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Updated: Oct 30, 2018 413 Comments · by

Thursday’s Workwear Report: Wool A-Line Skirt

The Personal Shopper (TPS) |

This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. striped-skirt-2This skirt looks a little short and a lot preppy, but I like it. The mixture of navy, green, red, and white is unusual, and I feel like you could pick out any of those colors to pull a quick and easy but interesting outfit together. The skirt is only $98, part of the Red Fleece Collection at Brooks Brothers. Striped Wool A-Line Skirt This is a pretty midi skirt in plus sizes, and Eloquii has a ton of plus-sized striped skirts, including this $22 skirt. Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (L-all)

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Comments

  1. K-cup woes

    I got my own Keurig in my office to save money on coffee, but I haven’t found k-cups I really like yet. Any recommendations?

    My office does not have a kitchen (yey public service). I have to wash dishes/cups in the bathroom sink. So a better coffee maker is not realistic.

    TIA!

    • Cb

      I’m in the UK but the coffee subscription I use has coffee pods. Maybe one of the US services does something similar?

    • lawsuited

      I like the Starbucks Veranda Blend and the Donut Shop Regular k-cups.

      Also, if I were you I think I’d just be using recycled paper disposable coffee cups and putting them in the organics bins rather than washing dishes in the bathroom!

    • Marshmallow

      I really like the San Francisco Coffee Company k-cups. You can get them on Amazon, they’re affordable, and they use less plastic than traditional types. You just need to keep them in an airtight container, like a Tupperware, because they’re mesh on the bottom instead of plastic.

      We have a similar setup (Keurig, no sink) and I got one of those sponges that holds soap in the handle. It’s not so bad to wash your coffee cup in the bathroom and it beats throwing away multiple paper cups every day.

      • Shopping

        What kind of washing thingy do you use? I have one from OXO that I love for most things. It is a little brush that fits nicely in my hand. Pushing down on the top of it releases soap from the bristles at the other end. But it’s a pain to use for tall glasses or for vases or for anything else that’s tall because my hand doesn’t fit in there. I’ve tried several with long handles, but the bristles on all of them face sideways, so I can’t really scrub the bottom of anything with them. I know this is a lame-o question, but it’s been bugging me forever!

    • Pep

      I never could find a k-cup coffee I liked (sampling many of BF’s along the way) but I picked up some Seattle’s Best House Blend at TJMaxx recently and I think they may be a keeper! $6.99 for a box of 16 pods.

      I usually run downstairs to our cafeteria for coffee, but they close at 2:30 and sometimes I need a cup in the late afternoon. We have a little kitchen on our floor with a commercial Keurig machine in it, so I wanted to be able to take advantage of that.

    • BeenThatGuy

      I like Gevalia. They are a great deal at BJ’s (something like 80 for under $40 – which is 30 more pods for the same price as the Dunkin Donuts bulk pack there).

    • CountC

      Are you at all open to washing one of the reusable K-cups? If not, stop reading.

      If you are, I would buy one of those and your regular coffee grounds. That way you don’t have to worry about finding a K-cup you like and SOOO much less waste. And honestly, I think this option is the cheapest versus buying the disposable K-cups.

      • lost academic

        So I read from the above that washing them out daily isn’t a good idea, but if you had a bunch of reusables you could load and wash at home.

        • Anonymous

          +1

          This is a great option, and I Tried it with my favorite Trader Joe’s coffee, but …. It wasn’t very good. If you start using this method from the start, you will get used to it, but it’s harder when you are already used to the tastier cups. Saves so much $$$ though.

          Costco Kirkland for me.

          • Maddie Ross

            Second Costco Kirkland – specifically “Pacific Bold” – as a surprisingly decent and relatively cheap k-cup option.

          • Anon

            +1

            Pacific Bold

            And the go on sale periodically, so you can stock up. A good deal.

        • Shopping

          With a Keurig-type machine, it’s really just one very smal piece that can be rinsed out when you rinse your cup. Much less complicated than other methods.

    • NYNY

      I’m a fan of Death Wish Coffee k-cups. I order them from Amazon to be delivered straight to my office.

      My best k-cup advice, after years of working in offices with Keurig brewers, is to never use the medium or large cup button on the brewer. If you want more coffee, use two k-cups. Using the larger brew sizes only leads to watery coffee. Blech!

      • Anonymous

        I think maybe you just materially improved my office life. Thanks for this tip!

    • Anonymous

      I love Tim Horton’s K-cups (you can get them on Amazon). Bonus – you can peal off the lid and the rest of it is recyclable!

    • Shopping

      Get a reusable filter and any kind of coffee you want! A hidden advantage is that you wind up buying coffee much less often (unless you have a huge storage space for coffee)

    • Anon

      What kind of coffee do you like / normally drink?

      Like what was your typical home brew or favorite outside coffee place/drink (eg. Starbuck’s/Dunkin Donuts etc…)?

      It is impossible to recommend something without knowing what you like.

      Coffee tastes vary widely. Many things are too strong or too weak for me and I like a less winey and more smooth coffee with a hint of Chocolate. So I used to drink bold blend of Emeril Lagassee’s K-cup. I would get them at Bed Bath and Beyond with the 20% off coupons, and sometimes they had large boxes on sale.

      But now I get Costco Kirkland. Better price.

      • Anon

        I like the Pete’s K Cups – the Major Dickinson blend or the holiday blend they put out each year.

        • TheElms

          I like Peet’s Major Dickenson too — get them on amazon to make them cheaper.

    • Bonnie

      Kirkland bold cups are great. I also have an Ekobrew reusable filter. It’s used with disposable liners so does not need to be washed frequently. For flavored coffee, I like Trader Joe’s pumpkin spice cups. I haven’t tried their other Kcups.

    • Scarlett

      Not super helpful, but I traded my Keurig in for a Nespresso because I never found a decent pod & the Nespresso pods are actually really good (in my opinion) – since they have a newer model, you might be able to find an older/used Nespresso if it’s for your office.

  2. Anonymous

    How do you get used to sitting at a desk all day in the same office everyday? Don’t you guys get bored and want to get up and move around?

    I feel like I am going to get fat and am wasting away my life indoors all the time.

    • Modern Paperless Office

      I have to get up to get things from the printer (100 paces away?) constantly. If I need to roam more, I use a distant printer (3 floors down) or I get a coke (will always involve stairs, too).

    • Cb

      When I need to have informal meetings with people, I suggest a walk. I also try and get out for a walk for lunch everyday, use a bathroom on another floor, relocate to a conference room if I’m reading or editing, and work in a coffee shop when I need a change of scenery.

    • Anonny

      I feel like that to. I do laps around the office and occasionally take a mini dance break behind closed doors. I eat my lunch while I work and use my actual lunch break to walk outside

    • anon

      Outside and I don’t get along, so I don’t mind being indoors. But I don’t like sitting all day. The secretaries in my office probably think I have some terrible bathroom issue because I usually do a lap around our floor, which just happens to end with the bathrooms, about once every hour.

      • asfd

        I go for a walk every hour too, but my boss can see me. Idk what they think but oh well. I do drink a lot of water so I actually do need to go to the bathroom.

    • Marshmallow

      My physical therapist told me I should be drinking so much water that an hourly bathroom break is necessary. I can’t quite drink THAT much, but frequent getting up to refill your water bottle and/or use the bathroom is good. For a while I had an adjustable standing desk which helped, too. Or just stand up and stretch. When you’re doing work you like and you get absorbed in it, it’s easy not to feel bored by sitting all day.

      • Lynn

        Peeing every hour seems annoying. Did your PT suggest this as a way to make you move more, or are we all supposed to be drinking this much water for health reasons? I’m hoping the former…

      • ChiLaw

        I was given this rx (“drink enough water so that you pee every hour”) for my recurring UTIs. It did work! But it’s annoying, and I love drinking water.

    • cbackson

      I didn’t. I got a standing desk and a wireless headset. I work standing and a take calls standing and/or walking around my office.

      • Amanda

        Yes! I got a standing desk too, and I find myself doing various standing yoga poses at it. It helps!

      • Anon

        Impressive…. Isn’t it hard to be standing all day? My back hurts just thinking about it.

        Yet, my back hurts sitting all day too…

        • CountC

          I utilize yoga techniques to make sure that I remain aligned while I am standing – tucking my tush and drawing in my abs so that I am not arching my back. I also always make sure my knees are slightly bent – never locked.

    • lawsuited

      The work I do sitting at my desk all day in the same office most days is pretty engaging, so I don’t spend a lot of time thinking about the fact that I’m indoors rather than outdoors. My work takes me out of the office at least once a week, so the (indoor) scenery changes pretty frequently.

      Also, I don’t mind getting fat :)

      • Idea

        this and I do hang pictures of the outside. Pretty National Parks calendars in particular.

    • emeralds

      I drink a lot of water and try to go for a walk on my lunch break. But yes, sitting inside all day staring at a computer drives me up the wall unless I’m mindful about getting up and moving around.

    • nona

      I have a pretty large campus (not a lawyer) so its a couple thousand steps to get to the cafeteria for lunch and back. I’ve also got a FitBit Alta that reminds me to get up and walk every hour (sometimes I even do it), plus refills for water and bathroom breaks and meetings, etc.

    • Anonymous

      I have a standing desk & drink lots of water so I need to visit the restroom often. Also use. Restroom two floors down from me so I use stairs often.

    • Lynn

      I get up and walk to talk to people rather than email or call. All the better if they are on another floor. But now I telework three days a week and we don’t have our own offices anymore. At home, the only place for me to walk to is the refrigerator, and that’s a problem.

    • January

      I have a Fitbit, which encourages me to walk around more (i.e., do laps around my floor). I have a window in my office, though, and I’m more of an indoor person, so I don’t mind that part of it.

    • Lilly

      I am very lucky to have a private office with an alcove that is not visible from the hall. Every now and then I get up and do a few of the kind of exercises from elementary school gym class, minus the really jumpy and thumpy ones.

    • Sydney Bristow

      I got an adjustable standing desk and do my best to make a quick loop around my floor every hour. My Apple Watch taps me if I haven’t moved that hour as a reminder.

    • Jane

      This is the primary reason I hate working. I hate being stuck in an office all day. It got worse when I changed jobs and now I no longer have a huge window in my office. I have a standing desk and I drink a lot of water so I actually do need to use the restroom about every hour. I’ve been out of school for over a decade, but the issue hasn’t gotten any better. I still feel trapped. It’s the same feeling I have on airplanes, which I also hate even though I’m not afraid of flying.

      • Anonymama

        There are a lot of jobs that don’t require being inside in an office all day, if that is an option for you.

  3. Anonymous

    I’m at the point in my pregnancy where I’ve told everyone at work, I’ve decided on my mat leave and told my boss and assistant, but I don’t know how to deliver the news to clients. I socialize with clients a lot, and am tired of making up excuses and hiding my pregnancy. I’m taking 12 weeks off which is less than the norm of 1 year for most women where I live and also less than the norm of 6 months for most lawyers where I live, so I feel like this is worth mentioning to ease concerns about coverage during my mat leave. I want to deliver it as a happy, matter-of-fact event, and veer away from my feeling that I should be apologizing for my pregnancy at every turn. Ideas for a script or any other thoughts on delivering the news?

    • Anonymous

      When they say, “hi, how are you?” You say, “Things are great, I’m actually expecting. I’m due MONTH. Planning to take about 3 months off and looking forward to working on XYZ when I get back.”

      If you’re in Canada, it’s super standard for government/in house to take a year and private practice to take 6 months (in my area top achievers in private practice have also used their status to take a year). Especially if you’re taking less than the 4 months available to birth moms that can’t be shared with the other parent, you should expect to get questions about why you’re not taking more time and may want to have a prepared answer for that so it doesn’t devolve into a huge length of maternity leave discussion (unless you don’t mind that). Easiest way to divert is to ask people about their own kids/experiences/nieces/nephews.

      • OP

        Yep, I’m in Canada :) My reasons for not talking more leave are financial as I make almost 3 times what my husband does so we can afford him not working but not me. I don’t want to go into that with anyone, least of all clients, so I’m saying “It’s much easier to my husband to take the time off work, so he’ll be with the baby the remainder of the year and maybe bring the baby to visit me at lunch sometimes!” to keep it light.

        • Never too many shoes...

          I think that is perfect! I took five months and I honestly could have gone back sooner. My husband also took two months of paternity leave (woo Canada!) and he loved it.

        • Anonymous

          One of the lawyers I worked with did the same thing as her husband’s company topped up to full salary so she took 4 months and he took 8 months. People will be confused by the taking 3 months instead of 4 though where the Dad can only take 8 months. No judgment – just giving you a heads up on what to expect. Totally fine to say -“I”m taking 12 weeks and my husband is taking the rest of the year.” People will generally assume that if you’re doing it that way, that it’s for financial reasons (it often is, but it annoys me that people assume it’s financial).

          For those with Canada envy – we get the time off but the pay situation is inconsistent – federal government and large companies/large law firm often top up to full salary but the Provincial government and smaller company employees often only get what is paid by the Employment Insurance system which isn’t much. It’s not all roses. The biggest benefit is that it’s accepted by most employers to take 6 months – year off without too much career impact – no pressure to go back at 6 or 12 weeks.

          • Anonymous

            Adding that you may also want to look into your pumping situation for when you go back (if you plan to BF). I find that because most people take a year, not near as many women pump when they go back to work (most switch to feeding before and after work if they are still nursing) so your company may not be experienced with what you need (e.g. private office or other room to pump).

          • Aunt Jamesina

            I think the envy stems from the fact that you get the leave at all, not whether it’s paid. We get twelve weeks unpaid if you work for an employer with 50+ employees in the US. Some employers give paid leave (though definitely not most), but I’ve never heard of anywhere that gives a year, unpaid or not. Six months is rather rare.

          • Edna Mazur

            Definitely have Canada envy. I’d say 1/3 to half of my coworkers come back after six weeks or so because they can’t afford to take 12 weeks unpaid.

            We want another, but as primary bread winner I may only be able to take 8-10 weeks this time

      • Shopping

        I like that your response steers back to work at the end. That could be tailored for each client “so I’ll be back in plenty of time to [do step Y in your project]”

        • OP

          Yes, the other reason I’m taking 3 months is that I have a big trial scheduled 3 months later, and want to leave my self time to adjust to being back and work before seriously ramping up for trial prep. It will be hard enough with an infant at home, so I don’t want to add more time pressure by taking 4 months and coming back to work just 60 days before trial.

          Obviously the trial doesn’t impact every client, and I also don’t want to give clients the impression that I’m being forced back by my firm because of the trial, because I’m not (it just impacts the 3 months versus 4 month decision for me), so I’m hesitant to launch into that whole explanation.

          • Anonymous

            I’d think carefully about the 3 months vs. 4 months. There’s a huge difference between how old baby is and how well you will feel in the extra month. I’d think about stretching it to 3.5 months or going back half days for a month first.

          • lawsuited

            Unfortunately going back half days is not a viable financial solution, because it will make me ineligible for maternity leave benefits and half my salary won’t be sufficient to fill the gap with my husband not working.

    • (Former) Clueless Summer

      Also in Canada and likely to be in a similar situation at some point – agree you may get some “you’re ONLY taking 12 weeks?” from people. Maybe not clients if they’re happy you’ll be back, but I have noticed there is some serious judgment if you don’t take your full year in some circles. I’d brush that off with “oh, husband is taking the rest of the time” – which may then devolve into a discussion about paternity leave, but better that than a discussion about your personal parenting style!

      • OP

        I’ve already gotten a lot of “you’re ONLY taking 12 weeks” with a noticeable undertone of “why don’t you love your baby?”, which is hard for me. I’m frustrated that people assume I haven’t crunched the numbers and considered all the options, and come to the (sad) realization that this is the only option that works for my family.

        • Shopping

          Maybe a flip remark about modern family dynamics or your baby daddy being a sensation new age guy in response to people prying like that? With a friendly smile, of course, maybe a sigh about how lucky you are to have him.

        • Spirograph

          I’ve been ready to go back at 12 weeks (or sooner, but I still took 12) each time. I think it’s great your husband will do primary caretaker duty for a while. My husband has taken a month or two off after my maternity leave ends for each of our kids and it’s been so beneficial for all of us that he had that experience.

      • OP

        I have thought about this, and I raised with my boss that if I’m not physically healed or the baby is very sick, I may need to extend my leave to 4 months. I doubt I’ll be emotionally “ready” to leave him or her, but moms have to do what they have to do.

        • Anonymous

          Make sure you are conscious to differentiate emotional readiness from postpartum mental health issues. If you experience PPD or PPA, the extra month might be helpful or you may be dying to go back at 3 months because that’s what helps your PPD/PPA – don’t feel guilty either way.

    • Julia

      It reads man’s preppy tie to me. I really like it, but not so much for workwear. I would have loved it at 15 with a crisp white button-down and my prep school boyfriend in school uniform on my arm. (I do think it could go a different way, but that’s my initial reaction.)

    • H

      Does it seem slightly too short for the office? I’m short so it would be longer on me, but still…

  6. front slit skirts in a suit?

    I bought a pants suit this summer and the matching skirt. The skirt is a below-the-knee pencil skirt with a slit in the front only. The slit goes from below my knee to a couple of inches above it (so it is higher than that when I sit down). I am not used to this. It makes it seem much less formal than regular suit skirts I have. If I sit cross-legged, it seems rather prominent.

    I will say that I am almost Lilith Crane-formal in my suiting choices. What do you all think — do you have any suiting skirts like this???

    • Susanne

      There’s nothing wrong with the kind of slit that you describe.

      Do you work in a particularly formal, uptight industry? Or is that just your personal style? I have to say, being Lilith Crane-formal in your suit choices may be a look that works against you. It may make you look uptight and dated. You may want to think about why you feel a need to be so buttoned-up.

    • Anonymous

      I dislike skirts like that – not because of formality, but because I feel like I’m wearing a skirt backwards or sideways. I just don’t get a front slit.

      • MJ

        I’ve had some center front skirts that always made me uncomfortable, so I just don’t buy them anymore. I don’t think they are necessarily unprofessional, but I did feel not right in meetings. I like the front slightly to the side slit, but not front center.

        I think if _you_ like it, you should rock it though!

    • NYNY

      I got the Classiques Entier doublecloth skirt during NAS, and love it. Can you link to your suit?

      I think the front slit look works best on a skirt that is longer – slightly below the knee, like you describe yours – and also high-waisted. It reads very elegant to me.

      As to the slit/modesty issue, any time I’m sitting in my skirt, either my legs are under a desk or table, or in situations like the subway (if I’m lucky enough to get a seat!), I hold my bag in my lap. The slit isn’t obscene when I sit, btw, only about 4 inches above my knees.

      • front slit skirts in a suit?

        It’s from Banana Republic. I probably could have gotten a petite length (I’m 5-4) but mine is regular and hits below the knee. I tried to find a link but it looks like it sold out. It was grey wool.

        I otherwise really like it, but I also had a bit of skirt-on-backwardsness to get used to.

    • SW

      I have one. The slit was higher than I liked when I bought it, so I took it to a tailor and had it sewn up some.

    • Shopping

      I would be distracted by concerns that it was slipping/riding up and too much leg was showing. Not saying that would actually happen, but that’s where my mind would go, when it should be focused elsewhere.

    • tesyaa

      If the skirt is not too narrow you can actually have the slit sewn shut by a tailor and made into a kick pleat. It can be done invisibly.

  7. SD

    What’s the deal with the “red fleece collection” versus other collections? I get that some are supposed to be ‘younger’, more preppy, etc, but it just confuses me, and I worry that perhaps there’s a quality difference.

    • Cat

      I haven’t experienced any quality difference, which is awesome. I’d say half the Red Fleece items are intended for preppy-trendy teens, but the other half are excellent workhorses. I bought one of their navy jersey pseudo-wrap-dresses for about $100 last spring, MACHINE WASHABLE, have worn it 10x and washed it 3x and it still looks like new. I’m mourning storing it for winter!

    • Anonymous

      Also really like some of the pieces and no note able quality differences. I was told that my store was not going to be carrying Red Fleece in-store any longer though which is disappointing.

  8. BigLaw is the worst

    I work in securitization. In-house not an option (would require move / clients are always randomly firing people seen as cost centers) in the sort term.

    Turns out, “comma chasing” is not really a skill to the rest of the world.

    Nursing school is looking better and better (many colleges near me have BA-RN programs for returning students; maybe they can start a JD-RN program???).

    signed,
    Junior partner, 2 young kids

    • AnonMN

      If you’re willing to jump down to an RN salary, consider utilizing your JD skills for something not in-house in corporate america? I took a huge salary cut to manage contracts in corporate america (I’ve done Insurance contracts, IT Contracts, and Energy contract, after having no experience with any of the listed type of contracts. People still hired me). I leave the office at 4pm and work from home 3 days per week. I NEVER work after hours or on weekends. Pay cut seems really worth it for now (2 young kids), but ask me in 20 years if I agree. . .

      If that’s not an option, then commiseration. Big Law is the worst, especially with kids.

      • Frozen Peach

        Will say that I am in-house and that good contract managers are seriously needed!!!

        • AnonK

          Just started a contract manager gig after clerking + big firm. The money is good and the hours are great. No complaints other than that the work is a bit repetitive and there’s not a ton of upward mobility… but hey, I can see my family at the end of the day.

        • Anonymous

          any thoughts on whether experience only as a federal law clerk (career 7+ years) would be considered for such a position? I have always been interested, but I’m not sure how transferable my skills would be. My favorite part of clerking is case management if that helps.

          • Anon

            I did litigation and then some structured finance before my current position managing contracts for a very specific industry (in which I had zero experience) so probably.

          • AnonK

            In my interview for my current gig, I spun docket management to mean “I am capable of handling a large volume of projects in various stages of completion without getting flustered or disorganized.” Clerking experience is great for this. Another benefit is the “ability to explain legal things to non-lawyers,” which happens a lot in this role.

          • AnonMN

            Yes. I honestly got my first job with no contract experience even though they “required” experience. So yes, I think you can totally spin your resume that having the JD is “contract expereince” and I bet a lot of the things you do can be spun for this: i.e review memos, etc.

        • Meredith Grey

          More curiosity on what experience is needed for these types of positions (years out of law school/particular skills)? What are these positions usually called?

          • CountC

            Honestly, I think it runs the gamut. I had four years of heavy contract drafting and negotiating and general business law practice experience, plus two years of soft contract-related work, but my colleague who was hired for the same position had zero contract experience. He had been a Lexis rep and and a solo practitioner doing criminal work and VA claims. Neither of us had experience in our particular industry.

            Our positions are called either contract analyst or contract manager. I have seen the same types of positions called contract administrator as well.

            Not all of the business units in our company have contracts groups, some run strictly with the attorneys. IME, if you are anywhere near a defense contractor or a company that works with defense contractors, start looking at their job postings. They should have this and subcontract administrator positions. You will likely have to weed through entry level positions, which they often hand out to new college grads, but there are higher level positions (aka better paying positions) to be had as well. I do not work for a defense contractor, but we have customers that are. Regardless, some of our other business units (IT and other industry segments) have contract groups as well. Large companies are a good place to start, but I think smaller companies sometimes have this type of position when they don’t want to sink a lot of money into a big in-house legal department.

      • question for the universe

        I will say that I think about this (moving to a wildly different position where I have a fixed schedule and no bring-home work). But I worry that with my seniority and legal background, someone would sniff me out and just dump me into management.

        So while my goal is just to work 2 overnights in an ER, I’d eventually be a nurse manager or somehow in hospital management and have to deal with HR, hiring, firing, scheduling, training, compliance, and getting sued.

        It’s like my friend who starting working at a McDonald’s in high school before she could even drive and was some sort of manager by the time she graduated (and was offered all sort of training and incentives to stay — OTOH, all of the wealthy people I know seem to have 3-4 McDonald’s franchises and maybe she could have been one of them had she stayed).

        TL;DR: when companies find competent help, they all seem to work it to death, so maybe for all of the change you’d be no better off (but possibly paid much less). Interwebs: pls tell me I’m wrong if I am (it is literally the only think keeping me at Miserable Job A: the thought that I’d only be replacing it with Miserable Jobs B-Z).

        • AnonMN

          Honestly, the jobs are such that, with my JD/skill base I can get 4x the work done in the same amount of time as my co-workers who aren’t JDs, so they think they are “working me to death” but they are not.

          I’ve also found that in these positions (no billables) they can only work you to death if you let them. I am salaried and meet my goals and then some, so they really have no basis to make me work/do more. So then it becomes a personal thing, can you say no to pressure? I do all the time, it doesn’t affect my pay or work environment and actually allows people to see a good example of boudaries. But It takes a little “i’m sticking it to the man” confidence.

          • CountC

            Yes! There is no expectation that I work more than 40 hrs a week and I have no problem getting my work and more done in those hours. I take on more responsibility because I want my boss’s job when he retires in two years. I get excellent reviews and my boss trusts me and often comes to me for legal explanations and the like even though he has been in contract management/administration for almost 20 years.

        • Anon

          I think you don’t understand how nursing works. They wouldn’t ?force you into some higher level admin job. You work where you apply.

          People who go into admin purposefully choose that because they don’t want to do traditional nursing anymore. They always need nurses doing nursing, so if you are good they wont be pushing you to do something else!

          That’s one of the nice things about nursing. You can change to different types of jobs all the time. Like, you can certainly start out working nights in the ER or the ICU. Then as you get burned out, you work with typical patients admitted to the hospital on the regular floors. Or you can work with an outpatient clinic (any field of medicine you want… and they are so so different, that you can keep learning if that is your interest). You can work as a private duty nurse, a home hospice nurse, a nurse for insurance companies that calls high risk patients at home and reviews their meds/medical needs with them etc…

          Nurses are always needed, are paid quite well with good job security, you can move just about anywhere without a job and find something (as you are not as locked into your field as a specialized doctor).

          But a lot of nurses get burned out, and it can be very stressful (especially working in the hospital carrying a high patient load). And if your fantasy is working two overnight ER shifts, you have a lot to learn! That is brutal on your health/mood/sanity…. really terrible to be shifting constantly from days to nights (unless you stay on the ER schedule all week)… and not something nurses tend to do as they get older. Hard to sustain, health wise.

          Why don’t you shadow someone who is a nurse/doctor that you know?

          • Anonymous

            Thanks — I have a cousin who is a nurse and has 3 children and I amazed at how much saner her work life is than mine (BigLaw). She’s been at it for 25 years (no loans from her schooling, which was an RN program run by her hospital / community college). She’s super smart and very hard working and can basically pick her jobs at this point. I don’t know if she is considered at 100% based on her shifts (I think she works 3 x 12 hour shifts, which can be thrown off if she has to go somewhere in the helecopter with a cardiac patient). She *has* to be at work on snow days so drives a 4WD SUV even though we have 1 hill in our county and has to stay over in really icy weather. Hospitals don’t close, yo.

            She might consider downsizing her job, but (unlike me) she’s not likely to quit it entirely (like me).

      • More details please?

        What exactly is a job like this– I mean, how do I find one? This sounds awesome! (Also 2 young kids and you have just described my dream schedule).

        • CountC

          I posted some information up thread on qualifications (although YMMV).

          As for what I mostly do on a day-to-day basis . . .

          – draft and negotiate terms and conditions of sale/purchase, distributor agreements, NDAs, etc.;
          – review and help prepare RFQ/RFP proposals;
          – monitor expiration and renewals of agreements;
          – draft termination letters;
          – manage issues that come up under the agreements that I have worked on or with the customers/distis for which I am responsible;
          – address issues that come up with “my” customers via customer service where appropriate;
          – draft language for use in responses to customers;
          – manage USG subcontracts and bid proposals for two subsidiary companies;
          – stay current on FAR and DFARS regulations (and by default I have become the group “expert” on the regs);
          – low-level compliance monitoring with various USG threshold requirements (I don’t manage the implementation of things, just keep track of whether we are going to cross a threshold); and
          – create training materials for business people to help make my job easier.

        • AnonMN

          I have found all of my jobs by searching for “contract” and “negotiation” on the job sites. The “good” ones will typically say “JD preffered” but not always. Agree with CountC, those are my basic job descriptions, just in a different industry.

        • Anon

          – Review and redline contracts
          – Manage the actual contract database (pull contracts, review contract terms, interpret and advise business on liability/risk/duties under contracts)
          – Work with outside customers as well as internally with business to negotiate contract terms (this includes emails, phone calls, and in-person meetings)
          – Draft termination/collection/etc. letters
          – Keep up on legislation and regulations that are pertinent to issues that regularly come up in contracts in my industry
          – Other miscellaneous projects

        • CountC

          LCOL just under $90k. Range at my company is anywhere from $60k to six figures for managers.

        • Beth

          I had a contacts mgr reporting to me; he made 95k + 10% bonus target with 3-5 years post law school experience, none directly relevant. Denver. If he’d had industry or more direct experience he’d have been offered more like 115.

        • RR

          Why am I not doing this? As a big firm litigation partner, would I be considered overqualified? Would people look at me for this type of job?

          (I have always loved my job, but the last year has left me really burned out, concerned about my mental health, worried about future growth potential as a woman in this profession, and just not sure I can keep doing it forever.)

          • OP

            Yes — this is totally me. I loved my job. I added in kids during the recession, so it was all manageable. The economic recovery has brought back the crazy in the work world and my older children are just needy of me in ways that haven’t worked well with outsourcing (and need a parent who is really present and patient and not all multitasking and stressed out; I was a better parent during the recession b/c I was about 75% busy and there was no push for more b/c 1) there was no “more” and 2) 75% was a rockstar compared to many other groups). Plus, my parents have gone through various health issues and I can myself being the horrible child of “we can’t have the funeral until after quarter end; I am so terribly sorry, but that is just how it has to be.”

          • CountC

            I think you will be fighting an uphill battle on convincing people it’s a switch you want to make for real and for good, but I don’t think it’s impossible. I had to explain why I no longer wanted to be in an attorney role at every step of the interview process for my current job and I had already been working here part time for four months in a CA role and had personal contacts on the inside giving me good recommendations.

    • AB

      I know someone who did BigLaw securitization and now works for the SEC. I don’t know much about her work, but that was her off-ramp.

      • Legally Brunette

        Yes, I know several folks that transitioned to the SEC. And the SEC has offices outside of DC as well, so may be something for the OP to consider. I also believe that they aren’t on the GS scale, so the pay is considerably higher.

        • Anonymous

          Agreed. In DC, that is the career path (along with folks who have gone to Fannie/Freddie). In NYC, it’s to a bank.

          Outside of DC and NYC, I have no idea.

    • Anonymous

      I’m a senior associate patent attorney in large boutique. After the Alice decision, my work sucks.

      I have decided to become a nurse. I went through the books, “What Can You Do With a Law Degree” and “Pathfinder” to identify my 2nd career. To find nursing programs in your area, search for accelerated 2nd bachelors programs. Many are 12 months to 2 years to complete. I’ll need about 26 credits of prereqs before applying.

      I am volunteering at a hospital on the weekend and going to school at night. Anatomy class is really fun!

      I am so looking forward to nursing as a second career. I want to be useful. And to be able to call a doctor on the tough cases instead of having to “figure it out”. I want vacation. I want sick days. I want overtime. You are not alone.

      • Anonymous

        That’s it — I don’t want to hate the next 30 years of my life as much as I’ve hated my 10 years in biglaw (I loved my clerkship, but the one judge in my area who has a career clerk already employs my friend in that role). My dr / nurse friends are all “girl, do it!”

        • Anon at 12:36

          Exactly. I didn’t hate my legal career. But I dread practicing for even 1 more year.

          I like nursing because (1) I don’t have to pick a specialty right away (the reason I’m not doing a direct entry Masters of Nursing). (2) Nurses have a practical skill set that is valued in the marketplace. (3) Nurses can do so many things! It’s really incredible what nurses can do with their skills. (4) There is room for advancement: nurses can get masters and phds in nursing. There is admin and research. All kinds of roles to explore! (5) I can volunteer in developing countries and actually make a difference. (6) Loads of part-time and alternative schedules. (7) I can move to any state and not take a bar exam!

          I have so many more reasons. I can’t wait to get out of my boring office and work with people.

      • RN, JD

        I’m late to this conversation, but as someone who practiced nursing for nearly 10 years, the grass isn’t always greener. I actually left nursing to go to law school. Been practicing law for 4 years now and it’s the best decision I ever made.
        I really struggled with irregular hours (switching back and forth between days and nights, not being able to have standing commitments because my schedule was always changing), working holidays (for example, every other Christmas and both Thanksgiving and New Years on the years I didn’t work Christmas), and taking the brunt of family’s stress. The families are almost always (understandably) very stressed and as the nurse, you’re always there so you get the brunt of that, but then don’t have the necessary power to do anything about a lot of it. Oh … and having to wait for some jerk who graduated from med school yesterday to come write an order for something that I already know needs to happen. I found the whole thing exhausting, thankless, and frustrating.
        I’d strongly second the person who suggested shadowing a couple of nurses to get a feel for what it’s really like.

    • Married to a nurse

      I am married to a nurse and it does have it tremendous benefits as a career path, but it’s also incredibly stressful and challenging in ways that my corporate executive job just never is.

      For those interested in nursing as another career, I would suggest you read the book “The Shift: One Nurse, Twelve Hours, Four Patients’ Lives” by Theresa Brown. Theresa is a former professor of literature who got a second degree nursing degree. This book focuses on one single shift that she works on a cancer ward in a hospital. She still works as a nurse and also write for the NYT “well” blog.

      I also wouldn’t underestimate the physicality of nursing as a career. Being on your feet for 12 hours, lifting patients and pushing those huge beds around is no joke.

      The egos and sexism present in the fly-over area hospital where we work though is sometimes jaw dropping to me, and I do not work in a woman-friendly field.

      Working paid overtime, not having a work phone and being truly off the clock is amazing though.

      Finally if you become a nurse, there’s lots of advanced practice options such as CRNAs, Nurse Practicioners, midwives, etc. that are really interesting.

  9. Bloom

    The mom’s post isn’t up yet, so posting here. Has anyone played any good baby shower games lately? Planning for a friend and it’s going to be a mix of young friends and older relatives and family friends so nothing that would induce pearl clutching.

    • Jeffiner

      Baby Shower Bingo. As the Mom-to-be opens each gift, guests check that gift off on their bingo cards. It keeps everyone engaged during the gift opening portion of the shower, instead of having them be bored and doing the standard “ooh” at everything. Sometimes the shower host will even hand out blank bingo cards before the shower, and guests will guess what the gifts are to fill out their cards.

      Also, instead of playing games, decorating onesies is popular now. Or get plain alphabet letters from a craft store and decorate them with paint, glitter, etc, and the mom can hang them in the nursery.

      • (was) due in june

        Yes to baby shower bingo. It makes the gift opening less obnoxious/boring.

        There was a mad libs type advice game that happened at one shower that I thought was amusing.

        Despite the fact that all of my friends and I did onesie decoration at our showers, none of our babies actually ever wore them.

    • Susan

      One of my favorite games is a kind of variation on the Honeymoon game – you get a list of questions and have the father to be answer them, then at the shower, the guests get a list of the questions and have to guess how many the mom will accurately guess her partner’s answers. Questions could be “facts” like, “How many diaper changes does an baby need each day?” Or “how old is a baby when it first smiles?” Or more random, like “What college will baby go to?” “What is (dad) most looking forward to doing with baby?” I’ve done this game at a few showers and it’s always a lot of fun. It’s a nice way to include the dad if you’re having a ladies only shower. I will say that one very uptight dude heard about it afterward and thought it was making fun of the dad, as in “Laugh at how wrong his answers are about babies!” But we asked the actual dad (who was already the father of a 2 yo) and he said he wasn’t offended in the least, “Because I am not insane.” But as always, know your audience and maybe go easy on the “baby knowledge” questions. Also, apologies if your shower honorees are not a mom/dad pair.

    • NYNY

      Just promise not to put melted candy bars in diapers and make guests guess what it is.

      • Anonymous4

        +1 million

        Also. Please no pin the sperm-on-the-egg

        I have suffered both. At the same shower.

      • ChiLaw

        Someone just suggested this in a baby-shower-planning email chain and I died. I’m a ghost now, which, I hope, means that I don’t have to go to the baby shower.

    • MJ

      I love the ribbon or TP game. Everyone gets access to a roll of ribbon or TP and gets to guess how big around mama is. It’s pretty hilarious how far off some people are. Do not do this if mama has body issues. Do this if mama is laughing at how huge she is.

      • Anon

        You’re the kind of person who touches pregnant women’s stomachs, aren’t you?

        • Anonymous

          ??? This game is fun and involves zero touching of the mom to be by anyone.

        • MJ

          You guess not touching the mom at all! The mom does her own last and you compare by holding it up. I NEVER touch anyone else’s stomach, esp. not at baby showers. EEEEW personal space invasion. NO.

          • CC

            This seems like a huge personal space invasion though. You are having her measured like a cow. No one I know would like this-I guess no your crowd. Every woman I know who “laughs at how huge she is” also thinks murderous thoughts when the billionth person that day remarks oh my god are you having triplets.

    • Cat

      Print out a large calendar and have guests guess arrival date/time (just remember to follow up and announce the winner/have a prize!)

    • Anonymous

      Have a box of diapers and a can of sharpies. Each guest can write a message to Mom and Dad. When parents are changing diapers in the middle of the night, they can read a sweet (or funny) message from a loved one.

      • VKJ

        This is my favorite one! Middle of the nights are so tough so encouragement then is always welcome.

      • SC

        People did this at my shower. I liked that it was completely voluntary, and people could write as much or as little as they wanted, and could be funny or encouraging. My SIL, who is usually pretty surly about forced fun, got really into it and wrote probably 2 dozen silly messages. And it was fun to read them as we did middle of the night diaper changes.

    • Anonymous4

      We did a memory game. I decorated by hanging baby items on a piece of twine – like bunting. After introductions and while people were getting refreshements, I took them all down. The person who remembered the most items won.

      Other ideas:

      Nursery Rhyme fill-in-the-blank
      Guess the children’s book using illustrations
      Appropriately themed MadLib (you could write your own)

      • Senior Attorney

        Oh! This just reminded me of the BEST thing we did at the last one I went to! They had little unfinished wooden blocks and all different colored Sharpies, and we made alphabet blocks! SO FUN! After the party they varnished them or whatever. Anyway it was a blast and the blocks will be an heirloom for sure.

        • MK

          We did this at my baby shower and I LOVED it. My kids still play with the blocks.

    • ChiLaw

      My favorite, if your friends are artsy or crafty, is decorating onesies. They can be had for cheap in multi-packs, and at the baby blow-out stage you’re going through so many…

      We would gather fabric markers, felt, hot glue, decorative trim, etc., and have a little station and then just let people go wild. It’s fun! At my baby shower we hung up some ribbons and clothespins so people could display their creations when they were finished. It was cute. And now when I look back on pictures I think, “aw, that’s BabyChi in the onesie her aunt made her!”

      • SC

        Awww that sounds fun. But I’m so nostalgic about sick days watching The Price is Right.

    • anon

      I just hosted a baby shower for a friend this weekend and our “agenda” was something like:

      -Decorate bibs with fabric markers while waiting for all guests to arrive

      -Pin the pacifier on the baby (purchased for $5 on amazon)

      -everyone bought a baby picture & people wrote down their guesses as to who was who; then people traded their sheets to “grade” each other’s work

      -baby item price is right (then gift all the items to the parents-to-be)

      -put 6 baby foods in separate bowls and have people guess what they are eating – this was a hit and people were wildly off-base

      -baby animal matching (i.e., cub goes with bear; kid goes with goat). These can be surprisingly hard. We DIY-ed the animals and baby matches on little index cards and again people wrote down their guesses and then traded their sheets to “grade” each other’s work

      -“don’t say baby” – hand everyone a clothespin or something similar when they arrive and explain that if they hear someone else say baby, they get to steal that person’s pin. person with the most pins after an hour wins.

  10. Amanda

    Help up my blazer wardrobe, please! I have a light brown (almost taupe) collarless blazer and a J Crew gray blazer that I wear all the time. I would really love to get some other blazers, too. I have a couple blazers with patterns (black and white, which I love way more than the other blazers, but I can never find outfits to put them together. Any suggestions?

    I love the bright blue blazer (link to follow), and it’s sitting in my Nordie’s bag, but I’m hesitant to pull the trigger since a lot of the blazers I’ve bought and love just sit in my closet…

  11. Anon

    Yesterday, there were numerous suggestions on scripts for how to handle people yelling. These were all great suggestions. Like the OP did in that scenario, I often get flustered when people are upset or angry with me – I am definitely a people pleaser. Any suggestions on how to settle myself when I’m flustered so I can think calmly and remember these scripts?

    • Anonymous

      Pick like 3-5 scripts. Write each one on a post-it. Place them next to your mirror where you get dressed in the morning. Practice saying them every day, to yourself, in your mirror. You will memorize them and get used to hearing yourself say them.

    • emeralds

      Didn’t catch the thread yesterday, but I sometimes have to deal with really emotional people, and have always gotten praise from supervisors and/or yellers (once they’ve calmed down) for being able to handle it well. I go with deep breaths and mindfully pausing before I respond to frame my thoughts; you can also never go wrong with summarizing what they’re saying (without all of the shouting) and establishing your common ground if you need extra time to collect yourself, e.g.:

      Helicopter Parent: YOU ARE THE WORST THIS IS A HUGE ISSUE YOU ARE INCOMPETENT AND RUINING MY LIFE AND MY CHILD’S LIFE WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE
      emeralds: [deep breath, count to 5] It sounds like [issue] is very frustrating for you and your student, and please know that we are all on the same team here: finding the best outcome for your student and getting this resolved. As I understand it, [this is what happened].

      And then move onto the substantive discussion about what needs to happen.

      • Marshmallow

        This is similar to deescalation techniques I learned as an RA in college and have served me well ever since. We called it “cow face:” think about relaxing the muscles in your face so you can keep a neutral expression. Like a cow. Deep breaths, then talk.

        • Anonymous

          Cow Face. Amazing. I practice relaxing the muscles in my face as part of my meditative practice, but now I’ll be inspired by the image of a chill af cow. Thank you.

          • Marshmallow

            “chill af cow,” YES. I was an RA at a very small liberal arts school in the greater NYC area. We mostly just had roommate arguments, drunk arguments, nothing too serious, but our training was amazing. It was such a good life choice for me. I still lean on a lot of those skills ten+ years later.

          • Anonymous

            @ Marshmallow: I can recall people getting into fights in RA training in my school about the naming for what used to be “gay acceptance week”. Not b/c the week people and the y’all are going to h3ll people, but like a circular firing squad. Not inclusive enough (so GLAW, which was also not inclusive enough). Other terms: too clinical. Other terms not fluid enough. It was like an Onion parody, except it wasn’t.

            These are legitimate points to raise and discuss. But it seemed to be among a group that was not able to raise and discuss anything without a few minutes later having some one yell out that you’re a bigot (etc.) and stomping out of the room.

            We would up with something too long for the banner we had wanted to put up (or it would have been LGBTQQAW), but I think that there was a sub-argument about tolerance / acceptance / something else. COW FACE was much needed!

            I was a waitress. THAT really schooled me.

        • Anonymous

          Wow — where were you an RA? I was an RA and it was mainly dealing with lost keys (easy) and the one student each year who had a parent die (OMG rough) and checking out the vacuums.

          • Crazy Roommate

            You must have been at a chill college. I recall calling my RA once to chat with my [former] roommate who threatened to slice my tires if I didn’t return her strainer right this minute.

            I imagine that was super fun for the RA.

          • Anonymous

            OMG college students.

            What happened with the crazy roommate? Genuinely curious.

            My RA training wouldn’t kick in (very kumbaya, not helpful here), but my inner Joe Pesci would: You’ve gone on record with a threat. If there is so much as a scuff on that car I will be looking at you. I will be a witness against you to the police, and to the adminstration, and to whichever licensing board you may ever need a license for. I will find people from your high school that will back me up on this and more. Strongly reconsider whether you weren’t gravely mistaken in what you said to Roommate and consider whether that strainer is more important than your future.

            Honestly, with people like that, you just have to call them on it. Every single time.

          • Crazy Roommate

            Yeah, I requested to switch dorms at semester to get away from crazy roommate (and looking back, I added plenty of my own fuel to the fire, but the relationship needed to be severed) and moved out. I took (by accident) her strainer, so she called me and asked for it back. I apologized and said I’d bring it back after the break, since I was already at my parents house.

            An hour later she calls and flips her lid. Her BF is also on the phone yelling. My parents had the enjoyment of listening in and sent me back to college three weeks later with a different vehicle, just in case she was legit crazypants. The RA gave her back her strainer and I avoided her like the plague for the rest of my college career.

          • Anonymous

            What is she doing now? [If you know.]

            BigLaw Partner?
            One of our crazy clients?

            She’s out there somewhere. Straining pasta.

    • Anonymous

      Maybe not helpful, but I find the more often you are able to breathe, moderate your voice, and stand firm in the face of someone yelling at you the easier it becomes. I also find that just those actions usually shame people into lowering their voices and calming down. It matters less exactly what you say and more that you ostentatiously refuse to engage in a shouting match.

    • SD

      I just got a book called Crucial Conversations and it provides a really fantastic framework.

      • NOLA

        That book is the best book I’ve ever read for supervising people and dealing with difficult situations.

      • Idea

        That book is the best book I’ve ever read for supervising people and dealing with difficult situations.

        • SD

          The program is worth it as well? I can tell the framework is excellent, but it’s definitely a difficult set of skills to consistently and correctly put into practice!

    • potatochip

      WHERE IS THIS MAGICAL THREAD? My search skills are failing me and I could badly use the advice.

      • Workplace Woes

        Might have been mine? Bottom of yesterday’s Nordie’s thread. But mine was more “VENTY VENTY VENT MAD” than anything- but it did have a few good suggestions for yelling clients.

  12. Anon

    Chicago Ladies, I could use some help with restaurants in Chicago for a three-day weekend/anniversary trip I am taking soon with my husband. I’ve searched other threads and haven’t found one on point. We are pescatarians (veggies plus seafood) and love good food. I travel to Chicago fairly regularly and was there with DH a few years ago and am frequently underwhelmed with the food. Please help us find impressive restaurants! Last time, we ate at Slurping Turtle and Sable. We found Slurping Turtle to be more focused on being hip than good food and I thought the food at Sable was on the heavy side and just OK. For another reference point, I have had dinner at South Water Kitchen a few times for work and had good seafood and wine there, but that feels like a work/corporate spot and not all that close to where we are staying.

    We are staying in River North and would like most spots to be in walking distance but will cab one night for an amazing restaurant. Our favorite kind of restaurants tend to be smaller French bistro types but we will take anything that is known for great food and wine. Based on some research, here are places I’m pondering for dinner: La Storia, Topolobampo (if we can get a reservation), Beatrix for brunch and/or possibly dinner and Imperial Lamian for dinner or a dim sum brunch. I’m interested in anything worthwhile — brunch, wine bars, a great lunch, romantic dinner, etc. Thank you!!

    • kktt

      I really liked Maude’s Liquor Bar in the West Loop, which is french food in big portions (shareable plates). It’s a little bit dark in there – when I took my mom, she used the flashlight on her phone to read the dessert menu- but it’s cozy and romantic, and the service was fantastic. I loved the pork belly lyonnaise salad and sausage, but I’ve also heard good things about the seafood tower.

      For something casual, you might like Fish Bar in Lakeview- fantastic fish tacos and a heated patio!

      • kktt

        Les Nomades is also very fancy and very fantastic- the wine list and souffles, especially.

    • Shayla

      Bavettes! It’s a steak house, but really good sea food too. They’re known for the drinks as well, but you can bring a bottle of wine (the corkage fee is to share a glass of the wine with another table–call to make sure this is still the policy). But try to get a reservation now it’s really hard to get in or plan on going and grabbing a drink and app at the bar.

      • Ellen

        Don’t forget the CHOP HOUSE if your Carnevioueus like me. I got alot of food when the manageing partner took me to the CHOP HOUSE. I had a Cobb Salad as an APPETISER, then Lamb Chop’s, and then a CREME BROULEE for Desert. The manageing partner had a steak (48 OUNCES, I think). I did NOT have to eat for a Day. YAY!!!

    • Anonymous

      I highly recommend Acadia. We just went there to celebrate our anniversary and the food was phenomenal. It has two Michelin stars and is definitely comparable to fine dining in SF and NY. Menu is veggie and seafood-heavy; I think on our five course tasting menu there was only one dish that had non-seafood meat, and they’re super great with dietary restrictions so I’m sure they could sub in a veggie or seafood course. Make sure to let them know you’re celebrating, they gave us glasses of prosecco on the house. I also loved Lula Cafe for a casual brunch. It’s a little far from downtown but worth the drive/L ride for the great food.

    • Minnie Beebe

      Vegetarian Chicagoan here!

      In River North:
      Siena Tavern is great.
      Ocean Cut is supposed to be great seafood (but I don’t eat it, so can’t comment directly)
      You can have a super-yummy lunch or dinner at Eataly

      If you’re willing to travel to the West Loop (a very easy cab ride) and want to have a fancy, fancy meal, you could try to get a reservation at Blackbird. I found it to be vegetarian friendly. Grace would be another good option (they have flora or fauna tasting menu options – I’ve never eaten here though)

      I’ll second the Lula Cafe brunch recommendation. It’s in Logan Square, so not super close to downtown, but a funky neighborhood northwest of the loop.

    • Anon OP

      These recommendations are fantastic! Most I have not read about and many hit exactly the kind of places we like. Thank you!!

      Of course, I’ll take any more insight from Chicagoans but just wanted to say thanks so much.

    • Angie Harmon

      Le Colonial in the Gold Coast would also be a great option. The food is fantastic and something different

    • ChiLaw

      I *love* Hopleaf. It’s a Belgian beer bar/restaurant in Andersonville (a cab or train/bus ride from you). It’s cute and cozy and the food is killer. As is the beer. They’re famous for their mussels and frites. Mmm.

      If you’re a beer geek, they regularly have Zombie Dust on tap, which is unusual and awesome.

      No reservations, and bring IDs (they carded my MiL on her 70th birthday), but it’s really swell.

      • Anonymous

        +1 to Hopleaf. Also recommend Longman & Eagle though it isn’t walking distance.

      • Anonymous

        Not OP, but I will definitely check this out when I’m up there next week, because Zombie Dust! Thanks for the rec!

    • Anonymous

      Ema is in River North and is great Mediterranean food. Boka in Lincoln Park is one of my favorite restaurants ever. Llena Brava (also by Rick Bayless of Topolobampo) in the West Loop is pretty seafood focused.

    • Ms B

      My Chicago fave is the kitchen table at The Aviary. If you can get the rez, there is a multi-course drink and snack pairing menu that is unbelievable. The hubs and I have done it twice and would love to go back again.

      My understanding is that they can accommodate most eating preferences (as they should for the price). Enjoy and no driving on the way back to the hotel!

      Also, I never go to Chicago without getting crumbly caramels at Teuscher in the 900 North Michigan shopping building. Divine!

    • Anonymous

      Lena Brava!! Rick Bayless’ newest restaurant – all wood fired seafood and an amazing mezcal list.

  13. Italy?

    Going to Rome for work conference this fall. any suggestions for outfits? I’m not super trendy, so thinking more black dresses, etc., but I would like to fit in. I’m a little intimidated. if it were a vacation that would be easier for me, I think. maybe I’m overthinking it.

    • Minnie Beebe

      Do not bring shoes with skinny heels. Block heels are great for Rome, since the streets are often made of stone/brick. Otherwise, people tend to dress well in Rome (the residents, anyway. Tourists look like, well, tourists…) Black dresses sound great to me.

      • Anon

        +1

        A good trench.

        A couple scarves to wear with trench/black dress to give yourself a touch of color/style. One neutral, one less so.

      • Senior Attorney

        +2

        I was just in Sicily (so not Rome), and my observation of Italy is that the locals look amazingly chic, and the Americans look like Americans. Just own it and wear something you feel good in. Black dresses with maybe scarves and a great trench and cobblestone-ready shoes should be fine.

      • Shopping

        Tall boots. Wear them for the flight, then switch into slippers on the plane.

    • Anonymous

      Would the non-athletic wear from Athleta be something that would be better tourist attire? Or still stand out wildly?

      For me, it is comfy and washable / drip dry and not fussy, and less sloppy that my preferred at-home attire. But perhaps not chic enough?

      Also, are Birkenstocks worn in Europe / Italy? My feet really like them. Even in cooler weather (Arizonas with smartwool-type socks). Also some Danskos / Clarks boots.

      • Laura B

        I mean this in all kindness, if you’re concerned about being chic, Birkenstock Arizonas with socks are a bad idea anywhere, including my midwest America home. My MIL really likes Birks, and she just got a pair of Birkenstock Havana shoes that are really cute – I suggest trying those if you love them. By all means, you do you, but sandals + socks are not chic.

      • Ms B

        I went through Italy in a below the knee black knit skirt (think J.Jill’s Wearever line or similar) or dark ankle pants with Aerosoles loafers with one inch block heels, a short sleeved or sleeveless blouse or cashmere t-shirt, a cardi, and scarves plus dark sunglasses. I added a dark knee length trench on cooler or rainy days The scarves were essential for churches (some require head coverings). I did not feel out of place anywhere we went, but I would upscale for a conference.

        I have seen some Mephistos in the South of France in early summer (especially along the coast), but no sandals at all in Italy in the fall. Italians have a schedule to what they wear — if it is November, the coats are out, even if it is 80 degrees F in Rome and the palm trees are dropping coconuts.

  14. j

    Hi Hive! I’m brainstorming a list of feminist couples/marriages for a bridal shower game I’m planning. Anyone have any ideas of real or fictional couples that I could include?

    Also, if anyone has ideas for any non-terrible bridal shower games, I’m all ears for those, too.

    Thanks!

    • kktt

      Tammy and Eric Taylor, Friday Night Lights
      Leslie Knope and Ben Wyatt, Parks and Rec

    • Marshmallow

      RBG and Martin Ginsburg, obv!

      I like the “What’s in your purse?” game. It’s a good break from gift opening.

    • Delta Dawn

      For games, if this is a shower where people know the bride well (as in, not a shower for her mother’s friends, etc.), you could play a game to see who knows the bride best. I went to a shower once where the bride’s sisters read questions about the bride– what is her favorite color/movie/restaurant, where did she meet her fiancé, what would she do with a free Saturday, etc. (these can be sweet and tame or more, ah, inventive)– and everyone wrote their answers, including the bride. Then they asked the bride to tell her answers, and everyone checked off how many they got right. They had little prizes for who got the most answers correct. It was cute and easy.

    • Idea

      Billary.
      Barack & Michelle (ok, I’m political)
      Bob & Elizabeth Dole if you or the couple remember them from before his e r e c t i l e dysfunction commercials.
      Authors? They seem to be married to each other a lot – like Michael Chabon and Ayelet Waldman?
      pre-feminism and not great role models but King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella of Spain were each powerful in their own way

    • Senior Attorney

      Bill and Hill Clinton, of course.
      Joe and Jill Biden
      The Obamas
      Jean-Paul Sartre and Simone de Beauvoir
      Pierre and Marie Curie
      Abelard and Héloïse
      Gertrude Stein and Alice B. Toklas
      Bill and Melinda Gates
      Paul Newman and Joanne Woodward
      Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt
      Johnny Cash and June Carter Cash

      • CC

        I think some of these are just feminist women, not feminist marriages. Sorry but bill and hiliarys marriage is not what you want to be thinking of when you are getting ready to be married (and I say that as a huge Hillary admirer, but I’m not going to forgive bill for having the 24 year old give him a bj in the office. I look at our 24 year old law clerk and just think about how young she is!) also Elanor and Franklin?? Franklin had multiple affairs (and Eleanor too prob)

        But second the obamas

  15. New Job!

    1. How much time is normal to take in between jobs? I received and accepted a tentative job offer contingent on a pretty involved background check and security screening. Estimate time is 45 days to 2.5 months, putting my start date right around the Christmas holiday season considering this, is it crazy to ask to start in the new year?

    2. Assuming I’d get the time off, I’d love to do some solo travel on the west coast. West coasters, where would you recommend going in the Winter? I was thinking Pacific Coast Highway from Santa Monica, maybe up to San Francisco, but I’m open to ideas!

    • Anonymous

      I would start prior to the new year- that way you can get all of the admin and orientation stuff out of the way and really start the new year getting down to business. This is especially true in law where billables start ticking on day one. Anything you can do to get non-billable stuff done before the clock starts running is ideal.

      I don’t have any experience with winter west coast travel, but I think I’d want to do Portland!

    • Laura B

      I don’t have experience with this (haven’t switched jobs yet – I’m seven years into my first prof job), but I would absolutely take the time and travel. I have a planned exit date from current job (which is still a year away, grrrr) and I’m so burnt out already that a couple weeks off (min) is going to be less optional and more necessity.

      Also, the Pacific Coast Highway plan sounds awesome – that is a bucket list travel item for me.

      • Anon

        +1

        There aren’t a lot of guilt free breaks in adult life.

        Grab them while you can!!!

        No one will miss you over the holidays.

    • CMT

      I think it would be reasonable to ask to start in the new year. You could already have holiday plans. The people who will be training you are more likely to be out of the office around the holidays. And wanting a little time off is also a totally legit reason.

    • Anon

      Ask if any changes to benefits are scheduled to occur with the start of the new year. I didn’t think to and as a result have to pay for long and short term disability insurance coverage. If I had started on December 30th rather than January 2nd, they would have been free. Ouch!

    • Walnut

      The only reason to potentially start before the holidays is if it would affect future benefits. Does 1 day count as a month or as a year for 401k vest, insurance, vacation time, etc?

      • Ms B

        Cosign. The place where I was in-house counted vacation days and 401K eligibility by month and year of start, so starting January 2 versus December 30 would cost three personal days plus a year of 401K match. It’s the reason I left there effective the first Friday of January in my departure year . . .

      • Anon

        But given our current drought, ‘rainy season’ means the occasional rainy day, especially in Southern CA.

    • ANon

      Even in the winter, PCH from Santa Monica to San Francisco is beautiful drive. I would absolutely recommend it. There are tons of great little towns along the way. You can make the trip easily in one day, but I would take 4-5 days, go slowly, and make plenty of stops along the way.

  16. Workplace Woes

    I love this skirt. I would have a difficult time wearing it, but it would 100% be something I would pin on Pinterest.

    I posted late yesterday about an issue with a coworker-friend at work, and got some really, really needed validation and sympathy, but few ideas for how to address this issue with my coworker. A script would be great. I’m opposed to taking it to his supervisor before trying to talk to him about it, and I haven’t decided if I want to tell my supervisor.

    I am an attorney in legal aid, and a client came in unexpected yesterday; we no longer have an open case with him. I was the last one to touch the case, but am not familiar with it, and the person who did handle the case no longer works at my organization. So, my supervisor IMed me on our office system to let me know the client was at the office, in person, because I knew nominally more than him. I was in a meeting over the phone just then, which is noted on our IM system “Busy: In a Meeting”. I told my supervisor I’d handle it in a minute. He said Friend was dealing with client in the lobby now. Friend works at the front desk. Doing this kind of thing is part of his job.

    I finish the IM conversation with Supervisor (30 seconds?) and Friend shows up at my door. It’s clear I’m on the phone. He says “Your client is in the lobby.” I mouth “Wait,” “He can wait,” and then, when Friend isn’t understanding, “WAIT. HE CAN WAIT.” I wrote “He can wait” on a piece of paper, too. I.e., it was very clear what I was intending to say: I am busy. The client can wait.

    I tried to get off the call (it was with another attorney in our org, much more senior to me) and she gently reminded me that clients don’t get to dictate our time when they show up unannounced. I agreed, but was flustered and a bit panicked in the moment. But I stayed on the call. I IMed the Front Desk supervisor and asked her to tell our client that I was busy, but that he could wait or call to set up an appointment. She said “You bet- absolutely.” No indication the client was being rude, disruptive, etc.

    Friend shows back up outside my office and starts HUMMING THE JEOPARDY THEME SONG and miming self-gardening (? I don’t know what else he could have been doing). This was incredibly distracting, obviously, and I was even more flustered now- just trying to say “Mmhmm, yeah, absolutely, of course,” at correct times on the call, but failing miserably. Friend starts saying “YOUR CLIENT IS HERE. HE’S WAITING. YOUR CLIENT IS HERE.” Frustrated, I finally wrote “Tell. Him. To. F-ing. Wait.” He said “Okay, okay!” And left. I got off the call about 5 minutes later, very embarrassed about how unprofessional I looked to this attorney.

    I went out to the lobby, and client was sitting quietly, not making a racket, not bothering the Front Desk, with no indication he had been doing so at any time previously.

    Dealt with client, and got back to my desk. I messaged Friend “Thank you for handling that. When I’m on the phone, though, and it’s unscheduled, clients can wait.” He said “Gotcha. I will keep that in mind for the future.” And was terse and wouldn’t make eye contact or speak with me for the rest of the day. This doesn’t bother me; the huge amounts of unprofessionalism and immaturity he shows do, and the fact that he wouldn’t treat anyone else in the office like that also bothers me immensely. Probably the most out of any of this, that bothers me- he would never, ever, ever, ever pretend to be self-gardening outside another attorney’s office when they were on the phone. Ever.

    We started at a similar level of “seniority;” he was a front desk staffer and I was an intern, and are friends outside work, but since I became an attorney, I’m finding that he’s not as professional at work as I would like. I’ve been trying to make it more professional, but I need to do better about it as well. Yesterday, however, was beyond the pale for me- his actions caused me to be distracted on an important call, I looked very unprofessional, and I entered the client meeting already frustrated and flustered, which did not help. I don’t know what I could have done differently- I emailed the attorney to apologize afterwards, which sucked.

    I want to bring this up with him, but I’ve tried to casually bring up this kind of thing or just ask for the assistance he is supposed to provide and he somewhat responds, but tends to turn it back around or make a joke out of it.
    Example. “I don’t always feel like I’m taken seriously at work by other attorneys; when I come to your desk to ask you to help me mail this, and you respond by making fart jokes, it’s frustrating and doesn’t help, especially when others are around.” “I get that, of course, but remember that you’re taken as seriously as everyone else in the office.”
    Example “Hi, Friend. Can you please help me do x?” “Your mom can help you do X!” (Do X myself.).

    What do I say to him? I’m also going to work on putting distance between us- he’s a good friend, and that sucks, but I don’t think he can separate Friend and Colleague/Subordinate, unfortunately. And that makes me look bad.

      • Workplace Woes

        Read it and thought of this coworker immediately, but he doesn’t go that far- other than the one or two “your mom can help you do X” situations, he does do what I ask him to do, just he gives me a bunch of s**t when I ask. And I’m not his supervisor, in any way, shape, or form. So, it gave me okay ideas (stony faced, cut out the joking, etc,) but not a good idea for how to talk to him.

        • Idea

          I think you’re thinking too hard. You don’t WANT it to go that far. Cut.It.Out.Now. Cut out YOUR enabling of him and cut out HIS antics. Not professional!

        • KT

          Giving you Sh*t when you ask is unacceptable. You need to have a conversation with him where you say, in no uncertain terms, he needs to cut the crap.

    • Anon

      OMG. Dramatic and ineffective, much?! Why on earth after all this happen would you IM him and start with “thank you blah blah blah.”!? Why did you not walk over to his desk and in a tone that conveys you are NOT happy say to him — you can very well see I was on the phone; when I am on the phone, a client who stops by unannounced who isn’t creating havoc on the place, can wait; I expect you to know that as a receptionist. And I AM not amused by your singing or anything else outside my office and it dare not happen again.” And then walk away. If you are a yeller, yell. If you are not — everyone has a tone they take that conveys that a subordinate has screwed up. You conveyed nothing with your thank you IM and then you wonder why his immaturity makes you look bad? It’s bc you take it and that likely makes other attys think you are ok with it or even find it funny.

      • Anonymous

        Wait agreed. You already dealt with this yesterday. You didn’t do a great job, but now it is done.

        • Anonymous

          Agreed. You have to rip off the band-aid, and start treating him like a subordinate. Stop being friends unless YOU can figure out how to separate that relationship. You can’t expect HIM to manage the professional relationship because clearly, he just pushes your buttons.

          • Senior Attorney

            She is not a bitch. She is spot on.

            By permitting this excessively unprofessional behavior by him, you are behaving unprofessionally yourself.

            You may well have to say goodbye to this friendship, but you can. not. permit. this to continue. It will come back and bite YOU sooner or later.

          • Senior Attorney

            In moderation for repeating the b-word. Trying again:

            She is not a b—-. She is spot on.

            By permitting this excessively unprofessional behavior by him, you are behaving unprofessionally yourself.

            You may well have to say goodbye to this friendship, but you can. not. permit. this to continue. It will come back and bite YOU sooner or later.

          • Opal

            +100 Being ‘professional’ does not mean you just concede and do X when he informs you that he would prefer your mom complete the task. Being ‘professional’ occasionally requires a raised voice, a stern talking to, correcting a behavior, stopping a behavior in its tracks. Step up. Do it. This is no friend. You will lose in the end.

        • KT

          Wow, no she’s not. A coworker who did this needs a verbal dressing down. What he did was stupid. What you did, which was let yourself get flustered, screw up a call, and then send him a thank you, was totally ineffective and the reason why he does this crap.

          • Workplace Woes

            Okay, sorry for my immediate response (and the namecalling). I know I didn’t handle it firmly enough and got defensive.

            I had a discussion with his supervisor when I got in this morning and mentioned that he came to my office twice, knowing I was in a meeting, and was very disruptive. She said she would reiterate to him and the rest of the Front Desk that if clients show up, it is appropriate to message us, once, asking what we would like them to do and then do that, not harass us and remind us the client is there.

            I’ll have a conversation with him when it can be privately about that yesterday was absolutely unacceptable and should never, ever happen again, as well as that his general behavior is also unacceptable and I need him to do things when I ask, as he does for other attorneys in the office, without giving me crap about it or being difficult. It’s going to probably feel like it came out of nowhere for him, but that’s fine.

            Does this have to be an in-person conversation? Asking not because I’m unwilling to do it in person, but because of the dynamics of our office set up make conversations like this very difficult to have privately and I don’t want others overhearing.

          • Senior Attorney

            And honestly, not sure it has to be super private. He is so far out of bounds that a public dressing down is not completely inappropriate.

    • Anonymous

      “Hey, yesterday wasn’t cool. I told you I was on the phone. You can leave that to reception to deal with in the future. You were very distracting to me on the phone.”

      • Opal

        This response doesn’t address the pattern. That’s the issue that needs handling.

        • KT

          Yeah, “miming self-gardening” isn’t distracting. That’s completely inappropriate, firable-offense and he needs to be dressed down hard.

        • Anonymous

          Yeah but she’s obvi not going to do that. It’s a step in the right direction at least.

    • SC

      I would have focused on the lewd hand gestures, documented the story, told HR or a superior, and documented their response. “Staffer interrupted a phone call yesterday and instead of waiting patiently for me to end my call, made lewd hand gestures at me.” With that single fact, the rest of the story is irrelevant. I would not address Staffer myself, because this is beyond a simple management problem, and I would be doing everything I could to have a subordinate disciplined or fired for sexual harassment because that’s the only way to communicate that that behavior is unacceptable in the workplace. Go ahead and call me a b-tch.

    • Ally McBeal

      This reminds me of something that happened to me. I spent one summer during college temping as a receptionist at a large corporate building. I’d never been a receptionist before and never worked in a corporation! I was a baby. A vendor showed up to see one of the buyers, and I called her to let her know her appointment was in. It went to voice mail. I sent her an email. No response. I called her again. No response. Vendor is getting really irritated. Finally, she storms into the lobby and walks straight to me and yells, “DO NOT EVER, EVER DO THAT TO ME AGAIN. I was on a call. This guy can WAIT. DO NOT DISTURB ME when I’m working. It is VERY UNPROFESSIONAL.” She then storms off, taking vendor with her.

      It was awful and I definitely cried. But it also taught me a very useful lesson about who I reported to. Receptionists work for the attorneys, not for the impatient client in the lobby.

      • SC

        That actually seems like really strange behavior and a major overreaction. If someone were waiting for me in the lobby, I would want to know. For all the receptionist knows, Attorney needs the delivery by a certain time and will be furious that extensive measures were not taken to notify her. Also, if I were expecting a delivery but might not be available, I would leave instructions with either my secretary or the receptionist.

  17. Office gossiper

    How do you shut down the office gossiper and complainer? I have a peer who keeps coming up to my desk to complain about workload and senior management. I do not want to engage with her but she just keeps talking. I told her to talk to her manager but she just keeps repeating why the work place is so bad, shes’s not getting promoted, etc. Even when I have headphones on, she still talks to me.

    • kktt

      At the risk of outing myself, I once instituted No-Complaining Wednesdays for our pod at work. Our team was full of loud, optimistic, enthusiastic types, so it went over surprisingly well. Not for all offices/teams.

    • Anonymous

      Be direct. Try: “I understand that you are unhappy here, but I am not. I enjoy my work and I have a lot of it to do. Sorry I can’t chit chat with you.” If it continues–repeat above and add–“I am trying to be polite, but you don’t seem to understand that I don’t want to talk about this–maybe I need to talk to a manager.”

    • Diana Barry

      You could ask Ask a Manager, but I would just keep your headphones in and not engage with her like you don’t see her there, then if she taps you on the shoulder just say “sorry, don’t have time to talk, see you later” and repeat ad infinitum. If she still doesn’t get it after a week of this you could bring it up to your manager.

    • Anonymous

      “Sorry you’re so unhappy, you should talk to your manager about that.”

    • Anonymous

      Dealt with a coworker like this. If she came to my office, I would give her two seconds to talk to make sure it wasn’t something legitimately work-related and then I would say, “Sorry, I don’t have time to talk, I have a deadline/to get this to the client/I have a conference call about to start.” It took about 12 times before she finally got that I just never had time to talk to her, but eventually she did.

  18. Anonymous

    Any advice for going into business with a friend? We work in the same field and are considering opening our own firm. He is gung ho, but I am cautious because I don’t want to either ruin our friendship if the business goes sour, or not advocate as aggressively for myself because he IS a friend.

    FWIW, I do tend to overanalyze, and we have worked together on projects before. We work well together. But I do think about long term impacts and “what ifs”.

        • CountC

          But if you must, contracts and written documentation for EVERYTHING. You want their to be no dispute about who agreed to what or who is responsible for what or who owes who what money. It’s ripe for friendship destruction IMO and I have helped people get out of this sort of arrangement after it has gone south and ugly.

      • Senior Attorney

        I agree. The worst cases I dealt with as a civil litigator were cases where friendships-turned-business-partnerships went bad. If you want to open a firm, do it on your own or shop around for somebody who’s not a friend. Lovely Husband’s law partner someone he knew professionally but is not a friend, and although they are friendly enough business partners, from my observation the personal distance has been a good thing.

    • NOLA

      My only experience with this is my SIL and it was years ago. She started a business (marketing research consulting company) with a friend and former colleague. Things were going great until the friend/business partner had serious difficulties TTC and my SIL got pregnant unexpectedly (but happily). It went south after that and never recovered.

    • Anonymous

      My former business partner told me there are two chairs in heaven waiting for the first business partners who die liking each other.

      I have done this and wouldn’t do it again.

    • Family and friends don't mix with business

      Don’t have advice specific to partnering with friends, but I have a parallel experience, I think. I work in a family business (I’m part of the family), which is something that is frequently advised as a “don’t do it”, especially on sites like Ask A Manager. After years of being really annoyed by that advice because I did really like being a part of the family business, I now completely agree with it. I gained a lot of skills, and the first five years were awesome, and I learned that I love working with DH – so I don’t regret doing it. But now DH and I are miserable, want out, and it is so insanely sticky/complicated/heart-wrenching because it’s like we’re “abandoning” the family. I would think working with a friend would be the same if they time came when one of you wanted out.

  19. Big 4 jobs

    I work opposite people in the Big 4 who aren’t accountants, but who do financial modeling. I am too shy to ask what you need to do to get a job like that (or other non-accounting jobs there). It looks fairly appealing — offices throughout the country, not a law firm or a big bank. [I am sure I am missing out on how the grass isn’t greener.] Does anyone here work for a Big 4 firm who can explain a bit about different career paths / backgrounds?

    I know there is a lot of consulting and that takes many JD/LLM tax people (or did — maybe still?), but am pretty clueless.

    • consultant

      So they are either doing consulting or advisory. Advisory can be financial advice, assisting audit, IT recommendations etc Most people have degrees in finance/economics/accounting/information technology, either BS or MS.

      Quality of life wise its usually less hours than banks, but busy season can be busy. The firms are generous about PTO, have a relaxed culture, but traveling can take its toll.

    • Idea

      This is a time that is perfect for shyness! You actually only have to ask 1 or 2 questions to get people started talking about their job! Think “informational interview” — take him/her to coffee for 20 minutes, and they’ll be talking and you’ll be listening. Perfect!

    • Anonymous

      You should ask! I’m a lawyer and I ask clients/accountants/bankers/other individuals I interact with this question all the time. It’s easy small talk and I usually learn something interesting about either the person or the industry.

      You don’t have to say “how do I get a job there?” – I usually say something like “X industry is so interesting because of Y – how did you end up at this company?” or “how did you end up in your current role” and people will give you their elevator speech.

      Also, you can check the job postings for roles you think are interesting and see what the requirements are, or check the linked in of the people you interact with to see what their background is.

    • BabyAssociate

      You should definitely ask. I’m sure they’d be more than happy to share their paths.

      That’s how I got my current job, I met with someone and was like “hello, I would like do be you someday, how do I do that?” Two years later and I am in the office next door.

    • Anon for this

      This is my job. I have an undergrad degree in accounting and was put on a CPA credentialing track when I started. The specific work/practice group you end up in will inform your credentialing requirements, but keep that in mind as you may need to pursue CPA/CFA and have the requisite education to do so. I got my job through an internal referral. Regulatory consulting practice groups will hire JDs/LLMs, but your modeling work may be limited.

      If you’re one of my clients, I will pass your resume along and indicate that you’re a client. We have a pipeline for hiring that way. If you’re not a client but I work with you on a client, I will probably pass your resume along but may be more honest with our recruiters about any work product I’ve seen of yours.

      Just ask–but be clear that it’s because you’re interested in it from a career change perspective because otherwise I’ll think you’re just making small talk.

      • Anonymous

        I don’t know — I’m just exploring the universe. I think I missed the boat on being a quant and maybe that that’s what I should be doing (more modeling and less legal / tax re what is being modeled). I just need Bloomberg and MatLab in my life I guess. :)

    • Newbie

      The most common path is to either be hired with a finance degree out of school (or lateral from another firm)or switch from an audit role (with an accounting degree). I can’t think of anyone I know who has taken a different path and I don’t know of any JDs who do this work. it is uncommon to be hired into these groups out of an MBA because they are all fairly technical.

      Keep in mind that there are a variety of groups at Big 4 firms that do modeling for different purposes – transaction support, traditional valuation groups (which typically do purchase price accounting and goodwill work), and consulting-type valuation groups. It would be easiest to get hired into a consulting valuation group out of an MBA but I think it is still uncommon unless you did banking or something else financial prior to that.

      Big 4 firms have other non-audit groups as well so you could very well ask under the auspices of learning more about the firm and not specifically trying to get a job in this group – you might find something that is well fitted to you if you are just attracted to the idea of working at a Big 4.

    • Anonymous

      Backgrounds will depend on what they do. Tax consultants have JDs. For other sorts, it’s likely that many of them where likely undergrad business/finance or MBAs.

      Depending on what they do, I would start to do some reading before an informational interview. Example, if they do valuations, spend some time reading Seeking Alpha, etc.

    • Anon

      At at least one of the big 4, they have a role called “project controllers”. They are considered consultants, but bc they typically don’t get billed out to the client they don’t make as much as most consultants. Role involves excel modeling all day every day, with lots of heads down people and only some client interaction. You don’t need a CPA or Mba. Project controllers are used in other industries as well, so it can be a good career for those who love crunching numbers all day.

  20. anonymous

    Someone yesterday suggested vacationing in Nicaragua. I’ve decided to do it. What are things I shouldn’t miss?

    • SD

      That was me!!

      I LOVED Big Corn Island and stayed at Hotel Paraiso, which I recommend. Ask the owner, Mike, to take a day trip to Little Corn Island. Going to the Corn Islands will eat into your travel time because you have to take a plane there, but I just loved that place so much. It’s utterly unique. I stayed there a week and by the end was on a first name basis with every cab driver there; that’s how small and friendly it is. I’d treat this as the relaxing “beach” part of my vacation. Maybe one day I’ll retire to Big Corn Island…

      Volcano boarding in Leon is totally touristy, but come on, why resist it? Go to Leon for that, stay the night at a party hostel and hang out, then I’d probably leave.

      I’d treat Granada as a hub for whatever tours strike your fancy. There’s stuff like rainforest treks, kayaking, etc. Visit the french market while you’re there. Explore the churches; they have great views of the city.

      I enjoyed staying at Laguna de Apoyo for a couple of nights right before going home; they arranged a cab at 3am to take me directly to the airport in time for my flight (about an hour away). Not a ton to do but it’s very relaxing and there are monkeys!

      The thing I regret not doing, and will do when I go back, is making my way to Ometepe. Look into Hostel Finca Magdelena- heard good things about it from a fellow traveler I met in Granada, and I went to Leon and she went there. Btw, go with a backpack instead of traditional luggage; you’ll need to walk like half a mile or whatever from the bus stop to get to the finca.

      Depending on how much time you have, you MAY have to choose between Corn Islands and Ometepe because they both take time and hardship to get to.

      I don’t know, I just kind of showed up without any plans and barely any research and had a blast going wherever the wind carried. Don’t even speak Spanish. Felt pretty safe. Great adventure. Let me know if you have any other questions!

      • anonymous

        Yeah! I booked a ticket arriving in Managua at like 2am. What’s the best/safest way for a single woman to get to a hotel? Taxi? Do some hotels come pick you up?

        • SD

          I’d stay at like a hotel airport in Managua and go straight from there to your first destination. No reason to stay in Managua. And it’s the place I”d be most wary of being pick pocketed, so watch your stuff while you’re there!

    • B

      LOVED Ometepe, loved Leon, thought Granada was super touristy. The Lonely Planet Nicaragua forum was super helpful when I went about 5 years ago; there is a trip report from me somewhere on there. We did it on the super cheap (local buses and hostels). 5 years ago you had to be prepared for things like the water or electricity to inexplicably go out for several hours, not sure if that is still true. If I went back, I would totally do some of the multi-day volcano hikes from Leon.

  21. Anonymous

    Background: my parents divorced when I was an adult living out of the house, it was ugly. I am estranged from my mom’s parents and have been for about 20 years. I tried to reach out to them in college and my mom asked me not to, so I stopped. My mom recently returned to contact with her parents after also not talking to them for many years. At this point, I choose to not have a relationship with my mother’s parents because they have said some horrible things about my dad and his parents/side of the family in the wake of the divorce and seem to show absolutely no shame or apology for saying what I consider to be horrible and gross things about my family. I have told my mother if they want to apologize I would have that conversation but they don’t want to, so.

    My mom’s dad/maternal grandfather, a lifelong smoker and alcoholic, has colon cancer. My mom has been calling me with updates. I don’t have a relationship with these people. The other day I finally told my mother if she wants to, she can keep telling me the parts that impact my personal health history, but that I find discussing cancer stressful and I do not want to be included in the blow-by-blow of when he is seeing what specialist or having what procedure done. Cue guilt trip.

    This is a fair request, right? To not want to be emotionally burdened with the significant medical issues of something I don’t know?

    • Anonymous

      I think you need to reframe it not as receiving updates about someone you don’t know – it’s not about that – it’s about supporting your mom dealing with a person she cares about suffering an illness. Not sure what that looks like but given that your mom doesn’t have your dad to talk to anymore, I can understand why she wants to talk about the challenges in her life with someone. Figure out what your boundary is and stick with it but remember it’s about supporting your mom when she’s struggling, not about knowing about the maternal grandfather – maybe that looks like you doing something nice with her to help take her mind off it?Supporting her doesn’t have to involve just listening to the medical blow by blow.

      • Anon

        +1

        I know this is hard, but yes… you need to focus on your Mom’s needs. It doesn’t matter that you don’t know your grandparents. Your Mother is suffering and will soon lose a parent and clearly has a huge amount of angst/guilt/anger wrapped up in her family history. This can be brutal, and perhaps you childhood was fortunate and you didn’t have this…. but often these brutal family issues come to a head when people are dying and can be crushing. Please…… Have some empathy here. After her divorce, what is going on now is probably the terrible experience of her life.

        All you need to do is listen, and say…. “I’m so sorry…. That sounds so hard” Maybe call her a little more often.

        I would also recommend to her that she find someone local to vent to, if possible. Like a friend or another family member who will also understand the complex issues (sibling?). Just simply ask her…. “Have you talked with (sibling) lately? How are they dealing with things?”

    • Cornellian

      I’ll second the 11:40 anonymous in saying that I think you need to look at this as a question of how much and what type of support you’re willing to give your mother as she goes through something traumatic. If you can’t separate that from awful things they’ve said to/about you, let her know that. But I don’t think your mother is thinking about your genetic information when she’s talking to you, it sounds like maybe she’s just using you as an emotional support.

      I think 11:40 was right to say if you’re not comfortable playing the support role in the way your mom wants you to, that’s fine. Maybe there’s something else you’d like to do with her or a therapist you’d like to recommend for her.

    • Anonymous

      Honestly, your mom is dealing with a tough situation. Even when there are relationship problems, having a parent die is very hard. It’s probable she just needs someone to talk to about it. It would be kind to listen to her updates – it doesn’t mean that you have to suddenly like them as people. You like your mom and that is enough.

    • Anonymous

      Different opinion here. When my mom insisted on regularly updating me about the declining health of a relative who was abusive toward me, I had to ask her to stop. It was too upsetting to hear his name, and I did not have any interest in “making peace” with him before he died, which is what my mom was hoping I would want to do when I heard how bad his health was getting. You have set boundaries regarding your relationship with her parents, and it’s ok to have those boundaries with her. You get to decide what your boundaries are, and the kind thing here would be for her to respect that. You can do so gently, and without minimizing how upsetting her father’s situation is to her, but I think taking care of your emotional health is equally important. If your mom needs emotional support to deal with this, you could encourage her to lean on her network or find a therapist to work with. You do not have to be that for her.

  22. Sloan Sabbith

    After having to be convinced to buy them and having no idea what I would wear them with, I’ve worn leopard print flats two days in a row. Thanks Hive! I love them.

  23. Cornellian

    Off topic question for New Yorkers:

    Does anyone know a good carpenter/cabinetmaker? I’d like to have a simple bookshelf built in to my apartment, and also see what my options are for redoing my master bedroom. I’ve found lots of custom furniture makers, but I think I’m looking for more of a built-in guy.

    Thanks!

  24. AnonforThis

    My cousin is significantly younger than me and the other cousins in the family. The rest of us are all within 2 or 3 years of each other, while he’s 15 years younger. He’s the only “kid” in the family that’s still in school, and I feel for him because I feel like he missed out on a lot of the hoopla we all had when we were kids celebrating birthdays and stuff together.

    He’s in college now, and I always try to send him little gifts and stuff to let him know I’m thinking of him. He’s a good kid, but quirky. He would much rather have a rousing discussion about Nixon or the original Shakespeare folios than drink and party. In my football loving family, he’s kind of the odd ball.

    I literally have no idea what to send him as gifts. I usually just send Amazon gift cards or iTunes cards, but I feel so impersonal…but he’s a college kid, so maybe gift cards and cash are best? What on earth would you get a very studious college guy?

    • Idea

      Have you checked out the catalog ThinkGeek? It’s online at the dot com.
      Also maybe career/life advice books or help or things like that?
      Subscriptions to magazines/newspapers?

      • lawsuited

        ThinkGeek is definitely more science-y, so may not be the best for him if he geeks out over politics and Shakespear. A magazine subscription is a totally awesome idea – it was one of those luxuries I could never afford as a student, but having something to read other than textbooks is great. Maybe The Walrus would be good?

        • rosie

          A more politic + Shakespeare version of ThinkGeek? Unemployed Philosophers Guild! Could find some very cute little gifts for someone with those interests.

    • Senior Attorney

      I’d say cash or gift card with a thoughtfully chosen card to make him laugh.

      • AnonforThis

        Nothing makes him laugh :( I don’t mean that in a snarky way, I mean in a genuinely I have never seen this kid laugh way.

        His Christmas list at 10 and 11 included physics textbooks.

      • Senior Attorney

        Well then a card to tickle his science nerd pleasure receptors. Something that shows you know him.

    • Shopping

      That’s sweet of you!
      I think my nephews liked the holiday-themed care packages I sent when they were in college. Some years I included an Advent calendar, but more successful was a box of homemade cookies with a couple tubes/tubs of frosting, window clings or other super-simple decorations, and a cheerful hat or scarf. (I’ve recently seen toboggans with Bluetooth speakers/earpieces that I would send if they were still there). Similar things could work for other holidays.
      Geeky gifts that play on specific interests could work too–a Star Wars French press or John Adams doll would also say “thinking of you”.
      You could go the low-clutter route and be sure to send him any articles you come across that are related to his interests, with a conversational/discussion-type question to chat about with him, or ask about his classes and then get into a specific topic he seems really interested in.

    • BabyAssociate

      If you do the gift card route, I wouldn’t do iTunes. I don’t the the youths use it anymore!

      If you’re at all crafty, make something for him that will be memorable. For graduation my mom made me a fabric tissue box that dispensed cash, it was amazing and so creative. I still have it.

        • BabyAssociate

          Guess what….I also heard the youths don’t use Facebook anymore either!!!

          • lawsuited

            The college-aged youths still use Facebook. The high school-aged youths have moved away from Facebook onto Twitter, Instagram and Snapchat. (Based on my college-age and high school-aged youths.)

      • Sloan Sabbith

        Apps, though! You can use iTunes cards to buy apps! And apparently, things within apps. One of my colleagues’ friends uses iTunes cards to buy things in….erm, world of warcraft? world of war? warcraft world?
        oh god.

        • Wildkitten

          I buy tv show seasons on iTunes. The youths probably stream them illegally.

      • Anonshmanon

        for more personalized gift cards, how about these: takeout chain that you know is near his house/dorm, thinkgeek, steam if he is a gamer, science/history museum

    • NOLA

      I think it totally depends on the guy and what he likes. My nephew is a freshman in college and struggling a bit to make friends and having a little bit of a tough first semester. I text him here and there to check in, so I knew he was having a rough time. I sent him a package this week with totally silly Halloween stuff from Target. Gummy boogers, Twix ghosts, Sweettarts in a ghost, Halloween socks, etc., plus a silly black cat card with $20 in it. He’s a fun and silly guy so it works for him. Yours may be tougher/more serious. This is a nephew I can send animal butt refrigerator magnets and “Number two” pencils and he loves it.

    • Miz Swizz

      Any time I ask my husband what he wants for birthday/Christmas/gift of any kind, his response is Amazon giftcard. His rationale is that he can get (almost) anything he wants at a great price. Where I see it as impersonal, he sees it as the best possible scenario because he can get exactly what he wants. I think you’re fine getting the Amazon cards.

    • Anon

      It’s ok that you don’t know or understand his interests. He may or may not be grateful now — but in time he will be grateful that a 35 yr old cousin cared to be involved in his life at age 20, when you likely have your own adult life now.

      Honestly if he likes things like science books — Amazon gift cards; he can buy whatever interests him. Also he’s still a college kid and must eat — even if he doesn’t party and drink; why not gift cards to casual restaurants on campus, even like Subway or Potbelly or Dunkin are a great change of pace if your day to day involves cafeteria food or cooking for yourself for the first time? Not sure what year his is in college but when he gets to the stage where he lines up internships/jobs after graduation — then you can get him a clothing store GC as most 22 yr old boys don’t have a ton of dress pants, button downs, blazers etc. and having to buy them suddenly dents their (or their parents’) budgets.

    • SC

      You’re probably overthinking this. All of the men and young men and boys I know have preferred gift cards and cash to pretty much everything else (at least from aunts, cousins, etc.). The only exception might be food, if you know what he likes. In fact, I doubt anyone would receive a “just because” gift card and think “Oh, man, she doesn’t know me at all.” They’d think, “Sweet.” In fact, my aunt included a Whole Foods gift card for me with some Christmas gifts for my son, and I thought, “Cool, yay! That’s nice of her!”

  25. REPOST: Risk management????

    I am repostng this from yesterday’s Suit of the Week post, as I didn´t get any replies:

    I am thinking on taking an ISO 31000 training by G31000. I don’t want to give much information not to out myself. I have been managing projects that are risk-related in the last few years, but I am no risk specialist. I want to open new doors in my career, so to speak, both because of the current downturn in my field and for personal reasons.

    Does anyone have experience working eith ISO 31000? I don’t really have specific questions, it’s more that I would like to know what kind of work you do, in which field you are and what certification/learning path you recommend.

    TIA!

    • Anonymous

      Are you looking to gain experience in a particular kind of risk – ex, business vs security?

      • REPOST: Risk management????

        I am expecting to be able to consult on Risk Management for companies that have physiscal assets, such as transmission lines, pipelines, tank farms, process facilities… but I don’t really know if ISO 31000 will be useful for that at all.

  26. Shopping

    Non-professional attire question:
    My kid got Chucks for the new school year, has already outgrown them and wants an identical pair, one size larger. Problem is that the backs of the heels are completely worn through. Not dragging feet is one fix, but idk if that’s realistic. I know that there are curved little pieces (of metal? hard plastic?) that can be affixed to the heels of dress shoes to stop this type of wear. Is there something similar for rubber soles? What are they called and where would I buy them?

    • Idea

      Chucks are OK and are cute and stuff, but also try taking your kid to one of those running shoe stores that watch you run and get you the right running shoe for your arch & the way you turn your foot when you walk/run. My kids running shoes (and he’s only 7! but plays every day at recess, etc.) were just pulverized. The running shoe store employee confirmed that it’s his high arches (like mine) so the kid’s feet turn to support himself, so the shoe was running through quite unevenly (and way too quickly on that one side). New running shoes with the right fit and support made all the difference in the longevity of the shoe.

    • Diana Barry

      Oh lord. Don’t. Just buy the bigger Chucks. You could tell him if he wears through the shoes before he outgrows them, he just has to keep on wearing them with the holes.

      • Shopping

        Well, sure, but as long as he’s getting newer ones to replace the one he’s outgrown, I might as well take a step to help him take care of them.
        Last year his feet barely grew at all. It didn’t take long to realize that white Sperrys were not a good choice for school shoes, but he wore them til June.
        Have I proven myself to be a decent enough parent now that you might offer some useful advice, perhaps even a response to the question I asked?

        • Diana Barry

          IME Chucks are pretty disposable, kind of like Keds and similar. I wouldn’t waste more $$ trying to keep them nice for longer. Idea’s idea is better, if you want them to last longer.

    • lawsuited

      Yeah, Converse are not really long-wearing shoes, so while a month is definitely fast, I wouldn’t expect a pair of Converse worn daily to last longer than 6 months or so? If it’s important to your son to wear Converse instead of regular trainers with better arch support, tread, etc. it’s probably a style choice and adding a device to the back of the shoe to protect it from wear will probably mess with the “cool” factor of the shoes. I think this is a scenario where you buy a pair of trainers and a pair of Converse, encourage him to alternate them, and if he wears out the Converse he can just wear the regular trainers.

      • Shopping.

        If he needs a second pair of shoes, we’ll get them when these wear out. It hasn’t been anywhere near six months. More like two. I don’t see how a little plate under the heel would impact the look as much as wearing “trainers” to school.

    • H

      I’m not sure what protective thingy you’re asking about, but if it doesn’t cost much, go for it. Another thing you could do is buy him multiple pairs so he can rotate them.

  27. Anonymous

    Question for the group – if you all miss the deadline to cancel a hotel on business travel, do you still expense the charge? I was on the trip in question and was able to stay at my first hotel instead of moving over, and I just forgot to call the second hotel in time. Charged for one night.

    My company is pretty liberal about this but I feel badly since this really was my fault.

    • Anonymous

      I would call the hotel company and ask them to refund it. Yes, you messed up, but depending on the chain they may do it as a courtesy. If it’s the same chain, they should definitely be able to help.

    • Senior Attorney

      Why don’t you ask whoever is in charge of approving your expenses?

    • October

      A similar situation happened on my team. The person expensed our company, but did not pass it on to the client (our company absorbed the cost). It’s one of those things that happens, and a night at a hotel is peanuts for most companies. Talk to your manager.

    • Beth

      Do it, worst case it gets rejected. I expense change fees for flights I miss…happens rarely but is s cost of doing biz.

    • Anon

      I made a mistake and booked a non-refundable hotel room for a hearing that got canceled. I checked with partner – told her I made a mistake and should I bill it anyway – she said bill it to the file but I will write it off. So the firm paid but obviously not the client.

    • SC

      I’d ask someone but would also be upfront about your mistake. To me, forgetting to cancel a reservation is different from missing a flight (unless you slept in or forgot your driver’s license or something), or even booking a nonrefundable room for a canceled hearing.

  28. Ugh

    My elderly grandparents and my mom (who is no spring chicken herself) are in Florida, inland of West Palm. My mom told me they are not in an area that typically floods but I’m still really worried about them. I wish my mom would have gone home before the storm (she is just visiting grandparents) but she wanted to keep an eye on them during it, which I understand but now I just have more family to worry about. Any stories or tips from people who have weathered (ha) similar storms appreciated.

    • MargaretO

      Hopefully your grandparents home has hurricane shutters and glass. If not they should decamp to a hotel that has those things, and wherever they are stock up on bottled water and some flashlights. But if they take those precautions they will be fine.

      • Ugh

        Thank you – yes, they live in a fairly new, small home with shutters, which they already put up. They have water and food and flashlights. In addition to worrying about the shutters holding up (no experience with how effective they are?) I’m also worried about the heat – they will likely lose A/C and it’s 90+ degrees out. But maybe it will cool down during the storm?

        • MargaretO

          It sounds like they will be safe during the immediate storm, I’m not sure about the temperature issue. I don’t have direct experience with a hurricane myself, just in the same situation as you – grandparent living really close to yours. If the power ends up being out for a long time hotels will get booked up fast, but in that case maybe your mother being there would be a good thing, since she could help drive them towards an area with power. It’s hard to tell ahead of time, but my grandparent and their neighbors have the shutters and hurricane windows and are staying in place.

        • anon

          Advise your mom to have a full tank of gas and cash on hand (we usually keep $1000 during hurricane season), in case they need to evacuate somewhere relatively far away, and gas stations/ATMs don’t have power. Hotels will fill up if the area is out of power for a long time. Orlando has the second-most hotel rooms in the country, plus a million time-share condos, so there will likely be (expensive) options there.

    • Shopping

      How far inland? Here in Tampa, hotels are getting guests escaping the storm. We should be fine here.
      Tips or stories…Stock up on grilling supplies and get meds/essential papers in order in case they do have to leave? Only hurricane I’ve been in was when I was 12. Tropical storms are still weird to me, because, unlike tornadoes, there isn’t a specific time that they hit, are intense, and then are done.
      You might want to set a group text/email or family phone tree so they aren’t tied up on the phone with relatives all day (and so people who are in harder-hot areas can get through)

    • Anonymous

      No tips, but I hope they (and everyone else safely in the hurricane’s path) are safe.

    • Commiseration

      I have family in Jacksonville that’s refusing to evacuate. They are young and think they are invincible. They have family a few hours north and inland offering them a free place to stay with their own bedroom and bathroom and their cat is welcome. They just think this will be an adventure and want to hunker down and weather it (no pun intended). They were just starting high school when Katrina happened so maybe they don’t remember how bad it can get.

      • anon

        I grew up in South Florida and now live in New Orleans. IMO, what happened after Katrina, particularly the extent of flooding, is unlikely to happen elsewhere in the country. I would evacuate only if I were in a mandatory evacuation zone.

        You can prevent a LOT of property damage by being home. During the last hurricane to hit New Orleans, my in-laws were out of town. I was able to clean out their refrigerator before they lost power. After the storm, they had a roof leak, and DH and I dried the drywall and carpet with towels and fans and placed (and emptied and replaced) buckets under the roof. At our house, during the storm DH and a neighbor were able to sandbag (with kitty litter and garbage bags) our second-story porch door to prevent rain blowing into the sideways and then leaking down to the first floor light sockets. At both houses, after the winds died down, but while it was raining, we helped clear the gutters to prevent flooding.

        If they are safe from wind and flooding, they will most likely be fine during the storm. And, if they are young, healthy, and prepared, they will most likely be fine without power and in the aftermath of the storm.

    • Anonymous

      Spare external battery packs for cell phones. And recognize cell phones may not work for a while if cell towers are out of commission.

    • mascot

      We are under mandatory evacuation orders and left first thing this morning (Ga Coast). It’s scary to think what is coming.
      They need to be prepared to be w/o power for several days. at least and will need food/water/light source. Fill the bathtubs with water (it’s clean water and you can always use it to flush toilets if needed), remove everything from the yard so it doesn’t become a missile, locate copies of all important documents, have extra medication (its probably too late for this) and have a plan for removing foods from the freezer/fridge so you can cook them if you lose power. Otherwise, leave them closed.

    • Anonymous

      Re mascot’s advice to fill the bathtub with water: Is it obsessive for me to think “great idea for flushing the toilet, but also a potential drowning hazard if anyone is wobbly on his or her feet.” I write as someone whose parent was recently hospitalized overnight after a fall (thankfully, injury-free and no serious underlying condition found).

      TL,DR: Be _obsessively careful_ to confirm that whoever walks INTO the bathroom also walks OUT of the bathroom. Hover, ask “are you OK?” or do whatever it takes even if someone is peeing at 3 a.m. And be sure there’s a way to open and unlock all bathroom doors from OUTSIDE the bathroom.

  29. nan

    I need help styling this skirt (link below). I’m a little self-conscious about my stomach, so I’m not really convinced that a tucked in blouse works for me.

  30. AZCPA

    Does anyone have suggestions for flats similar to what Clarks makes? I am generally business casual (on the casual end) and wear flats most days. I want something at least somewhat cute, but durability and comfort are higher on the priority list. I walk between 4-6 miles on an average day, so I need flats with a good amount of structure and support. Unfortunately, Clarks just don’t fit my wide at the ball flat feet. Because I walk so much and wear out my shoes, <$100 is highly preferred.

  31. Anonymous

    Half vent/half question. My dog is driving me crazy. My husband and I are getting a divorce. We adopted a dog together a couple years ago, and he wants nothing to do with her. So its me alone with the dog. She has reacted badly to my soon to be ex’s moving out. He left 2 weeks ago, and the dog keeps having accidents on the floor. I’m talking every day. I literally will take her outside, and she’ll pee on the floor 20 min. later. I get she is feeling confused, so that’s probably a factor. However, I’m having a hard enough time taking care of MYSELF. I now have to run home at lunch to let her out and clean up the mess. I feel like a terrible person, but I almost want to give her back to the shelter. Almost..but then I’d miss her, too. Any tips? I’m at a loss. She is housebroken, just emotional. Should I ask my vet about doggie Prozac? I read that’s a thing.

    • Shopping

      Have you asked a dog trainer? Maybe local kennels would have ideas on calming stressed out pups. If nothing else, hire a dog walker!

    • Anonymous

      Ask your vet; hire a trainer; get a lunchtime dog walker. This is a short term problem. You’ll get through it.

    • rosie

      I think talking to the vet and maybe sorry term meds for the transition would be a good idea. What about a dog walker so you’re not shouldering do much of the responsibility right now?

    • Coach Laura

      Sorry to hear about yours and your pet’s trouble.

      +1 to talking to the vet. We’ve put our senior dog with anxiety on xanax and yes there is prozac or valium for dogs too.

      If the dog is anxious you can try melatonin after dinner – it really helps with anxiety and has no side effects so you could try that before going to the vet. Google can give you the correct dosage by pet weight – my 18 pound dog gets 1 milligram.

      When you take her out (and then she pees when she comes in), does she pee outside? If she doesn’t pee outside, then you might try “crate training”. Basically, if she doesn’t pee outside, put her in the kennel for a short period and then take her out and try again until it works. This is a short term training – usually works quickly as she relearns to pee inside.

      If she is peeing outside and then peeing inside right after, that’s trickier and needs a vet’s help. Or behaviorist.

    • Terry

      Be kind to yourself. This is a huge adjustment for you and for the dog – the downside is that you’re the one who has to help you both through this period. Our dog had significant behavior problems while adjusting after a move. (For example, our 60 lb dog started jumping up on kitchen counters and our dining room table.) I ended up meeting with a trainer, which was helpful, but time solved most of the problems.

      Can you keep in her in the kitchen (or some non-carpeted area) while you’re away?

      • Terry

        And… have you considered some distraction? We freeze a banana in a classic Kong and it keeps our dog busy for ~25 minutes. It might give her less time to worry.

    • Anonymous

      Is your dog in a crate? I would probably crate the dog while away from the house (in the short term).

    • JTX

      Take your dog to the vet to rule out any medical issues. It is entirely possible the dog has a UTI or other medical problem that just happened to coincide with your STBXH moving out.

      • Anon in NYC

        Yes, that’s a good point. One of the signs that my dog has a UTI is she has accidents in the house, even after having just been outside.

      • Wildkitten

        And the vet can help with doggy xanax or doggy proxac or adaptil or a thundershirt or whatever else you can use to get both of you through this stressful situation.

  32. Ellevest?

    Has anyone tried it? Seems really neat but I have reservations about trying something new rather than a Vanguard or Betterment.

    • sfbae

      I guess I don’t understand why there needs to be special investing for women from a quick glance at their website. I’ve tried betterment and wealthfront but have just returned to my trusty vanguard- lowest fees around, easy to manage with target date funds, done.

  33. assistant

    Two questions about whether I should bring this up to my new-to-me assistant:

    1. My office has lunch meetings several times a month. My assistant is in charge of lunch orders. I have an allergy that sometimes means I need a separate meal. (I’ve offered to bring my own and was shot down; several other people have food preferences that are routinely accommodated, so my allergy gets accommodated too). Apparently assistant will order separate food for me even if I’m not invited to/don’t know about a meeting. She will then put the food, labeled with my name, in the office fridge without telling me about it. The first time this happened, I never noticed that the food was in there. Eventually the leftovers went bad, the fridge smelled, and everyone blamed me because the smelly stuff had my name on it. I asked assistant to please tell me before she puts anything in the fridge with my name on it, but I still periodically find things with my name that I know I didn’t put in there. Fwiw, assistant does all clean-up too – it’s not like someone else could be putting the leftovers in the fridge.

    2. Assistant seems incapable of exercising any judgment when it comes to deciding whether to staple or paper clip documents. I’ll ask her to print off a set of documents for my reference and she will paper clip every document, even if it’s a stack of 30 2-page documents. I’ll ask her to print off a document to be used as an exhibit (that she knows she will have to scan) and she will staple it and then complain about having to take the staple out. I cannot discern any rhyme or reason as to why some things get stapled and others don’t. I think the answer is probably that I have to specify whether the documents should be stapled or paper clipped every time I ask her to print something, but I’m wondering if there’s a way I can get around this (due to my own forgetfulness).

    • Anonymous

      1. She’s accommodating your allergy, yes? Just check the fridge from time to time and chuck things.

      2. No. You have to tell her. She isn’t a mind reader.

      • Senior Attorney

        +1

        Seems like the answer to both of these is for you to pay a little more attention.

      • OP

        Points taken. With respect to (1), do you think it reflects poorly on me that there’s a lunch with my name on it at a meeting that I’m not invited to? I don’t want to seem like I’m ordering a lunch for myself in connection with, for example, a partner’s only meeting. Maybe I’m overthinking this.

        • Senior Attorney

          I don’t know why you can’t tell her to check and make sure you’re actually invited to the meeting before she orders you a lunch. That should be a no-brainer.

        • Anonymous

          Tell her you’ll let her know if you’re at a lunch meeting so she can accommodate you. If she doesn’t hear from you, she shouldn’t order you lunch.

    • lawsuited

      1. Check the fridge on days you’re not attending the meeting and eat your complimentary (allergen-free) lunch!

      2. Tell your assistant to staple or use a paperclip for documents where that distinction matter to you. If there is some clear rule (e.g. only exhibits need to be paperclipped, everything else can be stapled) then you can explain that to her and remind her a few times until she gets the hang of it, but if not, you just need to tell her each time.

      • OP

        For (1), sometimes I don’t even know that there was a meeting – that’s how it happened last time. I know to check the fridge if I was signed up for a meeting but couldn’t attend for whatever reason, but I don’t check the fridge when I have no reason to know that a meeting was even happening. I think I’m just going to have to dig through the fridge every week to make sure there’s nothing with my name on it, as suggested above.

        For (2), thanks, there are clear rules like you said, but I wasn’t sure if that was too petty to raise. I don’t want to seem overbearing or mean.

    • AttiredAttorney

      When emailing a work request to my (amazing assistant), I usually say “Please print 20 copies of this document, double-sided, in color. Please staple.” If that’s too much, why not get one of those cover sheets that print shops have that has all the check boxes for how you might want a document prepared (paper size, hole punch, binding, doublesided, etc) and use that for print requests?

  34. Senior Attorney

    Marriage report, 26 days in: So far, so good. I left my cell phone at home today (first week back from honeymoon, work week systems not super well in place). Noticed it while driving to work but didn’t have time to go back for it. Imagine my surprise and delight about half an hour into my work day, when my assistant announced “you have a visitor!” and Lovely Husband (whose office is a few blocks away) appeared in my office doorway, cell phone in hand, saying “I knew you’d be higgledy-piggledy all day without it!”

    It makes me so happy that there are such men in the world, and to be married to one is almost more than I can bear…

  35. Winter

    Shout out to those who helped me frame my thoughts yesterday re how to talk with my assistant about so-called private appointments. Posted on yesterdays thread, but repeating here:

    Thanks for the ideas!! At the end of the day, we had a very brief conversation yesterday focused mainly on fixing what ever is going on in outlook that makes it look like I have things scheduled. I also mentioned that ‘private’ things really should stay private.

    The whole thing bothered me a lot, but the advice to not overreact was well taken. Nothing to be gained from creating drama.

    • Meredith Grey

      & thank you for re-posting the follow up! I love hearing how these advice threads end!

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