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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
I love a flared trouser, and this blue color is divine. When Victoria Beckham started her fashion line, I was a little dubious, but over the years, I’ve found a lot of pieces to love. (How gorgeous is this coat, for example?) These pants would look beautiful with a white blazer or a tucked-in printed blouse. I always find that when you wear a pant with a wider bottom, it helps to keep your top relatively slim-fitting to balance out the proportions.
The pants are $370 and available in UK sizes 4–14. Victoria Woven Flared Pants
Express and Liverpool have more affordable alternatives for $56.73 and $71.20, respectively — and Express offers short, regular, and long lengths. Liverpool also offers a plus-size option for $78.40.
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Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com.
Sales of note for 10.10.24
- Nordstrom – Extra 25% off clearance (through 10/14); there's a lot from reader favorites like Boss, FARM Rio, Marc Fisher LTD, AGL, and more. Plus: free 2-day shipping, and cardmembers earn 6x points per dollar (3X the points on beauty).
- Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale (ends 10/12)
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything plus extra 25% off your $125+ purchase
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide
- J.Crew Factory – 50% off entire site, plus extra 25% off orders $150+
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Sale on sale, up to 85% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 50% off 2+ markdowns
- Target – Circle week, deals on 1000s of items
- White House Black Market – Buy one, get one – 50% off full price styles
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Relocation Process Tips
My husband and I will be relocating a couple states away in the near future – what are your best tips / secrets / lessons learned about the relocation process? Thanks in advance!
Pep
Start reading/following the local newspapers and TV channels to get up to speed with local issues.
Ribena
Join some sort of organisation/ local volunteer project to make friends that aren’t people you work with!
Airplane.
Hire professionals to do your packing, not just professional movers.
Anon
Counterpoint, that would have been very expensive for my move a few years ago and we managed to get all our thing across the whole country (in a POD) with nothing breaking after packing carefully ourselves.
Airplane.
Fair. I just always 1) think it’s worth it when using the money v time calculation OR 2) employer has paid for it.
Anon
Yesss. We finally did this when we moved for my husband’s last job relocation and it made the move soooo much less stressful. I think the cost was pretty trivial too, maybe a couple hundred bucks at most. But we were living in a 1 bedroom apartment at the time, so not a ton to pack.
Anon
1) Sort through items now so you don’t move things you don’t want to keep and drop them off at a local charity.
2) Professional packers and unpackers. Military spouse here, and having professional packers is life-saving. It takes us normal people forever to pack up a kitchen, but movers who do it all day can do it in a jiffy. I personally also love unpackers. The hardest part of moving for me is the other side where you’re tripping over 9 million boxes and wads of paper and wondering where the heck X is. Unpackers just unbox everything and set it on the counter/floor and take the all the papers and boxes with them. Sure, your dishes and books are everywhere, but you can SEE everything AND you’re not tripping over extra boxes and paper. It makes the house feel so much calmer and helps the unpacking go quickly – you see everything that needs a home and you put it away.
3) Hanging boxes for your clothes. They’re expensive, but they make life SO much easier. And if your closet is compulsively organized like mine (sleeve length, color, fabric), tell the movers (or yourself :) ) to put items on the box rod the same way they hang on the closet rod – makes it quicker putting your new closet in order.
Cat
Counterpoint on the hanging boxes — we moved ourselves a few years ago, and to achieve the same thing for less money, we used large trash bags for hanging clothes. Pick the kind with ties so you can tie all the hangers together with them. Then lay the clothes flat in a large box. For bonus points, use masking tape or a sharpie to # the bags in order – easy hang-up! We didn’t waste the bags, either, and 3 years later are STILL finding an occasional labeled bag in the “bag of bags” trash bag supply.
Anon
I’ve liked the hanging boxes as well, but they’re ideal if you can find them on Craigslist/Nextdoor. That’s what I did and it saved money and was more environmentally friendly (which felt nice after SO much paper/box/plastic waste in the rest of the move…).
SSJD
Start cleaning out closets, medicine cabinets, old storage, files, etc. now while you have time. It takes a lot of time to get rid of all the stuff you don’t want to move. Don’t leave it for the last minute. Donate/sell what you can instead of throwing things away as you run out of time.
If you are moving to a high cost of living area, think about what you can do now that will be much more expensive in the new city: have your car detailed, recover dining room chairs, get your hair colored and cut.
In addition, even if you are moving to a lower cost city, there are things that take time and energy to find such as new dentists, doctors, jewelers. Before you move, get up to date on medical visits and tests (e.g. mammogram), repair items sitting around your house (e.g. jewelry or furniture).
Start to collect free used boxes and packing paper from people in your neighborhood so that you can save on moving costs.
Good luck!
anonshmanon
I usually start packing ridiculously early. You can pack seasonal decorations now, and rarely used items, while decluttering what you no longer need. 2 or 3 months out is when I usually start packing 1-3 boxes a week.
Also start using up items from pantry and freezer.
EM84
Just going through (another) international relocation myself, here are my learnings & tips, some of them may have been covered by other posters:
* find someone who lives in your destination location and get all their knowledge and tips on where to live, which schools are best (if relevant), where are key traffic jam points – should make your life easier when choosing new apartment/house
* I have a rule of not buying new or more furniture in the first few months, so that I can get a feeling of the apartment first and only then consider buying more stuff (bc I already have too much already)
* start reading online blogs, newspapers, TV from your new destination country to get a sense of what is happening, what are their national holidays, cultural events, restaurants etc.
* start sorting and decluttering now. Don’t leave it for the last moment before moving out or – even worse – for when you will be unpacking. If you do it now, you will have less stuff to move and pay for, less stuff to unpack and you won’t have to dread not only packing, but also unpacking. Regarding decluttering – I do focus on one room every Saturday. I go through all shelves, drawers, countertops and ask myself: if I were moving to a 1/2 smaller apartment, would I want to keep this? This helps me make quick decisions – trash, recycle, donate, keep.
* hire professional movers and pay for packing and unpacking. I didn’t pay for unpacking during my first move and I did during the second move and it was a day v. night difference. The second time, the unpacking was done in 2hrs (!), the movers had good tips on where to put what, unpacked everything carefully and even took empty boxes out. I could fully dedicate to relaxing and discovering my new city instead of spending 4 weekends with unpacking.
* Hire professional cleaners.
* Cancel your subscription ahead of time, to not pay double services in old and new location.
* Depending on your hobbies, you may want to reach out to some interest groups in advance and sign up for first few classes or sessions (e.g. I already have a few yoga classes booked so that I don’t have excuses to why I am not going)
* tell people (at work, at classes, at volunteer group) that you are new in town and kindly suggest coffee or drinks Even though you might not click with them, they may be able to put you in touch with other people.
* plan some “educational “ trips in your new city or nearby cities – I always try to learn more about new country and do as much sightseeing as I can. It helps to understand the culture and people mindset.
Anon
The suggestions on packing early are right on. You probably have far more to get rid of than you think, and it’s so much nicer to not pack and then unpack a lot of crud.
If you are involved in any organisations in your area that have chapters or affiliates in your new area, get on those mailing lists now. It’s nice to be able to stop in to an event or get to know people before you move or right as you are there. If you go to church, look for a church that is larger and has a lot going on, even if it’s not as close to your house.
Question on Newark Liberty airport
Ladies – hope you can help me with this. I will be flying to Newark Liberty airport reaching around 11pm, and my outbound flight is the next day. I am planning to stay at one of the hotels close by the airport and was told that I need to take the shuttle from P4, and that I should go there via Air Train.
1. Is it possible to just walk to P4 from the airplane gate?
2. Where do I buy the Air Train ticket? Do I even need to buy a ticket if I just go to P4?
3. Assume there is no issue with general safety etc at that hour as it is an airport
Any other info you can share on Newark Liberty airport is most appreciated.
Thanks
Anonymous
it’s possible to walk to P4 but incredibly stupid. Take the air train. There are signs everywhere you don’t need a ticket. The airport is perfectly safe.
Anonymous
The air train to P4 is free – it is just the monorail connecting the terminals and parking. You can walk to P4 from the gate, although I wouldn’t if I was flying alone at 11 pm as it is outside and it goes through some not very populated areas that aren’t well lit. The main terminal (C) at Newark is ok, but Terminal A is incredibly outdated and overwhelmed (as in, they have upscale porta-potties in the hallways). If you are flying out of A the next day, I would recommend going to the bathroom and getting anything you need before you go through security.
Cat
The Airtrain is free within the airport and parking facilities. It’s taking it all the way to the train station that requires a ticket (unless you are connecting to Amtrak as it’s built into your Amtrak ticket). I’m not sure if you can just walk to P4 but it would most certainly not be an appealing walk. The Airtrain is super easy.
We’ve landed at EWR around 10 and taken the Airtrain to the train station. Other than being generally in a stupor from jet lag, no issues.
Cat
Here’s a map – https://www.nyctourist.com/travel_newark.htm
Anonymous
Thanks, all. I didn’t realise P4 was outside and will not walk. Appreciate the replies.
Dasha
I always liked the elegant and austere style of Victoria Beckham brand, but having acquired three pieces of her clothing in the last year, I have to say that I am disappointed with the quality and execution. There is inevitably something off in the fit, or the fabric, that leaves something to be more desired. At least at that price range.
Ellen
This is because they are relying on her stardom (her husband is a big football star in the UK, and she is a SPICE Girl), so they can get away with selling cheaper merchadise for high pricesf — I don’t know what the big deal is — after all you don’t wear the tags on the outside–and surely won’t now. I do think you can dress provocatively w/o the fancy lable, and when you do, you will find men anxius to please you. So I say to go with the flow and with any luck, you will find a man, with or without being interested in fancy labeling. YAY!!!
Anonymous
Looking for shopping help – So, I see a lot (slash I am targeted on instragram all the time) for clothing rental subscriptions, and I love this idea. I was searching this weekend for one that would allow me to rent clothes for an upcoming beach vacation at the end of April with my husband, infant, and another family with their 2 year old. I don’t need anything fancy, and the other twist is that I am in the process of trying to lose a significant amount of weight, and I have put myself on a clothes buying ban until I reach a mid-way goal. I also don’t live in a beachy climate, and the beach vacation is not a typical vacation destination for us, so I don’t need the casual beach wear clothes except for this one week of vacation. So there’s no need for me to invest in these clothes either. I also don’t have time between now and the vacation to scour second hand stores for these items.
Is anyone aware of a rental company that rents clothes for an in between size that are also not super fancy clothes? Rent the runway didn’t have any of the basics that I am looking for. I honestly am just looking to rent like shorts and t shirts, a casual sundress or two, maybe a jumpsuit. When I think about it, these are often lower-priced clothes so I am not sure if it would make sense for a company to even offer the types of clothes I’m thinking of in a rental program. My typical stores are Boden (basics) and Anthropolgie (more interesting unique pieces) for clothes and gap or the brand Daily Ritual for lounge clothes. But if anyone knows whether this rental clothing site I’m imagining exists, I figured it would be this group. TIA!
Angela
Gwynnie Bee has casual items, but you can only get 3 at a time, so not sure if that’s quite what you’re looking for. Le Tote may be another option, I think you can get up to 5 things at a time.
NY CPA
I have a 5 item subscription to Gwynnie Bee, and like it. I used to have RTR Unlimited and the clothes were way too fancy for my every day needs (business casual office).
Anonymous
I did Le Tote briefly a couple of years ago. Honestly, I hated it. The clothes looked shop-worn to me (and obviously, they were, they were worn by others before me and then laundered) and many weren’t my style when they arrived (even if I’d picked them out by the photos – I mean, I return probably 1/3 to a 1/2 of what I order online, so that’s not shocking). I still like Rent the Runway for formal dresses, though.
Housecounsel
Le Tote was terrible. I signed up because I saw all this Free People. But the Free People was almost never available and instead they sent cheap dresses and tops you’d find on the clearance rack at Marshall’s.
Anonymous
cosign this.
Angela
I agree, the quality of Le Tote was shockingly bad. I figured they would at least not include any ripped items in my FIRST box in order to give a good impression. Not so.
pugsnbourbon
A couple ideas:
– could you do a clothing swap with friends?
– would it make sense to get some pieces on sale from Target? As far as quality goes, I’ve been pleasantly surprised – my shorts from Target are going strong three seasons later. When you lose more weight, the stuff will likely be still in decent shape and you can donate it.
Anne
This sounds like Old Navy/Target/Swap.com time to me, not a rental.
Housecounsel
Old Navy dresses are on huge sale and they’re perfect for vacation. I think they’d cost you less than renting.
Vicky Austin
I had one pair of Old Navy jean shorts that lasted me four whole summers of camp counseling (not a lot of time to do laundry!) and beyond. I think I finally let them go a few months ago. The cost per wear was pennies at that point. I think you can absolutely buy a pair for your beach vacation and hang on to them for summer and future beach trips.
anon
Yeah, Old Navy would be great for this.
Anonymous
Agree – watch the sales – you can definitely get enough stuff for under$100. Pick tops you can repurpose as work tops.
BeenThatGuy
I have a Nuuly subscription for my casual wear and RTR for my work wear. Take a look at Nuuly; it’s mostly Anthropologie and the like. With them, you get 6 pieces at a time for the month.
RR
Agreed re: Nuuly being a good option for this.
anon
I haven’t used it yet, but I am thinking about signing up for infinitely Loft. It is only 3 items per box, so not sure if that would help your scenario for the beach vacation. I agree with the poster who referenced Target. It may actually be a better deal to just buy a few versatile pieces. I’m from florida originally and for a beach vacation i normally just have a swimsuit, a pair of shorts, a maxi dress that doubles as a cover up, and whatever casual shirts i wear anyway.
anon
Ann Taylor and Banana Republic both have a rental product. Maybe try there?
Ribena
Sports ladies! How were your weekend training sessions? I ran 15km (just over 9 miles) yesterday, my penultimate long training run for my half marathon on the 15th and I now finally sort-of believe I can do it! Hopefully the weather will be better and it won’t be called off due to COVID-19.
(I also finally got round to putting up a fundraising page – it’s linked on my social media and so far has reached a grand total of £5, which will totally end global poverty, haha).
Cb
I can’t believe you ran in that weather. I went to yoga and was nearly blown off my feet.
Ribena
The worst bit was along the coast road with the suspicious smelling crosswind. Even the best upbeat pop couldn’t distract me from that!
pugsnbourbon
Nice job on the run!
We finally had warm-ish temps here in the Midwest (false spring? real spring? who knows) and I was feeling good enough to lift in my garage again. I’m sore today but happy to be back at it.
Airplane.
Not a runner but I got in 3 solid weight lifting sessions at the gym this weekend. 1 on Saturday and managed a 2-a-day on Sunday. Weather is turning here and I still am in disbelief that the clocks spring forward this weekend when we totally didn’t get any snow this winter. I didn’t break out boots or salt and there not even one pretty snowfall.
hi hi hi
Congrats! I was burdened with expiring credits at OTF (expire tomorrow) so I had to do an OTF class on Saturday and Sunday AND my usual 60 minute spinning classes on Saturday and Sunday. Needless to say, on Sunday when my spin instructor called time, I was like “thank god that’s over!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
Anon
I ran six miles, which is what counts for a long run for me right now (23 weeks pregnant and have had some complications that have made workouts hard). And I did some prenatal yoga. It’s tough bc I spectated the Marathon Olympic Trials Saturday and feel super inspired to train for a race right now but all I’m training for is labor, ha.
Anon
If this helps, think of it as training for a race next spring: the more you keep running (within normal bounds) now, the easier your recovery will be and the sooner you’ll be able to start running again.
Anon
Yeah, everyone had told me you really don’t lose as much fitness as you think you will bc your body is already working harder to grow the baby. I hope it’s true!
Anon
I’m completely impressed that you “only” ran six miles because of pregnancy complications. I’ve never run six miles in my whole life and when I was pregnant it was all I could do to walk around the block. You’re doing great.
The Only GenXer in the Office
Training for labor is no joke. One of the women in my Orangetheory classes ran up until the week before she gave birth (and was in class up until the day before) and she swore working out made labor easier. It’s an investment for yourself! You’re amazing!
anon
The week was kinda busy, so I didn’t exercise much during, which made my three mile run harder than usual. But the important thing is that I did it!
Ribena
You still lapped everyone on the couch! I barely ran for a month or so between Jan and Feb and the first three miler back in was terrible.
Anonymous
I’m 11w pregnant and haven’t been able to run in a month, but went out for my 5 mile trail race I had signed up for a while back, and was able to not just finish but run almost the whole way. Was really pleased as I had planned to hike it.
The Only GenXer in the Office
I don’t think I could do a trail run and I’m not pregnant – you are awesome!
anon
I ran 7 miles after a week of not working out at all, thanks to a cold/sinus infection that kicked my tail. It was hard, it wasn’t fun, and my knees were killing me by the end, which hasn’t been a problem at all up until this point. I probably should’ve eased into it, but I didn’t want to get behind on my long runs.
Anonymous
Nice! I am recovering from a cold, so I ran after my small children (doesn’t help with the cold) and spectated the US Olympic Trials Marathon via Twitter and people’s Instagram stories. Otherwise, would’ve gone for a longish run of 1-1.5 hours. Not currently training for anything, but there might be a half and a marathon on the cards this year.
Anon
I’m 5 weeks postpartum and managed a 2.5 mile run. I did five half marathons last spring, so I’m obviously still recovering, but it felt good to get back into it.
Ribena
That’s huge! You grew a human! And you’re still running! Superstar!
The Only GenXer in the Office
You are a beast!!!
Anon
Thank you both. :)
Oh! Did anyone see that two women who ran in the the Olympic Trials are pregnant, and a third is a month postpartum? They are beyond amazing.
The Only GenXer in the Office
I had a productive weekend – Orangetheory and barre on Saturday, and a walk at the beach and a 90-minute Orangetheory class on Sunday. I just finished a half marathon two weeks ago (my 10th!) and will be running another in May (then one in August, one in October, and one in November). I’m also training for a four-day backpacking trip in July so have been hitting the inclines hard. It’s going to be a very active year!
Cara Dune
I was taking care of my flu-ravaged family all weekend and didn’t get to work out, but I am looking forward to my very first Muay Thai class this evening.
NOLA
I went to the gym every day it was open last week (closed Sunday-Tuesday) and got in workouts this weekend despite a crazy busy schedule. I needed it after last week!
Seafinch
I am feeling very proud of myself.
Over the weekend I got my regular workout in (arms), did a short run crammed between family obligations, and did a hot yoga class.
Just finished an eight week beginner programme on the Sweat App, and started day 1 of Level 1 yesterday. I have done 5-6 workouts (plus a few extra) every single week and haven’t missed a single scheduled workout, despite: my husband being deployed, him coming home, two vacations, me returning to work after a year long mat leave (into a high intensity and understaffed litigation unit), a lot of tiring days doing military training (gas hut and weapons) to get my expired credentials up to date, and the regular four kids stuff. I have my annual PT test scheduled for 20 March. Yikes!
Anonymous
Can I wear a light grey wool coat to a funeral? It’s my only dressy winter choice, otherwise I tend to wear a Barbour or something puffy.
Anonymous
Yes
Anon
Definitely.
Anon
It’s also ok to wear something puffy in a muted color.
LaurenB
Even if it’s not a muted color – it’s a coat. If you live someplace cold enough that a puffy coat is necessary – people in those areas don’t nitpick the specific coat.
Anonymous
Sure! I don’t think people are going to be nitpicking your choice of outerwear, as long as it’s not excessively inappropriate. Reasonable people understand that coats are expensive, each person only has so many outerwear choices, and not everyone is going to have a coat that’s perfect for the occasion but that most people are trying their best to work with what they have.
Cold weather camping newbie -- f/u
Thanks to those who have been helping me on my camping journey. Overnight lows were in the 20s, but it was great. The worst thing was the overnight need to go to the bathroom (but staying hydrated is not unimportant); honestly, I have never wished for a larger bladder so hard before.
Helpful:
Sleeping bag *2 plus sock bag thingie; keeping headlamp in boots to keep it from getting lost
Need to work on:
What to put underneath bag to keep cold from coming up from ground (that bag will not slide away from as you sleep); have seen people repurposing yoga mats for this; over-bringing of things not needed
Grateful for:
Kind and helpful strangers; not having rain (would take cold over rain any day)
This group will graduate to backpacking. I understand that in bear country people may forgo deodorant and brushing of teeth for days. I live in the mountain SEUS, so damp or humid most of the year and bless my heart but I can skip teethbrushing if I can at least floss but I fear me sans deodorant.
Anonymous
You can wear deodorant and brush your teeth backpacking in the SEUS.
anon
Pretty much every backpacker I’ve ever known uses a Thermarest (or comparable) under their sleeping bag.
I’ve also never met a backpacker who doesn’t bring a toothbrush. Some trim the handle shorter to save on weight, but they all brush.
AnonInfinity
I’ve brushed my teeth and worn deodorant while backpacking in the SEUS. However, one thing I will say is that you get VERY stinky if you’re going for several days, and so I wouldn’t have noticed if anyone was/wasn’t wearing deodorant after the first, like, half day. For me, brushing teeth is much more essential! Glad you are having so much fun!
Anonymous
I am not a backpacker by any means, but I find that in the SEUS I would be ripe in a bad way after doing any sort of exercise and not getting to shower off (which I guess is not an option). So if I hike somewhere during the day, I usually have a car ride back to get a shower, but can’t imagine continuing on. Maybe over a F-SUN weekend it wouldn’t be awful, but in some weather I would anticipate riding home with the windows down or having a stash of wipes in the car (or even going to a truck stop).
AnonInfinity
I do bring some wipes with me on the hike to freshen up as much as possible, but if you’re going to be backpacking and camping at primitive sites for a couple of days, you have to just kind of embrace it! I like to bring a change of clothes to leave in the car so I can get out of my dirty sweaty clothes and shoes for the drive home. And that first shower after is so marvelous.
Anon
No, you should not stop brushing your teeth! Oral hygiene is very important while backpacking (like everywhere). I place my toiletries in my bear canister while backpacking and try to avoid products with extreme scents, but that’s it. You can also brush without paste if you want to reduce weight.
Anonymous
I camp routinely in bear country. I use unscented deodorant and other products but definitely do not forgo tooth brushing. You need to keep your toothpaste and other toiletries in your bear canister, and don’t spit toothpaste near your tent. If you are in the SEUS, the black bears here are lazy and timid compared with the black bears out west. You still need to practice proper food storage, and I do know people whose backpacks have been ransacked, but I always laugh when the rangers tell me to lock my food up in the car.
Get an insulated sleeping pad. A yoga mat is a terrible idea, especially for backpacking.
You don’t need to be a martyr. Making smart investments in the proper clothing and equipment will vastly increase your comfort and enjoyment without breaking the bank. I got all of my gear from the clearance section at REI and it’s great. And if you really hate the outdoors that much, let the outdoorsy parents chaperone the camping trips and volunteer with the troop in another capacity.
Anonymous
OP here. I love the outdoors! I’m just new at staying overnight in tents. Every time I go it is in a different season so my knowledge from the prior trip isnt helpful.
Anon
Merino wool is great for backpacking because it doesn’t get smelly.. or as smelly anyway.
Anonymous
Can you tell anything about a salary band in a job description out of context? I’ve never worked with a place with one and am wondering if there’s a way to get a hint based on the number and letter or if it’s unique per company.
Anon
My employer (state government) has pay bands although they aren’t posted in job descriptions. New hires typically get an offer in the second quadrant (25th-50th percentile). It’s very hard to get above the midpoint, unless you’re exceptionally qualified and in demand, but they don’t like to offer the minimum either. As far as current employees, we get COL raises automatically if we’re below the midpoint. If you’re above the midpoint your boss has to justify why you need a raise.
Anonymous
Thanks. I think I wasn’t clear, I meant the job description says “salary band: 2D” and I’m wondering whether I can suss out if 2D is high or low in terms of dollars that the band implies.
But what you’re saying is very helpful context too.
Anonymous
No
Anon
Oh I see, sorry. My employer lists the pay bands on our website, so it’s publicly available what 2D is in dollars. But if it’s not available online, I’m not sure how to find out. I don’t think there’s any consistency about what letters and numbers mean, except for the GS, which is used by the entire federal government.
Airplane.
No. If you’re already working with the employer’s recruiter, ask what the salary band is.
Airplane.
These pants need to be styled with different shoes. Strappy sandal heels with flared trouders? So dated.
Anon
Nah. If it’s warm out, what shoes do you expect them to wear with it?
Airplane.
I can’t imagine a temperature that is so warm you need to wear sandals but not warm enough that you’d wear a dress or anything other than long, full-length trousers. But you do you.
pugsnbourbon
I’m not so sure – strappy heeled sandals are “in” with all sorts of pants, according to the targeted ads/”articles” I’m seeing. I’ll be sitting this trend out myself.
Anonymous
That’s frustrating because, as a 43 year old, I’d look like I hadn’t gone shopping in 15 years if I sported this look – but I love full-length trousers.
Eliza
Agreed. It’s the first thing that caught my eye.
Anon
i really do not know who to vote for tomorrow in the primary. I live in TX. Who do we think is really the most likely to be able to win in November? Though to be honest, I am kind of pessimistic that any of them can pull it off
SF chic
Go with your gut.
Then look at your child/niece/friend’s child, and think… is that also best for them?
And then help drive people to the polls, since your state closed like ?1/3 of its polling stations.
Anonymous
I also wonder if any of them can win; I feel like the safe bet candidates are trying to fight enthusiasm with compromise, and I’m not convinced that’s a winning strategy. And then any candidate who isn’t a safe bet is just a gamble.
And then the prospect of a “contested convention” that’s been being discussed makes me feel like it may not matter who I vote for anyway!
Anonymous
Biden; vote for your preferred candidate.
Anon
Biden. I know polls show that Biden and Bernie are both beating Trump by similar margins, but you have to remember that the GOP wants Bernie to be the nominee and hasn’t targeted him negatively yet at all (in fact, Trump is practically campaigning for him) while Biden has been the subject of GOP anger for decades, and they’ve spent the last year smearing him with all the Ukraine stuff. I don’t think Biden is the most inspiring candidate and I don’t love the idea of another old white male president (although that seems inevitable at this point since Bernie and Bloomberg are also both old white men), but I don’t think anything is going to come out about Biden in the general election that will change anyone’s mind, because he has such a long history in national politics and everyone knows who he is, for better or for worse. Whereas a lot of people like Bernie’s personality but don’t know as much about him, and when the GOP starts running ads with video clips of Bernie praising Castro and other Communist dictators, a lot of center, center left and center right people who aren’t Trump fans are going to sour on Bernie and stay home, and that will cost us the presidential election as well as possibly the House.
Also, despite Bernie’s reputation as a guy who inspires huge turnout, the first four primary states suggest that Biden is actually better at getting out the vote (SC which went for Biden had much bigger relative turnout than NH which went for Bernie; I’m excluding the caucuses because that’s a different process). A lot of people at Bernie rallies are high school and college students. High school students mostly can’t vote and college students can but don’t, and that’s unlikely to change dramatically this year. Something to keep in mind when you see images of his huge rallies.
I hope Biden picks Kamala Harris as Veep – I think that would be a really unbeatable ticket.
Anon
+1 to all of this and it echoes what I feel living in the SEUS and a red-leaning purple state.
PNW
Thank you for articulating this. I’m so overwhelmed I feel like all I can do is wave my arms around and say “ugh”. You gave me a few better talking points :)
Anon
Vote for your preferred candidate, but Bernie wins in a Trump match-up in almost all polls.
Anonymous
YMMV with polls — remember that people were not just surprised but shocked to find out that Trump had won the election. I do not see what the pollsters are seeing and suspect that many people who are Trump voters (vs active Trump supporters) are under-represented and that the Bernie supporters (vs actual election day voters) are over-represented. And this is based on my sense that people who are undecided or non-primary voters are either busy at work or refuse to answer calls from unknown numbers because they are completely irritating (I got rid of my land line for this reason).
Anon
+1 if 2016 taught us anything it’s that polls are unreliable
Anonymous
Polls in electoral college states that matter?
Angela
+1. So sick of hearing about “national” polls — too bad the national vote has no bearing on who becomes president!!
Anon
I work with a lot of 18-22 year olds and you would be surprised how many people I know who attend rallies and wear t-shirts for their chosen candidates and are all over social media with their support, but don’t actually….vote. I don’t want to be all “gosh, kids these days” but I just don’t see Bernie’s enthusiasm among young people translating to actual voter turnout. I think it’s smarter to pick the candidate who appeals to likely voters, ie., older people.
Anon
I’ve been on team Biden since he declared his candidacy. While personally, I’m a bit to the left of some of his positions, he’s a generally decent human being, has solid foreign policy chops and is a proven consensus builder. I also think he will appoint really solid, skilled and diverse candidates to important positions in the Cabinet and elsewhere.
Anon
Honestly, I’m sort of disgusted that our options have once again come down to a bunch of elderly white men. I think that’s a terrible way to offer a contrast to Trump. There were a lot of candidates I could have gotten excited about, but they’re now all out of the race or being written off. Most of the head to head data shows very little difference between candidates so I’m not sure it matters that much. At least Bernie offers a different and more optimistic vision, though I’m not a fan of electing yet another cranky old man.
Anonymous
Probably Biden. He’s not my favorite, but it is who the party will coalesce around and who can attract crossovers.
On another note, I hope you will vote Amanda for Texas in the Senate race!
Anon
Biden. We need the electoral college in the midwest, and a socialist – democratic or otherwise – isn’t going to win them.
And OMG, just picture the attack ads on Bernie. They literally write themselves! Republicans will have a FIELD DAY with Bernie’s long, long history of Scary Unamerican Things. (Never mind of course that dude in the WH currently has plenty of authoritarian tendencies – this GOP is reeeeally good at calling the kettle black.)
Think about all the nice, middle of the road people you know. The ones who greatly dislike Trump’s behavior, but would have serious questions about voting for a socialist. Those are the people who will vote for Biden. We’ve got to keep our eyes on the prize here: ousting Trump.
Anon
+1 to all this. He was not my first choice (that was Mayor Pete) but I’m Ridin’ with Biden now.
Ellen
I am very sad about Mayor Pete. I wish I can find a straight version of him, b/c he was smart and articulate and only 38 years old! FOOEY!
Anonymous
+1
Anon
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/02/opinion/joe-biden-bernie-sanders.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share
RR
I think it’s a Biden/Sanders race at this point, which makes my vote for Biden.
Anonymous
I was coming on to post a similar dilemma, although I’m in VA. Warren is my preference, but I’m torn between voting with my heart and picking the best person to beat Trump who is not Sanders, whom I despise, which makes me lean Biden. Gah.
anon
Would have loved to vote for Warren, but I’m voting for Biden in Texas. This race is too important.
Anonymous
I’m voting Warren in Massachusetts tomorrow (though Pete was my first choice). She is smart and qualified and not one of the three old white dudes who have somehow outlasted the rest. I’d hate to see her lose her own state to Bernie, though I fear that may happen.
Anonymous
Vote Biden, so you won’t be throwing your vote away. I am not enthusiastic about him, but I am enthusiastic about putting forward a candidate with broad enough support to win the nomination.
Anon
Biden. I preferred both Klobuchar and Warren, but neither of them has a realistic path to the nomination at this point, and I don’t want Bernie to win. I really doubt he could beat Trump in my blue-ish purple Midwest state.
Anon
Biden. I don’t feel like Sanders can win and if he does, I don’t think he has a track record that suggests he’ll actually get anything done.
Anon
This board definitely skews Biden – probably because it has a higher percentage of high-income individuals than the general population. Go with the candidate that excites you, but there’s something to be said for going for either Biden or Bernie if you want a candidate that is showing real strength.
Anon
You don’t have to be super wealthy to be affected by Bernie’s proposed tax increases. I make $50k and I support Biden in part because Bernie hasn’t promised not to raise my taxes. The only response I’ve heard from Bernie supporters is that the tax raise will be good for me because then I’ll get free healthcare, which I find insulting since I currently get free health insurance through my employer. Not everyone in America hates their healthcare plan, and while Medicare 4 All and higher taxes might be better for *most* people it’s definitely not better for all, including me and a few others I know in my situation.
anon
But if you get fired tomorrow…..
And your friend/kid/cousin/parents etc.. who likely do not have your amazing luck.
Anon
I want there to be a public option as well as subsidies and an expansion of Medicaid for those who can’t afford to pay health insurance premiums. There are obviously poor people who need help paying premiums and nobody should be one medical emergency away from bankruptcy, but that doesn’t require forcing everyone off their private insurance and onto a government plan. Obamacare was a phenomenal step forward that drastically improved the lives of myself and many others by making preventative care free, not letting insurance companies deny you coverage for pre-existing conditions, removing lifetime limits and letting children stay on their parents’ insurance longer. We can take more steps in that direction without burning down our entire system and starting anew. Most of my friends and family feel the same way. I’m in the Midwest in a swing(ish) state, fwiw.
Anon
+1. I’m also around $50k HHI (and am one of the Biden supporters above).
I am fully in favor of some form of public option for healthcare, as that’s the big question mark for when I’ll be able to retire. I don’t feel that Bernie’s approach is the best one, or even possible to implement. Incremental progress is how progress will be made on this front.
Lastly, there’s good reason why the GOP has been taking it easy on Bernie Sanders. It’s so they can annihilate him in the general if he becomes the nominee.
Anon
I liked this op-ed from the NYT:
The empirical evidence shows that there is no need for alarm about Mr. Sanders being the Democratic nominee, and even some cause for confidence. If you want to engage in theoretical thought experiments, a useful exercise would be to ask how many people who voted for Hillary Clinton in 2016 would switch their votes to back Mr. Trump just because Mr. Sanders was the nominee? Common sense suggests that the answer is infinitesimally small. If that is the case, then Mr. Sanders would win the popular vote. As for the roughly 78,000 votes in three states that flipped the Electoral College, the particular strengths that Mr. Sanders brings to the contest strongly suggest that he could close that gap and make the leap into the Oval Office.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/28/opinion/bernie-sanders-polls.html
Anonymous
Honestly, I think the NYT may be undervaluing that number. For instance, my MIL – a union teacher and staunch dem – has openly said she will not vote Bernie. She’s a big Warren supporter and will rally behind Biden, but I think would probably stay home on election day if it’s Bernie.
Anon
Why on Earth would she be a Warren supporter who turns her back on Bernie? Warren’s proposals are basically identical…
Anon
Because there’s more to a candidate than policies? Warren is to the left of me on most if not all issues, but in my opinion she’s brilliant, hard-working, accomplished, empathetic and would be a terrific president. She’s exactly the kind of person I’d like my daughter to look up to, and I believe that’s an important part of being commander in chief. Bernie is an angry, sexist narcissist who just yells at people and hasn’t gotten anything done in his entire life because he doesn’t understand that cooperation with people who don’t see exactly eye-to-eye with you is necessary. Personality-wise, I don’t really find him any different than Trump, although I agree his political agenda is less harmful than Trump’s. I don’t believe either Trump or Bernie are role models for our children and would have a hard time voting for him for this reason.
Also their policies aren’t identical. Warren is much stronger than Bernie on gun control and has been a more active voice in talking about universal childcare, which is something that’s important to me.
Anon
I can certainly see not liking certain aspects of Bernie’s personality, but for this election, the comparison group is Trump. Do you honestly believe that Bernie getting angry at wealth inequality is the same as Trump getting angry at refugees from “sh*thole countries” and calling women dogs? That’s the part I’m having a LOT of trouble wrapping my head around – I can totally see why you could critique certain things about Bernie, but can you explain why you think his personality is “not any different” than Trump? I’d really like to understand why people are saying this because right now, it’s as if you told me that the sky is pink and up is down.
anonshmanon
+1. I expect Warren to endorse Sanders when she drops out.
Anon
i really wish Biden had just run 4 years ago so we could’ve avoided the hot mess of the past 4 years. do we think there will be any issues for Biden on the family front with the Hunter and Hallie Biden relationship, break up and Hunter’s new marriage
Anonymous
I think there is plenty of fodder among the Trump family for a strong retort.
Anon
It’s old news, everyone knows Hunter is a mess.
Jeffiner
As a fellow Texan, I’m more concerned with the down ballot races. The chances of a Dem getting Texas’ Electoral College votes is, while not impossible, very unlikely. It is possible to flip the Texas state House (who gets to draw the next set of Congressional districts), but its the top of the ticket that draws voters out. Bernie claims he can inspire people to turn out, especially young people that we need, but he has a lot of baggage for older voters. Can Biden inspire enough younger voters? Would either candidate place emphasis on voting the whole ballot?
FWIW, I voted for Warren, because I think she’s more effective, listens better, and has less baggage than Bernie, and she’s more in touch than Biden. They all 3 may be similar in ages, but she seems healthier than either Bernie or Biden. Also with Castro as her VP, Texas turnout would be high.
Anonymous
“Polls are unreliable”… except when they benefit Biden, apparently. Honestly, I don’t know how anyone can think of what is in the best interest of their children (or nieces, nephews, students, friends’ children, etc) and vote for anyone but Bernie. Warren too, but she no longer has a path to the nomination. I will be voting with my heart, and I believe in M4A, the green new deal, and universal pre-k. I believe in a grassroots campaign and removing big corporate donors from politics. I will vote for Biden if he’s the nominee but he represents a lot of what I see as are the problems with the establishment. I hope you’ll consider voting for Bernie, OP.
Anonymous
The answer is we don’t believe Bernie can do any of the things he’s promising. And Bernie’s campaign staff has acknowledged that publicly.
Anonymous
BTW I appreciate your non-snarky reply. There has been a lot of unnecessary aggression on this board lately when talking about each other’s preferred candidates.
Anon
Biden for me as well. I do worry about Bernie’s electability, but honestly I worry more about what a Sanders presidency and the aftermath would look like. Not his actual policies – I know he won’t get Medicare for All implemented and I’d be ok with it even if he did – but about his divisiveness. Joe Biden will try to reach out and be a president for all people, even those who didn’t vote for him, and I believe he’ll help our country start to heal from this horrible mess. Bernie has no interest in reaching out to anyone but his most ardent supporters, or making any kind of compromises to help us move forward. This is the man who wanted to primary Obama in 2012 because Obama wasn’t making progress fast enough. Instead of recognizing the problem was a Republican congress and putting in the work and pounding the pavement for Democratic House and Senate candidates, he blamed the one member of his party who was actually doing the most work to try to move forward. Bernie has a god complex and his “I alone can fix it” mentality (very Trumpian btw) is very troubling to me. I think it’s the polar opposite of what our country needs right now and honestly, I think the backlash to Bernie’s election (if it happens) will be so big that we’ll end up with someone far worse than Trump in 2024.
anon
+1
I’d be on board with Warren, too, mainly because she’s so damn smart — but I expect her to drop out at some point.
Anon
Something that I think no one has mentioned is that Bernie has said he won’t take Bloomberg’s promised money if he becomes the nominee. Everyone else, including Elizabeth Warren, has said they’d accept the money. Bernie is cutting off his nose (and the noses of a lot of other – much more vulnerable – people) to spite his face. I’m all for grassroots fundraising, but I think this election is too important to turn down that kind of funding opportunity, and the Democrats will need a lot of $$$ to successfully take on Trump.
Anonymously
Vote for the person who most speaks to you. Bernie for me due to healthcare, criminal justice reform and upping the minimum wage. I already voted in California and I am on pins and needles waiting for the result in Texas tomorrow!
Anon Lawyer
Has anyone ever worked with a career coach? Was it helpful? I’ve been in the same place for quite a while and I could use someone to talk through what might make sense for me strategically but also for my life in general. I don’t feel like I need help with my resume and cover letter so much as I need help with big picture and emotional stuff. Like a career therapist . . .
If this is a thing how do you find someone who will be good?
Anon
Yes and that’s exactly where I was at – my coach helped me explore what I did not like about my job, figure out strategies to get my bosses to work with me, and when they were ultimately unsuccessful, validates that I had done my best, couldn’t fix the things I didn’t like, and it was time to move on. It was very useful to get an outsider’s perspective. I have taken some of the coping skills that I developed (like a gratitude practice) into a new job that is an overall better fit for me, and they are helping me make this new job a great one for me.
Anon Lawyer
Thanks! This is exactly what I want.
Anon
How do you find a good career coach?
oil in houston
I used one and she’s great, Debbie Leoni, she’s written a few books so you can check her out
Anon
Try Liz St Jean – based in Canada but does a lot of remote work (and focuses on women’s leadership). Or post tomorrow with your city and people may have good suggestions. Barriers to entry to become a coach are low and quality varies greatly so you’ll want a personal suggestion
Anonnz
Yes, I used a career/life coach and was pleased with the experience. When I found myself between contracts, at an inflection point in a serious relationship, and suddenly needing to move apartments (and how to proceed wasn’t obvious in these 3 areas), I figured it was time to call in professional help. To find one, I googled career coaches in my geographic area; read their websites and online reviews; and called a couple. Asked about fees, how to book sessions, etc. She helped me question my assumptions and lay out a whole series of possible paths forward. One recommendation she shared (among a series of other exercises and resources) was the book Designing Your Life: How to Build a Well-Lived, Joyful Life by Burnett and Evans. Definitely recommend!
Anon
Bay Area ladies, have your employers issued guidance or clarified working policies re: coronavirus? Now that two counties have emergency declarations, we have active transmission, and some of the largest companies are canceling all travel, etc, I’m looking for guidance from my employer and we haven’t gotten any messages at all. My employer never sent any emails during the thick of our brutal wildfire season either, but I feel like it would be very helpful to know what to expect from the corporate side.
hi hi hi
We’ve been getting a lot of client requests for advice on what they can and cannot do. It’s possible the advice is coming this week. That being said, most client alerts I’ve seen from various law firms are basically summarizing the CDC guidance:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/specific-groups/guidance-business-response.html
Anonymous
Why would they? You go to work as normal unless and until health officials order otherwise.
Anon
That’s a very reactive approach rather than a proactive one. A lot of employers in the Bay Area are opting for the latter, but sounds like OP’s isn’t among them. I think we’re likely to see more action this week because there are more cases circulating in the region now.
Anokha
I’m in the Bay Area and my employer sent out an email saying there was a company wide ban on all non-essential travel, both domestic and International.
Anon
National company, same here.
Anon
this is not a direct answer to your question, but i work for a university (not in CA) and we received an email over the weekend that a research scientist might have been exposed to someone with cornoavirus and as a result 17 students/faculty/staff have been asked to self quarantine. DH left today for a conference in southern CA and over the weekend he received an email telling him it is now a no handshaking, no hugging conference.
Anonymous
Not on point, but I wish every conference was no handshaking, no hugging…
Anon
I think we should all do this: https://nypost.com/2020/03/02/wuhan-shake-greeting-goes-viral-amid-coronavirus-outbreak/
anon
My large employer has a task force that sends daily updates (they were also very organized with the power shutdowns last fall). So far, they’ve cancelled travel to China, Italy etc. and encouraged people to reconsider any other travel. Otherwise it’s mostly referring to CDC instructions on hand washing, self-isolating/quarantining if you feel sick or have potentially been exposed to somebody sick. A lot of our staff can reasonably work from home and most departments are already very accommodating on this topic.
One of the updates last week contained a reminder that it’s uncivil and illogical to treat our Chinese and Asian-American coworkers any different when they haven’t returned from traveling lately. It’s sad that they found this reminder necessary, but am glad they took this seriously enough to address in the all-staff update.
AAM had a letter last week (one of the morning posts with 5 letters), where a manager laid out what they do for their team in communicating and accommodating this situation. There was a lot of input and ideas as well in the comments.
CountC
Mostly the same at my large employer, which has several sites in CA. We don’t get daily updates, but we are getting updates from our segment/function leaders (e.g., GC) and we have an internal page with FAQs, etc. Our employer is already very accomodating of working from home except for positions where it’s not possible. Of course, the people who can’t work from home (manufacturing plants) are also the ones who often don’t get paid if they don’t go to work, which makes me very mad on their behalf.
My travel for the month was taken off the board due to the non-essential travel restriction. Fine by me because it was going to be a hellacious two weeks of travel and I can just as easily conduct the training virtually.
Anonymous
I’m supposed to travel to the Bay Area in 2 weeks for work. Should I consider cancelling? My understanding is the county emergency was to accept federal funds, not because there’s actually an active emergency.
Anon
That’s for SF (the funding part), but Alameda County in the East Bay has declared a public health emergency that I believe is in response to the cases there more than for funding purposes. I would check with your employer.
anonshmanon
There is one healthcare worker resident of Alameda County, that was likely exposed to the case in Davis, and is under quarantine. Despite that, the emergency declaration is about accessing emergency funding.
anon
I live in Santa Clara County and would not encourage loved ones to come in a few weeks. My guess is that we have more community transmission than has been announced because it’s really hard to get the test.
That said, we’re going about normal life pretty much as usual.
anon
Had an ambitious, more junior resource newly hired that does not report to me but may collaborate with my team asking for my time on a weekly basis (1 hour calls, reach outs). I took the initial calls and then asked to cancel the calls each week thinking they would get the message. This went on for several months and got worse. This morning, I kindly advised that these calls do not work for my busy calendar and you can count on me to reach out directly to you when there is a specific item we need to collaborate on. Received another follow up note asking if they could be involved in everything. So my direct message does not seem to be getting through. Any suggestions? This is a nice person with good intentions asking for more attention/involvement than is normally afforded and planned.
Anonymous
You haven’t given a direct message at all.
anon
OP here…then I need to be much more direct. Thank you for this.
Anon
You have to nip this in the bud. The new person is probably trying to assume he/she is your peer when they are not. I’ve had this situation before with someone who was actually trying to move into my role and it took me way too long to figure it out because I assumed good intentions and all of that.
No matter what the reason, you don’t have time for this. Stick to your guns. I would ignore the “involve me in everything” and reiterate that you will contact them if/when you need them.
anon
OP here…thank you for this. You are correct that person thinks they are my peer. I will reiterate that I will contact then if/when I need them to support a specific activity.
Cat
Is the new person the peer of your reports? And the new person’s manager your peer? Is it possible that the new person’s manager has encouraged him or her to try to be more involved and open lines of communication between your respective teams? This behavior seems so obtuse that I feel like part of the explanation for it must be missing.
anon
Yes, this new person is on a separate team that supports my team but only at a certain stage of our strategic engagements. It definitely is possible that the new person’s management has encouraged them to get very involved etc.; however, I also think the person believes they are my peer and they simply don’t understand the organization/hierarchy etc. Person is over their skis in general. Just checked in with a peer of mine and he is doing exact same thing – ” I will let you know if/when we need you to support an activity.” I was trying to be nice and now learning that I need to be very direct and set clear boundaries.
Cat
Ah, ok. OP, I mean this kindly, but your posts contain a lot of “corporate speak” – resource, collaborate, support an activity… an easy habit to pick up but I suggest explaining it in less consultant-y terms so it isn’t lost. “We’ll include you on an as-needed basis when we get to Y stage. I’m glad you’re eager to get involved in our company, but asking for meetings is premature. We wait to bring a project to your group’s attention until after we’ve checked that it meets our group’s initial criteria. So everyone can make the best use of their time, please hold off until we suggest a meeting.”
anon
OP here…thank you Cat! That is very helpful feedback! I have edited to reflect our scenario:
“I will let you know if/when we need your support. I’m glad you’re eager to get involved in our pursuits, but we will bring you in when the opportunity fully meets our criteria and we have identified specific activities that we need you to support. This enables all of us to make the best use of everyone’s time.”
How is that? Look forward to your feedback….
Anon
*This. I had no idea what you were talking about except you have an annoying coworker. Also, referring to a human being as a “resource” is gross… is that actually a thing in some industries?
anon
OP here…I am going to add “You will definitely have a role when we transition the overall engagement to your team”.
Anon
That still isn’t direct enough IMO. I would add “please hold off on any emails or meeting invites until I contact you” or similar.
Cat
I like that better. You know your own office culture on whether it would go over badly to be stronger with the “your meeting invitations are premature” language.
Two last thoughts on the motivation before you say anything stronger-
1. if you’ve asked about the specific reason for all the outreach or desire to be “involved.” Like does the other group have a suggestion on adding to your screening criteria and that is why the sudden desire to get in on the project earlier…. but it is just being communicated spectacularly poorly as general involvement?
2. have you and your other peer checked in with new person’s manager? “Hey we’re getting a lot of requests for meetings from Jane. This is different from our usual routine, so before reminding her of when your group generally gets involved, is there something driving this that we aren’t understanding?”
anon
I wonder if they are trying to get a better idea of what’s coming down the pipeline so they can plan accordingly? Is it possible that the current practice of waiting to reach out until you need this group ends up having the effect of, from their perspective, work getting dumped on them urgently with little notice when it would be possible to keep them looped in and allow them to plan their own workflow better? No idea what you do obviously so disregard if N/A, but this struck me as a possibility.
Anonymous
1. He or she is a person, not a resource. 2. Is your team not communicating well in areas that affect this person’s job? In my experience, the standing meeting invites tend to happen when there is a hole occurring somewhere along the line. Is it possible this person doesn’t have a good sense of when your team will be handing off projects or enough detail on your team’s part of the project that will influence how others subsequently approach? If you’re too busy to sync up, it could be that you or your team also are brushing off day-to-day communications that have created the desire for the standing meeting to begin with. I’d look at process and see if there are opportunities to build in better transparency on progress. Are you sharing project schedules not just with those executing but also those stakeholders who are influenced by the outcomes or have their decisions either directly or indirectly affected by your team’s work? Are status notes easily stored and shared? Instead of being irritated about having your schedule disrupted and focusing on limitations in the individual’s seniority or status in relation to you, I’d try to take the emotion out of it and look at the project itself. The more you can put in project status supports and milestones for when you will/won’t need involvement of others, the better it will be for anyone working tangential to you and your team to provide the resources you need when you need them.
Anon
Wasn’t this exact question asked on Ask-a-Manager this AM?
anon
Hmmmm I didn’t see it on there…do you have a link?
Anonymous
I’ve noticed a couple of younger women in my firm wearing short suit pants — like coming to the lower calf, at least a couple of inches above the ankle. In a formal-ish fabric, with a suit jacket. Is this the trend? It looks like they had a growth spurt overnight to me.
Anon
That’s not a short suit and I feel like you’re going to give the wrong impression because of course short suits are not appropriate for office. What you’re talking about are wide leg ankle pants – essentially gauchos in suiting fabric. I don’t like them, and more than likely the women you see wearing them are too tall for the length. They can be business casual office appropriate if they come to the ankle or just slightly above. But tbh, they’re so hard to pull off I’d stay away from this trend and not encourage the younger women to wear them either.
Anonymous
Yup. On trend. Have you not seen any J.crew or Banana adds in like the last 3 years?
Anonymous
Cropped pants have been around for so many years now that I’m not sure I’d call them a trend. They’re more like the norm and are verging on modern / current / classic. That could be why you’re seeing them show up as part of a suit. (Do you work in a very conservative region or industry? It may simply have taken several years for the trend to show up in your region or industry.)
Now, longer pants are actually trending again on the front edge of trends, simply because all pants styles have been cropped for so many years.
Anon
Are they tall? If you’re 5’9″ ankle pants will ride higher on the leg than they do if you’re 5’4″. And I think that with “ankle” pants people are less likely to get them precisely hemmed than if they were full length pants, so they are longer or shorter depending on the wearer, vs. everyone having them individually hemmed for a specific look.
Anon
You know that you don’t have to wear them if you don’t want to, right? You sound quite judgmental here.
anon
What would you do?
I’ve been miserable at my job for ~18 months. Our legal department is woefully understaffed. It’s tight when one of us goes on vacation or is sick. I’m underpaid but the hours are pretty 9-5 for me, which was fine enough for the first few years because biglaw was brutal for me.
A year ago, someone left our department just as we were hiring someone new. Me and let’s call him Joe were the only ‘legacy’ ones in the department. Training the new person was really draining for me because we don’t have any org charts so it’s stupidly mostly based on institutional memory. (Not a smart setup!!!)
Since I took on more work, I asked for a raise and was told that salary would just increase a little each year, no matter what my responsibilities/title was. I took that as a clear signal that there was no future here and have applied for other jobs in the last year. I feel pretty ready to leave law but it has taken a lot of time for me to adjust to the thought. Financially, I do not need to work anymore. (I wrote here about this last year and got some great advice, thank you!) We have been struggling with trying for a family so in the next few months, if I’m not pregnant we are going to start with treatment options. I guess it seems to me that I don’t need to work so if I’m going to, it may as well be something that I enjoy and am excited about doing and not something that stresses me out. So I had a loose plan in my mind to wait until my bonus hit (this week) and decide if I’m going to pull the trigger on leaving or not with the idea of closing out the quarter and training whomever on some of those tasks that are due quarterly.
I just this morning learned that the only other person senior to me (Joe) has announced he is leaving by the end of the month. I was about 90% of the way there to committing to leaving after closing out the quarter and thought I had some time to figure that out. But now given that our department is so understaffed, his work will have to be assigned and taught within the next couple of weeks before he leaves. I do not like the areas he does and it would be a lot more work and stress and I don’t think I’d be paid well enough. If I’m going to leave, I think the best practice would be to say something quickly so that his time training is not wasted on me. (Note that our boss is so removed from the day-to-day he wouldn’t know how to train.) Even though I know it’s not *my fault* that the department is so understaffed. On the other hand, I could be Assistant GC and learn some new areas making me more marketable and try to negotiate more money (not sure how well that will go given last time I got $0). I’m just not sure I care for those areas of the law — or that I even want to still be a lawyer. I also wonder if I burn a bridge more if I take on more responsibility and then walk away in less than 6 months. I’m chiefly concerned that it’s not worth the stress, especially at a time I hope to be pregnant or pursuing treatment options. I have no idea if my boss intends to hire more people — as we’ve been saying for years — but as discussed, that is a lot of training time for those folks. Also — maternity leave is not paid and while that’s a short period in time, in terms of childcare, I would be primary parent doing any pickups, etc. (my husband travels a lot for work and has a less predictable schedule and is paid well for his time). Help me please!
Anon
You take care of YOU. This company has shown over and over again that they don’t value their legal department – by not hiring enough staff and by not giving raises to the ones they do have. When it boils down, this is as simple as, “I stuck with Company for as long as I could, but they refused to hire enough people to handle the company’s needs and I was doing the work of three [four, whatever] people by the end for the pay of one.”
Ellen
Yes, it sounds like your inhouse job bites the big one. Go have the baby and then you can return to another job after the baby is old enough for day care, if you want. Otherwise, just retire from the practice, like I want to if I ever find a guy to impregnate and marry me. You at least are married so you just need TTY. Good luck to you and F*** those bosses for not paying you what you are worth.
Anon
So you’ll be doing the work of three people, with no promise in additional pay (or even title), no paid maternity leave, you don’t have to work for a living – why are you staying there?! There is no upside, at all. The company is shooting themselves in the foot.
Wait until the bonus is in your bank account, for non-bridge building sake, give four weeks notice (if they want you to leave sooner that is on them), and in the remainder of your time, try to create written work as a sort of “training for the next person” because at the salaries they are offering, it will take them a while to hire your replacement.
Anon
*bridge burning
Anonny
I am also in a woefully understaffed legal department with a below-market salary and 9-5 hours. I recently went on maternity leave (12 weeks to the day, one week paid), and when I came back, it was like I never existed. The new guy I spent months training is now the department’s golden child (he is…young) and I am just an afterthought. My advice to you would be to use this time prior to starting a family to either find a new job that you enjoy, or lean waaaay out and collect a salary until you are ready to leave. I know it’s hard to step off the career track and then step back on later, but careers are long and stress is a real thing. Good luck to you OP!
anon
Thanks and good luck to you, too. Boy do I know what you mean. I think there is a little smidge of me thinking, why should the junior that I trained a year ago be the heir apparent bc I leave (and Joe does, too)? And then I think, it’s not my problem and if he’s smart, he will leave too like the rest of us. Thanks so much for the advice, everyone. I think typing it out was a helpful exercise — even if it was a novel! — and appreciate the gut reactions of people.
Anon
I agree with comment above that you take care of you. I’ve tried to stick it out with a non-growing/shrinking group and by the time I decided to take care of ME, I was the last standing and incurred unfair chagrin from my boss who wasn’t appreciative of the fact that I stayed until then but upset that I was finally leaving. People have to move on, and they do so all the time. Keep your plans to yourself and give them a two-week notice. They’ll probably be bitter about it but I guarantee there’s nothing you can do to make bitter people less bitter.
Anonymous
So you’re going to quit and be a housewife. Stslysrsly that’s the plan? No. Obviously don’t do this.
anon
Well, that wasn’t quite the plan. I am someone who likes doing things so while I am burnt out and need a break, it won’t be long before I want to do something again. And unfortunately, having done this before, it’s going to be a slog for 4-6 months with the new transition (training new people, taking on new responsibilities) and I’m already burnt out! So the question is – do I leave now or try to stick it out before I leave – for whatever reason. As I said, there isn’t a future at this company, which I’ve known for a while, so I’m not staying long-term. I was asking about this position/company and expressed more broadly that I wasn’t sure I wanted to be a lawyer anymore, which I think is important in validating the titles. (In other words, if, however, I needed to find something right away as a lawyer, getting the Assistant GC position would be necessary.) I want to do something new and feel pretty lucky that I have the opportunity to pursue and try new things and not be stuck in this position at this company if I don’t like it. That being said, thanks for your input; I know others will see it that way, so helpful to be reminded.
Advice
Looking for career advice on a potential transition. I am a government lawyer (litigation). I am mid-30s and have been practicing for 9 years. I have two preschool children and do not want to stay home but might like to have a little more flexibility (pick them up from school, maybe, that sort of thing). I love my job: the subject matter, the people I work with, the ability to usually leave work at work (unless we are in trial, 3 or 4 times a year), the ability to usually go home at 5. I really believe in what we do, too. I work with a lot of women my age who are truly my friends.
As I approach the 10 year mark, I feel pressure building to look for something else. I worry that after a decade here, this job is no longer a value-add to move into something else, and instead it becomes a career-long path to stay with government (which might be fine, but I feel like I want to do more, accomplish something new, I don’t know exactly).
Recently I have been talking with a friend about his law practice. He’s a family friend who is in his 60s and has his own practice alone, and he is looking towards retirement and thinking about winding down. He is looking for a younger lawyer to bring in, work together for a few years, and ultimately hand off/sell his practice.
His current practice is very different from my experience in litigation– he is real estate, transactions, corporation setup, wills and trusts, etc. He has no litigation but says he would take those cases if he had a litigator join him. If I made a transition like this, my goal would be to eventually bring in a partner to handle the transactional side. I am meeting with him next week, very preliminary, to visit about both of our goals and to ask questions.
What questions should I be asking?
What advantages would a move like this have over my current government setup?
Is it realistic to view this as a way to “hang a shingle” without having to fund the startup/overhead costs?
I would really love any input on how to handle our meeting and what I should be considering. Thank you!
Anon
Make sure your dissatisfaction isn’t just boredom that could maybe be solved by something more pedestrian – a new hobby or a vacation. The grass is rarely greener.
As an independent, you wouldn’t have healthcare or a pension. Those are HUGE things to just toss aside. You’d be going from a cause you believe in to run of the mill transactional work.
Anon
Personally, I think it’s a mistake leave a job you love just because you’ve been there for 10 years. If you’d always dreamed of hanging out a shingle, my advice would be different, but your post suggests that you’re just looking to move on because you’ve been in your current job a while and that seems really silly to me. Also, if the guy is planning to retire, you will soon have overhead costs and have to deal with all the business aspects of running a law firm. I think you’re underestimating how much work that will be, even if you inherit a lot of business from him.
Anonymous
100% this. Plus, I would generally be wary of how much business a guy in his 60s is actually going to leave you. Experience (repeated experience) tells me that is simply not true. They may not retire, and even if they do, their clients may not stay with you.
Anon
I would be very specific about how he is going to start getting litigation work – how many times has he been asked to and turned down litigation matters? What happens if he doesn’t have a full-time litigation docket for you? It does not seem realistic to completely create a new practice area overnight, so if you do this, you’d need to be okay with being a transactional lawyer at least part-time.
Anon
+1 to this. I made a transition from all ligation to a mix of transaction and litigation (not entirely by choice – we moved to a small town where there wasn’t enough litigation to support a full-time practice, except in divorce law and criminal law, which I didn’t want to do) and it was hoooooooorible. I hated it so much I actually ended up moving into a JD-preferred in-house job. I know there are some people who like any kind of law, but I think a lot of litigators would hate transactional law, and probably vice versa.
Anon
My experience is that people don’t leave their practice gracefully. They hang on, let you do the grunt work, and cash the checks. They also don’t invest in succession planning or let you cultivate a relationship. (Meanwhile other lawyers/firms from the outside are able to do that.) So by the time they do retire, the clients don’t know, don’t have a real relationship with you, and take their business elsewhere.
I know this is cynical but I feel like every one of my colleagues who banked on this is struggling a lot.
anon
I would be wary of this. I agree with anon above that people don’t leave their practice gracefully and retiring lawyers vastly overvalue their practice. If he plans to “sell” his book to you, you better get a good idea of what he’s asking because in reality these books aren’t worth much.
Angela
If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
Not a Newbie
Tips for styling a basic black skirt and jacket suit to not look like a newbie?
I’m a senior associate, and on my way to a client meeting last week, I got asked by the receptionist if I was at the firm for an interview.
I was wearing my favorite classic Banana Republic black seasonless wool suiting pieces. And a white blouse. Black and charcoal are really the best neutrals for me, so I don’t want to forego that (plus I’m Asian, in an Asian country, where black is fairly standard workwear).
I do think it may have been the white blouse that created the newbie-ish impression, but it’s (naturally) not the image I want to project. But I’m at a bit of a loss what to wear under the matching suit pieces. Cowlneck merino wool sweaters look nice on me but I feel too casual in them. Differently colored silk blouses? Blouses with more details? Scarves? Please help me project a bit more sophisticated vibe, rather than a recent college grad looking for a job? FWIW, I’m 5-8 so not short, 33, and generally don’t read as young or childish (and have never gotten any comments or feedback to that effect).
Anon
Why are you considering changing your entire style because of one comment from one receptionist that wasn’t even implying that you are “a newbie?” If anything, she confirmed that your clothes are business professional. Let it go and move on with your life.
Anonymous
I think it’s the white blouse that does it. I love black suits and think they are classic for a reason. I would style with a brighter color, or a print. Larger necklaces help, too.
Anon
+1 It’s definitely the white blouse.
Cat
Black suit and white blouse is indeed what basically my entire 2L class (the women anyway) were wearing for interviews. So I most definitely associate that particular pairing with newbies too. Any color other than white will help you avoid that! I like gray or blue silk with black, or patterned silk, or lightweight sweaters like the Tippi with a scarf or noticeable necklace. A cowlneck is just too much fabric at the neck combined with a jacket for me personally.
Anon
I think adding color underneath the black suit sounds like a good idea, whether through the blouse or by wearing accessories such as scarves or necklaces… what about your bag/briefcase? Are those also black? Job seekers tend to play-it-safe by wearing neutral and avoid accesorizing. But professionals with a job can add some flair to their looks.
anon
I wouldn’t worry about it. Not all interviewees are new lawyers–she may have been expecting someone for a mid-level interview for all you know. And not all new lawyers are recent college grads or in their mid-20s.
If you want to up your style, I’d make an appointment with a personal shopper at a nice department store.
pugsnbourbon
I wouldn’t read too much into the receptionist’s remark – they may have been waiting for an applicant and was asking everyone who came in.
On the other hand, just about all the alternatives you listed would be great as part of a suit. A cowlneck might look a little strange under a jacket, but colored blouses/shells are great. Jewel tones like teal and burgundy are beautiful with charcoal gray.
anon
Ouch. I don’t think there was anything wrong with what you were wearing; chalk this up to a weird interaction overall.
Anonymous
Do you always get this needlessly worked about about innocuous comments?
Cat
I don’t think this is fair. People so rarely give frank commentary on the first impression you make. Why not take a moment to think about the feedback?
Anon OP
Thanks all. I will try different pairings next time. For context, this was not a normal comment for me, as receptionists at my biglaw firm are trained to recognize attorneys scheduled for client meetings on their floor and direct them to the right meeting room, status of participants, etc., without being asked. So while they probably did have an interview scheduled with a candidate, the fact that they directed the question to me suggests there was something interviewing-ish about my attire on that day.
Anonymous
The white blouse is fine, but add interesting accessories when you wear it. I like jade with neutrals. I also look for silk tops in a range of colors, they can make the same grey or black suit look seasonal or on trend.
Classical music radio recs?
Any recommendations for a good classical music radio station that I can stream online at work? I’m not particularly knowledgeable when it comes to music but I like to stream background music while at work (when my door is closed, of course)…
Anonymous
I would create a custom station on Pandora, seeding it with composers you know you like, and then using the “thumbs up” and “thumbs down” to hone as needed.
Anon
https://news.wfsu.org/schedule/wfsq
I’m fortunate to live where we have two NPR stations, one for news and one for classical music.
They’re free to stream.
Anonymous
The Performance Today archives.
SF chic
I find the music available on Pandora/Amazon etc.. streaming to be pretty poor.
Try WFMT in Chicago. See how you like that. I rotate between the cities that have high quality symphony orchetras (ex. Chicago/NY/Boston/SF/Philadelphia). Usually you can just search with the city name, classical music and most of them a public radio so you can add that to your search terms.
kk
There’s a few great spotify options – two of my favorites are “piano in the background” and “morning classical”
Anon
WCRB
Anonymous
I listened to The Classical Channel out of Raleigh, NC online while I studied for the bar. It was a lovely mix.
DLC
BBC radio 3
Vicky Austin
Help – I am applying for graduate school. I studied abroad during undergrad. My admissions advisor persists in telling me that I need to go through a complicated website called World Education Services to request documents of my education abroad. It’s requesting things like a certificate of my degree (I didn’t earn a degree from the foreign institution) and a diploma supplement (didn’t receive anything like this). It’s also charging me $100 (minimum!) for all this. Is this normal?
All the courses I took at the foreign university are on my undergraduate transcripts. I didn’t receive a degree or any equivalent. In fact, I don’t remember receiving any papers, forms or documents from them whatsoever – everything was handled by the two universities. Should I push back with my admissions advisor? She’s insisting that my application can’t be completed without these items.
anynon
Yes, push back. Most school roll study abroad into their transcripts especially if it’s an internal or joint program.
Anon
Is this admissions advisor with the school you’re applying to? Then you need to listen her and do what that institution is requesting, whether or not you like it/want to do it. (I agree it seems annoying.)
Anon
I might try one more time to tell her that the classes were part of a study abroad program, that you received no degree or certificate from the school, and the classes are reflected on your undergrad transcript. After that, if she is with the school, you just have to do it regardless of how stupid it seems.
Anon
Requesting official info from study abroad seems normal. When I applied to law school, at least one of them required me to contact my foreign language study abroad program in South Korea to request a transcript to be sent directly to the law school’s admissions office.
anonshmanon
It’s worth pushing back at least once. Reiterate that all courses and credits that you took are on your undergraduate transcripts and that you did not obtain a degree abroad, so there is no degree to be certified.
Unfortunately, it is normal that admission processes rely on third-party vendors, and applying for college, or grad school, or even professorships relies on structures that exclude people without money.
Anon
For US law school apps they ask you to do this, and undergo a foreign credentials evaluation service that is another couple hundred bucks.
Anon
That does seem kind of strange. Study abroad classes are very common, why would they think you got a degree? I would push back a little bit but if she doesn’t budge then I guess you’ve got no choice.
Vicky Austin
Thanks folks. I am asking the WES people and the foreign university about precedent for this situation. Appreciate the insight!
Grad Advisor
(I do grad admissions in a social science-type field at an R1 university.) The university’s web site should be explicit as to what is required. You don’t say what field you’re applying in, but in humanities / social science fields, it would be unusual to require separate documentation if your overseas courses are listed fully on your home institution transcript.
Anonymous
Most comfortable sleeping mask? I especially need it for when I get migraines, so it can’t be tight around my head.
Anonymous
My favorite ones came as a “gift” with my new sheets (sheets & giggles)
Sunflower
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07F8WJCQX?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title
Anonymous
Earth Therapeutics Shut Eye Sleep Mask (from Harmon Face Values) has a strap with velcro so you can adjust the tightness. The fabric is soft and it does block light well.
Anonymous
Slip
Anonymous
This might be the total opposite of what you are looking for, but I also have migraines and really like the Gravity weighted sleep mask. I got a knock off from Amazon.
Rothys v Skechers
Happy Monday! Has anyone tried Skechers Cleo flats? I’ve been interested in buying a pair of Rothys points but they’re not in my budget at the moment.
pugsnbourbon
Haven’t tried them but I think they’re cute.
Delta Dawn
I have them and love them! They’re a little more almond toe than pointy, but for the price difference they are totally worth a try. I have a pair of black rothy’s points and wanted to order the leopard ones– then I got the Cleo in leopard instead and have been very happy with them.
editor
I have! One family member was wearing them, and two more of us ran out to buy the very same ones. I LOVED them. Then I bought one more. I love everything Skechers, and the Cleo are my “dress” choice.
I can’t believe that Rothy’s would be any more comfortable. Go for it!
Minnie
I have a pair and I really like them! I will say that mine started to smell pretty quickly; not sure if the same issue exists with Rothy’s since I’ve never tried them. I have heard of folks machine washing the Cleos but I don’t think it’s the recommended shoe care, unlike for Rothy’s. But as an overall shoe, very flattering and fairly comfy. And for the price you really can’t go wrong!
OP
Thank you all! I think I’ll give them a try
Anon
I have. They have memory foam inside, but it’s still pretty much like walking on pavement without shoes. They got beat up and stretched out really fast. I probably wouldn’t buy them again.
Keratin Treatment
Hello everyone..is there a keratin treatment with low formaldehyde content that you love? Bonus, if I don’t have to wait for days to wash my hair. I have done Keratin Complex before and loved it. Later I stopped getting any treatment due to concerns about carcinogens. I don’t want stick thin hair, but something that cuts the frizz.
My hair is a bit longer than shoulder length. Thin hair but VERY frizzy. I generally blow dry and flat iron my hair every time I wash my hair and wear it in a ponytail. But I am so bored of it. I want to be able to leave it open.
Anonymous
Beware if you have thin hair. I did this for my fine frizzy hair and it looked like I had no hair. It was awful. And when it grew out it was frizzy for an inch around my part and then flat, My most regretted hair experience ever.
Anonymous
I can’t vouch for it but I’ve been meaning to try OWowKit. No chemicals.
Anon
regarding voting, does anyone know of any sites where i can read about the most likely democrats to flip republican seats? like the above poster, i also live in TX
Anon
https://fivethirtyeight.com/politics/
Anonymous
https://flippable.org/
Anonymous
flippable . org
Anon
Klobuchar is out and endorsing Biden. She was my #1 choice originally but it was clear she couldn’t win, so I think she’s doing the right thing.
Anonymous
Wish Warren would do the same (but endorse Bernie). I am a Warren supporter, for the record.
Anonymous
+1 I am really relieved that the more moderate candidate except for Bloomberg have all taken a step back in time for someone moderate to have a shot at the nomination
Anon
Yes I appreciate when politicians do this promptly. Bernie was way too reluctant and way too late to endorse Hillary in 2016.
Anonymous
Are certain types/brands of thermometers more error prone than others? I have an infared forehead thermometer that says I have a normal temp, and a regular oral thermometer that says I have anything from 99-102. I stayed home today to play it safe but really can’t miss more time if I’m not actually sick! I feel fine.
Anon
Not a doctor, but in general I believe standard oral/rectal thermometers are most accurate. Curious, why did you take your temperature if you feel fine? (My guess is you are coming off a virus, or surrounded by people who are sick?) Check temp again in the evening, but I think if you feel *totally* fine you go to work.
Anonymous
Wasn’t feeling great yesterday, and had the same temperature range. Was traveling on Friday (domestically, but out of large international airport) and have been more paranoid than usual due to COVID-19
Anon Probate Atty
The forehead and ear thermometers I’ve tried in the past have been more inaccurate. I stick with my good old oral thermometer.
Anon Probate Atty
Any recommendations for a backless bra? Bonus points if it has any padding. I love backless styles but I am 1. Fairly flat chested and 2. at the age where a bra is not optional.