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We've been curious about the story on Gothamist, “Overachieving Women Will Drink You Under the Table,” in part because so many of you “liked” the story once we posted it to Facebook (and amazingly, not one of the six is one of our drinking buddies!)
Looking more closely at the reports from the Telegraph, the study notes that “The more educated women are, the more likely they are to drink alcohol on most days and to report having problems due to their drinking patterns . . . . The better-educated appear to be the ones who engage the most in problematic patterns of alcohol consumption.”
We have a few thoughts on this, which we'll try to put in a cohesive order, but we're primarily curious to hear from you: 1) Do you drink to excess? 2) Why do you think that is? 3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? (3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? Fine, and 3c: what do you toast to?) 4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much?
What have you done about it? (For right now, let's just talk about alcohol, although we suspect a thread on prescription drugs might also be in order.)
My Thoughts on Overachieving Women Who Drink Too Much
First, on drinking during one's downtime (weekends, evenings, vacations, whatever): We've been mulling it over in our heads since reading the article, in large part because — why yes! — this author (and most of her overachieving friends, particularly those from law school) have been known to overindulge here or there during personal time. Is it because we are stressed out from our day jobs and need help unwinding? Is it because we drink to “reward” ourselves for all of our hard work during the week?
As one of our commenters on the Friday post wondered, is it a chicken and egg syndrome — are women who are more likely to overindulge also more likely to become overachievers? Is there a competitive aspect to drinking — if we are competitive people, are we more likely to drink competitively as well? How much does money play into it?
For example: if you go to nicer bars, a) there are often more options for specialized cocktails (as seen by the mixology craze in NYC), and b) if you are served better liquor, there are less repercussions — for example, a cheap gold-colored tequila will presumably leave you with a much worse hangover than if you're drinking a quality clear-colored tequila, like Patron Silver — which in turn means that, without the hangover to “teach” you not to drink so much, you continue to do it.
(We suspect the actual “answer” to this phenomenon is probably a very unsexy, sensical one: women who are “overachievers” frequently have children later in life, which means that they have a) more disposable income and b) less real responsibility. (This would also mean that they've never had to take a “break” from drinking, as required by that whole, you know, pregnancy and breastfeeding thing.) This was noted by the authors of the study, as well.)
Second, on drinking at work functions: Obviously, one should not drink heavily drink at work functions.
That doesn't mean you shouldn't drink — in fact, as commenters noted on the Friday post, not drinking often raises more eyebrows than drinking does. (We agree with the commenters: please do not be that person who asks people: why aren't you drinking? Also, ladies who don't drink — any tips or experiences you'd like to share re: not drinking?) Which, we suppose, means that you are best advised to get a glass — of anything — and hold onto it throughout the night. (Or, at the very least, practice a 1:1 rule — one glass of wine/liquor, one glass of water or soda.)
(While we're giving advice: please, please do not post pictures of yourself drunk on Facebook. Do not let your friends post pictures of you drunk. Yesssss, sure, you look adorable and yessss, sure, it's hilarious. Strangely enough, though, that prospective employer or the employer looking to make cuts doesn't think so.)
{related: we rounded up 10 great mocktail recipes}
Finally, on drinking alcohol in the office: I remember being very surprised, years ago, when a former colleague casually admitted to regularly drinking at her office desk, in that “home stretch” from 7pm – quittin' time. I don't think she drank to excess, but still, it really shocked me — perhaps because I had always had a rule against drinking alone, but perhaps because she was so successful and well-regarded at the job. Obviously, this kind of thing happened all the time in the Mad Men era — but does it still happen now? What has your experience been?
What to Do If You're a Woman Who Drinks Too Much
Consider Quitting Drinking
There are a ton of books out there on sobriety right now, particularly for women — we've rounded up a few below.
You can also look into online programs like those from Rachel Hart (Take a Break), Gray Area Drinking, Tired of Thinking about Drinking, or look into sobriety journals like those from Soberish.
What to Drink Instead of Alcohol
And, of course, there are a ton of wonderful seltzers, fake alcohols, and other low- or non-alcoholic additions to help you drink a lot less…
Some of our favorite non-alcoholic drinks and things to add to plain seltzer (we love our Sodastream!) include:
Our Best Tips for Moderating Alcohol Intake
Here are some products to help you with moderation:
Pictured above, some ideas on how to moderate your drinking: Caloric Cuvee, [sold out] but similar) and Wine-Trax; all $9-$19 at Amazon. I've also talked about how much I love the beautiful cocktail glasses from The History Company because they're generally smaller!
Stock image via Stencil (woman in suit). Blue martini glass via Katfry LLC (Kat's wedding cocktail). (Originally pictured: New York City, 17 May 08, originally uploaded to Flickr by flickr4jazz.)
Liz
I have never liked the taste of alcohol enough to drink to excess. Sorry.
legalicious07
Amen, sister!
anon
Lotta questions there. 1) Do you drink to excess? Yes.
2) Why do you think that is? Combo of liking the taste, liking the effect of the drink, and so forth. Unwinding/stress relief is definitely part of it.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? During a school night: If we’re drinking, splitting a bottle of wine with the hubby. During a weekend night: having a few martinis, then splitting a bottle of wine (or, um, 2) with the hubby or other friends.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? Love clear tequila, Hendricks gin. Also a fan of a good Malbec, Rioja, Zinfandel, Shiraz, or other red wine.
3c: what do you toast to? Nothing particular. Usually to good friendships or a great marriage. Occasionally to work success, occasionally to work defeats.
4: On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it? Yes, we have. We’ve stopped drinking daily and, having realized that we CAN do that, stopped worrying about it beyond that.
trial lawyer
Ditto, but after our going dry experiment I’ve cut back to one glass of wine per “school night.”
I also do a lot of after work happy hours with friends and business folks. 1 – 2 glasses of wine at those events.
Hard liquor is just too risky and I can’t navigate happy hour handshakes with those silly martini glasses, so it’s red wine for me.
I don’t drink anything “girlie” at work events — no cosmos, no white wine, no spritzers, nothing fruity.
Eva
No white wine? Yikes, can we discuss this more? I don’t really like red, but can certainly drink it if it’s deemed much more appropriate.
Bree
I’m also curious as to whether other people attach a stigma to white wine. I greatly prefer red wine, but generally drink white wine at business functions because it’s easier to navigate — ie, doesn’t stain your lips or teeth awkwardly while you’re trying to have a serious conversation.
Anyone else have a different take on this? Tips for red wine not staining lips/teeth (that is, if you are a generally light-lipped gal like me… I recognize this may be less of an issue for people who wear a lot of dark lipstick…)?
Kat
As someone who has had red wine spilled all over my beige Brooks Brothers suit by a very drunk summer associate — I see no stigma in white wine.
Bree
RIP nice suit… :-(
trial lawyer
Let me clarify. I like white wine, but have been mocked a few times for ordering it. I practice and hence drink with “manly men” types and I’m a rare woman. When I’m out with other “lady lawyers” I drink white or red or whatever.
Thoughts on appropriateness of drinking a beer at a work-related function? I rarely see women do it, but I do love beer.
3L
Really curious Kat, was that summer associate offered a job at the end of the summer?!
Kat
I should clarify that I was a summer associate also when this happened. This was at the after party (maybe the after-after-party — we had them in those days) and I think it was primarily just the summer associates. The red-wine-spiller was one of my best friends at the time, so I kept quiet about the spill — went from looking down at my suit in utter shock to grabbing her arm and her bag and dragging her to a taxi to get her out of there. She was offered a job at the end of the summer.
Shayna
I think that generally speaking wine is seen as more girly, beer as casual, mixed drinks (cocktails) as even girlier (especially the ones that you have to give a recipe to the bartender for him to make it), and straight liquor is seen as impressive… Not right, but those are the attitudes out there…
I haven’t noticed a difference between people’s attitudes toward white and red wine, but I don’t drink red wine (migraines), so it never even occcurred to me
Legally Brunette
I think white wine is considered more of a girly drink because it’s lighter than red wine, more sweet, etc. I’m particularly thinking of wines like a Riesling or a Gewurtzdemeiner (sp). I can’t imagine that there is a stigma to it though, people at my firm are pretty evenly split btw white and red wine at happy hours. But I’m a red wine girl myself, I just like it better.
M
I’m also a red kind of girl, but I tend to drink white wines at events in case of any accidents: I don’t want to worry about anyone knocking my elbow and ruining either my dress or someone else’s outfit. I consider it defensive drinking.
Eponine
It depends. I get a little judgy of people who only drink sweet drinks. So if you’re ordering a sweet dessert wine because it’s yummy, I’m probably lumping you in with all the chocolate and apple “martini” drinkers. If you know wines and you order intelligently, no problem with ordering white. And of course if you are eating a meal you should order whichever wine goes well with your food.
Anonymous
Funny – I much prefer red over white, but only drink white at work events so as to avoid purple teeth.
T
I rarely drink, but when I do I’m a beer in a bottle kinda girl. I currently work in mfg, so for the rare work function its not a problem. I’m also a 1L at night. Is there a stigma in ordering just a beer in the law world?
lulu
I don’t know if there is a stigma to ordering a beer, but I’ve never seen it done outside of a bbq or casual in-office event. (I’m a lawyer.)
On the red versus white debate, I am a red wine drinker 95% of the time, but when I’m at a work function, I go for white wine for the reasons that people have mentioned–and know men who do the same. Although I tease my mom about white wine being girly, the real issue is what she drinks; I have never truly though that white wine was girly, except perhaps when I was still learning to appreciate wine.
RR
I hope not. I’m a beer in a bottle girl too. And I’m a litigator in BigLaw. I think it looks sillier to order something you obviously don’t like to try to look more sophisticated (of course, if you like it, go for it). That said, I wouldn’t ever order a pink wine or a fruity cocktail at a work function.
s-k-s
I’ve seen both men and women ordering beer at many a work funciton – maybe b/c I’m in the midwest, but I don’t think anyone would bat an eye. At nicer events, the bartender will put it in a glass.
LakeSide
Bah. I’m a girl, and I’m the first one to order a Guinness or drink out of a beer bottle at a work function. I like beer better than wine. There is nothing wrong with ordering beer in the law world.
MM
Maybe it depends on your practice or city, but I think a lot of my colleagues drink beer. I wouldn’t think twice about it.
MM
I’m definitely curious about how to respond to questions about not drinking. I don’t drink for religious reasons (Muslim, but I don’t wear hijab so it’s not “obvious” that I’m Muslim), and I am not particularly interested in “hiding” the fact that I don’t drink. I just drink Diet Coke or juice or whatever suits my fancy that day. But people do often notice. When people ask, I generally go out of my way to explain why (socially, too, but especially at work-related or networking functions) because I don’t want people to assume that I’m pregnant. Is this the right approach? I don’t want people to make assumptions about me (young, newly married), but I also don’t want to come across as judge-y or a religious nut.
Anonymous
Im not drinking (part of my low cal, low carb diet). I just drink alot of diet coke, with a lemon or lime, and no one ever says a word.
Eponine
@ MM – it’s sort of a rude question and people shouldn’t ask why you don’t drink, but if you don’t mind answering, a simple “oh, I’m Muslim, actually” is the best response. I think you’re right that some people would speculate that you’re pregnant, and if you just answered “for religious reasons” you’d either get follow up questions or people would wonder if you’re Mormon, which probably brings with it even more undeserved prejudices than being Muslim does. But I don’t think you need any explanation beyond a short, honest answer.
lulu
One note on that study–the “overachieving” subjects only had to have a college degree…so the headline was terribly misleading in a world where having a B.A. is practically a prerequisite to obtaining any non-retail/restaurant/hospitality job.
As for the questions, I don’t think I drink excessively. Most of the time I have a glass or two of wine (weekday or weekend). If I go out to a bar/club I might have 3 drinks, but rarely more–mostly because of the cost. (I would rather spend my money on clothes!)
As for the reason for the phenomenon, I think it is a combination of disposable income/little non-work responsibility and dealing with the stresses of work. I know that my glass of wine can easily turn into half a bottle after a tough week.
Oh, and as for drinking at work, I drink a small glass of wine if we are having a cocktail hour at the office, and sometimes take that glass back to my desk, but as a general matter, it would never occur to me to drink at work. Reminds me of a high school math teacher who was rumored to fill her coffee cup with scotch.
Shayna
good call – I think every high school has one of those! Definitely don’t want to go there…
75
In law school, Professor Casner aslways advised: keep a bottle of schnaps in the office and pull it out with nice glasses when clients sign a will. I thought that was lovely advice, but I have never followed it. On the whole, alcohol and a law office are a bad combination.
It is said that trial lawyers drink a lot, and I am sure that is true. It is an occupational disease of the trial lawyer. As to drinking at a professional function, in this part of the country that is not done, with a very few exceptions. At business lunches, everyone here drinks iced tea. I think that is a wise and good rule.
Limiting our after hours drinking is terribly important – as to the intake of empty calories, as to preserving our brain cells, and as to preserving our personal and professional reputations. Any attorney would thinks she might have an alcohol problem should immediately seek help. Nothing ruins a law practice as totally as alcohol abuse.
Anonymous
You must tell me what part of the country this is where alcohol is rare at professional functions. I might consider moving there for that reason alone. As someone who doesn’t drink due to religious reasons, I find the prevalence of alcohol at every social event a bit much.
Anonymous
2nd. please tell, because not only do i not drink, i don’t like going places where drinking is the main activity.
legalicious07
I completely agree!
Drinking has no sway for me. No one in my immediate family drinks (perhaps because both my parents had grown up seeing their own fathers drink to excess at certain times), and I wasn’t one of those high school teens who spent my weekends playing drinking games. In fact, I never even had my first taste of alcohol until my 1L summer working for a firm. (And keep in mind that I took several years off between college and law school.) So for me, it’s just not a big deal. I don’t like the taste. I don’t like the smell. I don’t like the way it makes people act when I’m around them. I agree with George Bernard Shaw here when he says that (presumably excessive) “Alcohol produces artificial happiness, artificial courage, artificial gaiety, artificial self-satisfaction…”
The bottom line is — I don’t judge someone else’s decision to drink, but neither should I have to justify my decision not to do so.
M
Work hard, play hard. Kinda sums it up.
C
Well, I don’t drink due to religious reasons. The women I work with drink casually. I don’t think they regularly drink to excess (even if they feel like it during tax season).
KLo
I lie and tell people I’m allergic to alcohol. I grew up with parents who didn’t drink and a lot of tee-totallers in my family. And funny enough, there aren’t ANY embarrassing drunk pictures of me to put on Facebook. And I’m still a lot of fun.
MelD
When you tell people, do they just leave you alone or ask more questions? I really am allergic and can’t tell you how many people refuse to believe it and persist in asking 3-4 follow up questions to figure out whether I’m really allergic.
KLo
I tell them that “unattractive things happen” and that I turn red and get puffy. Because I actually DO have a sensitivity to a few types of drinks and decided never to learn which ones were which, I can be somewhat honest. I’m pretty open, so if I keep the truth from people, they tend to back off. Maybe you could be a bit more curt? I normally just get the response “I’m so sorry” to which I usually reply “I’m not” with kind of a wicked smile :)
Anonymous
I grew up in a teetotaller family and never somehow feel the need to have a drink…I can appreciate a glass of good red wine, but equally happy if I never ever drink again.
Work: No drinking in my office, unless one of the top bosses decides it’s cocktail hour at the local bar 5pm Friday…I just skip it as I prefer to get home and unwind.
The issue is friends (well, not the close ones) & acquaintances on casual nights out etc – so I just nurse my one glass/pass it on to husband who happily will finish it for me.
Daisy
When I worked in litigation, the excessive drinking was brutal. I start with one cocktail or glass of wine & then shift to club soda with a lime. People assume I’m drinking vodka tonic/soda & don’t ask questions.
trial lawyer
I’ve used that trick, too!
Bree
Big fan of this!
Anon
(1) Excess? Very rarely. Usually only on a bachelorette party or other pre-planned big girls’ night out; otherwise, the “excess” is just the dull headache the next morning after having one too many glasses of wine over a very long dinner with friends.
(2) Why? My group of girlfriends doesn’t all get together too often, so when we do it’s usually a bach party or a big deal for us. The other “excess” I mentioned, too much wine at dinner is usually the result of a good, leisurely meal with great company and ordering that 3rd or 4th glass that I don’t really need. Kind of like the “time flies when you’re having fun” cliche – the wine glass drains quickly when you’re having fun!
(3a) School nights? During nice weather, my husband and I will often have a glass of wine or a beer on our balcony and chat about our day. Many (but not all) nights we will have a glass of wine with dinner and a little extra after. If we are drinking on a weeknight, I’d say we typically drink .5-.75 of a bottle of wine, sometimes the whole thing.
(3b) Likes? I am a pretty picky drinker. I primarily drink wine. Irish/English ciders such as Magners or Strongbow are favorites if I’m at a non-wine kind of place. Beer and hard liquor are not typically my thing, although Iwill have them if I’m in the mood for it when we are out. I think the extent of hard liquor at home is Bloody Marys at our weekly Sunday football parties or margaritas for a BBQ.
(3c) Toasts? Anything that deserves it!
(4) Worried? I think I used to worry about my drinking more. Europeans drink wine daily, and it’s considered to be part of the culture…in American some people consider daily drinking alcoholism. As long as it doesn’t affect your personality, your ability to get up in the morning and your function as a contributing member of society, I think it’s totally fine to enjoy a glass or two of wine at night. Two glasses of wine over the course of 2-3 hours when I get home has zero impact for me on any of those things. Now, if you’re pounding whiskey nightly to escape your problems, then that’s something else entirely.
Bree
Do you think you’re “judged” for ordering cider, the same way you would be judged for ordering something pink or fruity?
Anon
I don’t order cider at professional functions, i.e. those where you wear a suit and network, ass-kiss, hob-nob, etc. I love wine and will drink that at professional functions.
As for casual office functions, like a Friday happy hour at the Irish pub around the corner, I will order a Magners, in a glass over ice (the traditional way it is served). I don’t care for the overly sweet domestic ciders, and I’ve actually had several colleagues ask about the Magners (and consequently turned them into dry Irish/English cider drinkers).
RoadWarriorette
Another cider fan here! I love Strongbow, and far prefer it to beer. I prefer it draft style, and it actually looks like beer so unless you stood with me as I ordered you have no idea I’m not drinking beer. For those that do ask, once they taste it, they realize it’s no girly drink :)
Chicago K
Another cider fan here – my favorite being K’s brand.
I don’t find many places to even order them – outside of an irish pub.
Not a beer drinker at all, but cider can be nice in the fall or even those cool summer nights around the campfire. :)
CS
1) Do you drink to excess? sometimes yes
2) Why do you think that is? if it’s excess, i’m out w/ friends, had a tough day/week, etc. and it’s a good way to unwind.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? if i drink during the week, it’s a happy hour w/ coworkers (maybe go a couple times a month) or i’ll have a glass of 2 at home in a given night, by myself. this is usually only if i had a very bad day, need to lose some inhibitions, etc. I may do this everyday for 2 wks, and then not do it for 8 whole weeks. It’s sporadic. As for the wkend, i can go a whole weekend not drinking. my boyfriend isn’t a big drinker so i think that has a lot to do with it. if i have a girls night, it’s def a lot of alcohol. for instance, this wkend is a bachelorette party so i expect it to be a very “excess drinking” night :)
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? wine! sweet ones, reisling, pinot grigio, and some light mixes. i also enjoy chianti. a light beer every once in awhile. and cranberry/vodka’s when i’m out.
3c: what do you toast to?) getting through the day, having a job (had a lot of layoffs), a wedding, engagement, baby, a breakup…
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? maybe a little, but i’m still young and i have my binges especially when single. What have you done about it? nothing, i’ve never drank excessively alone, i can go days, or weeks without it, so it was never an issue. but it’s funny when I go home at xmas it always occurs to me as i reflect on it, i realize i drink every day of that entire 2 week break! hahaha, family :)
divaliscious11
Lots going on here –
1) Do you drink to excess? – No
2) Why do you think that is? – I like a buzz, but I don’t like to be drunk
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? a glass of wine, maybe 2, a glass of champagne or two, a beer or two, or a vodka gimlet or 2
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? – see above, like lagers, red wines (merlots/malbecs) Perrier jouet, but I also like a nice Cava
3c: What do you toast to?) Whatever is in my gratitude journal for the day!
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? No
divaliscious11
Oh, and I’ll have ONE drink at a work function and no drinks in the office if I am expected to do additional work
Dawn
I am a trial attorney, so maybe that influences my drinking more than I think (I have noticed we are always the last ones at a work cocktail party).
I drink primarily during the week, after work/at the end of work with work collegues or at functions. I occassionally drink on weekends socially. I do drink more than I should sometimes, usually when drinking with men, who as we know can drink more. I feel pressure to keep up with them, and often, my glass is filled (or a refill is brought) without even asking me (even if I still have wine to drink). I also feel like the time I spend drinking with collegues or friends is often some of the most valuable conversation time I have with them, so I’ll stretch it by having another glass with them.
When available, I drink something like vodka/cranberry and initially ask the bartender to make my drinks weak–they have always complied. It helps, a lot. Typically, though, my collegues drink wine, so that’s what I drink. I’ve considered whether I have a drinking problem (which I define as drinking interfering with either my work or important relationships), and the answer is, sometimes, when I’m depressed (yes, it’s self-medicating). So, I now attempt to avoid alcohol when I’m depressed. Otherwise, I have no problem not drinking. It’s really more of a way to connect socially with people. I have, on a Friday, taken a glass of wine back to my desk to finish a few things after a happy hour. And I’ve had a glass of wine on the weekends while working on something.
(the other) Dasha
1) Do you drink to excess?
Not intentionally, and only rarely unintentionally. Vitamin B helps.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night?
I don’t really drink on school nights, unless its a “bar night” type situation with school/work friends, in which case weekend rules apply. Maybe a glass of wine or a beer in a social situation or after a very, very stressful day. On the weekends, if I drink, its usually no more than 3-4 drinks spaced an hour apart – the total number depends on how long I’m out, but I rarely exceed four. I generally don’t get too drunk this way. Rarely I’ll do shots at someone else’s suggestion – I’m not a party pooper.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer?
Lately I like French ’75s and anything else with champagne in it.
3c: what do you toast to?
Nothing in particular.
4: On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
No. Most people I know tell me I don’t drink enough. Which might be true.
Midori
I grew up in a denomination that condemns the consumption of alcohol, but have since shifted to a more moderate position. I am still careful about how much I have at business-y functions just because I’m kind of a lightweight (and control freak?), but for the most part I prefer just to drink in my own home. There’s nothing quite like a glass of red wine or a nice gin and cranberry or gin martini and a good book or crossword to wind down before bed. In general, though, my limit is one drink. I usually don’t want more than that, whether it’s the calories or the dizzies.
Alcohol at work? Not in my firm culture. If/when I have my own office, there will be a bottle of bourbon or like stuff for pulling out after big wins, heartbreaks, or milestones. I like the will-signing ceremonial shot–my old clinic prof used to do that, and I thought it very classy of him.
Chicago K
Love to have a glass of wine with a good book, while just relaxing at home by myself. Doesn’t happen too often, but I am with ya!
I’m also partial to wine in the bathtub! :P
NYC
This is really interesting. Thanks for posting, Kat.
Big law litigation associate here…I like drinking in general and do occasionally drink to excess. I think this is partly attributable to work stress and partly to my social life. I rarely drink alone and plans with friends usually involve wine or cocktails. I limit how much I drink during the week. I find that now that I’m in my 30s, even one drink on a week night slows me down the next day. Either because I can’t recover as well or because it is no longer possible to get through the work day hungover (because of increased responsibility). Calories are an issue too, of course. But over the weekend, I usually have at least a couple of drinks, with a preference for white wine and bourbon based cocktails. I avoid red wine because of migraines. I occasionally worry that I drink too much and will go through period of time when I limit myself to two drinks a day.
Elizabeth
I have gone through law school and my first few years of being a criminal defense attorney while rarely drinking. Not for ideological or abuse reasons, I just don’t like it much and usually am a D.D.. I have fielded the almost non-stop questions of “why aren’t you drinking?!?!” over and over again.
To avoid all the questions, if there are mixers I will just mix myself a juice drink (cranberry, grapefruit, sprite etc.) and people assume that I’ve put alcohol in it. But definitely always have some sort of drink. Shirley temples are also delicious and don’t look non-alcoholic.
I’ve also found that people are less judgmental when they need a ride home at 2 am and you’re the only sober one left!
SUCL 3L
My favorite response to when someone asks why I’m not drinking or only drinking moderately? “Because some needs to make sure your drunk butt gets home safe!”
L
I don’t drink. Never really have. I generally don’t care for the taste and, perhaps too, I like to be in control. I do find though that the peer pressure to drink now (early-30s) is about as strong as it was in college. Neighbors invite us over for a beer, co-workers “need a drink” at the cocktail hour, a glass of wine “goes better” with a nice meal than a diet coke. It can be frustrating and every time I have to say “I don’t drink” I feel like it either comes across as a judgment on the other person or causes people to think I’m a recovering alcoholic. It’s neither–I’m just an anomoly in a family of people who love their wine.
LizM
I don’t drink nearly as much as many of my collegues. It’s a combination cost/calories/I-don’t-like-being-drunk-except-with-people-I’m-totally-comfortable-thing (there’s a long, personal story there).
I tend to drink club soda and lime and people assume its vodka. If people notice AND are rude enough to ask, I usually just say its personal. People generally get the idea, but if they keep pressing (and it’s not someone I can blow off) I use the calorie reason.
One word of warning for women, though – I had the “personal” thing backfire on me at one job because I stopped drinking completely, and also started a diet that involved drinking a lot of water, which meant a lot of bathroom trips. A gossipy office-mate was between my office and the bathroom, and before I knew it, she put two and two together, and told the entire office I was pregnant (which I wasn’t).
L
1) Do you drink to excess?
Not any more. I used to occasionally, in college and law school.
2) Why do you think that is?
Hate hangovers (those happen after 3 drinks for me now). Also, I went dry (a) while studying for the bar, and (b) during my 2 pregnancies. I am nursing now so won’t have more than 1.5-2.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night?
During the week – 1 glass of wine while making and eating dinner, maybe once every 2 weeks. On the weekend, 2 drinks/glasses if we go out to eat, which is maybe once a month or once every 6 weeks (you can tell we have young kids, yes?).
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer?
I am a big fan of German/Austrian rieslings and gewurtztraminers. Like Belgian white beers and #9. Also like amaretto sours, cosmos and all those other girly drinks.
3c: what do you toast to?
Nothing.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
No, never. Although I did swear to myself after having about 10-12 drinks at my 22nd bday party to never, ever drink that much again (and I never have).
Clerky
I drink about 3-4 glasses a week, sometimes less and sometimes more depending on how busy our weekends are. Oddly, I enjoy drinking way more than my husband. Once, I was alone at home for a week when my husband was out of town and I drank a glass of wine or 2 every night. I have heard about the “don’t drink alone” rule and so it made me think twice about doing that again.
I definitely don’t drink excessively, particularly when I compare my answer against some of the other posters, but I also know myself well enough to know that I enjoy the taste of wine and I don’t want to get too comfortable with that habit.
I also come from a family of non-drinkers (and my mother in law thinks people who drink are “bad”) so I never drink with family around.
Anonymous
1) Do you drink to excess?
Nope. If I have a dinner party, I’ll drink to perhaps tipsy, but that’s generally as far as it goes (and I usually switch back to water at some point in the evening).
2) Why do you think that is?
I’ve always been wary of drunken craziness. That’s not to say that I’ve never gotten way too drunk — I have, but it’s on a handful of occasions. (Literally, I think I can count them on one hand.) And the last one was several years ago.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night?
“School nights” I often have one drink after dinner (usually scotch or bourbon with soda). (I count my calories, so it’s measured and accounted for!) Weekend nights I might have more than one, or split wine with my fiance over dinner. We really barely ever go out to bars, and when I have it means maybe 3 drinks.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
Nope. I drink relatively frequently (at least in the phase I’m in right now — six months ago I might have one drink on the weekends and none on weekdays, but there were times before that when I had a glass of wine fairly regularly), but in small quantities. I’m generally in that “1-2 drinks per day is healthier than teetotaling or going overboard” range, with a slight uptick on most weekends.
Associate
It seems every organized law related event I attend is some form of a happy hour. Are other professsions like this?
Anon
I find networking events are more fun when alcohol is involved. It makes people more talkative/less shy.
Ru
it appears engineering is that way, too, especially if the event is planned after 4pm. it makes me really uncomfortable – why would you want to drink in front of people who are judging you professionally?
Jill
1) Do you drink to excess? – Sometimes
2) Why do you think that is? – Stress relief, like the taste, plus it’s just social. Really, what else is there to do with colleagues after work, if you’re not going to head to happy hour and lift a glass? Like another reader said, work hard, play hard.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? on a “school night” I often join colleagues for drinks or half-price wine at a nearby restaurant. If I go out to dinner with my hubby or friends, I’ll often have a glass or two of wine or beer.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? – beer, red wine or sometimes white in the summer, vodka tonic, seltzer with lemon and Canton (a yummy ginger liqueour that is relatively low in ETOH content).
3c: What do you toast to? To life in general. Sometimes to a work victory or other success. Sometimes to the day being over and no longer being in the office.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? Yes. But then I just cut back for a while.
pinkrobot
1) Do you drink to excess?
rarely, but I do drink frequently
2) Why do you think that is?
because it can be fun.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night?
work night: Happy Hour with coworkers or an office hang out/party. Probably once every other week. Drinking in the office is a common occurrence in silicon valley. The more start up like ( or desperately trying to be seen as start up like), the larger the in house liquor & beer collection. The more corporate the software company, the less frequently engineering drinks. There’s also a correlation between the number of hours engineers are implicitly expected to work and the amount of in office drinking (long + weekends if start up, 10-6 if staid corporate). I follow a 3:1 rule, 3 oz of water to 1 oz of ethanol at 50% (100 proof) . In general, I cap it at 3 oz ethanol a night and no one has ever raised an eyebrow.
weekend: glass of wine with dinner. If we eat out, and there is a really unusual cocktail I might try it.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer?
I’m a fan of Hemmingway’s Death in the Afternoon, Parma (pomegranate liqueur), cidar, sparkling wines, Malbecs & Cameneres. A thimble sized amount of a good 20 year aged scotch is a nice treat too.
3c: what do you toast to?
toasting is generally optional, but if someone proposes one, Ill play along.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
Nope. As long as one can stop drinking when it stops tasting good, and it isn’t impeding any aspect of your life, it is not a problem.
Mel
On school nights, 2 or 3 light beers or glasses of wine, but only if we go out and do something, which is only probably one night a week. During the week at home I’d rather eat than drink the extra calories. On the weekend, maybe 3 drinks on Friday and Saturday. If there’s a big event…bachelorette party, wedding, birthday etc. maybe a few more.
2.5L
As a law student, I suspect my answers to be a little different. Prior to law school, I worked in the Capitol and found my lifestyle didn’t change.
1) Do you drink to excess? – Yes
2) Why do you think that is? – It’s what all the other 22-27 year olds with disposable income (or so much debt it doesn’t matter) and limited responsibility do Thurs-Sat nights.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? School night- splitting a bottle of wine/ two cocktails with dinner with friends. Weekend- I know this sounds bad, but, binge drinking.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? – Scotch, Red Wine (zinfandel, pinot noir), G/T
3c: What do you toast to? Whoever bought the drinks.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? Sometimes. I think law school is work/hard play hard so I’m just trying to fulfill both ends of the equation. I assume when my lifestyle changes so will my social habits.
Ellen
Med school was like this too. I think there’s something about being in a relatively high pressure academic setting that makes people do this. We’d study like crazy, drink like crazy. Now that I’m a chief surgical resident, a wife and a mother to a 16 month old I don’t have the time, energy or desire to drink to excess. I feel bombed after a single cocktail, which I usually consume prior to a meal out on a weekend night. If I’m feeling really naughty, I have a glass of wine with dinner to follow.
Anonymous
1) Do you drink to excess? Yes.
2) Why do you think that is? I think the biggest reason is that I live in San Francisco and am super interested in food and wine. I am invited to a lot of tastings, events, etc where there’s just a lot of alcohol. I turn more down than accept and still find myself at them several times a month. Drinking is just big in my circle of friends.
I’m also a trial attorney and my husband has a demanding job as well, so alcohol does help relieve stress.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? It varies. I do try to stick to no more than 2 on a school night because it does impact how I sleep. My husband and I will split a bottle on the weekends if I cook a nice meal. and if we’re at a tasting, all bets are off (public transportation is our friend)
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? Primarily wine…boutique CA producers. I like Belgian style beers. I rarely drink the hard stuff – an occassional shot of chilled limoncello is about all I’ll do.
3c: what do you toast to?
Anything – good friends, mostly
4: On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
Yes. I have taken steps back at various points in my life. Booking the calendar with non-alcohol focused events helps – hiking or trips to museums, brunches, dinners at ethnic restaurants, like Indian or dim sum, where the alcohol selection usually sucks and doesn’t really add anything to the experience.
Lynette
1) Do you drink to excess? No.
2) Why do you think that is? I don’t like that out of control feeling that you get while drunk and I don’t like dealing with hangovers
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? A glass or two of wine with dinner. Cocktails and “hard liquors” are saved for the weekend.
(3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? , Pinot Grigios or Chardonays during the summer. Used to like Reislings but now find most of them too sweet. Zinfindels or Malbacs during colder weather. Love Old Rasputin Imperial Stout, vodka martinis and bellinis during a nice brunch. I’ll enjoy an occasional shot of Blanton’s.
Fine, and 3c: what do you toast to?) Any type of good news and or fortune.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it? Don’t think I drink too much.
And what’s with the “never drink alone” rule? I’m single and love to cook, so more often than not, I manage to cook a nice meal for myself when I get home from work and enjoy wine with my dinner. I don’t invite friends over to share a meal everytime I cook so……
JJ
Amen to questioning the “never drink alone” rule. My husband travels Monday through Friday. I’m an attorney and love cooking use it for stress-release during the week when I have time (and I get to cook everything my husband won’t eat). If I’ve had a stressful day and I cook a good meal, I’m going to have a glass or two of wine with it and not feel guilty.
JJ
“I’m an attorney and love cooking [and] use it for stress-release during the week when I have time (and I get to cook everything my husband won’t eat). ”
Gah. Sadly, I haven’t had a glass tonight and have no excuse for my typing/grammar…
LizM
For me, the “never drink alone” rule is really more “don’t get drunk alone” rule. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with having a drink or two at the end of a long day, regardless of whether someone else is there with you.
SUCL 3L
(1) Rarely – Suprisingly, I’ve found that being in law school past my 1L year has killed my tolerance. I think this is because I got so busy during my 2L year, and even more so during my 3L year, that I don’t have the kind of time to party it up like I used to in college (I went to a big state school that was known for being a party school).
(2) Anything close to excessive drinking usually occurs on a night out on the weekends with friends. There’s a favorite bar in downtown that my friends and I like going to – outdoors with lots of tables and chairs, lights in the trees, and usually a jazz band playing. Something about good friends, good music, and a couple leisurely hours that makes the drinks flow.
(3)(a) On a school night – usually only 1 and at most 2. On a non-school night – typically 2-3, but could be more depending on the occassion/atmosphere.
(3)(b) Out to dinner, it’s usually a glass of red wine. At home, probably a dark beer (perfect for those nights when I have a taco craving). Out on the town – my signature drink is a whiskey and coke.
(3)(c) Anything worth toasting to – successes and good friends!
(4) Only on mornings when I wake up with a wicked hangover.
M
I’m a recovering alcoholic (sober for more than 2 years) but when I drank a lot at after work happy hours, I was definitely not the only one partaking in many drinks. It is not for me to say if someone else has a drinking problem, but even with just a year of sobriety, I look at the behavior of some of the people I used to play hard with, and it worries me. These are all incredibly smart, accomplished people, but I myself was remarkably functional even in my worst drinking days, so it’s very hard to say.
I don’t drink at all now, obviously. I have no problem telling people who are pushing booze at work events I don’t drink, and if they push, I will tell them the reason why I don’t drink. Usually they are embarassed. For me, being a recovering alcoholic is not something I’ll go out of my way to talk about, but I am not ashamed of it, nor do I feel the need to try and hide it. Yes, I am aware there is a huge stigma, but alcoholism won’t become less stigmatized if I don’t tell the truth about it.
My co-workers don’t know (it’s never come up) and I’ve never told my boss directly, but I am 99.9% sure he knows. I must have the best boss in the world, because he has been incredibly (subtlely) supportive and he has never sold me out on the issue.
Shayna
1) Do you drink to excess? No
2) Why do you think that is? Wine gives me migraines, and I have a major fear of being impaired and saying/doing something idiotic that keeps me from having more than a single drink – that and my stomach is only so big – if I drink more than one reasonably sized beer or cocktail then I can’t eat dinner… or more to the point, I will be eating something, so I really can only fit in one glass of whatever
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? “school night” – none, weekend night… maybe a beer with friends, maybe a cocktail, maybe nothing… nothing is more likely than not – I used to be fat, and although I don’t count calories, a diet coke with zero calories beats a 300 calorie mixed drink!
(3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? Fine, and 3c: what do you toast to?) I like Magic Hat (almost) Pale Ale, other ales, Stella Artois beer, Baileys Irish Cream, Kahlua & Cream, if I want something sweet, honey mead wine if I’m bringing wine somewhere (grape based wine gives me migraines)
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it? Not a worry… If I have 3 drinks a month that’s a lot for me…
Shayna
Sorry – forgot the “toast” question — Usually toasting to family being together, friends seeing each other, overcoming little failures, achieving big and small successes that differentiate each day from the one before
Janet
1) Do you drink to excess?
I do, on occassion. A few times per year, although in the past I drank to excess much more frequently (and to a much larger excess).
2) Why do you think that is?
I like the taste, and enjoy the ability to “let go” of some of my worries for a short time — it’s fun. I have stopped drinking to excess as often since I moved in with my significant other — he is less of a drinker, and it’s not fun — and quite embarassing — to be the only one drunk. Also I used to be able to drink cheap alcohol until I blacked out (oh, college), and wake up able to face the day. Now, a 3rd glass of wine puts me over the “hangover” edge.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night?
A beer or two with dinner if I’m out to eat is common on a “school night” but I rarely if ever have a drink if we’re eating at home. Standard weekends are the same — drinks with dinner if we’re out. A few times a year I will “go out drinking” and tend to indulge more on these special occasions.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer?
I recently discovered Malbec, but Zinfendel has always been a favorite. I love good quality tequila, and have a soft spot for spiced rum. I love stouts in the winter and belgian beers in the summer.
3c: what do you toast to? A really great day or a really rough day, and any special occasion.
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
Yes, I have worried. My father is an alcoholic, so I have thought long and hard about whether I am self-medicating with alcohol to relieve anxiety. Also, I used to frequently drink to excess, and made some very bad decisions while drunk, which gave me pause. However, I’ve been largely relieved to find that since I’ve been a “grown-up” (out of school), I rarely drink to excess and I don’t miss it. The fact that I don’t need to drink has been a huge relief, and I’ve largely stopped worrying about it.
Lawgirl
I have, sadly, have had a glass of wine (alone) before my hour-long commute home at night… It does help, after a really stressful day. No, I don’t drink out of 7-11 coffee travelers cups in my office, though. LOL. But if I worked until 10pm every night, I can relate to Kat’s officemate who has a 7pm drink at her desk… I’d do the same if I were working at home. Hmmm…. Maybe Europeans have their late dinners and drinks for a reason..?
AC
1) Do you drink to excess? Yes.
2) Why do you think that is? I’m a 3L at a southern school. It’s part of the lifestyle. I’m from a coastal city and I love sporting events, both lifestyles that tend to include alot of alcohol. I don’t really drink to relieve stress, just to have a good time.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? “School night” – During the year, I rarely drink on a school night (I only have class 3 days a week though) unless it’s for some kind of event. I’m not really a “drink a glass of wine alone to relax” kind of person, though that might be different, oddly enough, if I had a front porch. During the summer, I clerked at a big-for-my-coastal-city firm (where I will be working after graduation), where there was an event nearly every night, and drinking was usually encouraged and definitely accepted and expected. We clerks had a great time and for the most part, as long as we were not openly trashed to the point of embarrassment, it was all good. On the weekends in school, I generally get drunk one or two nights (when your weekend is Wednesday night through Sunday, it’s hard to drink every night).
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer? Bourbon, white wine, sometimes light beer and sometimes craft beer.
3c: what do you toast to? Anything or nothing.
4: On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? Not really. Like most people at Southern state schools, I binge drank regularly in college. I still drank 3-4 nights a week as a 1L and have gradually toned it down as I got older. I can already tell that the busy lifestyle I will have as a lawyer will leave me too tired for very many blowout nights and the hangovers that follow. And I’ve already mentioned that I don’t really drink alone or need/want a glass of wine to relax every night, so I anticipate limiting my drinking to a couple nights a week, and probably only getting drunk if there’s a special event or occasion.
As I mentioned, I’m from a coastal city in the South. While alot of the Bible belt is more uptight about drinking, my city is more of a mini New Orleans (in fact, we started Mardi Gras). Add to that the fishing, boating, beer-by-the-water culture and most firms are pretty fun places to work, with most people pretty into drinking. I would say “work hard, play hard” is definitely the motto.
KZ
are you from Mobile? I hear it’s a fairly neat town.
Anon
I would love to see a poll on perscription drug usage.
I was recently told by a classmate how useful ritalin is to help with studying. While I have never tried it (and don’t plan on ever doing it), I must admit that I find minor tranqualizers (for which I have a perscription) to be beyond helpful for sleep/relaxation after a stressful day. Nothing will calm my mind like they do. I hate taking them though, even with a doctor telling me too, because it just doesn’t feel right to like them so much. Also very helpful for those giant presentations at the office, really calms the nerves.
Would love to hear from other stressed out ladies if they have a similar conflict.
Lucy
I think probably a good 1/3 of my law school, and certainly at least 1/2 of the law review, took ritalin to study and before exams.
I didn’t and don’t. I always thought it was kinda like cheating, steroid-sy and all that. I wish they would ban them. I think it’s terribly unfair. Everyone does not have ADHD. If half the college age crowd qualifies, it’s not a disorder– it’s the norm.
(and yes, there may be some genuine cases out there, but believe me they do not make up the majority of people claiming the disorder.)
anon
I think a lot of it is boastfulness. there can’t possibly be as many people in my graduating class that took stimulants as there claimed to be. I think it’s just boys being boys, and pretending that they’re on the same drugs that their friends are on. I don’t tthink everyone’s actually doing it
anon
try beta blockers to calm your nerves without any ‘tranqualizer’ like effect. these will just help stop the physical effects of nervousness, like sweating, heart racing, voice shaking, etc., but without any sleepiness at all. it’s common for doctors to prescribe this for stage fright, or for big office presentations.
anon
i don’t see any problem w/ taking them as you’ve described. it’s like taking ambien to get to sleep. not really a big deal, many do it.
annie nonomous
1) Do you drink to excess?
sometimes, but not very often anymore
2) Why do you think that is?
social reasons – i’m still in law school, and it’s amazing how ingrained drinking is in the culture. there’s a bar night every week for the entire school, the law school is the only building on campus where drinking is allowed, it’s a “tradition” for the SBA representatives to pass out jello shots after the last finals 1L year, etc…
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night?
school night – one or two glasses of wine
“out” night – a couple of vodka/sodas and maybe a beer.
(3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer?
wine: tempranillo, malbec, pinot noir, barrolo, beajolais noveau, muscadet
for liquor, i like monopolowa vodka, woodford reserve bourbon (or if i can afford it, pappy van winkle), and cazadores tequila.
i’m from the pacific NW and along with wearing jeans to the opera, driving subarus, and loving rain, we have a proud tradition of microbrews – so i drink those! ninkasi is great, but it can really pack a wallop, so if i want more than one drink, i choose something else.
Fine, and
c: what do you toast to?)
whoever i’m with at the time
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it?
no, i am good at moderating myself – i only drink once a week or so, and those are usually “school nights”. My tolerance is low and the feeling I get the next day is never worth it. Plus, I think you only have to know one person with a drinking problem to notice how bad and ugly it can get.
Bets
Haha! I saw Falstaff last month–and yes, I wore jeans to the Opera. Gods, I love Seattle….
On a slightly more apropos note: I get seriously drunk maybe once a year–it usually takes that long for memories of the last epic hangover to wear off. ;)
rebecca
I’ve been reading this blog for several months now and this is the first time I’ve been motivated to comment. Not sure what that says about me. FYI, I’m 23, out of school, working at a nonprofit on a pretty low salary – so kind of an atypical demographic here.
1) Do you drink to excess? Yes.
2) Why do you think that is? Because I’m 23 and it’s fun. I rarely drank in college, for a variety of reasons, and am sort of making up for that now. I’m also somewhat introverted, and drinking lets me loosen up, but honestly …. I really do like getting drunk.
3a) What does a typical night of drinking look like for you, during a “school night” and during a weekend night? Weeknights I have a glass of wine with dinner about half the time, if I’m staying in. If I’m out with friends on a weeknight ( once a week or so), I’ll usually have 2, maybe 3. Weekends – I think I had four drinks on Saturday night, and I had an early dinner on top of that. Especially now that it’s warm I generally go out to a club/bar once a week, mostly to dance, and it’s more fun when you’re drinking.
3b: Any favorite cocktails, types or brands of wine, liquor or beer?
I love margaritas, and cosmos, as obnoxious as I feel when I order them. I like sangria and red wine. For cocktails I’m mostly a vodka girl. I’ve only recently started getting in to (i.e. tolerating) beer, and it’s still the kind of thing that I only drink when I’m eating nachos or a burger or some stereotypically salty bar food.
3c: what do you toast to?)
4) On the more serious side — have you ever worried that you drink too much? What have you done about it? No. I’ve only been drinking seriously/often for about a year, and nothing really bad has come of it so far. I’ve never made any really stupid decisions while drunk, I’m a stickler about not getting drunk on weeknights (I need my sleep), and through some weird twist in my biology I basically never get hungover. So if I didn’t enjoy being well-rested so much I probably COULD drink on weeknights, and the only problem I’d have would be the waking-up-in-the-morning-still-drunk part.
Presumably I’ll settle down a bit by the time I’m, I dunno, 30, but right now I have no debt and few responsibilities. If I’m gonna overindulge, it ought to be now.
anon-ny
responding to MM (couldn’t reply specifically above for some reason)- until very recently I was a non-drinker for religious reasons as well. I never made a big deal out of it and most people leave it be. I generally drink a Diet Coke or cranberry juice at cocktail parties and bars. Since I am originally from Utah people either figure out that I’m mormon and attribute the not drinking to that or they flat out ask. If someone asks why you aren’t drinking, tell them you are practicing muslim or for religious reasons and they will usually leave it alone.
That being said, I feel it is generally up to me to make other people comfortable that I am not judging them for drinking. As a summer associate and each time I have started at a new law firm with new co-workers, I feel I have to put in a little extra effort to make everyone comfortable with the fact that I’m still fun or cool or whatever even if I’m not drinking. This has been reinforced by a number of people telling me I am fun despite the fact I am not drinking (in other words, I can make a fool of myself without the assistance of alcohol, not sure if that is a good thing). Eventually, people become pretty protective about it and many will go out of their way to get me something or defend my non-drinking ways to others.
MM
Yeah, I didn’t intend for mine to post above, either. Commenting working a little weird for me today. Thanks for the response. I do try to be casual and make a little joke when I respond so I don’t come across as judge-y. But unlike you, I am unfortunately not naturally gregarious, so I can’t always put people at ease as quickly as I would like. (I do regularly go out to bars with friends, and they aren’t uncomfortable at all, but with colleagues and acquaintances it does become more awkward.) Also, I do dislike “having to” bring up my religion in daily conversation, because it often leads to long discussions of my religion, which feels inappropriate for the workplace. But that nonetheless seems preferable to letting people assume I’m pregnant.
Eponine
If you don’t want to bring it up, order club soda with a twist in a rocks glass. (Basically, that’s carbonated water with lemon on ice in a short glass.) Everyone will think it’s gin or vodka and tonic.
EmilyRyan
This is what I think: Drinking and binge drinking is a central part of the higher education (college) culture in the United States. A lot of people give up heavy drinking after college, but the “most educated” women have spent the longest time in this culture. This makes heavy drinking seem a) more normal and b) not like something you have to give up “after college” when you “grow up” (because “after college” you went to law school…and there was still plenty of time and incentives to keep partying).
Lucy
That’s very insightful.
I never thought of that.
Sharon
I couldn’t disagree more. This drinking culture that you all describe has absolutely never been a part of my work world, which is primarily MBA’s from top schools whom I assure you are just as educated as all you lawyers. Maybe every now and then people would go out for a drink after work, but it wasn’t “expected” socializing. And once everyone started having kids, those days were done with — people would rather go home with their families than go drinking. And I have never, ever been in a situation where someone would chastise someone for drinking white wine (even playfully) or comment that they weren’t drinking anything at all.
The only time I can think of that there has been excess drinking are at things like corporate retreats — but there’s never been any pressure to “drink like the men.” Yeah, a bunch of idiots get drunk because that’s what idiots do. But it’s not expected or applauded, and normally they have the good graces to be embarrassed afterwards.
Sorry, this seems a unique law culture thing to me. I have to say, it seems so dated / “Mad Men” to me.
v
My mid-size firm doesn’t have that culture either. I’m wondering if it’s a corporate law thing.
Shayna
I agree with Sharon — My first job in public accounting had beer or wine at the firm holiday party but other than that, there was a lot of food during tax season (we pretty much lived there January – April 15), and since then I’ve worked at the biggest exempt organizations in the country which are essentially international corporations, and never had that experience (and yes, we are highly educated, white collar, etc.)
Chicago K
It might also depend on what area of the country you are located in. I work for a Fortune 500 bank, also where most people have MBAs, and we definately have the drinking culture at some of our locations (outside Chicago).
While I’ve never seen anyone drink at the office, after work get togethers at the bar are common, and after work dinner outings will have people ordering beer, coctails, and bottles of wine. Company parties always have alcohol, we even rented out a microbrewery for a party one year.
As someone who has a low tollerance for alcohol – and therefore a fear of drinking and driving – I often decline to drink. Which leads to question upon question, and even a demand that if I was going to attend a party in our corporate suite at a sporting event, that I was required to drink!
Needless to say, I kind of went off on my manger telling me this…I definately feel like an outsider when I don’t drink and it’s noticed. Although when everyone else has had a few, they seem to think my perrier and orange is an alcoholic beverage.
Claire
Some weeks I drink two glasses of wine every night. Some weeks I drink almost nothing. I get buzzed on week nights fairly regularly… that means two or three glasses of wine/beer. I don’t keep hard liquor in the house as a rule. If I’m out drinking on a Saturday night, I drink gin and tonic or beer. I’ll get drunk maybe once every other month. If I feel like I’ve been drinking too much recently, for whatever reason, I just stop. I try not to drink alone, but sometimes I do anyway.