Frugal Friday’s Workwear Report: Side Pleat Asymmetrical Top

185 Comments

1. This is beautiful!

2. Ladies, I’m contemplating a move to Washington, D.C. from New York. I’m about to turn 30, and work in international risk advisory. I have some family connections there but don’t have an active social network in the city. Is there anyone who has made this move or similar and have you been happy? What is good/bad about living in DC (other than metro works?) TIA

   1. People are always moving in and out of this town so it’s easy to make friends. I love that everyone is smart and passionate and loves what they do and wants to make the world a better place.

      1. Yay! Fruegel Friday’s! I love Fruegel Friday’s and this Fruegel Vincent Camuto Top, tho with Frank around, the asymetrical nature of the top would sureley lead to him trying to straighten it out, and his hand’s would find a way to my stomack, lookeing for a cheep thrill. Fooey on Frank!!! After all, he does have a wife at home that he can do a “bodycheck” with w/o haveing to grab mine. DOUBEL FOOEY!

         As for the OP, Wildkitten is right (again)–I think we are soul-sisters! I went the other way, starting in NY, then goeing to college and law school in DC, and then returning to NYC because that is where the job’s for me were. In DC there are alot of good peeople from all over, and they are all interested in dateing and mateing, tho not necesarily in MARRYING. So many guy’s to choose from, but all of them will want you to take your clotheing off so that they can see what you look like naked. That was the dating scene for me. I did NOT want to see guy’s naked on the first or second date, but this is what you face and must be ready to deal with as a young singel girl. Fortunateley, I was abel to find that out w/o haveing to do what these men wanted. But you as a profesional have an advantage–a job. You are NOT required to do anything sexueal for a man if you have indemendent mean’s, in the form of a paycheck, b/c you can buy your own dinner, and you do NOT have to do what they ask just b/c they bought you a $23 entree at Outback steakhouse.

         I would probabley would have stayed in DC if I got a goverment law job at GS 9, but they would NOT hire me. FOOEY b/c the attorney got mad just b/c I would not date him. I guess in the long run that is good b/c he is probabley still there and I would have been married to a GS13 attorney, but NOT a partner in a NYC firm as I am now. Everything has a sliver lining.

         I also have a guy lookeing for me to date him–we have met twice now, and he has a job here in NYC just like me, tho he live’s in Statan Island. He keep’s askeing if I own this apartement, but I told him that my dad let’s me stay here–I do NOT want him to know how sucessful I am-and this is a lesson for you. Do NOT let the DC guy’s know that you are very sucesful, or you will have to wind up cookeing and waiting on them b/c they do NOT want to feel inferiur to you, so they hold themselfs out as better and have you do stuff for them. Do NOT fall for that, as I did with Sheketovits. He was a looser, but he pretended he was better then I was so that I would do whatever he wanted. DOUBEL FOOEY! DO NOT FALL INTO THAT CONUNDRUM.

         Grandma Leyeh is thrilled that I have met a man, thru Myrna’s freind, but she want’s me to make sure he is not a looser b/f I take any clotheing off for him. I told her NOT to worry b/c he does NOT even look at me, let alone ask for me to take my clothe’s off or do stuff to him. I hope it work’s out, but I will NEVER move to Statan Island, b/c that is NOT Manahattan, and it is also a long FERRY ride away. YAY!!!!

   2. Yay! I have lived in DC for seven of the past ten years (left for law school for three years and then came back). I love this city but think I have a good handle on the pros and cons. I haven’t lived in NY but I visit often, so I’ll try to compare from that perspective too.

      Pros:
      – Lots of open and green space. Because of the height restrictions in the city, you can always see the sky, and there are tons of large parks scattered throughout the city.
      – Because the city has such a large population of young people and newcomers, there is a vibrant social scene. Making friends as an adult always is challenging, but I think DC might be one of the easiest places to do it.
      – Everyone is so smart. I meet people all the time that have the most interesting jobs and passions. I’m rarely bored talking to someone new that I meet.
      – Normally this would be a con for people moving from almost anywhere else, but cost of living is cheaper compared to NYC.
      – There is a really great restaurant and bar scene for a city of this size. New, hip places open all the time.

      Cons:
      – People are very work-centric. It’s true that one of the first things you’ll get asked when you meet someone is “What do you do.” And there are a lot of people who really play the “networking game” 100% of the time.
      – If fashion is your thing, although people tend to look “nice” and more dressed up than some other cities, the dress is usually pretty conservative and boring.
      – It’s getting better, but the population here tends to be pretty transient. I know a lot of people who moved here and had large groups of friends only to have them slowly move away over the years.
      – Food delivery sucks compared to NYC. Also much fewer ethnic food options – there is really great authentic Ethiopian, Salvadorian, and to a lesser extent Thai and Vietnamese in the city, but no good Chinese or Mexican (though you can get that in the ‘burbs).

      I’m sure I can think of others – if you have any particular concerns I’m happy to respond!

   3. As my username suggests, I was living in Brooklyn before moving to DC 6 years ago. DC still feels like a small town to me, and I miss all the things that make NYC, and Brooklyn in particular, so great. I miss the diversity, cheap (and good) eats, cozy bars, and the walkability. But, DC has come a long way since I’ve been here, and it has grown on me. That being said, I would move back to NYC in a heartbeat. But my career is here (I’m making far more $$ here than I ever did working in NYC), and I can’t afford to just pick up and leave. Maybe once my student loans are paid off…

   4. I’ve lived in DC about 5 years now, and though there are some things to complain about, I think the social scene is pretty great. It’s a cliche that everyone here asks “what do you do?” but everyone I’ve met does something really interesting, and for the most part something they are passionate about, so it’s a good conversation starter. It’s a very social town, with kickball and softball leagues, trivia nights, and lectures/events for anything you’re interested in. The downsides are, in my opinion: everything is expensive (especially housing), traffic and public transportation are not great, and people tend to come and go quickly. There’s also not a super great arts scene like there is in New York.

      1. Come visit Baltimore for art shows put on by MICA students and graduates!

   5. I’m not sure if you’re only interested in people who’ve moved NYC to DC, but I’ve recently moved to DC. I’m single and 34 and went to grad school here for a year and just came back.

      One of my favorite parts of this city is all the educated young professionals with great life stories. It feels like everyone you meet at happy hour has traveled the world, accomplished some amazing thing, etc. It’s really inspiring and you learn so many new things. There are a million activities going on – check out the Washington Post’s Going Out guide for ideas.

      On the other hand, people are generally here for a Purpose. The first question people ask when meeting you is what do you do. Some newcomers to DC find this greatly off-putting. For me, it helps me drive the conversation – if you work for an African animal conservation fund, let’s talk about how you got into that! In general, I think it’s fair to say, IME at least, that if you’re not career driven, you won’t have lots in common with people here.

      I think the weather’s great. I love the pace of the city – quick, but not harried. It’s a very beautiful place, too – I’ve spent time in NYC and all that density can smother a person sometimes and you just want to breathe and have a bit of open space. DC has that in spades. It’s 90 minutes to the Shenandoah mountains, 2 hours to Maryland beaches. The city’s height restrictions also mean you can always see plenty of sky and sun. Depending on your neighborhood, it’s very walkable.

   6. I have briefly lived in DC multiple times after living in NYC. I didn’t stay long because in my mind, DC combined the worst parts of a city and a suburb–except for pretty specific pockets, it seemed like downtown DC emptied out after about 6 pm. But at the same time, you had the awful traffic and high rent of a city, but without as good a subway (or taxi system, but now there’s Uber, so who cares) as NYC. You *can* make do without a car in DC, and I did it the first time, but it wasn’t pleasant or nearly as easy as living in NYC without a car, so the second I got a car. Rent/cost of living is cheaper than NYC, yes, but not dramatically so. Also, it’s basically a company town. Pretty much everyone works with or for the government in some fashion, and the population is fairly transient. This may be a positive or negative depending on who you are. On the other hand, there’s a lot of nice green space and you can see the sky because of building height restrictions, which is nice. But overall, I liked NYC more. I think if I had not lived in NYC first, I would have liked DC a lot. But I mentally kept comparing it to NYC, and NYC won. (Of course, I ultimately left NYC, so take it for what it’s worth)

      1. Just addressing the downtown part….nobody really goes out “downtown” (like, the K Street area). That’s like the Wall Street of DC. All the other fun neighborhoods (U St., Shaw, H St., etc) have plenty going on at night!

         1. Yea, but still not as much as NYC. I suppose my point is there are lots of happening areas/neighborhoods in NYC, far less in DC. Plus, if you want to get from one area to another, it takes longer because of subway system design that’s basically designed to get you to the core of downtown during commuting hours. Which makes sense for commuting to work, but was super annoying when I wanted to go from say, my apartment in Columbia Heights to Eastern Market on a weekend.

         2. Chinatown is really happening every night of the week, and I’d argue that’s downtown. (I don’t think of K St as “downtown” so much as “that barren wasteland of glass office buildings” – K St doesn’t have many bars and restaurants, so I think of it as a corporate area, not a social area.)

      2. Oh, I forgot the other major positive of DC: the weather is better. Not having months and months of freezing cold was nice.

   7. I have lived in DC for 8 of the past 11 years. I echo all of the positives people mention above. These were more of a positive for me before having kids, though, honestly, because it’s hard to enjoy many of those things in our current life stage. I just wrote a very lengthy post one this but deleted because it boils down to: VERY expensive (rent/daycare/food/everything); really inconvenient travel/commuting (bad traffic/poorly designed roads, unreliable metro that is even more unreliable on the weekend, making metro travel with babies not a good option most of the time); lack of even semi-affordable real estate within the city; lack of access to what we spoiled west coast people would consider nice outdoors activities (and those that are here are VERY crowded); general snootiness and money/prestige focus — we don’t really want our kid growing up where your fancy summer camp matters; climate (dc summers are the worst).

      However, I’m going to REALLY miss all the super smart and interesting people who do really interesting things with their time.

   8. I have lived in a few major cities, including DC twice and NYC. One of the things that must be mentioned in DC’s favor: it is CLEAN–comparatively sparkling clean–especially on Capitol Hill. The stench and roving piles of trash endemic to most cities just aren’t there IME. It has lots of drawbacks, but walking around in any season is that much more pleasant!

   9. Thanks for the replies, ladies! Lots of consistent threads in these responses so I think I get a good picture of what it would be like.

   10. I’ve been in DC for over 8 years, and came here after working in NYC. I LOVE it here! I’m in my early 30’s and there are a TON of smart, ambitious, career-focused single people in town, and I’ve found it very easy to meet people. As it’s been said above, most people living here are originally from somewhere else, so beyond the initial “what do you do”, “what brought you to DC” always leads to interesting stories. Everyone was new here once. But again, that pervasive career focus can make dating a challenge, and the town can be transient as people move on to other pastures depending on the election cycle.

       Echoing that there’s lots of green space, plenty of activities and culture and history. It’s been easier to find my niche here than it was in NYC. Trivia nights, lectures, sports on the Mall, lots of free museums and volunteer opportunities, there’s always something to do. The food scene is improving like crazy, and I love that we’re within a few hours of the Appalachian Trail or the Chesapeake Bay and beaches.

       Depending on where you are going, getting around without a car is not impossible. We have a great bikeshare system, and lots of bike lanes. There’s Zipcar too. I find biking to be the best way (for me) to get around the city, but YMMV. Uber and Lyft are super popular here. My boyfriend doesn’t have a car or bike, and gets around just fine. Things are also reasonably walkable.

       If you have young kids or plan on having kids in the relatively near future though… I’d be more wary. It’s insanely expensive to have a family here. Everything here related to childcare and education is ridiculously pricey. The public schools (with a few exceptions) are not good.

       1. I would say that the DC area (note, not DC per se) is much more manageable in terms of having kids. I left NYC for northern VA late last year. Raising kids in a suburb of NYC (or in NYC) and commuting to a job in the city did not seem possible in NY the way that it does here. The area is very expensive, yes, but you get a lot more with your money than you do in NY and the public schools in northern VA, at least, are much more within reach than they are in Scarsdale or Westchester. Overall, I think the DC area is much more doable with kids than the NY area, but that DC can’t really compare to NY in terms of all that fun city stuff that people love. But I left NYC (after 15 years) for a reason. I felt pushed further and further out as a renter so the fun nightlife I wanted wasn’t all that accessible anyway (nor do I think it’s all that important to me as I get older and am starting a family) and yet schools were still pretty impossible to get into. So on the whole, while DC is not NY, I do think the broader DC metro area is way more accessible for families than the NY metro area.

       2. We have two young children and live in the District. Yes, it is expensive living in the city and you get a smaller space, BUT it is actually possible to buy a small single family home in the city AND within a very good public school zone for less than $1M. You could never say that about SF or Boston or NYC. So yes, it is pricey, but we have found DC to be infinitely more liveable for families with kids than other cities.

          1. I agree with really enjoying DC, and I will also add this — the zoo and most all of the museums are FREE!! Not to mention the monuments, of course. It’s such a great perk when you have family/friends in town.

3. Looking for advice on being a good friend.
   I’ve lived in a city for 10+ years now, and over time made some really great friends. Of course as the years go by, people move away, usually for jobs or after school ends to be closer to family. In more recent years, friends have moved just to be out of the city (to be closer to work, buy a more affordable place, etc.). Now I am the only one who lives in the city, and friends live 45 minutes to an hour away. We generally get together for lunch or brunch every other weekend, and there is a lot of pressure to meet half way. I don’t love to drive (another reason to live in the city :)), but I do it because friendships are important. But there are a lot of complaints made about any time we do meet in the city or hurt feelings as to why I don’t drive an hour to visit their places. Recently the friends wanted to meet halfway and made an unnecessary comment about how they wouldn’t want to be freezing walking around the city. It’s actually so cold, I don’t want to leave my apartment at all, but I’m trying to bite my tongue on this.
   I know friendships require work and some flexibility, but I didn’t choose to move. I’m also married and my friends are very much single, and I know from past experience that if they were married, I probably would never see them. I go out of my way to maintain these friendships, but right now I’m annoyed by it. Anyone else been in this situation? I’m sure I am being pretty selfish, but it’s so cold this weekend and the biting comments about the city are really bothering me. How do you maintain friendships with friends who don’t live close but they don’t live far?

   1. I have had success with this by alternating locations or doing the half-way bit consistently. However, my friends would never complain about driving to see me, as I have driven to see them, and they have offered to do the two hour drive to see me (even though I feel bad about that). I do make some concession for my friends who have kids, in that it is harder for them to make the two hour (to me) trip, which is why we generally do the halfway bit. It may be that the friendships have shifted a bit and your friends who have moved don’t value them quite as much as you do.

      In regard to this weekend, can you reschedule for a different weekend so that the issues with the crazy cold/wind this weekend can’t be used as an excuse? I don’t want to leave my house this weekend either, so I completely get that feeling!

      1. Thank you! Sometimes I have FOMO so I tend to say yes to all plans. I think in this case the horrible weather is making this move into the “not worth it” category for me, and instead of just opting out, I’m getting annoyed. I think it’s probably better if I skip this one and get in a better mood :)

         1. Ah yes, FOMO! I have luckily been able to get rid of the FOMO feeling, starting around age 30. It’s great. I feel no guilt about staying home when I don’t want to play and saying no to invites is very liberating!

   2. If you want to maintain the friendships you make compromises, because the math should work out so that the effort to see the people is worth the time you spend with them. If the only reason you were friends was because of proximity (which happens and is not a bad thing), then maybe you don’t schedule get-togethers so often. Sometimes that means they come into the city and sometimes you to drive all the way out to them. But yes, it does sound kind of selfish to insist they always come to you, if you aren’t willing to reciprocate.

      If it’s so cold you don’t want to leave the house (I live in MN, I get it), then reschedule. It won’t always be cold. They weren’t complaining about the city, they were complaining about the cold.

   3. I love cities, but… they can be expensive and a hassle. It can be easier (and cheaper – no paying $15 just for parking) to meet at someone’s house or at a restaurant in the suburbs. It’s nice to be able to just hang out in someone’s living room without worrying that you’ve overstayed your time in a restaurant, to park right next to where you are going, and not have to fight traffic.

      Yes, you have stayed in the city, but as people get older, they often find city life to be a lot more trouble than its worth.

      1. (And I swear, I am not a senior citizen – just a former city girl who appreciates suburbs with a lot of city-like amenities without the city traffic and city prices.)

      2. I have to agree. I live in the city, but I know that it’s a pain for people who don’t live in the city to come see me. It usually means I have to move my car to the street so someone can use my parking spot, I don’t know what I’d do without that thing!

         Right now most of my friends still live in the city, but if I had good friend outside the city I wanted to spend time with, I’d try to meet them halfway by at least occasionally going to see them, or finding somewhere between our places to meet for a bit.

      3. This. I have friends that live south of the city and I live north of the city. We could meet halfway in the city but it is so much easier to either go south to their area or them north to mine. The number one reason is parking. I love being able to go somewhere that has an actual parking lot rather than circling blocks trying to find an open garage and then paying $30+ for the privilege of parking there and walking another half mile to our destination.

         Plus, city life can be overrated in my opinion. I can wait in line and pay a cover charge to buy over priced drinks in a loud bar where I can barely hear my friends. Or, we can drive to suburban bar, walk right in, pay no cover, get a booth, and get cheap drinks and actually talk.

         But, I’ve always been a bit of a homebody and understand other people like other things.

   4. For kind of an opposite perspective, I moved into the city and my friends moved all over the country. When they visit, they always stay in the suburbs near their families. For short visits, I am happy to drive out to see them. When they visit for weeks at a time, my feelings are hurt that they never want to come into town to hang out in my area or at my house. This is partially because feels one-sided that I drive out to them (and sometimes fly to where they live to spend a weekend with them), but primarily because I feel like I have this whole life that they know very little about. You may be isolating yourself more than intended because while you don’t want to drive, they think you don’t want to make an effort to see the new life they’ve set up for themselves.

   5. I could have written something very similar as a lot of my friends have moved away as we’ve gotten older and they’ve had kids and I’ve chosen to stay put. Sometimes it can feel like a bit of a judgment – they’ll complain about parking in the city or how annoying it is to walk in cold weather or in heels and I’ll internally interpret it as a comment about what a pain in the a** it is to come see me and why can’t I be sensible and move to X suburb and be just like them. I also sometimes can’t help but think, “WTF – we used to love this, and now you just want to go garage to car to parking lot of a generic restaurant?!”
      BUT – I am sure they aren’t really saying that at all and maybe to some extent they also feel similar judgments when I go to see them and have to worry about the train schedule because there aren’t easy cabs or public transport to be had, or a cool new place to go try, and they preface every recommendation of a new shop or restaurant with a comment about how it’s “just like in the city,” etc.
      I think it’s important to separate what they’re saying from what you may be feeling internally, which may have no basis in that at all. You and your friends were all on the same page at some point – living in similar circumstances – and now you’ve made different choices and the transition that creates will sometimes cause friction but I think true friendships are worth the work, and if you care about them, try to not take these personally and make the effort when you can (assuming that it’s reciprocated). This weekend though is going to be miserable. I think it’s perfectly fine to hibernate and make plans for next Sunday.

   6. Am I getting this right? You meet half way regularly, but they still give you a bad time about it? Doesn’t sound fair to me.

      1. OP sounds more grumpy about having to meet halfway and wants them to come to her in the city because she doesn’t like to drive. Seems to me friends were fine with meeting halfway because they didn’t want to come all the way into the city and then walk around in the cold.

      2. Yes, we’ve been meeting halfway 80% of the time since they’ve moved. I don’t ask them to come into the city because I’d feel like they are doing me a favor, and it has been awkward. The only times they’ve come into the city were when they wanted to be there for a hair appointment, shopping trip, etc. One friend is definitely more willing than the other to come into the city, which is very nice of her.
         I think this weather just put me in a bad mood so I did something I rarely do and bailed.
         Thank you for all the comments. It is totally just me being a baby about the weather and getting annoyed when the real issue is that I don’t think it’s worth it to go anywhere when it’s this cold.

4. Styling help! I have a 3/4 sleeve navy blazer with white trim on the collar and sleeves. I love it, but have trouble finding good ways to wear it without looking super patriotic or nautical (not bad, but not my thing.) Ideas?

   1. What about grey pants/skirt and a yellow blouse? Just grey blouse/skirt would work as well. I also like pale pink with navy.

   2. grey bottoms, with a bright color underneath. I could see pink, yellow, or kelly green, depending on the shade of grey you choose. I’d also wear it with a grey top and blue jeans.

   3. I love navy and white blazers with jeans and a basic tee (striped, plain white, bright colors, whatever)

      Or for work, with burgundy pants (seriously, it looks great!)

      1. Ooh, adding burgandy pants to my want list. Pants selection is currently limited to black, grey, pale pink, and tan.

         I think I have some ideas now! Will do a closet raid this weekend to see what I can make work. Thanks all!

         1. Burgundy is surprisingly versatile!

   4. I’d wear it with a camel pencil skirt or pants and a bright-colored shell –bright orange, yellow, or hot pink shell. I’d add a scarf in a print with navy and bright colors.

   5. Love kelly green with navy.

5. Looking for advice on a family situation.

   I’m a third associate working in Biglaw. My cousin is a recent graduate from law school. She had a full ride scholarship and has no debt to pay off. After law school she received offers from 2 different AmLaw 100 firms. Instead she took a job with an organization that provides charity and advocacy services.

   I’m not saying what she is doing is not noble but I’m just afraid her idealism is getting in the way of her planning for her future long term. The place she is at now pays peanuts, she had admitted to me that sometimes they are late with her pay or that she pays back into their services with her pay. She lives in a crappy apartment, wears thrift store clothes and is surviving on noodles and a shoestring budget. Her job pays about $35,000 a year but I know she is actually getting less than that.

   I’m really not trying to be a snob because I know she is an adult and can work wherever she wants but I’m concerned because there is no room for growth or promotion where she is now and that the longer she is there the dimmer her prospects for anything else become. I doubt she can live like she is forever and with no firm or in house experience her career prospects will be limited. I think her idealism is clouding her judgement because it’s great to help people but you also need to look after yourself first.

   What would you say to her, if anything? I’m thinking about emphasising that she can help people on the side while she builds her career while she’s young/a new lawyer. How do I frame this to make it clear that I’m not knocking being helpful, just that I’m concerned about her future career growth?

   1. I wouldn’t say anything. She is doing what she loves. She has no debt. Plenty of non-lawyers do idealistic work for little pay and, as long as their bills are covered, are perfectly happy.

   2. Let it go unless she asks for advice. It’s not your business.

   3. You didn’t mention if she’s happy or not. If she’s fine with this, then that’s great for her. Buying clothes at the thrift store isn’t some horrible fate she needs to be rescued from, although the late pay thing is more of an issue. Still, she could find a different, similar position.

   4. Don’t say anything. Working at a non-profit can be great experience for other non-profit jobs. Money doesn’t equal happiness – she’s made a clear choice of the work over the AmLaw 100 money. Don’t judge her choices and don’t take her choices as a judgment on yours.

   5. Is the problem low-paying non-profit work, or is it that this particular non-profit pays her so very badly?

      My advice is to ditch the idea that she should follow your path. That isn’t going to happen. But a lot of people who are happy living on peanuts at age 25 find that it’s frustrating by age 30. So she will come to that realization herself, eventually (most likely). And she will also eventually figure out that “helping people” and “eating noodles” are not inextricably intertwined.

      If you feel the need to help, have her meet some of your contacts for lunch – contacts who are a half-generation or more older, who are doing stuff that fulfills them, and who can help her make a long-term plan. (Yes, big firm experience can be a good background for a top-notch non-profit. But she has to hear that from the stellar non-profit lawyer, not from you.)

      1. +1 to meeting contacts. This will be helpful to her not as an attempt to get her off her current career path, but to give her guidance as to how to maximize her options doing what she wants.

      2. I think this is great advice. I also wouldn’t call $35,000 objectively peanuts, even if it feels that way to you. Lots of people (including yours truly) have lived on it, and there are millions of people in America that would consider it to be doing very well. She doesn’t have student loans or other debt that would make a job like this financially irresponsible, and no matter how you slice it, it’s not your call anyway.

         The organization does sound sketchy, though. Being paid late is not cool. Even so, not your decision to make.

         1. Depends on the location (and the location of the office). In NYC and San Fran, $35k is rough. In smaller cities, it can be a perfectly fine salary, especially for someone in her mid-twenties. I assumed (but could be wrong) that the OP’s cousin was living in an expensive area.

         2. This is a great point, and something I think it’s easy to forget when you’re a regular on blogs like this. 6 figure salaries and 5 figure bonuses are NOT the norm! The median household income for a family of 4 is $45,000. On an individual level, the median salary for a woman is just $19,000.

            For many, many people in this country, a $35,000 salary would be life-changing. If she lives frugally (which it sounds like she does) that can be an extremely comfortable living.

   6. “I’m not saying what she is doing is not noble but I’m just afraid her idealism is getting in the way of her planning for her future long term.”

      I think YOUR idea of what her future “should” look like is what is getting in the way, here. Back off.

   7. You don’t, because she hasn’t asked for your advice.

   8. I would not say anything unless she asks you for advice. It’s not the career path you would choose, but that doesn’t make it any less valid. You don’t need to work in corporate law at a firm or company to build a legal career.

      It does not sound like she’s been at her organization very long. In time, she may decide that more money and promotion opportunities are important to her and move on, but I think that is a decision she needs to come to herself.

   9. How legit is the place she’s working? Ie, is it a well respected and established non-profit, or is it some sketchy place with no name recognition that may dissolve in a year?

      There are many lawyers who sincerely want to do public interest law and have no interest in working in firms. Very few of them are lucky to get public interest jobs right out of law school, which are rarer and sometimes much more competitive than law firms. So many firm lawyers are desperate to leave to do non profit/government work anyways but have to grind it out for years to get their foot in the door. You cousin got to jump to the front of the line, and she’s lucky. Her career may look less linear and secure to you, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t options. Trapping someone who wants to, and can, do public interest law in a large law firm is not a recipe for happiness….if she’s spending her whole biglaw salary on therapy and antidepressants she’s not getting out ahead.

   10. As I’m starting to find out about myself- not everyone prioritizes money, opportunity, promotion, etc.

       If she asks for career advice, tell her about your experience. But otherwise, I’d say leave it alone.

   11. Who said biglaw is the only definition of success? She’ll move on if the financial situation doesn’t work for her. The work she’s doing she presumably finds fulfilling.

       The most inspiring person I can think of from my time in law school is a woman who graduated at the top of her class in the ’70s, ended up working at Legal Aid because of gender discrimination, and has spent the last 40 years toiling in obscurity in elder and poverty law. The world is a better place because of people like her, and maybe your cousin is on her way to becoming like her. It’s not all about money.

   12. She sounds like an adult who is doing just fine and if she encounters problems will find a way to surmount them. Congrats to both of you on your success.

   13. Leave this one alone. She is an adult. She has no debt and has a job–that’s puts her ahead of 90% of people who graduate with serious student loans and can’t find employment. If she finds her work fulfilling, that’s her choice. There’s nothing wrong with thrift stores–geez, I’ve bought designer clothes there for a fraction of the price with the tags still on. (NYDJ jeans for $3?! yes please!)

       I may be biased–I ditched a sex-figure job and took a 50% paycut to work for a non-profit. I made a lot of money at my old job, but I hated it. I have less cash now, but am a zillion times happier. I enjoy my work, I actually get to be home to see my husband…I don’t miss it at all.

       1. That is quite the typo!

          1. ….annnnnd I just saw it. Awesome. Where did the edit button go!!!!

          2. Snorted tea on myself. Thanks for livening up 11am.

          3. It’s Latin for “six.”

             :D

   14. Your cousin sounds great. She has figured out early in life how to be financially smart (no loans!!!) and she can have a career doing things that make a difference and have great value to society.

       Your judgments really sadden me. What would we do without more people like your cousin?

       I live on 30k per year. It actually isn’t that hard when you are young, single, and live simply. I also dress extremely well, and enjoy life and do very powerful, meaningful work. Love it.

       You make me…. sad.

       Do we really need another corporate lawyer on the road to 300k, producing……???? what value in society? Or more lawyers like your cousin?

       1. It’s not all that surprising on a board where the assumption is regularly made that high achieving = high earning

       2. +1. I am a public defender and have been since I graduated law school 8 years ago. I love my work and do not want to do anything else. I have a family member (also a lawyer) who is constantly telling me it is time to move on to a firm and make more money. He makes many times what I do and more money would be nice, but me and my family are comfortable.

       3. I made $28k in my early to mid 20s living in a HCOL area and I thought my life was awesome. I enjoyed my job, I had no debt, and I was having a blast. If she is making it work and she enjoys it, who is anyone else to say it’s not the right path for her!

       4. Agree so much. I made 21K for my first two years out of undergrad doing what was, objectively speaking, the most important, meaningful work I’m likely to ever do. I can’t take credit for the hard work and drive of my students, but I know–know!–that I was one cog in the process that will help some of them break out of generational poverty through accessing higher education, post high school training, or a career in the military. I love what I do now, I still think it’s important, and I make 19k more a year, but it’s not as essential as helping a student be the first person in their family to go to college.

       5. +2 why does more money make you more successful? And your cousin will probably get way more responsibility and marketable experience right out of the gate. I argue against big law partners in court while their associates sit in the front row and watch (not saying big law can’t be a good career path, but I definitely don’t see it as better).

   15. To echo the others, you don’t say anything. It’s none of your business and even if she does ask for advice, you do whatever you can to not sound condescending and to realize that your path is not the only path and that success is not just defined in the manner that you define it.

   16. Ummm what? She’s a grown adult, you aren’t financially supporting her, this is none of your business. It’s not like secret info that working for a place that doesn’t manage to pay you on time is problematic.

   17. Do not say anything.

       Good for your cousin. Thankfully, people define success and happiness differently. The world sure be be less interesting if everybody did the same thing. Thank God for people who agree to work at non profits and make a difference.

   18. I strongly disagree with the other posters. You need to at least make her aware of this issue so she can make an informed decision. It is so, so hars to get back on the law firm track once you get off and she is doing precisely that. The converse of switching to charitable work from law firm is easier, though not necessarily easy. Even if she doesn’t have debt now, she’ll still need to buy a house someday and retire. She should work at a firm a couple of years to at least get things started in the right direction financially.

       She doesn’t have to listen to you, but she should have all the information before deciding. There are so many unjustifiably fatal and largely unknowable landmines in the law school hunt and the legal career arena and this is potentially one of them. Make sure she knows what she’s getting into. This isn’t an “I’ll know better next time” type of mistake. There’s a decent chance there won’t be a next time.

       1. Nonsense.

       2. But do you really think she isn’t aware of that? If she went to a top law school and had AmLaw 100 offers, she’s more than likely well aware of the career path she isn’t taking.

       3. You realize it’s possible to own a home and retire comfortably on a non-law firm salary, right?

       4. “She should work at a firm a couple of years to at least get things started in the right direction financially.”

          I disagree. Lots of people that work in non-profits do just fine financially. I agree with other posters that the place your cousin is working sounds a bit sketchy, but many non-profits pay perfectly decent salaries. Yes, you can make more money in the private sector, but you can also live comfortably outside of it.

          I’ve worked primarily in the non-profit sector and in government, and I know a lot of people that have made financial sacrifices to do important, world-changing work. They are all much happier than the people I know that chose lucrative jobs that they didn’t care for. (I’m not saying that there aren’t happy corporate lawyers or bankers… but if you don’t want to do that work, the big paycheck is not going to mask that feeling.)

       5. Not to mention no one “needs” to buy a house. There is also nothing in the OP’s post that indicates that her cousin would ever want to or ever be happy working in a law firm. Plenty of people, as has already been stated several times, have fine careers in the non-profit sector. *Gasp* non-profit employees may even own houses!

          She has NO debt!!

       6. She doesn’t have to work at a law firm, she should just be informed of the consequences of her decision. I find it surprising that the replies suggest that OP shouldn’t even DISCUSS with her cousin the possibility that a seemingly inconsequential decision could cost her literally hundreds of thousands in her lifetime.

          Doing nonprofit work doesn’t mean you can’t retire or that you can’t buy a house. It usually means those things will be harder, though. And, as I alluded to her earlier, her resume will be permanently impacted by doing nonprofit. Perhaps that’s fine for her if she really wants to sd nonprofit in the future. But she should be fully informed before making that choice.

          OP, you don’t have to listen to the majority here. The fact that you even asked this question shows your concern for your cousin’s future is not unfounded. I’d much rather my cousin be slightly upset that I possibly, maybe (but not really) made an improper inquiry regarding her future rather than look back in 5 years and say “well, I didn’t want to hurt her feelings.”

          1. If she turned down 2 job offers at well-regarded law firms, she doesn’t need to be “informed of the consequences of her decision.” It’s extremely likely that she’s well aware of them. She’s a grown woman, and she made the choice that works best for her.

             When you live on less than $35k/year in a HCOL area (I have) while your friends are making a lot more money, it becomes pretty clear to you that your choice to do non-profit work will entail some financial sacrifices.

             I think it’s quite patronizing to assume that she doesn’t know any better. The implication is that someone that did know better would make a different choice. That’s not true.

   19. I think you have a great opportunity here to work with your cousin to build both of your careers. I’d love to build a lifetime in the law where I move back and forth between public interest, government, and private sector legal work. Your cousin can help open doors for you into public interest law, could refer interesting pro bono matters to you that help you get stand-up or other meaningful experience (if you find the right firm, this can be very valuable!), can find board service opportunities, and can expand your network. In the meantime, you can expand her network, introduce her to your colleagues, and help her stay abreast of opportunities. Even if she never works in BigLaw, if she moves into public interest management or leadership, she’ll need good private sector connections. And even if you never work in public interest, if you move forward in your career as a lawyer, it’s helpful to have meaningful community connections and leadership. You both get to do the work you like, while building out your networks and expanding long-term opportunity. I honestly see this as a win win.

6. I am doing some consulting work between jobs, and need to create a contract. Does anyone have a draft they could share (redacted of course), or a resource to point me to for a template? This seems like the sort of thing where I REALLY don’t need to re-invent the wheel, and I am kicking myself for not saving a copy of previous consulting agreements I had in my files with my past company before I left…

   My email is ginnylee266 at the mail of the google, if you have a template you’d be willing to email.

   thanks a million and happy friday

   1. Not one that I can email but there’s a sample on the Iowa State University Extension and Outreach site under “Sample Consulting Agreement” that I’ll post a link to in a following message.

      1. Sample Consulting Agreement https://www.extension.iastate.edu/agdm/wholefarm/html/c5-84.html

7. I’m recently married and about to have a baby. My husband and I got married about 1.5 years ago (in our mid-30s) and had lived very independent financial lives up until moving in together. We have some co-mingled funds (joint savings account with wedding money in it and a shared credit card that we put shared expenses on) but have otherwise not gotten around to combining our income/savings entirely. As we’ve merged lives, most of our expenses are shared ones and go onto the shared credit card and out of our joint account. We expect this will become even more the case after we have the baby.

   I’m the type of person who likes to see where all my money is so the idea of combining most of our savings into a shared account and maintaining small, separate checking/savings accounts for personal expenses (i.e. buying gifts for one another or otherwise having some money to play with) is appealing to me. I also like the idea of merging finances since we’re a “financial team.”

   But I’m also the child of divorced parents and my mother (a SAHM for many years) always drilled into me that it was important to have some separate money of your own. I love my husband dearly and hope we grow old together, but wonder if it’s a dumb idea to completely merge finances. FWIW, I make a bit more than he does but, thanks to student loans on my end (which I’m still paying off), he has a great deal more savings than I do.

   I would love to hear about folks’ experiences and perspectives on merging finances in a marriage.

   1. we did it without pause. We earn about equal, with a flip-flop every few years. We each have a “fun money” account but that’s got $1000 in it, max, per person.

      I pay all the bills/manage the day to day finances, and I have access to and am named on everything but his retirement (of which i am the beneficiary). The only thing that is still in his name only is his student loan (about $20k left). Mine were in my name until I paid them off.

   2. I’m a child of divorced parents too and my mom was a SAHM for many years. I think your mom’s comment is more about having a job than having your own bank account. If you were to divorce, other than separate property such as premarital assets or inheritances, it doesn’t matter what “name” the account is in. If it’s marital property, it’s divided. Long winded way of saying, I completely merged finances and didn’t think anything of it (although YMMV). It’s so much easier (for us) to have one bank account and to pay all bills from that account.

      1. +1

      2. +1

   3. We’ve also been married for about 1.5 years, with a baby on the way. We merged all checking and savings accounts when we got married, have credit cards in individual names (which get paid out of the joint checking so pretty much the same as joint) and have individual retirement accounts. It’s just much easier this way and we don’t have to worry about transferring money to each other to pay for bills and fun stuff that we both enjoy anyway. I like to think of our incomes (and debts!) as ours now, and not so much individual. For gifts, I track all of our accounts on mint anyway, so there’s not much element of surprise there!

      FWIW, my parents have been married for over 30 years, have pretty much always both worked (mom makes more) and they share everything.

      1. Married almost 15 years, and this is our system too. Works just fine. I also agree with commenter above; this is more about your own income than own accounts.

   4. It’s a good idea to keep some money separate from your husband in case you are ever in a domestic violence situation (or similar situation). Being married and having equal marital property won’t help if you need $2000 for a flight and hotel on short notice. Sure, it likely won’t happen to you, but I would bet that most women in that position didn’t think it would happen to them. I have a relative who had to leave a lying, cheating husband fairly quickly and she was VERY grateful that she had saved about $5,000 in a totally separate account – he became very spiteful in the divorce and ended up keeping her treasured family heirlooms and items, including photos from her last vacation with her deceased sister. It was a darn good thing he didn’t have access to all the money too – how would she have even gotten a lawyer for the divorce if he had had control of all the accounts?

      1. This is a concern I take very seriously. I think having an emergency fund of your own would suffice for this, rather than always having a separate bank account.

   5. I like the idea of having some money in a separate account, and my husband can be a bit of a spendthirft so I float the idea of having our own “fun money” accounts once in a while, but it is so. much. easier. to just have everything merged. We have comparable incomes and no student loans. I brought probably $10-20k more savings into the marriage, but I was unemployed for several months and I spent probably close to $10k on school since we’ve been married, so I figure it’s a wash. We share a mortgage, a car payment, and have 2 kids worth of expenses, so the amount of individual expenditures either of us have is negligible compared to our joint obligations, plus we have the same general threshold for “amount that I want to spend on something for me that requires notification/approval of spouse.” For us, it’s just not practical to try to divvy things up. I have a pre-marriage investment account that is still solely in my name, and we each have our own IRAs and 401ks, but otherwise our finances are 100% joint.

      1. We both pay a percentage of our income into a family account and keep the remainder seperate. I prefer not to be accountable to someone else on all my money and it helps minimise arguments when DH and DH’s ex want to pay for something for my stepdaughters that I think is excessive – it’s coming out of his personal pot so I don’t feel resentful about not getting a say in it. Works for us.

   6. This is the type of issue that varies so much from couple to couple. We have been married for 13 years and everything is combined. Our hand was forced on that because my husband was laid off just after we got married. It works for us because we are both savers and have similar approaches to money. There are many different arrangements and you not any less committed to each other if combining isn’t the right approach for you.

   7. OP here!

      I am personally more comfortable with combining everything — though I think it’s nice to have a small, individual checking account for purchases that you want to make “on your own”–i.e. a gift for my husband or something that I think is kind of a silly splurge, though I’m guessing the idea of “my money” vs “our money” will disappear more and more over time. I think it will be much easier to manage things and we’ll keep a better eye on exactly where our money is and how it’s being managed.

      But I’ve heard so much advice on this s1te over the years to not completely merge that I’ve wondered if that was a mistake. Still open to hearing the other side, but this is where I’m coming from right now.

      1. We are basically merged and mentally treat it all as joint. If it all went south and we needed to get out now, we’ve got a few options. Each of us a primary holder on a credit card with the other listed only as authorized user, our cars are titled in our own names, we each have some pre-marital assets/inheritance that never got combined (again, mentally we have these marked for our retirement.) and we have individual retirement accounts. So yes, we could each access some money relatively quickly.

      2. DH and I got married 7 years ago at age 23. We combined everything. All our various chequing and savings accounts are joint. Our primary credit card is joint. Our line of credit is joint. The only thing that is separate is our “travel” credit cards which have low limits and we use while travelling, for business expenses or for gifts for each other.

         I make double what he makes, but neither of us had any assets before we got married. In my jurisdiction, the money we each make while married is considered marital property anyway, so I didn’t see the benefit to keeping it separate. And as a practical matter, it makes our lives much easier that we are both able to have a full picture of our combined finances at any given time and able to share the banking tasks between us. Anecdotally, I also think we fight less about money than some of our friends who have kept it separate, but YMMV.

         1. Same boat, but married much longer. We’ve had times where he’s made much more than me, where he’s been the only one working (I was in school), where we’ve made about equal, and, now, where I’m the only one working for pay (he’s a SAHD), but it’s always been all ours. I’m sure that there are some benefits in keeping some things separate, but I would think that it would raise issues, too (how do you decide what comes out of the joint verses what comes out of the separate accounts, for example)

   8. In my first marriage, we made about the same about of money, but both had crazy law school debt. We were 100% combined financially, which meant we both paid for what we needed/wanted out of our joint account. It made a certain amount of sense because we have three kids and most of our expenses were shared. However, he spent and spent and spent…There was a lot of fighting about money.

      I am remarried now, and we both have kids from previous marriages. We each have our own individual accounts for our individual expenses and the expenses for our own set of kids. But we also have a joint account for shared expenses – the mortgage, utilities, groceries. We both have a portion of our paychecks direct deposited to the joint account. It’s enough to pay our joint bills and have a little left over. When I want something just for me, I use my separate account. Neither of us feels we have to justify when we buy something for ourselves using those funds. It works really well for us.

   9. In my state, funds earned during the marriage and property obtained during the marriage will all be split, absent an agreement saying otherwise. Putting your names on each others checking accounts has no effect, even in a worst case scenario. We put on our names on each others accounts, mostly for convenience. We put all of our monthly expenses on a credit card that gets paid out of my account and he pays our mortgage out of his account. Our paychecks go into our respective accounts. It ends up working out to each of us paying a similar amount usually, and we have similar salaries so that’s probably how we would do it even if we didn’t have comingled finances.

   10. If you don’t have a prenup it really doesn’t matter where you store your money. I vote combine fully.

   11. I’m also really interested in this. I’m getting married next year and I think our plan is to go almost all-joint. We’ll each contribute some money to starting out our joint account and contribute all money going forward there, but also keep my pre-marital emergency fund separate. I would draw on it if that money was needed but other than that, it would stay in the unwieldy Treasury Direct account in my name that I have no idea if I could even add another name to anyway. I love and trust my fiancé completely, but the best-intentioned people can develop an addiction or have a mental breakdown, and it makes me feel safe to have some money that no one except me can withdraw (that we’re not planning to use for a particular goal anyway).

   12. Thanks, all, this is very helpful. I think I’m persuaded to do the most-merged model. It seems so much easier, we already think of our money as joint money, and we both have similar attitudes toward savings and spending. Just wanted to make sure I wasn’t missing some huge risk to doing so. Thanks!

   13. Right after we got married and decided to merge finances, I told my husband that I was going to keep some separate checking/savings “just in case” for this very reason. Well, it turned out to be a logistical pain the ass (I’d have to keep X amount to keep my current checking account status — which was not a small sum of money– or I’d have to switch to a paid checking account). We ended up just merging everything and its soooo much easier. I also didn’t like having the “just in case we get divorced” sort of thing hanging out in the background. I’ve been with my husband for almost a decade so I’m pretty sure I’d know if he was going to abuse me by now, so I’m not worried about that. Also have family support so if I ever really needed money I could access some.

8. VKD expressed sadness yesterday that the ivory was not available in Medium for the sweater featured yesterday. Check Lord and Taylor, they have what looks to be the same sweater and the ivory/medium combination was available this morning.

9. DH and I are contemplating a move from DC to Seattle. We’ve been here for several years and expect that our longer term career goals will bring us back here, but we’d really like to get out and live somewhere else for a while. We’re late 20s/early 30s if it matters, not planning to have kids. Both of our companies have offices there, so it would be fairly easy to arrange and not much would change on the work front. We’ve both been there and loved it, despite the overcast and rainy weather. Thoughts?

   1. Do it! Seattle is so different from DC and has so much to offer. I would love to live there and explore for a few years, but, alas, my job is tied to DC.

   2. I made the DC-Seattle move 8 years ago now. And if you read the whole “how’s DC compared to New York” thread–well, I definitely felt a lot of that was how I experienced DC! I think it’s easier to make friends there, but they are more likely to be transient and leave (only a few of my old friends still live in DC). Seattle IS known for the Seattle Freeze. That said, given the pace of Amazon hiring and some of the other tech companies, there’s definitely a huge influx of newcomers to meet and befriend! Seattle used to be cheaper–lately not sure that’s so much true. But it’s definitely less “what do you do” focused (because even those who work hard aren’t so much thinking they are changing/saving the world?). And the opportunities for running/skiing/paddleboarding/etc are amazing. I LOVE the Seattle weather–almost no snow, and the summers are a revelation after ten years of DC hot and humid!

   3. You rang?

      Seattle is in the midst of a years-long pattern of growth – exciting in some ways (more restaurants, yay!) and painful in others – very expensive, very competitive housing market, gentrification, NIMBY-ism, homelessness crisis. I think Meara’s statement that Seattle is less “what you do” is still somewhat true, but the douchebro/programmer bro population explosion is pretty ugly, culturally.

      Do plan your housing search around where you’ll work – if your offices are downtown, look to live in a neighborhood with good transit connections to downtown (pretty doable in most cases). If one or both of your offices are on the Eastside, I’d reconsider living in the city – the Seattle-Eastside commute is ugly.

      You said you’ve both visited before, but if that was mainly doing tourist activities, see if you can spend several days here exploring neighborhoods you’re interested in, testing commutes, getting a feel for the different areas of the city.

      Good luck!

      1. Yes, the influx of dudebros has not been my favorite. Especially in my neighborhood on weekend nights. Ugh

10. Just need to complain: the woman in the office across from mine is wandering the halls singing. Loudly. We’re academics, I don’t have tenure, this is not something I can ask her to stop doing. I just need to tell someone how annoyed I am.

    This is in between her loud phone calls organizing a political fundraiser. She’s been lecturing undergrads for years, and apparently can’t stop herself from projecting her voice all over the building.

    1. that is a NIGHTMARE. my sympathies. also an academic — my colleague has a lot of repetitive open-door meetings, and I have been really getting buddy-buddy with the spotify white noise station… but singing takes it to a whole new level.

    2. You need good over-ear headphones! You can just listen to white noise on them, but they’d tone her out at least a little bit.

    3. My colleague and I are forced to eavesdrop on each others’ extremely repetitive advising appointments. Oh, academia.

    4. That would drive me nuts. I bought noise cancelling earphones after my college put 4 year olds in a summer camp on my floor under the crazy assumption that faculty wouldn’t use their offices during the summer. The headphones are a godsend for helping me tune out my colleagues and students sometimes. I wonder what would happen if I wore them to faculty meetings…

    5. I feel you. I’m also in academia. Yesterday a manager in my department had a number of conference calls. She has a very loud voice anyway. She took all of these calls on speakerphone with the door to her office open. This went on all day long. I was about to lose my mind.

       And this occurred after an endless T ride where 2 separate people conducted long, loud cellphone calls at 7 AM in the morning…

11. I need to vent as well, it’s 8 degrees outside and, I swear to god, they’re running the A/C in the office today. Or the fan, something is blowing cold air everywhere. I get the need to keep the air moving in an office, to keep the place from getting sticky and stagnant, but there has to be a way to do this while keeping the place reasonably warm. I don’t need a sauna, I just need to be able to type!

    1. I am still wearing the shin-length down coat and scarf I was wearing when I walked into the building this morning at 6:45 a.m I feel your pain.

       1. I need to get me one of those long, down coats. They look like sleeping bags you can walk around in!

          1. They are great! I have an Eddie Bauer one with a hood. It was a life saver when I was walking from the Metro to my office years ago in DC. It’s great to have in PA even though I now only have to walk from my car to the building door :)

       2. I’m rather famous in my office for doing this.

12. How do you respond when your manager asks details about your vacation in order to challenge whether you actually “need” to take off the time you’ve requested? I’m trying to take time off work to attend a destination wedding in another country. There are lots of wedding-related activities in the days surrounding the wedding. I tried to avoid telling manager what the vacation was for, but I ended up spilling the beans because he refused to give me an answer on whether I could go. He’s now saying that it’s ridiculous to take off so much time (3-4 business days) to attend a wedding and there is no reason I need to be gone for that long. I was hoping to take a little more time off than required for travel and wedding activities so I could actually enjoy the destination – and make this my one big vacation of the year – but it looks like that won’t happen.

    We don’t have any deadlines or anything else pending during the time I would be away. Manager hasn’t given me any reason why I shouldn’t take the time off, other than that he thinks it’s stupid to take time off work for a wedding. Any advice on where to go from here and how to handle this sort of thing in the future?

    1. What does your employee handbook or benefits document say about PTO? I had to sign off that I had read all of our policies, so my first instinct would be to refer to the handbook or whatever. Ours says nothing about the purpose of PTO, just that you get X hours accrued per pay period and that you can take it with the approval of your manager.

       I have always phrased my requests as, “I am taking the following days off and using PTO. Please let me know if there is a group conflict.” When I say group conflict, I mean that everyone else in the group has taken those same days off – we have to have someone from our group here every day.

       You boss sounds like a jerk and I would be tempted to go above him and straight to HR, but I don’t know what that would do to your working environment.

    2. Wow, I can’t imagine my boss actually challenging my choices about when to use my vacation days so this sounds incredibly inappropriate on his part. Personally, I’ve always taken the approach of “I’m planning on being out on vacation x through y days. Please let me know if this presents any problems.” and then leave it at that. I’ve answered questions about a trip, but I do try to steer away from comments that could invite questioning, etc. Still, this sounds like it’s your boss’ problem, not yours!

    3. Get a new job. That boss sounds awful.

    4. I guess i would have called it a 3-4 day vacation, not a 3-4 day wedding. Sounds like there is more there, though, as whenever my team tells me they are going out for a wedding or whatever and it’s for more than a friday, i assume they are building in a vacation. Not my business unless I have concerns about the specific day they are taking off….which would be the same concern whether they were taking a sick day, a day to nap on the couch, or jury duty.

    5. “This is how I’ve chosen to spend my vacation time. It’s what makes sense for me.” End of discussion.

    6. Honestly I would go ask him what the potential conflicts with the date are and act like you are very interested in making sure you can set aside time for them on your calendar. Since there aren’t any he can come up with, then say that since there are no conflicts, you will mark the time on your calendar and formalize your plans. Sometimes you have to be pushy… tell instead of ask. If he’s weird about it, tell him he’s not invited on this trip because WTF.

       1. That’s how I started the conversation – “I would like to take x-y days off for vacation. Do we have any conflicts at that time? There are none on my calendar.” He responded “I dunno.” I asked again several weeks later, and still got a noncommittal (and annoyed) response. The third time I asked, he demanded to know why I kept bothering him about those dates and can’t I just figure out my vacation some other time. So that’s when I finally said no, I can’t go some other time because it involves a wedding. And then it sort of devolved from there – why would you take time off work to attend a wedding, why are you going if it’s that far away, etc.

          1. “Since I haven’t heard any conflicts, I’m going to mark myself as out of the office on vacation for these dates”.

          2. “I dunno” your boss sounds like such a professional gem.

    7. I like to take off the day following my vacation to sleep in and do laundry. I bet your boss definitely would not understand that. Clearly the only way to go about responding to this is to talk at length about the the destination’s great naturalist culture, red light district, medical tourism, or whatever would cause said boss to regret he ever asked for details.

       1. Perfect! Bore him to tears and he may never ask again.

    8. Email him; do not discuss in person. Basically say, “On XX date, I requested the following days off for vacation. Under company policy, handbook page Y, I am entitled to Z days of vacation, of which I have taken zero this calendar year. Please either approve this request, or, if you are denying it, state the reasons for your denial, the company policy that approves such denial, and copy HR on your return email denying the request.

       Thank you,

       Anonymous.”

       And *no matter what,* talk to HR about this and get it documented. You aren’t going to go over his head, yet, but I doubt this is the only crappy thing he does to his employees, and (absent a very weird company policy), it’s completely inappropriate for him to deny this request based on his stated reasons. I mean, if you were supposed to be in court trying a huge case the next week, yeah, I could see it, but otherwise, he’s out of line… and probably trying to see how much garbage you’ll let him get away with.

13. I need to lose a little bit of weight. I’ve been a little careless lately and haven’t been taking care of myself or treating my body well. I’m using this as an opportunity to adopt healthy lifestyle changes that I haven’t been motivated enough to do before, like using a standing desk. Any other tips for small changes to get healthier/lose weight that aren’t too hard?

    1. The step counter on my phone helps motivate me to move around more. Also, getting a big water bottle and trying to drink more water. And not eating dessert every night (especially since I have a hard time with portion control at the end of the day.)

    2. Track absolutely everything you eat. I’m new to WW and this is the biggest thing I’ve found helpful on the program. I like the points system over counting calories but you can 100% do it on your own via My Fitness Pal or just pen and paper. I was surprised at all the mindless snacking I was doing throughout the day.

       Also, cut out all fruit juices and sweetened drinks. Try to avoid replacing with diet versions (they don’t allow your body to reset it’s perception of ‘sweet’) and just drink water flavored with fruit.

    3. Do you drink regularly? halve your alcohol consumption. reduces calories, bloat, need to eat extra chips when you get home, but you aren’t depriving yourself. Plus your tolerance lowers quickly and you save money.

       honestly that’s the step that gives me the biggest bang for my buck.

    4. I recently did the same thing, about 5-6 lbs above normal to go. I lost it all fairly quickly, by choosing nutrient-dense food and quitting drinking for a week. I also went for a walk each day, sometimes only a few blocks. There are a few studies that show that eating well changes your gut bacteria and makes you crave healthy foods after a while. The first week isn’t so fun, but now I’ve got that momentum and the healthy foods on hand which makes it a habit and craving.

    5. I like zucchini noodles.

    6. Way to go on deciding to work on your health! Don’t try to “fix” everything at once–that’s a recipe for getting overwhelmed and giving up. Cutting back on alcohol is an easy one, if that works with your life. In terms of food, figure out what your issues are, and commit to tackling them on a reasonable timeline. So less “I will only eat healthy food forever!” and more, “On reflection, I grab a bagel from the bodega every day for lunch because I don’t have time to pack one in the morning. I will commit to packing a healthy lunch the night before 3x/week.”

    7. Going through this right now! I’ve been going to the gym once or twice a week (starting small), cut out all diet soda, upped spice in my food (think spicy salsa, peppers, red rooster). Helps me to eat less and drink more water. Also easy for snacking, just grab some celery and a jar of salsa and you’re good to go, minimal prep.

14. Can anyone recommend a brand (or pair) of shoes that is comfortable for a wide forefoot/narrow heel? I need some new shoes to go with a cocktail dress and was looking at some strappy heels, but they keep turning out to be slightly too narrow in the front.

    1. For shoes in the $100-$200 range I suggest Trotters (I get wide) or Clarks.
       For shoes in the $200+ range I suggest AGL or Paul Green.

    2. Also interested in hearing about brands, but for heels, these have actually been great for my (similar) feet: http://www.zappos.com/nine-west-flax-black-synthetic

       1. The thing that gets me about Nine West is that they make wide shoes… but only up to size 9! From size I think 7. It’s such a weird, narrow range to make them in.

    3. AGLs!!! And they’re on sale right now at Nordstrom. I have a wide forefoot and a narrow heel and they fit me really well. Also Stuart Weitzmans.

15. I’m a tax associate working on a client issue with a partner. The client is totally lost and has asked a couple times now for a very simple explanation of the issue. On calls with them, my boss is DEEP in the weeds citing technical details and I can hear the clients getting more and more lost.

    On our last call, after an hour of my boss quoting regulations and the client getting more and more frustrated and confused, the client asked for a very simple memo with the general rule and an example so that the chairman of the board could understand the big picture. The partner just sent me an old memo outlining step-by-step calculations for determining the tax penalty and told me to forward it to them.

    Am I missing something through my inexperience? I’m 98% sure the chairman of the board doesn’t give a hoot about how to derive the tax penalty; he needs to understand the basic issue in an executive summary.

    This – where we don’t deliver what the client’s asking for – has been going on for weeks now and I feel terrible for the client. When I’ve drafted simple memos for this client, the boss has edited them to turn them into tax treatises. I’m new here and the dynamic feels so strange to me. Is the partner intentionally not providing what they’re asking for to drive up the bill or is he incapable of taking a step back out of the detail woods after 30 years? Or is there some other explanation that I’m just not thinking of?

    1. I would forward the memo as your boss has asked but provide the simple explanation you think the client really needs in the body of the email.

       1. Oh my gosh, thank you! So simple! I can’t believe I didn’t think of it. And thank goodness it spares me any sort of awkwardness.

          1. I’ve dealt with this before (also in tax). You usually just need to find the politically acceptable solution like this when you can. Also, sometimes there is a reason that you are not aware of (e.g., the partner is covering penalties in detail because the client has been too aggressive in the past). If you are easy to work with and navigate the political issues, it pays off later. Clients and other firm partners contact me over the other senior tax partners because I’m responsive and I know how to handle issues like this. It’s frustrating, but view working with someone like this as an opportunity.

16. I have a long time friend who has a crappy crappy life and I think it’s a combination of having awful luck but also partly her fault for not extricating herself from the contributing factors. Like staying at a job she hates or keeping contact with toxic family.

    I try to be there for her and it isn’t like I’m doing much except for lending a listening ear. She tries her best to put on an I’m okay face and does admirably well, better than I would, at keeping it together. The thing is, my mood is easily affected by external forces and I have a low tolerance for drama, and there’s definitely that depressing feeling in the air whenever I’m with her. It actually fatigues me a lot to listen to her drama, esp when much of it is repeated issues over the years.

    We weren’t close to begin with, but I’m prone to wanting to care (until it gets fatiguing) that we somehow became close and now I wish I can get a vacation from the friendship. That sounds so horrrible, but had this been a boyfriend I would’ve ended the relationship. Since it’s a friend though, I’m super unwilling to abandon her. Not sure if I’m looking for advices or just needing to vent.

    1. I think you need to reframe your interactions with her. It sounds like you are spending energy trying to figure out how to help her when just having someone to talk to is helpful for her. Let go of any expectations that you will help her find a solution or ‘fix’ her problems. Go in with the idea that you will listen to her and the listening itself is helping and that you don’t need to think about it or help beyond that.

       1. Actually, as I said in orig post, I don’t do anything but lending a listening ear. She doesn’t expect anything else from me either. But I’m tired of listening. To the same thing over and over again. I’m tired of spending time with a perennially sad person. It pulls my own mood down.

    2. I had a similar experience with a friend. It got really, really old listening to the same complaints about similar situations where she would keep making the same mistakes. I get very frustrated when I feel that someone has a problem within their power to address but they just aren’t. I know that’s just my perspective on it, but I also need to preserve myself and not be in situations where I’m constantly watching it happen or hearing about it. I did break up with a boyfriend over something like this (though his was much more serious and involved not getting therapy and a PFA). With this friend, I ended up just responding noncommittally to the endless rehashings (sympathetic noises, “wow that’s awful,” “you must have felt so frustrated”). Because of a variety of reasons, we seemed to naturally drift apart over time, and that was sad but fine. I only have time and energy for a few close friendships and I think it’s okay if those change over time.

    3. I applied for my dream job, got nowhere and the girl they hired became my friend. She hated that job, thought it was beneath her, fought with everyone she worked with, told her employer she was looking for other jobs, turned down one or two good offers and was finally fired. She is currently jobless and complains about how unfair her situation is. I’ve somewhat stopped talking to her. At a certain point people need to grow up and take responsibility for their own actions. Yes, we live in an unfair world but it is what it is and there are people who have it much tougher than my friend and your friend do and they make the most out of what they have.

    4. I’m not sure if you’re intentionally alluding to this or if this is a new concept for you, but are you an empath? It’s a very woo-woo kind of thing, but I’m a real, sane attorney with my head on straight telling you it’s a Thing haha.

       I’m very sensitive to the vibes people and places give off. For the couple people that I’m closest to in life, I know how they’re feeling even when they’re thousands of miles away. (For strangers, it’s only when we cross paths.)

       Anyways, when this “gift” (quotes because walking by the crazy guy in the subway and getting a dose of his energy is not enjoyable, thank you) first arrived, I didn’t know how to handle it. It’s very easy to be overwhelmed by someone else’s energy. I have to really focus on my core and on not allowing the other person’s energy to enter. With someone particularly negative, I’ll mentally picture myself in a bubble and imagine their energy not being able to penetrate. Afterwards, I’m always very sure to shower or bathe because water is neutralizing for me.

       If this sounds helpful, there’s lots of information online. If I sound like the crazy guy in the subway myself haha, then I’ll just give the general advice that sometimes we have to extricate ourselves from unhealthy circumstances for our own good. If this friend is making you feel bad and there’s no way around it, I’d begin gently backing away over time, giving her a final goodbye talk if it feels appropriate.

    5. There are nice, low-drama ways to basically tell someone that they own part of their problems. “You can do better, but you’re not going to do better until you get out of this situation” is one of my favs. It focuses on what she can control (e.g., her willingness to stay in the situation) without blaming her for what she cannot control (e.g., her toxic family or crappy job).

    6. I had a friendship like this. I ultimately decided that I could only hang out with her while doing an activity (ie, not dinner/drinks) because otherwise it was an hour of me nodding my head agreeing how much her life sucks.

    7. I’ve been there twice with the same friend. We were extremely close about a decade ago, and I slowly and steadily put distance between us. I would get fatigued, I would get righteous and wonder what I was getting out of the friendship, and so on and so forth. We have reconnected recently and I am a kinder, more patient person than I was a decade ago (not to say I am perfect =p) and I very much regret how I used to view her. I regret the time lost.

       I have so much to be thankful for. I have been able to return to the friendship with open arms. I realized it wasn’t the right attitude before, that I needed to “get something” out of every friendship. I had to re-frame my expectations of the friendship, and decide that my expectation should be that I am there for her when she needs me. Because if I need support, or help, or anything, there are other friends I can go to, so it’s not like I’m unsupported in my own life. A lot of people have turned away from her, getting that fatigue, and the fact that I am just there for her in the pitiful ways I can be (lending an ear over text and email, since we don’t live close together) means a lot to her.

    8. When I started reading your post, I thought that I had posted in my sleep. Seriously, I have been through an identical situation with a long-term friend, and many times have thought about posting here for advice.

       Over the past couple years, I’ve slowly backed away because I find it totally exhausting to be together. I still try to reach out to her ~quarterly, but I really can’t handle getting together more than that. Anytime she has something good happen in her life, I make sure to respond very affirmingly so that we can focus on the good for a bit. I’ve also tried to switch to either activities that we can do together (so less discussion of drama) or activities that involve others (at least my H and child) so again we can’t go way deep into all the self-destructive decisions she makes.

       I’ve also followed the popular recommendation on this board and recommended she find a good therapist. Basically, I said ‘these problems seem so challenging, I’m not the one to help you figure them out. Maybe someone with professional training could provide more insight.’ At first, she read that as “there’s something wrong with me, why are you telling me to go get fixed?” but I repeatedly relayed my own very positive and affirming experiences with therapy (I truly believe that I would not be married nor have a child without having had this support and ability to focus on better understanding of myself and overcoming self-defeating behaviors), and finally she saw that it might be beneficial.

       But truly, no one can help themselves unless they decide to, so if the friendship is sucking away too much energy, you have to back off.

17. I wanted to see if anyone else has felt like this before and what helped. I have had a stressful year or so for a number of different reasons. I thought I had been managing ok, keeping it together at work and at home. However, I have noticed recently I feel on the verge of tears in situations that otherwise would not have made me feel that way in the past, including difficult meetings at work–I am a lawyer and am used to these type of meetings, my kid’s parent-teacher conference that went well yet I felt like I was fighting back tears the whole time, and an appointment with my mother’s doctor. (She beat cancer but we are still managing her recovery.)

    Is this the manifestation of anxiety or depression? Does this just happen with age? My youngest child is 5, so I don’t think it is hormones. Should I go to therapy? (I know that is suggested often. Maybe I really do need it?)
    Thanks.

    1. It could be, but one thing that I notice is that I’m personally more apt to being on the verge of tears if I’m hungry, tired, dehydrated or just feeling worn down emotionally or physically. If that’s the case, could you try to focus on self-care? Maybe a staycation where you have some “me time”?

       1. +1

          For me, once I start getting upset a) faster and b) at smaller things, it’s a signal that I’m worn down physically and/or emotionally. It’s such a clear red flag for me now that I’ve learned to notice it and pay attention to it that I use it as a guide to tell me when I need to step back. Like, once after a very stressful week at work I burst into tears when I heard that my boss left early to go golfing. Time to go home! Given that you’ve had a stressful year, that’s probably the cause. Therapy is super great, but I’d try self-care first. If it’s not helping, therapy can be helpful for learning coping skills.

    2. It sounds like you might deal with stress like me – I simply push through and make sure everything stays together, usually at the expense of my mental and physical health. Eventually it catches up to you. I don’t know if therapy is the answer here (though I think everyone can benefit from a little!) but what you might really need us just to slow down a little bit, give yourself a period to heal, really feel your emotions and process your thoughts from your hard year, and regroup. Dealing with a parent having cancer alone would make for an incredibly tough year for anyone. I second Veronica Mars – try going to the gym, eating a lot of omega-3s, and getting some outdoor time as a stop-gap. It won’t fix the ‘needing to process’ issue but it will reduce how stressed you feel about it.

       1. Thanks for the tips. Luckily, it’s not a major concern in my life. I just know myself and instead of getting ‘hangry’ I’m just more inclined to want to cry. That, and I’m not a fun person to be around if I’m worn out and jet-lagged!

    3. I get like this when I’m overwhelmed. Often, my overwhelm isn’t caused by a pressing deadline or anything concrete, so much as “OMG I need time alone and food and cake and s@x and for someone else to do the dishes.” I’ll just get worked up and end up on the verge of tears for no real reason. Crying, then cleaning the house, then taking a nap or a bath helps me feel like I have a grip on things again.

    4. Thank you everyone! I do feel overwhelmed and worn down, emotionally and physically. I know I need to do some self-care–just hard to find the time, etc. My husband is very supportive and I will try to lean on him a little more.

18. Any suggestions for how Uniqlo leggings pants/jegging size? I am usually a JCrew size 6. Do I get a small or medium?

    1. Definitely medium – I am a J Crew 6ish and take a M at Uniqlo in pants and L in tops depending on the style.

    2. Medium. Uniqlo runs very small.

       1. I just came back from Tokyo, shopped at the biggest Uniqlo in the world, and needed a medium in everything. I am a JCrew size 2. 5’4, 117 pounds, lean/muscular.

          1. The US Uniqlo stores are vanity sized, I believe. I wear an M and I’m usually an 8. The pants are all fairly short, though, and a pair of tights I foolishly bought had the crotch at the knees, even sizing up to the largest size.

          2. Sizing is different in Tokyo

    3. Medium, although I am a Jcrew 4. Maybe you should get a Large.

19. The husband and I will likely be running our own consulting firm in the next few months. (Or more to the point he will be joining my consulting firm as a partner). We have been warned by literally everyone not to do this as it is marriage disaster (currently we are pretty happy) but financially it makes more sense than having him go out on his own. I’m senior to my husband, have been successfully running this business by myself for a while. I would respect him as an equal but I know he’s going to feel that he is in charge and so is everyone else we interact with (I’m five years younger and live in an area where women largely don’t work). This sort of thing doesn’t bother me too much but is one of the reasons I started my own business rather than work for someone. Would appreciate any advice from people who have been in this position.

    1. This seems like a terrible idea.

       I think in this potential cons dramatically outweigh the pros of reducing overhead.

       1. It’s a tricky situation. The reality is having someone older and male would bring in more clients without a doubt and I’ve been in this dump of a city for five years now and made my peace with how sexist and stupid things are. I would like to have a partner and there are no women working in my area so I would be dealing with this kind of thing regardless of who the person was.

    2. Can you keep firm lines on which parts you are in charge of (like, particular clients, or a particular subject area) and keep his areas distinct? I would think the biggest stumbling block would be him feeling like he’s in charge, much more so than what other people think. If you posted about this before, maybe also try to keep clear boundaries that you are not his admin, and he needs to do his own admin stuff… Like for the first few months be really really firm about making him do it, to set a good precedent and get him into the habit of it. And have a conversation with him beforehand making it clear what your expectations are, and that you expect to be treated as no less than an equal partner, and the founding partner to boot. Be a little bit of a hard a$$, especially if you are not usually in charge in the relationship, to give him a clear idea that the work you is not exactly the same as the relationship you. Also you might want to have a trial period, like try it for 6 months or a year and if it’s not working for either of you, he will go get a different job.

    3. This is tough. Can you have a Plan B (discuss with him) on what will happen if things don’t work out after a trial period? Then you can set some ground rules for a short trial period (with him involved) and if it doesn’t work out, pull the plug immediately and shift to Plan B. He would need to 100% be on board with the trial period and Plan B. I don’t think you should have to give up something you have built for his benefit when you don’t even know if it will work out very well yet.

    4. This sounds like a really bad idea unless you can keep the line between work and home really clear and bright. So, no, he doesn’t get to think he’s in charge, you are. You don’t do his admin tasks if you’re the same person who posted a week or two ago. If he’s not willing to treat working with you as another professional work environment and respect the lines of authority/etc. then don’t do it. Does he subscribe to the sexist and stupid attitudes prevalent in your city? If so, then don’t do it.

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