makeup to the gym…
Sydney Bristow
I’m thinking about changing pills when I get my annual exam this year. I’ve been on my current one for several years but I sometimes have several months in a row with spotting for a couple of days. Not a huge deal but annoying.
I’m thinking about trying Seasonale or whatever pill it is that lets you have just 4 periods a year. If you’ve tried one of those, what kind of side effects have you had? Obviously I can look this up and will talk to my doctor but I’m wondering if some side effects are more common or deal breakers.
I also have this fear that if I don’t get a period every month that I might be pregnant. My husband and I absolutely don’t want kids. Is this an irrational fear? I always take my pill at about the same time every day but I still feel a little bit of relief each time I get my period just as reassurance that I’m not pregnant. it would be so much nicer to only have to deal with it 4 times a year though.
Anon
I take my pills consecutively in any case (so skipping placebo week for 3 months at a time) which has been okay’d by my doctor. He suggested I try Seasonale to see if I would like it since it is specifically made for that. I tried it for 3 months and HATED it. I’ve gone back to Yaz, taking it in the same way as Seasonale to get a period every 3 months.
My side effects on Seasonale: so.much.acne and facial hair growth (ew, I know). Spotting and light cramping even a few months in (this is a common side effect at first, but I expected it to go away).
Seasonale is a high androgen pill so depending on the person, may cause acne and hair growth. Yaz is a very low androgen pill, which is why I like it. If you google which OCP is best handout, you can see a chart of the hormone levels of various pills. Very helpful.
Anonymous
Why not try Mirena?
Sydney Bristow
I’m scared of it. Not only the pain but my sister had one and her body rejected it. Don’t many people wind up having regular periods on it? I thought the no periods thing was just a side effect for some people. If that’s not true, I might consider it but I’m still a little scared of it.
Bewitched
I think most people have no periods. I know there are a few people with bad experiences here, but many with very good experiences! Never think about BC for FIVE YEARS helped me get over my fear of it.
TBK
I love mine but I do still get periods. They’re light and no cramps, but they still last the same amount of time they did when I was on nothing. Before I got pregnant, I was on Loestrin24 and it was great. And no periods.
Emmer
Some people still have regular periods but they tend to be much lighter. I think it’s rational to have some fear of you being in the small minority of people whose bodies reject the Mirena, but you have to counterbalance that against the risk that you may not react well to Seasonale either. For every single method of birth control, you’re going to find someone out there who has a horror story. Talk with your doctor about whether you have any risk factors that make it more likely that you won’t react well to a particular kind. If I were you and didn’t have any risk factors counseling against a particular method, I’d try the one whose intended effects (fewer periods, etc.) seem most appealing to you. It’s unlikely (not impossible, just very unlikely) that any sideffect you do experience will be permanent even if you do experience them.
Sydney Bristow
Very true. I imagine it’s easier to change pills than it is to remove the Mirena if it has really awful side effects though. I will talk to my doctor about it.
lsw
IUD removal is typically super easy – way easier (and less painful) than insertion. I’ve had two IUDs inserted and removed. I switched from Mirena to Paragard, then had Paragard taken out to get pregnant. Just like any other BC, it’s totally different for just about anyone who uses it. I didn’t love Mirena because I had bad side effects. I *loved* Paragard and did not have heavy periods or cramping with it all. I agree with Emmer that basically any birth control has its horror stories, and I hope you would still consider an IUD. I wish I had known about it 15 years ago.
Baconpancakes
I’m definitely on the Singing the Gospel of Mirena train. I did have a lot of cramping for the first month, and light spotting for about 2 months straight, then progressively lighter cramping and spotting until 3 months in, at which point it stopped. 100% worth it. I don’t remember the last time I bought feminine products or took Midol, and I was a full-on, 4 days of heavy bleeding kind of gal before.
Anonymous BigLaw Associate
I am on the same train, same experience. Although my periods were super light (only 1-2 days of light spotting, and sometimes they didn’t happen at all really) before I got Mirena.
Anonymous
I have a Skyla and I don’t even have regular periods on that anymore. You can still menstruate, but it’s usually very light. I kind of wish I had gone for the Mirena because it more likely to stop your period. Insertion is very painful though, definitely the worst pain I’ve ever experienced. If that is your fear, well, it is a legit one.
MU JD
I’ve told this story before, but I was supposedly the ‘perfect’ candidate for Mirena. I had it, bled and had awful cramping for almost 4 months before I finally told my OB/GYN to just take it out. Went back on the pill. I take Cryselle and do the same as others – skip the placebo week so I only get a period once every 3 months. I know some people love IUDs, but they aren’t for everyone.
Anonymous
I loved mine, but the 2nd time I had mine put in, it fell out of the optimal position and I could have gotten pregnant (and I had JUST HAD A CHILD SO NO FREAKING WAY) had I not randomly gone in for something else & had them notice & tell me.
If you do get one– go back a month after to make sure it’s still in the right place & hasn’t slipped.
anon99
I’ve been on one of those pills for years. I think it is fantastic. I’ve had some (very occasional) spotting, but no other side effects.
lost academic
I have the same irrational fears. I used that pill for a long time and the fear gradually decreased. The infrequent periods really helped me. I did personally find it was much more important to be rigorous with timing that one or in month #3 my body would take deviation + stress and just send me a period early.
Anonymous
I was on Yaz for 1 year, then switched to BeYaz (or something like it) by my previous gyno. I loved Yaz — after a few months, no period! I’d feel minor cramping.
The other formula, however, lead to me developing a DVT and PE and being hospitalized for 4 days, then a year of blood thinners (and no more hormones). So, proceed with caution. My former gyno was just like “oh, so sorry that happened to you. Life sucks. Didn’t I mention the higher risk with this new pill?” (No, you did not, jerkface.)
Anonymous
Some women who are similarly worried about becoming pregnant but also don’t want to deal with a period every month just buy a pack of pregnancy tests and do one every so often (eg. the 3rd of every month). Taking 2 minutes to pee on a stick may your mind without having to have a period.
Sydney Bristow
That’s a good idea that I didn’t think of. Thanks!
Anon
I’ve been on Seasonale for years (since it came out) and I absolutely love it. No side effects; no weight gain, skin still clear etc. I take careful note of side effects and have routine blood work given my family history (my non-smoker 24 year old sister had a stroke due to Yaz) and I have had absolutely no problems. I’ve heard that the results vary from person to person, but it’s worth talking to your doctor about it.
Killer Kitten Heels
I was on Seasonique (same concept as Seasonale), and when it worked, it was great – the periods on it were kind of excessively long (but I had long periods before I started it, so YMMV), but only came 4 times a year, so it was kind of great. The problem was that, after about a year, it stopped working properly, and I basically went from only 4 periods a year to random spotting at totally unpredictable intervals, which was terrible. I also gained about 20 lbs over the first year, but I have no idea whether and to what extent that was BC-induced, since I had a couple of other simultaneous life changes that could also have accounted for the weight gain.
JEB
I’m on Seasonale and was previously on Seasonique for years before having my baby. Post pregnancy, I tried the Mirena IUD, but my body sadly couldn’t tolerate it. I’ve been very happy with Seasonale. I haven’t had any obvious weight gain, acne issues, etc…in fact, my pregnancy/post partum acne (pregnancy did TERRIBLE things to my skin) finally started to clear up once I started taking it again. Also, with other birth control pills, I experienced terrible bre*st pain, and I don’t get that with Seasonale. You might have some breakthrough bleeding (like a very light period), but that should go away after the first few months. I get slightly anxious about not having a period each month as confirmation that I’m not pregnant, but as someone else said, if you’re truly worried, a home pregnancy test can take care of that very easily.
never ever
I’ve been on the generic and with Dr. permission skip even the “seasonal” sugar pills. The only spotting I ever have is for a day or two if I miss a dose, or take it very late.
Anonymous
You can do it with any of the pills. Seasonale just packages them that way (so that you get a period every 4 months) but you can just take any of the pills every day without breaks and without sugar pills and they work the same. So if you like the pill you’re on, just ask the doc to prescribe it so you take it without breaks.
The downside (or upside, depending on how you look at it) is that if you forget at any point to take your pills you will get a period. I was more careful with my pills than I ever had been before because I had the risk of getting a period if I missed a couple of days (and I hate periods). So if you aren’t good at pill-taking and you miss days, you will know it because you will have to go out any buy tampons. Haha. If you are taking the pill all the time you shouldn’t even be ovulating so your risk of pregnancy is pretty low. However, a recent study showed that if you don’t realize you’re pregnant for a bit and are still taking pills, its safe for the baby.
Nancy Drew
Recommendations for where to take OOT friends with a four year old for dinner tomorrow night in Midtown or lower Manhattan? Dad wants something fun, daughter is well behaved and somewhat adventurous and mom is laid back. Thanks!
nyc
Mission Chinese!
Anon in NYC
Yakitori Totto on 55th could be fun if you go on the earlier side. Plenty of adventurous stuff, but also familiar items, like meat on sticks.
Anon
Kalkalash. Stick! Stick!
Anonymous
“Need a drink!”
“Crab juice or Mountain Dew?”
“Yuechhhh, I’ll take the crab juice.”
Anonymous
It’s a small place, but Galanga on West 4th Street, between 6th and MacDougal, is really tasty Thai.
I love Westville!
This may be too late- but Westville is a great option when you are with kids.
fake coffee snob
Ooof, apologies beforehand, I have a whopper of a question:
I’m looking for extremely cost-conscious ways to address psychological issues for my SO, who has no relationship with any doctor/psychologist/psychiatrist right now. He almost certainly has PTSD and the associated nightmares/night terrors he gets are debilitating (they come and go, but right now he’s barely slept in weeks and the impact on him is really hard to watch). My research says that there’s a promising drug regarded well as a first-line treatment; what would the right kind of doctor to see be in order to seek treatment without dozens of visits and thousands of dollars in care? My personal opinion is that it’s a serious enough issue that dozens of visits is perfectly acceptable, but…he simply won’t do that. Considering treatment at all is a huge step for him, and I don’t want to push it.
He’s a recent immigrant, and in his home culture, you don’t go to the doctor unless you have something life-threatening going on and psychological issues definitely don’t count. Because of his history with doctors (basically, he’s seen them for chemo and nothing else), he’s reluctant to go and also very reluctant to spend money on himself and on medical care. I pushed him to sign up for insurance for the first time this year, so he got a catastrophic care plan, but that’s it.
Are there ways to call a doctor beforehand and see if they’d be willing to entertain that kind of treatment, preferably without talk therapy, without seeming like a drug seeker? Has anyone gone through the diagnostic process for PTSD? Any other information? I’m totally out of my depth, since I usually approach psychiatric care in a pretty money-no-object way.
Wildkitten
Every psychiatrist (and even primary care doctor) I’ve talked to has been happy to prescribe something without talk therapy. They suggest also considering talk therapy, but it’s not a prerequisite of any kind. Drugs are great, seek them.
TravelAnon
Oh goodness that’s hard. I don’t know about medicine alone for PTSD, but just FYI re: dozens of visits — my understanding is that standard trauma protocol is 12-15 visits, so he might not be in for dozens. I got formally diagnosed with a simple questionnaire at an office visit with a therapist. It took 2 hours because they do diagnosis and intake at once. But before that my GP did a quick intake and gave a tentative diagnosis in about 15 minutes.
That said, the cultural bit is very difficult. I wish I had more to offer. It’s hard to see a loved one suffer mental illness. Good luck, and good for you for caring and asking. :)
HSAL
My husband and I are having two other couples over Saturday night. We don’t host people very often, so if they come over around 7 do we need to do a full meal, or could we get away with heavy appetizers? I mean, the full meal option would be ordering pizzas, I’d just like to do something a little more interesting without breaking the bank. Thinking buffalo chicken dip, other hearty dips, some frozen appetizers from Trader Joe’s etc.
Killer Kitten Heels
Hearty apps are probably fine, but make sure you have enough of them so that everyone gets a full-meal-equivalent’s worth of food, since if I’m going somewhere on a Saturday at 7, I’m expecting dinner or dinner-like food.
Cat
Sorry but I would expect an actual dinner for a 7pm invitation — no shame in pizza but I never actually feel full grazing on a bunch of stuff (even at a tapas type place where dinner is meant to be eaten that way). Could you make it feel more special with a fancy salad to serve on the side, as well as a fun app or two from TJ’s?
HSAL
Yeah, I’d have done a salad anyway but I guess I can just throw a couple apps in. I’m an early dinner eater who loves to graze, but I suspect I might be in the minority.
Anon
It might even be cheaper to cook a proper dinner – something casual and cozy, like sausages braised in cider with mashed potato, or a vat of chili. But yeah 7pm on Saturday is dinner.
Anonymous
That’s dinner time. Why is ordering pizzas your option? Can you not cook at all? Serve TJ’s appetizers as appetizers when they arrive, then a salad, garlic bread (I like pepperidge farm for super easy) and a lasagne.
7 pm for 3 couples means dinner party to me.
Bonnie
You could even buy premade lasagna at TJs (one meat and one veggie) if you’re short on time.
HSAL
I love to cook, but timing is an issue. I could probably prep the lasagna in the morning though, so that’s a good suggestion.
Bonnie
I would be expecting a meal too but think heavy apps could be ok. More so than lots of dips.
nutella
Yeah, I’d agree. I loooooooove grazing, but if that’s all there is at dinnertime come 7pm, I’m going to want to get a burger after your house. Don’t let people leave your house hungry– salad, heavy apps, and order a couple of pizzas.
PDXK
If cost is the concern, risottos, stir frys, easy pasta dishes, roast chicken, etc. are all fairly cost effective depending on what you throw in. Check out some food blogs and have fun, but I’d definitely interpret 7pm as a dinner invite.
Wow
Definitely serve a full dinner.
Idea
Please tell me what to expect.
“Come for dinner at 7!” vs. “Come for some appetizers & bar food to share!” would yield very different responses from me – I’d either bring a bottle of wine or a whole dish to share. Which do you want?
Walnut
When having folks over, I usually send an email a day or two in advance with the menu. “Looking forward to seeing everyone tomorrow at 7PM. I’m planning to make fish tacos and margaritas. Let me know if this won’t work or if there any any dietary constraints.”
HSAL
That’s a good strategy. It was mainly discussed as a “let’s hang out at HSAL’s Saturday night” with no mention of food. But I’ll finalize the menu tonight so I can let them know tomorrow.
Anon
Anyone else amused or baffled by the snow hysteria? I’m in DC but I suspect other cities are facing the same. People are stock piling as if they won’t leave their homes for the next 2 weeks. I just moved here from NYC where 10 inches of snow doesn’t shut down anything and 20 inches gives you maybe 1 day off – thought not if it falls on a weekend. I get that DC just doesn’t cope as well/doesn’t have the same infrastructure etc. But you’ll be stuck at home for what 2 days max, maybe 3? Do you really need 8 baguettes and 2 cartfuls of other food?
And then there are the people gasping bc they can’t find ORGANIC milk or berries. Really – one carton of regular milk in a lifetime is probably fine.
Wildkitten
I usually go to the grocery store on the weekend, which I probably won’t be able to do this weekend, and the grocery store trucks also probably won’t make it to re-stock the store, so I think the panic is logical. Did you see how many car accidents there were yesterday? I do not want to be on the roads.
Anonymous
Well, since you’re new here :) a storm of this size could actually shut down the city for a week. Look how poorly we did last night with 1 inch.
Anonymous
Yes. It took me two hours and 15 minutes to get from my Bethesda office to my home in NW DC. The roads were sheets of ice.
CountC
I’m always amused. I was born in CT, but moved to NoVA when I was in third grade. I hated the move until school got cancelled at the threat of snow. CT didn’t cancel school for hardly anything, certainly not for a threat of snow! That’s when I was sold on the move.
I live in PA now and people are freaking out here, although in a slightly milder way. I went to Target at lunch to buy hair dye, so I can take care of that while I am snowed in on Saturday. I have an SUV with 4×4, so if I truly needed to go somewhere in the snow (not ice, I don’t drive in ice), I could. I also made sure to get cat food and wine :) Priorities.
Anonymous
Child free me was always a panicker with snow. Tequila, wine, cheese, crackers and maybe some left over vodka somewhere do not sustain you for long without the help of your friendly neighbourhood restaurants. Snow meant grocery stores and driving – two unfamiliar things too many.
anonymous
Any speculation about whether us feds will get a snow day?
Anonymous
Haha. Well id up your estimate- in 2010 I was stuck for 6 days. I think they are predicting even more than that this time
JEB
We were stuck in my neighborhood for 11 days in the big 2010 storm! I could walk places, but it was tough given the depth of the snow. Our small neighborhood streets must have been the last to be plowed.
Anonymous
In the Midwest, and I’m wondering the same. It’s a dusting of snow and people are acting like a freaking blizzard is coming.
Anon
Really?? Somehow I thought these responses only happened in the south (which DC is). Somehow I thought Midwesterners and northerners roll with this stuff more — bc it snows ALL THE TIME there and they’re used to it.
Anonymous
Nah New Yorkers and new englanders sometimes freak out too. It’s just confirmation bias- you went the day/week before the storm so you are seeing the people that are there freaking out. Like there is a percentage of the population everywhere who freaks out and over buys for storms. You also have no idea if their pantry is stocked right now – but sure wantig the exact food they want and throwing a fit people don’t have it is bad manners but I see that in nyc all the time too
Anonymous
I also think that weather forecasting has become more sensational in the past decade–I mean, come on, we’re giving winter storms their own names now.
Anonymous BigLaw Associate
Meanwhile, in LA…
http://www.weather.com/weather/today/l/90025:4:US
Anonymous
Haha in the bay we’ve been having light sprinkles (almost not even rainlike, more like a fog that gets you slightly damp) and I barely want to leave the house.
(LA native! <3)
Bonnie
Yesterday was dreadful. I learned to drive in Midwest winters but had a hard time keeping my car on the road last night! I completely don’t get the need to buy ALL. THE. BREAD. though. We’re not going to starve to death and can walk to the grocery store if it comes to that.
Anonymous
Styling Question: work pants + boots. I don’t get it. How do you make this work? Further, if I did pick up some slim booties, I feel like the wouldn’t really go with anything else.
I am kind of a pants hater but I’ve gotten enough weird looks trudging through the snow in skirts that its probably time.
AnonMidwest
I truly don’t understand getting weird looks for doing boots and skirts in the snow… tights dry faster when they get wet…I’d rather not have wet pants for a portion of the day and/or not have to tuck my pants into boots.
Anon
But even if you’re stuck for an entire weekly, surely you’ll find something to eat in your home, no? It may be pasta or rice or PBJ over and over again, but you likely won’t starve. I don’t understand these people freaking out bc they can’t find their favorite berry or whatever — they can survive without it whether it’s 3 days or 6. These are suburbanites (in NOVA) with huge kitchens and relatively stocked fridges/pantries already – not living in Manhattan in a studio with a 1/2 size fridge that never gets opened!?
Anonymous
Remember we are expecting 40-50 mph winds and most of our region’s power lines are above ground, so power losses are pretty likely – with the derecho 2 years ago, much of the area lost power for 3-7 days. At least prior to that storm, few people seemed to have generators, so you can’t cook, etc. That huge kitchen doesn’t work so well without power!
Anonymous
Oh man, I almost forgot about the derecho. We were in a downtown apt at the time with underground powerlines and were totally fine, but hosted a bunch of our friends who lived in the neighborhoods with “mature trees” that came crashing down with all the power lines and didn’t have AC for a week in the middle of August. Now i live in one of those neighborhoods…
I’m not worried about food, and my stove is gas (I made sure to buy a new lighter, just in case), so I will probably even have HOT food. Plus I have gas heat. If the gas lines rupture, I have bigger problems than lack of power. But I have street parking and live on a non-thru street; I’m fully anticipating being stuck til at least Tuesday, and even then needing to shovel my car out from behind a wall of snowplow snow.